Future of Qantas in jeopardy: Joyce (Merged)
 

7.30 - ABC

Link to the segment is at top-right. AJ comes across very negative and whiney. Labelling the leadership of AIPA as "rogue" seems to be their latest line of attack.

Of course the Qantas board has no responsibility for the state of Qantas at the moment does it.
How many million has been lost in fines for price fixing, but of course the board didn't know anything about that did they....but hang on isn't their job to know?
How many million did they give to Dixon for staying on for stability after the debacle he created with the buyout?
Non reclining seats in Jetstar aircraft good idea that one.
Aircraft selection, how is that Dallas route going anyway?
Outsourcing engine maint seems to be working a treat.
Putting "The Australian Spirit" on a ZK rego aircraft with NZ crews.
I know one job that might be in trouble.

Just the usual argy bargy from both sides, neither saying to much to inspire. Expect more froth and bubble, until one does something drastic. Then it will hit the fan. Or might never, and sometimes thats best.

Future of Qantas in jeopardy: Joyce Merged
 

Future of Qantas in jeopardy: Joyce

May 26, 2011 - 10:24PM .

AAP

The future of Qantas as an international carrier is in jeopardy, the airline's CEO Alan Joyce says.

Fair Work Australia on Thursday approved a ballot allowing long-haul pilots to vote on taking industrial action for the first time in 45 years.

"The continued claim that they are going to take industrial action ... is an attempt at further damaging the brand," Mr Joyce told the ABC's 7.30 program on Thursday.

Advertisement: Story continues below

"Unfortunately, this is the way some of these rogue union leaders think."

The pilot's demands, which include wage increases - with the Australia and International Pilots Association (AIPA) pushing for a rise of two-and-a-half per cent over three years - would result in job cuts, Mr Joyce said.

"They are demands the company cannot agree to and they are demands that will result in job losses in this company," he said.

Mr Joyce labelled both the engineers' and pilots' union leaders as "rogues" who the company was "going to have to stand up to".

Qantas puts the cost of the demands at more than $300 million but the pilots' association says the figure is more like $90 million.

"There are certain demands I cannot concede to because it will endanger the survival of the company," Mr Joyce said.

"Our international business is losing money, our international business, if these demands are met, will go back even further."

© 2011 AAP

Of course none of the crap management decisions have anything to do with it do they Alan :yuk:

Same Ole Same Ole
 

Same rhetoric,different accent.Dixon is obviously AJ's scriptwriter of choice.
How many years have we listened to this monotonous crappe?
Spend some money on mainline,re engage the workforce.It Ain't hard Al
When having his op it didnt impair his ability to pull figures out of his bottom.
$300 mill.Give us a break

Joyce: GD's new spin doctor, puppet of Clifford.

If Qantas pilots do nothing, there will be job cuts due to the outsourcing of OUR jobs. If we fight there will be job cuts. Sorry Alan, Al if I may, im not going to sit on the sidelines and watch you take a bonus back to your 'partner'. Im fighting this, WE are fighting this all the way.

Enjoy your reduced bonus.

Oh and what is with the Chief Pilot sending out emails being a "company man"? Dude, aren't you meant to be on the pilots side?

Lets bring the WHOLE place down, Jetstar and all, fcuk em!!!

The blessings of being in charge.
1/You get a large say in how much you are paid.
2/You take credit for when times are good.get a pay rise
3/You blame anyone and anything else when times are bad.Get a pay rise.
4/Because you are in charge people listen to your spin (not too critically usually) and have a better chance at selling your side of the story.

However , reading some press of late maybe people are waking up to the spin.People are wondering why it is that Qantas is having so much trouble with its people, its products and its equipment.

Whose Future?
 

Joyce should be worried about his own future.
Its hurtling towards him at mach.85

Lets bring the WHOLE place down, Jetstar and all, fcuk em!!!

Typical selfish Okker attitude.:}

What about your other 30,000 fellow employees and their mortgages and families?

The International business is losing money Mr Joyce, because YOU and your boardroom peers have failed to invest in the product. You have failed to innovate the product.

Engineers and pilots are NOT the ones "damaging the brand". I am fed up with hearing this rhetoric. It is those in your position who are doing the damage.

Get your noses out of the money trough and start taking notice of your customers.

Looks like Alan Joyce is setting this all up for the big one. It will be interesting if the board let him take this airline to the brink.

It's one thing to talk tough during a negotiation, the way he is going about 'negotiating', since the beginning is by using misinformation through the media painting the employee groups as evil people hell bent on destruction.

Most of us were here before you AJ, we'll be here long after as well.

Good luck Alan :ok:

For once I agree with the CEO - the future of the airline is jeopardy.

The only thing we disagree on is the reason why.

Game on!
 

So sad. AJ these "Rogues"where loveable for 80 years until your current lot of managers stepped in with a set of dodgy calculators.

