Power of the Chairman’s Club
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Power of the Chairman’s Club
Says it all for me.
Top Answer
18th Jul 2023, 22:17
But Finnair is okay
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But Finnair is okay
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That’s because they’re not paying enough to be competitive. There are many Pilot hoping to see an article in The Australian saying Qantas has been prevented by the Australian Government from hiring overseas Pilots to fly their new domestic aircraft very soon.
Last edited by aussieflyboy; 19th Jul 2023 at 08:58.
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Qatar are not just flooding the market for the sake of it, people are actually flying them due to top notch service and hard product, they have the demand. If you have flown Q Suites recently you will understand. They have nailed many parts of the experience, Qantas Long Haul is an embarrassment.
I don’t think Qatar was asking for much, when factoring in Etihad who had 9 flights a day into Australia at one moment in time. Today that sits at 2.
I don’t think Qatar was asking for much, when factoring in Etihad who had 9 flights a day into Australia at one moment in time. Today that sits at 2.
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Australian jobs is just a joke. They don’t like competition , without a near domestic monopoly there would be no Qantas today. Total and upper hypocrisy but you would expect nothing better from Joyce and co.
Surely even the Australian federal government aren’t stupid enough to approve foreign pilots. Public and political sentiment for QF is at an all time low.
You should have faith that the government will
recognise it as an attempt to screw industrial conditions down, and that there’s plenty of Aussie pilots to fly Aussie jets. QF just have to pay what they’re worth, rather than this industrial divide and conquer using subsidiaries - and then playing victim and asking for foreign pilots.
You should have faith that the government will
recognise it as an attempt to screw industrial conditions down, and that there’s plenty of Aussie pilots to fly Aussie jets. QF just have to pay what they’re worth, rather than this industrial divide and conquer using subsidiaries - and then playing victim and asking for foreign pilots.
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Unpopular opinion, but I think this is a great result.
The last thing we need are these grubs flying here more. Need I remind you all of the “extra service” provided to women in Doha 2020? Nothing has changed including their attitude. Hate Qantas all you like, but we don’t need these billy goats making more money off Australians.
https://www.theguardian.com/australi...t-doha-airport
The last thing we need are these grubs flying here more. Need I remind you all of the “extra service” provided to women in Doha 2020? Nothing has changed including their attitude. Hate Qantas all you like, but we don’t need these billy goats making more money off Australians.
https://www.theguardian.com/australi...t-doha-airport
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They have nailed many parts of the experience,
And before you say Qatar Airways didn't order the searches….They are an arm of the Qatari government that has an ongoing record of poor treatment of many, women among them. Imagine if that had happened in an Australian airport to passengers dragged - without explanation - off a Qantas flight. I'm not sure it would have been quite as conveniently swept under the carpet because they offer wonderful service and great Q-suites.
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Not an unpopular opinion with me (SLF) - I have in the past flown with Emirates and Etihad in business class - great service, low price, and usually an A380. But after Doha 2020 I've vowed never again on a ME airline. Flew Thai Business last month to France, and it was great. I'll pay extra to avoid going in to the ME.
Just imagine - you stumble and accidentally tread on the foot of the Emir's cousin, breaking his toe. He's already pissed off because his camel came last in yesterday's camel racing, so it's off to prison you go. Sure, the airline will get you out again because of the bad publicity, but do you want to spend a night in a jail in the ME? No such thing as "rule of law" and everyone's equal.
Mind you, we really could do with a bit more competition - Thai Business had 22 rows in a 777, and it was choccers. Qantas jobs for Australian pilots. Yeah, right. Fat profits for executive's pay, and stuff the rest. And can anyone tell me the last time Qantas paid some company tax?
Just imagine - you stumble and accidentally tread on the foot of the Emir's cousin, breaking his toe. He's already pissed off because his camel came last in yesterday's camel racing, so it's off to prison you go. Sure, the airline will get you out again because of the bad publicity, but do you want to spend a night in a jail in the ME? No such thing as "rule of law" and everyone's equal.
Mind you, we really could do with a bit more competition - Thai Business had 22 rows in a 777, and it was choccers. Qantas jobs for Australian pilots. Yeah, right. Fat profits for executive's pay, and stuff the rest. And can anyone tell me the last time Qantas paid some company tax?
One can only hope the QANTAS rationale masks the real reason the government rejected Qatar’s overtures, namely taking a moral stand over the repugnant episode in Doha. I see Flight Centre’s CEO has mocked this argument proving once again that if you don’t stand for something, you’ll fall for anything. A more positive response from “Skroo” would have been to encourage QANTAS to fill the demand for travel to Australia by servicing the market properly. He is apparently wilfully blind to the fact that Qatar Airways is a state-run airline. Know your product.
https://www.smh.com.au/business/comp...20-p5dpvz.html
https://www.smh.com.au/business/comp...20-p5dpvz.html
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MPs loll in comfort as Qantas logs record profits and planes fly like wounded ’roos
Canberra's decision-makers may get to enjoy five-star luxury in chairman's lounges but the hoi polloi get far less salubrious treatment.MICHAEL SAINSBURY
JUL 31, 2023
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A QANTAS PLANE AT ITS MELBOURNE ENGINEERING DEPOT (IMAGE: AAP/JOEL CARRETT)Qantas is relishing a financial sweet spot, with profits booming and its share price skyrocketing off the back of high prices, 15 years of under-investment in its fleet, engineering staff and facilities, plus screwing staff wages down and buying back shares.At its annual results next month, Qantas is expected to deliver a profit of $2.425 billion-$2.475 billion according to May guidance.
