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-   -   QANTAS 2011 grounding about to be revisited? (https://www.pprune.org/australia-new-zealand-pacific/623808-qantas-2011-grounding-about-revisited.html)

Rated De 24th Jul 2019 04:55


Given the significant earning of the CEO (and Executive management) and the fact the Company is making profits in the billions, it is not unrealistic to reject the arbitrary 3% QF group wage policy. However - it takes the pilot group to be willing to take some action.
It starts at the individual level.
The "representatives" must reflect the discontent, however it appears that the "representatives" would prefer to follow the goat path to management.
With the former AIPA President sitting opposite those he once purported to represent, as a handsomely rewarded IR negotiator, the smart money is on the "senior union representatives" busily amending their Curriculum Vitae hoping to tread the path to management.

Berealgetreal 24th Jul 2019 10:29

Geez that’s not good.

Angle of Attack 24th Jul 2019 10:37

The QF SHEA is about to be smashed down at at least 90/10 Voting NO, let’s discuss after the event, that will be in several weeks time.

dragon man 24th Jul 2019 10:47


Originally Posted by Angle of Attack (Post 10526787)
The QF SHEA is about to be smashed down at at least 90/10 Voting NO, let’s discuss after the event, that will be in several weeks time.

I so hope you are correct, would make this Dragon very very happy 😃😃

Beer Baron 24th Jul 2019 11:28


Originally Posted by Rated De (Post 10526595)
It starts at the individual level.
The "representatives" must reflect the discontent, however it appears that the "representatives" would prefer to follow the goat path to management.
With the former AIPA President sitting opposite those he once purported to represent, as a handsomely rewarded IR negotiator, the smart money is on the "senior union representatives" busily amending their Curriculum Vitae hoping to tread the path to management.

Seriously Rated De, you are a cheap gutter troll. You trot out your big words and pretend to be an expert on everything but you are not a professional pilot, you don’t work for Qantas, you are not a member of AIPA, you don’t know the members of the COM, you don’t know the Executive and you don’t know the negotiators. You are an internet troll, criticising all behind the cover of anonymity.

The AIPA members you criticise work hundreds of hours (predominantly) for no monetary reward. They do it to advance the conditions of their colleagues. It is an infinitely more noble pursuit than that of an internet troll who only seeks to disparage those whom they do not know.

The most important factor for pilots if PIA becomes a necessary path is Unity. We all must stick together to back our colleagues to achieve a fair outcome. Unity is not achieved by denigrating the union office bearers who will be the ones to call for such action if/when the time comes. Attacks that are not based on facts but only sew distrust and division. You wouldn’t know the individuals if you saw them in a terminal, you’ve never shared a flight deck with them and you know nothing of their plans for the EA or beyond.

Ironically, the biggest beneficiary of your gutless, ill informed attacks on the AIPA exec is the one person you troll more than all else, Alan Joyce (or Little Napoleon as you childishly call him). So well done on that own goal.

Jetstarpilot 24th Jul 2019 12:10

It’s “Sow” not Sew.... ✍️:ugh:

ScepticalOptomist 24th Jul 2019 21:28


Originally Posted by Jetstarpilot (Post 10526865)
It’s “Sow” not Sew.... ✍️:ugh:

In the age of mobile devices being the most common computing device with their tiny keys and aggressive autocorrect, who really gives a flying f$&k.

Was his message lost because of one spelling error?

Numpty.

Chris2303 24th Jul 2019 21:36


Originally Posted by Beer Baron (Post 10526826)
Seriously Rated De, you are a cheap gutter troll.

I am surprised this took so long

gordonfvckingramsay 25th Jul 2019 04:27

Beer Baron, are you suggesting that union reps have not crossed the table?

ExtraShot 25th Jul 2019 05:44


Alan Joyce (or Little Napoleon as you childishly call him
Perhaps an appropriate nickname if some of the rumored displays of ruling with an Iron Fist and volatile temperament are true?

Maybe not a bad thing to be in business either, especially in Australia where we tend to celebrate crushing the ‘little guy’ (figuratively speaking of course). He is probably onto something, it’s made him a very rich man.

Beer Baron 25th Jul 2019 06:15


Originally Posted by gordonfvckingramsay (Post 10527559)
Beer Baron, are you suggesting that union reps have not crossed the table?

No I am not.
I am not speaking in defence of the handful of AIPA exec members over the years who have made that decision. But at anytime there are 40 pilots on COM, 8 in the Executive and the people in those positions change every few years. The pilots who have crossed the table are in the extreme minority. How many have done so in the last decade? I can think of 2 off the top of my head.