When J* was a pup the Q PR machine spouted the brands would never clash. In reality, it appears the opposite has happened. Turning on the pilots & engineers is not the reason the Q bottom line is in a mess, (creatively speaking,) it's the way it has been managed. I believe the media is a wake up to that this time. I thought Richard Woodward came over well on the 7.30 report.
This will quickly become a huge international aviation story with a continued following, spread far and wide.

Qantas pilots stand to pocket $200,000 each | The Australian

and here already,

The Himalayan Times : Qantas pilots may stage first strike in 45 years - Detail News : Nepal News Portal

Funny enough, back in Ireland EI management are taking a different view on a similar situation. EI was a basket case for years until this CEO came along with a fresh approach that dogged the airline since the1990s. The CEO at EI has quickly gained worldwide respect and is reported on in all the worlds aviation press, he has no blinkers and comes over positive with his staff which is quite a change from EIs past in IR. Perhaps AJ should take a look back in the old country for a few other clues in dealing with IR situations..

Aer Lingus won't touch staff for now - International - IOL | Breaking News | South Africa News | World News | Sport | Business | Entertainment | IOL.co.za

my bold

Christoph Mueller (German I believe) is handling the situation with a fresh approach, looking elsewhere, moving on from the old way of doing things, namely pointing a finger (sledge hammer) at the staff.

Qs management focus is wrong for the current climate with competition.
AJ, The unions are willing to talk, why can't you? Why does it have to be a war?
Hard ball tactics avoidable, outdated and totally unnecessary.
Update Q shareprice $2.06 as of 25-05-11

It's quite interesting reading all of Margaret Jacksons stuff --- about the Board fearlessly planning the future of the airline and being responsible for everything.

....and now the pilots and engineers are going to destroy everything with their bare hands???

Some Board.

They are demands the company cannot agree to and they are demands that will result in job losses in this company," he said. Mr Joyce labelled both the engineers' and pilots' union leaders as "rogues" who the company was "going to have to stand up to".
Qantas puts the cost of the demands at more than $300 million but the pilots' association says the figure is more like $90 million.

Lies, Lies, Lies........
2.5% a year and job security - Thats the headline.
Stay strong lads, Good luck - everyone in Aus Aviation is standing behind you.:D

Interesting; Delta Airlines gets into financial trouble the employees chip in and buy the company a B767. Qantas starts doing it tough some employees start actions to make it worse.:ooh:

Way to go Alan :D
Stop your whinging and get on with the job of steering the ship.
Everyone is tired of seeing you in the media crying foul over everything be it
fuel,competition,staff, unions yadda yadda !!!
Why is he so hell bent on locking horns with his own staff !! :(
Just get on with it Alan or hand over the ship to someone else and fast. !!
Iceberg at 12 O'clock !! :eek:

TBM-Legend.

Completely different senario. Delta had LEADERSHIP ! See what happens when you have staff on side! They buy you an aircraft. They didn't have management that were trying to sell out their jobs to the lowest bidder. They "Worked Together" to turn things around. They didn't engage the staff as the enemy.

It's time to go...........Alan.

You can make fun of the CEO all you like .... but the punter only sees what's on the 7.30 report!

This is a PR battle ... not a battle over who's right or wrong :suspect:

Honest question
 

TBM; To what do you base your statement about Qantas doing it tough?

gotta agree with peuce

On CH7 Sunrise this morning Mel quoted AJ saying that under a new wage claim Qantas pilots would TAKE HOME an EXTRA $200K per annum. That is either very slack journalism, or else deliberately mischeivious and misleading misinformation.

It all feels like shades of the way pilots were painted as overpaid bus drivers by Messrs Hawke, Abeles and Strong 22 long years ago. The company is using the same PR game plan dusted off from 1989.

Funny how after any serious e.g (QF32) or even minor incident the pax all come out gushing that they don't care what the pilots get paid because their lives are in the pilots hands.

I didn't notice anybody disembarked QF32 complimenting the poisonous leprechaun on his stunning performance.

According to the figures AJ has delivered last night the pilots are after $317m, which represents a 26% increase.

This then means the average QF Longhaul pilots package at present is around $730k and at the completion of the EA term will be close to $920k. Please feel free to correct my figures if necessary.

I never knew life was so good.....and I bet 1700 others didn't either!!!

Can we please work on dispelling this sought of cr@p any time soon?

My thoughts exactly. One email from AIPA, one email from the CP, one email from Aipa.....it's like a game of tennis. I wonder if the CP wasn't sitting there in his office and was just an ol' ordinary line pilot, what his thoughts really would be. I also like the reference to the fact that the lack of performance of Qantas International cannot be blamed on mismanagement or Jetstar....wtf:ugh:

As for the Sunrise shambles, I'm glad I missed watching it this morning for the sake of my tv living to see another day. What a joke.:yuk:

Is it just me or is it ironic that QF HQ is on 'coward' street?

