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AIPA President Drops the ball on Lateline 31/10/2011
No disrespect to Captain Jackson, as he strikes me as a dedicated leader of the AIPA. I must say though, that after watching his performance tonight on Lateline (31/10/2011), I have to wonder if he's the person best suited to be publicly speaking on behalf of the AIPA.
While I'm sure he discharges the duties and responsibilities of his role as president of AIPA with all the integrity, intellect and diplomacy this post requires, one can only conclude that his presence on Lateline tonight was a lost opportunity for the pilot group to get their points of view across to the viewing audience. He was clearly nervous, and that is understandable given the magnitude of the situation. However he lacked any clearly articulated answers to the questions put to him, and at times it seemed even the simplest of responses were vague, disjointed and fumbled through. There was no polish or sense of authority in his delivery. The questions put to him were dollies, loaded with opportunities to articulate and expand on the pilots' positions on key issues, events and concerns. It was almost as if the presenter was deliberately feeding Captain Jackson the questions the pilots have been longing for the media to ask for all these past frustrating months. In short it was a chance to put the heat back on the company and apply the blow torch. I'm sorry to say that by the end of the interview he looked like a man who had been searching for the truth and who wasn't comfortable with his answers. AIPA can't hold a press conference ever five minutes and expect the media to turn up. Qantas management can - and will! In the next few weeks they're going to take every opportunity afforded them to hammer home their position. Again and again and again. This was one of the few opportunities you get to put across your position; where you're the only ones getting air time. No management shouting you down, or other unions fighting to get their members concerns heard over yours. I'm not a huge fan of the TWU's man. He strikes me as the kind of person who has only enough RAM in his head to remember four sentences at a time. But by the time the interview is over you've heard those same four sentences repeated forty times. You know his position in no uncertain terms. By the end of Captain Jackson's interview tonight all you 'kind of knew' was that it's 'kind of not about the money', and 'kind of about engagement'............'kind of'. With lots of ums and ahs thrown in. There's twenty days . . .. and counting . . .. unless the conciliation period is extended. There's only a small window of opportunity to change popular opinion. You can tell after Joyce's stuff up grounding the fleet there's a change in the prevailing wind, and a definite chance to win the masses over to our side. While I'm not a Qantas pilot, I do feel like we're all in this together. Every kick needs to be a goal though. So my question is this - given that this is the end game and there is so much at stake - do you not feel that it would be prudent to dip into the war chest and employ some PR professionals? At the very least they would be able to create talking points and structure some pre-packaged answers and fall back points. This would then ensure that those who talk on behalf of the union membership stand the best chance of impressing the media, the public, (and maybe even the bosses), as to their professionalism, their coherence and their credibility. There can be little doubt that the aviation industry in Australia continues to need a strong Qantas. Looking to the role of the pilots will play in contributing to this long term objective , I believe the union must be successful in securing Australian jobs for Australian pilots now. If not, they will be too weak in the future to stop management imposing their will on what will be left of the Qantas work force. In short AIPA - it's time to bring out your A game! The Monster!:ok: |
Securing jobs at 530 000 AUD a year for a 380 Captain..............you have to be kidding. Not one airline can afford to pay this amount of money.
So if it's not about money but just jobs..............why don't you guys chip in a little. It still won't make you poor. And if you're still not convinced, just watch this Late Line report about what the markets think. Lateline Business - ABC |
I have to agree. This interview was a silver platter of opportunity for AIPA to set itself aside from the other unions and crystalise what their position is. The interviewer even said "so it's not all about the money then?" as if to feed Barry the line. Unfortunately, it was a wasted opportunity. In the same way that leaders of large organisations are not expected to do their own PR, neither should Barry. It's simply not working. I say that as an AIPA member but non QF pilot.