To attack the integrity of all the incumbent office bearers because of the actions of a few over previous years is grossly unfair, unjustified and damaging to the ultimate goal of unifying pilots to protect and improve our working conditions.

V-Jet 25th Jul 2019 11:39


but you are not a professional pilot, you don’t work for Qantas, you are not a member of AIPA, you don’t know the members of the COM, you don’t know the Executive and you don’t know the negotiators.
Makes him the perfect balanced sample and far more eligible to comment than any of us with multiple axes to grind, methinks..... More of it, I say. Or does anyone here think Qantas is properly fleeted up for the future?

Group think is dangerous. Alternate views should be taken on board and at the very least, considered as valid for discussion. Outsiders frequently see far more than those personally involved. Which bankers saw the banking crisis around the corner?

SandyPalms 25th Jul 2019 11:51


Originally Posted by V-Jet (Post 10527874)


Makes him the perfect balanced sample and far more eligible to comment than any of us with multiple axes to grind, methinks..... More of it, I say. Or does anyone here think Qantas is properly fleeted up for the future?

Group think is dangerous. Alternate views should be taken on board and at the very least, considered as valid. Outsiders frequently see far more than those personally involved. Which bankers saw the banking crisis around the corner?

Really? Do you want to here my opinion on the Pies?

Rates De can only be spouting rubbish fed to him through people with an axe to grind. Let's be serious here. This person is an uninformed trouble maker. Fed **** from the likes of GD and PM. If in fact he isn't IW. We've heard all this crap before. I've been in the meetings.
Qantas needs a new fleet, yes. But that is what is happening. To deny that is just ridiculous. Get a grip and stop throwing stones at volunteers. You're an embarasment, the lot of you.

V-Jet 25th Jul 2019 11:55

I like pies, but I’d rather hear it:) Are your favourites best with BBQ, Steak, horseradish or tomato?

V-Jet 25th Jul 2019 12:15


Qantas needs a new fleet, yes. But that is what is happening. To deny that is just ridiculous.
Ahhh! A glass Half full man/woman/LGBTIQXXXXXX (hope I didn’t leave any out:))

Is the collective noun for 14 aircraft a fleet? Don’t some actors own more? Would any EK/BA/LH/SK members care to comment?

SandyPalms 25th Jul 2019 12:30

Ok gents (or ladies or whatever V-jet is) can you tell me, and I mean really tell me, what is it that you need QF to do to satisfy you? Because frankly, I don't get it (I know your gonna tell me how I really don't get it blah blah). This rubbish has appeared on this site for years.

Does anybody actually understand what Rated De and his sympathisers are actually talking about?
Other than the cheap shots, of course.

Apologies if I've spelled something wrong. I know how much more important that is to some professional pilots in this country.

embarasment is an understatement.

V-Jet 25th Jul 2019 16:51

I think I could summarise it this way: For anyone in Qf management to work in and for, the best long term nterests of Qantas, and not treat the organisation as a piggy bank to extract as much cash for personal gain as they can.

That would be a VERY good start.

josephfeatherweight 25th Jul 2019 17:08


Apologies if I've spelled something wrong. I know how much more important that is to some professional pilots in this country.

embarasment is an understatement.
You misspelt “Embarrassment”.
(Relax, TIC)

Rated De 25th Jul 2019 19:00

Currently, your former union President sits opposite your current "representatives", representing IR.
That former Union President, and we heard it all before from believers, was openly stating he was not involved in Industrial Relations. He most certainly was and to this minute is tasked with undermining existing terms and conditions.
The former Union President, became the Chief Pilot, not strictly industrial.
Doesn't a former Union senior executive, continue after his remunerated career in Qantas, work for IR?
Wasn't a current negotiator "awarded" a training position whilst actually conducting negotiations?

Perhaps, as it works in the professional world, simple terms are inserted in agreements, that require an exclusivity (non-compete) clause, for a period of years after serving in any executive capacity are introduced?
The absence of any such agreement, when all around the professional world their purpose is to try to protect sensitive information from changing sides, is interesting.

As for their fleet, wander through almost any international airport and observe fleet, not Qantas but competitor airlines, the "project" has already been decided, funded and implemented.

Which is precisely why their fuel included CASK is close to the upper bound of competitor airlines, and why Roger Montgomery assessed a CAPEX required of AUD $1.7 billion to keep the fleet age (JQ excluded) where it is. Fleet age is at the upper bound of competitor airlines.

help me jebus 21st Aug 2019 21:00

https://www.bbc.com/news/business-49421426

Ryanair loses court battle to block UK pilot strike


Seems it's in the air..


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