Joyce, stop being such a bloody coward. Get out there, engage your staff, look them in the eye and show some leadership. Take Qantas where everyone wants it to go. FORWARD! Not one Australian (even your opposition VA) want to see it go down the tubes. Follow JBs lead and do something constructive.

Everyone in the company is desperate to feel proud again, they want Qantas to succeed. You and your cronies are the ones who are causing this sham.

Buy some decent proven aeroplanes (777) piss off the dugong (convert the remaining orders for A350s to cover if the dreambreakers don't do what they are supposed to do, yes plan B I think it's called), get some 748s to compliment the 777s on the trunk routes, and invest in world class engineering facilities to attract contract work to cover your own maintenance and labour bills.

If you announced you were doing the above to revitalize the brand and asked for pay freezes, mark my words - most would be ecstatic and go on the ride with you. The staff just want some leadership.

Oh and announce you're freezing your own and executive pay and will only unfreeze it when you feel comfortable to reward your staff with their own increases.

That would be a pretty good olive branch to kick off the new Qantas.

The ball is in your court.

The company needs to be made to understand that it will be held accountable for incorrect statements - add a new claim to the negotiations that a penalty of $100 per employee will be made for any incorrect claim made to the media. At least the CEO will have an incentive to tell the truth.

Yeah but he keeps getting away with it and if the pilots don't get their ****e together they will reap what they sow. Nothing.

For the life of me so many of us are exasperated because they are just taking this with no response and we dont understand why???

Get out there and get active PLEASE.

Losing the PR War...badly
 

Until AIPA engage the services of top-notch, shrewd Public Relations consultancy the battle will never be won...

Punters will believe what they read in the press and see on the telly...

Meanwhile the MUA are asking for 17% pay rise and knocked it back 15% with annual 4%!!!! I think QF might need a reality check somewhere in here.

Patrick's punches telegraphed to union by a three-year-old | The Australian

Drop the wages claim.

QF pilots are desperately claiming that it is "nothing to do with salaries and is only about the off-shoring".

How is anybody supposed to believe that when the media are presenting it as basically a wages claim? This is not the fault of the media. Whilst there is a wages component to the demands then the media are entitled to report it that way.

Shout as loudly as you like that it is "not about the salaries" but nobody will believe you.

Drop the wages claim.

This thread could have been better named "the future of management in trouble".

A good manager would have had this entire mess put to bed by now.

FGD135- their wages claim is already BELOW CPI. So they should just take a pay freeze because the media cant operate a calculator properly or indeed do any research whatsoever?

You guys need to get some facts out there in the public domain, even by starting on pprune so that those of us who support your cause know what to say when non-aviation mates ask "just what is all this about"?

Things such as a succinct list of what you are asking for, how this compares to other airlines in the industry and exactly what it is projected to cost.

Quite right Terry, when Menadue was boss and the company was up against a wall due to a savage downturn in this country, the whole staff had meetings over a period of time in the hangers. They came up with ideas to save the company money, from turning off unnessary power, to volunteers working for nix on days off. Why? because Menidue was honest, decent, cared for his staff, and everybody was desperate to keep the company going. No shareholders of course then, but a boss that gave it his all, so the staff did to. Air New Zealand has also now done the same thing with a boss that inspires. It can be done with QF, IF the right boss is brought in. Pay anything to Borgetti, but get him back. And shaft the board that sacked him. He has the ability to unite the staff, listen to the problems, and meet and compromise with various sections of the company. QF staff don't need to buy a 767, they just need Borgetti back, thats even better. Start saving.

tg , If only it was that simple , I don't know how many posters have been tracking the waterfront dispute . The MUA , a Union steeped in militant history and great leaders , Fitzgibbon , Tas Bull come to mind and many others , backed away when facing a lockout . Yes , the employer was prepared to shut the operation down take note cybrspace militants . So , beware , do not become so cute about all this , remember old trade union tactics always have a job to return to.

You're missing the point. The QF pilots are being slaughtered in the court of public opinion because of how the wages claim is being perceived - and this will not change. Sooner or later, somebody will rerun the "glorified busdrivers" line.

Only by dropping the wages claim (for now) will anybody listen to your pleas re off-shoring.

You can always come back to the wages claim later. The priority right now is the off-shoring.

To leave the wages claim in there is dumb and invites the slaughter to continue. The media and public will soon lose interest - their minds will be made up (that it is all about the pay).

I doubt if you'll get Borghetti back from Virgin. Richard Branson will make sure that won't happen!

FGD135 is correct.

We MUST remove the ability for management to misrepresent the pay claims.

At the very least, drop/'rejig' the payload band tables and remove any of the staff travel claims which management say are inflating the figures.

Leave the 2.5%, which at current CPI rates seems to be a 0.5% to 1% pay cut each year in real terms.

A Job Security/Scope Clause is NOT going to come cheap!

Perhaps this thread should be renamed "Future of Joyce in Jeopardy : Qantas":E