I think AIPA are a victim of timing, and are being dragged down by the industrial action of other unions. Their public stance needs to distance themselves from this. Some suggested points to drive home: Red ties and inflight PAs have not disrupted anybody. Pilots are aviation professionals who take themselves, their profession and safety culture seriously. For Joyce & co to suggest Qantas pilots would be 'too distracted' to discharge their responsibilities safely is offensive. In the current climate, there is no point negotiating on anything other than job security because it is painfully obvious that the company intends to significantly downsize its international division. AIPA is not just another bully union, it is a professional association looking to secure a future for its professional members. Any refusal to negotiate on job security for international pilots by Qantas is a refusal to take safety seriously. It looks like arbitration would put an end to any hope of job security being negotiated on, so the next three weeks are critical. I think the Qantas flights / Qantas pilots thing is too simplistic. The rephrased version that Joyce prefers (paying JQ pilots the same as QF) is getting more air time. And it is effective - Barry Jackson was unable to successfully answer the question on Lateline about how much difference there actually is between JQ and QF pay. It looked really bad. To crystalise the meaning of the job security clause, some more detail is required. To be honest, I'm not sure I believe in their current stance. I would tend to think that some commitments from the company about the future size of and investment in QF international would be more effective. I think we all realise the entire business model of JQ is based on lower wages. Maybe it's worth leaping more on that bandwagon? 'This weekend, Joyce has shown his hand about wanting to run Qantas into the ground (figuratively). AIPA is now concerned about the continued existence of an Australian icon.' The general public have a propensity to protect the idea of Qantas the safe, Aussie airline, and AIPA needs to get on that bandwagon. Just my 2c worth anyway. I want to get involved in some way other than ranting on PPRuNe but it seems like AIPA are intent on handling their own PR. |
And what about the moral high ground? Why not get on that bandwagon too?
Unions are being accused of holding QF to ransom. AIPA needs to shoot that down. What Alan Joyce and the board are doing is wrong. It it just not right to destroy a good Australian company and off shore it. Why should Qantas go the way of Arnotts and vegemite? QF is one of Australia's biggest employers. If they are allowed to get away with not committing to keeping Australian jobs with the pilots, there will be no stopping where it goes after that. First it's the pilots, then it's the rest of the workforce. We are not holding Qantas to ransom, we are holding them to account. We will negotiate on anything, but we need to know our company wants us into the future. Pull at the heart strings, guys. Come on! It's publicity A game time! |
On another note, Bill Shorten was on-side and on-message in his interview on the same show I thought.
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Can anyone post a link to the interview?
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bring back Brian McCarthy.....
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Lateline - 31/10/2011: Qantas needs to engage with workforce: Jackson
i'm just an observer, been watching from a tower near you for 30+ years... not impressed with this performance but not surprised given the level of pr and media coaching available to AJ and his cronies felt he could have nailed home a few key points: premeditation, cynical timing - AGM, CHOGM, spring carnival etc.. solidarity with TWU etc, real or not, would help in the pr war.. can't wait for comment from gruen planet on wednesday!!! bon chance Z |
I thought it was fairly positive for the union. I don't think it helps to berate a leader who has been thrown a curve ball of historical proportions over the last few days. He seems fairly humble and approachable, like somebody the public can trust, that's the most important thing.
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Red ties and inflight PAs have not disrupted anybody. Pilots are aviation professionals who take themselves, their profession and safety culture seriously. I find this totally unprofessional. There are other equally public ways to take your ( valid ) claims. And please...........stop this " It's not about money " At 530 000 AUD for an A380 captain, this is totatlly indecent. Your operation is losing 200 Millions a year. If your share of the cost is 4% this means 8 Millions for you to cut. Clear and simple. Forget the pay rise ! |
How about you ask Mr Joyce to give some of his dough back? The airline clearly can't afford that either.
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It appears to me that QF pilots are like most pilots; totally engaged during boom times of promotion and pay rise and yet grumpy and disengaged when the reverse happens. In other words, engagement is something the airline purchases.
What proposals have AIPA placed on the table to ensure QF remains competitive in a changing marketplace? Pay rises and better staff travel. |
He was clearly nervous, and that is understandable given the magnitude of the situation. However he lacked any clearly articulated answers to any of the questions put to him, and at times it seemed even the simplest of responses was vague, disjointed and fumbled thru. There was no polish or sense of authority in his delivery. I agree, the questions were softballs. Hopefully he will be coached with better sound bites before the next interview. Here on the other side of the world the headlines declare that the 'Qantas strike' is over: Aussie court ends Qantas strike, fleet grounding - BusinessWeek Aussie court ends Qantas strike that left tens of thousands stranded - Chicago Sun-Times Qantas Strike 2011 Ends: Australian Court Puts Stop To Grounded Fleet, Labor Dispute |
Please Please Please give me a break...how many A380 Captaind actually earn $500000 a year?? J***us PLEASE get real:ugh:
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Please Please Please give me a break...how many A380 Captaind actually earn $500000 a year?? J***us PLEASE get real The highest paid captain of an A380 gets $536,000 - an increase of more than $40,000 on last year - and the average A380 captain's wage is $415,000. |
I'd hazard a guess that the A380 pilots who earn $500,000+ pa were never going to be locked out on Monday night anyway!
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Many valid points there MonsterC01.
Maybe Jacko should look into appointing you his briefing officer. Please check your PMs. |
The leader of any union should be able to clearly present their members’ case publically without embarrassment. Last night, an opportunity to present the pilots’ case was missed.
If the president's preformance is typical of how the leadership of AIPA presented their case to investors and the parliament, is it little wonder!!!! |
@memyself, I'll bet you will be interested in what the pilot has to say when you hear a loud bang! The oxygen masks fall from the ceiling and the cabin starts filling with smoke.
When you walk off the aircraft in your urine soaked pants, don't forget to remind the pilot just how overpaid he is! Get off your high uneducated horse! |
Quote of the week.
“Here we have a CEO who pocketed a two million dollar pay rise on Friday, stranded 68,000 passengers around the globe on Saturday, tried to pin the blame on the government on Sunday and then thinks he can claim victory and walk away scot-free on Monday". Says all that needs to be said, very neatly for my 2 bobs worth. |
So Joyce's handling of the matter was risky. So he took an unprecedented step. So he needed the backing of the board to do it. So he put his reputation and his job on the line. So he forced the government to get involved? Sounds like a lot of work for a CEO.
I'm not surprised he got a pay rise. The markets put Qantas up around 5%, so they liked it. |
Be made a mockery of the government and took away workers rights to negotiate a fair deal
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A pilot spoke on Ross Greenwood's 'Talking Money' show last night at about 19:15.
He, IMO, spoke well, put across to Greenwood some good points to which Greenwood agreed, then when he gave the example of the young new /manager's' straight out of Uni who come up with the 12 cups of tea from 1 tea bag rule to save money.......Greenwood laughed and basically finished the call. My point though, there has to be guys out there who can tell the media what's going on, there are no doubt, plenty of pilots who can do it but as for doing it on camera.... not sure about that, surely a 2nd tier PR company could be used. |
I didn't realize that AJ wanted to be a pilot, earlier in his career. Here is the online article.
Pilot reject came up through ranks | Courier Mail Pilot reject came up through ranks
http://resources0.news.com.au/images...alan-joyce.jpg WORKING CLASS: Qantas chief executive Alan Joyce. Picture: AFP Source: AFP THE man who is attempting to steer Qantas through the biggest crisis of its 90-year history is a mathematical whiz from a working-class Irish family. Alan Joyce entered the aviation industry straight out of Trinity College in Dublin where he studied science, majoring in physics and maths. The eldest son of blue-collar parents Maurice and Collette, Joyce dreamed of being a pilot when he started work with Ireland's national carrier Aer Lingus in 1988 but failed the vision test. Instead he focused on management, and quickly moved up the ranks from his first job as operations research analyst. After eight years with Aer Lingus, during which Joyce worked on an ultimately unsuccessful plan to match the aggressive budget airline Ryanair, he was headhunted by Ansett and moved to Melbourne. He left before the airline went bust, joining Qantas in late 2000 as the head of network planning. Just three years later, Joyce was made chief executive of Jetstar where he used chunks of the Ryanair business model to build a successful budget airline. This included the 25-minute aircraft turnaround policy, to get maximum use out of aircraft and reduce the cost of flight crew stopovers. In 2005, Joyce was asked to head up Aer Lingus, but he stuck with Jetstar and in 2008 was rewarded with the plum position of Qantas chief executive, replacing Geoff Dixon. Much has been made of the fact Joyce started in the job on a much-reduced salary to his predecessor, but has since increased his annual income to more than $5 million a year. Joyce became an Australian citizen in 2004. Now 45, Joyce is intensely private and has refused to even name his long-term partner - a New Zealand man - with whom he lives at The Rocks in Sydney. |
I met a man a few years ago, about early fifties and as a Captain, he was about to leave JS for SE Asia to fly. He had a recent experience that he was not comfortable with (and my job involved discussing that). He told me much about the 25 minute turnaround and how that business model did not fit with his training and career understanding of safe flight, planning, briefing, aircraft preparation aspects etc. I came from the same flying training regime as this as did many of us who learned to fly in the 70's. There have been many incidents associated with these issues and there will be many more as there is really only one way to prepare for flight. Sure aviation, especially high-end public transport, is safe but this safety is diminished by this business model. The fact remains that passengers see aviation as risky, probably because when it goes wrong, it is is really spectacular and the business model results are usually terminal. Sometimes the self-righteous, uneducated and narrow-minded means to an end by business managers is self-destructive. The management model should really include some strong operational and safety component that can balance this, otherwise there may be no business model to worry about as the supply and demand chain will diminish to zero very quickly; spectacularly in fact.
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Originally Posted by Me Myself
I beg to differ. When I fly, I am absolutly not interested in employee's rant. I just want to get home or wherever, hassle free and not pestered by PA annoucements other than what's expected from a normal airline.
I find this totally unprofessional. Do you find it unprofessional that couriers delivering lockout notices to pilots have stated that the delivery was booked before the AGM? Do you find it unprofessional that the CEO of a very large company would say things on camera that are demonstrably false or exaggerated? Do you find it unprofessional that a Qantas spokeswoman would complain that "you can't just switch an airline on and off" only a few weeks before its CEO did exactly that? Do you find it unprofessional that a CEO would collectively punish tens of thousands of customers with virtually no notice at all, on a weekend? Do you only complain about "professionalism" when it suits you? :confused: |
Me myself and anyone else who believes QF propaganda... The QF LH EBA can be viewed online and the current hourly pay rates for pilots can easily be found and analysed.
Some notes for your research. A380 pilots are flying a fleet that is still developing so very few of the line pilots fly a full line... They are displaced for training. The current roster divisor is 160 hours and there are 6.25 roster periods in a year. This will get you a base rate. Add approx 20 hours of overtime for 5 of those roster periods. Add another 30 hours for simulator and ground duties. That will give you the gross pay of an average line a380 captain. If you come up with a figure anywhere near 530000 dollars give me a call and I will refer you to a good calculator repair shop. |
I watched Lateline. I was a little disappointed with some of the missed opportunities, but my wife thought he was great. He certainly did not come across as a militant evil unionist and did get good points across.
FWIW I was told by someone I trust that there ARE some management capts on the 380 earning over $500. I was staggered, no they certainly would never be the ones locked out, but it seems it is true. When you consider relative salaries, I think one point is often missed. Qantas salaries from the -400 down are on par with the rest of the world. The 380 seems a bit higher, but remember the $AUD has 'never' been this high. If anything untoward happens in China, it is highly likely the $AU will fall quickly to its historical norms of .65c - .85c. That would adjust the pay scales considerably - as it would fuel. |
Australians need to wake up. we are selling our country right across the board not just the airline industry.
The day is coming that australians in order to live and work in australia in any role other than a manager, will first have to have lived and worked in Asia. |
but my wife thought he was great. He certainly did not come across as a militant evil unionist and did get good points across. Carry on Like Alan Joyce and you wont get any support from anybody |
don't restructure the business and see what happens>>>
Swissair/Pan Am/SAS/TWA/Eastern/United/America West/PSA/Wardair/UTA/Ansett/nearly ANZ/Sabena/Olympic/etc etc |
Troll Alert !!!
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Stay behind the scenes Barry
I agree, no disrespect to Barry Jackson, but he doesn't present well in interviews. Television or radio.
Ian Woodward is a much better choice to front the media, in my opinion. |
Why didn't you add MacAir to the list TBM?
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Just a quick one, maybe it's time for Fatigue management on all players after the weekend dramas. Barry Jackson looked worn out to me, I wonder how long it is since he's had his wife's cold feet on his back in his own bed:zzz:
frothy |
TBM
don't restructure the business and see what happens>>> Swissair/Pan Am/SAS/TWA/Eastern/United/America West/PSA/Wardair/UTA/Ansett/nearly ANZ/Sabena/Olympic/etc etc I wonder what they do different?:) |
Pffft...
- It's been the company saying "no" for >12 months,
- It's been the company which, through its own deceptive/misleading/disingenuous recent history and looseness with facts, has failed to clearly and unambiguously lead employees where they need to get to, - It's been the company which failed to make a counter-offer to the contentious claims, - It was the company's 'negotiating style' which prompted FWA to authorise specified and legal "Protected Industrial Action", - It's been AIPA (& others in their way) which complied with every FWA requirement in 'ramping up' to wearing the incredibly disruptive red ties, - It was AJ who grounded the airline with 3-hours notice. :hmm: |
for the record. |
98% of shareholders don't support you It is likely that the majority of shareholders were against the resolutions with a minority of shareholders holding 96% of the shareholdings passing them. Perhaps it's time that for interests sake, the results from individual shareholders votes be available. |
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