But customers remain deeply unhappy. The airline cancels flights with monotonous regularity across its three main Australian arms — Qantas proper, Jetstar and Qantas Link, which services smaller regional airports. Its phone lines are permanently clogged, economy-class food is loaded with sugar, fat and/or is inedible, and its club and business lounges look like unkempt late-night dive bars — tatty, dirty and understaffed. Yet prices remain stubbornly high due to, according to the competition regulator says, a lack of competition.
Now it’s de-Joyced, Qantas should be returned to the people
Read MoreThose expecting some relief from the Albanese government in the shape of more competition in the airline sector (that it claims it wants) and/or the delivery of proper customer guarantees and compensation that consumer groups are seeking (such as those long available in the EU and now on their way in the US thanks to a rare bipartisan bill passed by Congress last week) have been bitterly disappointed.Instead, it appears to be doing its best to protect Qantas’ dominant market position, in thrall to their lobbying.
In a bewildering move, in the past week Canberra has rejected Qatar Airways’ bid to add an extra 21 flights into Australia, and a bid by well-regarded Turkish Airlines to begin its first flights to Australia is also under a cloud. Transport Minister Catherine King, who has all but ignored the sector since taking up the role after last year’s election, has struggled to explain the Qatar decision, claiming it was unrelated to a nasty incident that saw Australian women put through demeaning body checks in 2020.
Increasingly, observers are concerned that the airline is leveraging its ultimate lobbying ace in the pack — its exclusive Chairman’s Lounge of which almost every federal politician is a member. Members have access to a special phone line which, unlike regular Qantas call centre lines, gets answered in a thrice. They are offered free upgrades, access to frequent-flyer seats that even Qantas’ most loyal platinum and lifetime gold members cannot get, and are showered with five-star treatment in plush lounges that sit behind secret black doors at Australia’s major airports. It’s not just politicians; some senior regulators and judges who may adjudicate on the company are also members.
Qantas remains the senior player in an effective oligopoly with Virgin Airlines — together they control 95% of the domestic market, with Qantas taking 66% of the overall market. With partner Emirates in a cartel-like arrangement, Qantas also holds 53% of the Australia-Europe market, dominates regional holiday routes such as Bali and Phuket, and holds about 40%-50% of the lucrative Australia-US market.
Its domestic earnings before interest and taxes (EBIT), or profit margin, increased from 12% in 2016-17 to 18% for 2021-2022 — a 50% increase in six years. Typical profit margins for domestic aviation operators in Australia were between 8% and 10%.
‘Delighted’: Qantas engineers and pilots respond to Alan Joyce’s departure
Read MoreAnd with the average Qantas fleet age now 15 years, its understaffed maintenance division is struggling, especially with the domestic workhorse 737s.“Pretty much everything is a mess with the 737s,” one engineer told Crikey. Aircraft are carrying “massive hold items” components or systems that don’t work but the aircraft can continue to fly under the manufacturer’s guidance. The “cabins are in poor shape. I’d say the company wants to run these aircraft without big investments until the [new] A320s come in. There are just no parts or manpower.”
One pilot described this as “like flying wounded kangaroos, with some not even allowed to fly over water at times”.
Pilots who spoke to Crikey agreed. “It takes at least 15 minutes to even get someone to look at a last-minute fault — and they are pulled off another job. This is behind a lot of the delays. It never used to be like this,” one pilot with decades of experience said.
Meanwhile, at Qantas’ main engineering base in Australia, staff are working in what one engineer described as “Third World” conditions.
“We are still flat-out every day in Sydney and as you see in the media we still have plenty of delays,” another engineer said. “We are sending A380s to Singapore for maintenance now as the Qantas maintenance facility at Los Angeles is such a basket case they are unable to complete the maintenance they were set up to do.”
The Sydney base was treated with disdain, “Yet we are the facility where the most maintenance is achieved. Our facilities are still Third World and no money will be spent upgrading them until Qantas knows what Sydney Airport Corp wants to do with the terminals. We have been promised new hangars for 20 years yet no one wants to invest in world-class infrastructure.”
It is also still many years until its fleet renewal will get into full swing, with dozens of aircraft — including replacements for its A330s — in a global environment where waitlists on Boeing and Airbus planes are only getting longer. Crikey has learnt that outgoing CEO Alan Joyce will belatedly announce the purchase of 12 787s and 12 350s — both long-range twin-aisle aircraft — at the results briefing next month. When they will be delivered is another matter.
Flying blind: Qantas and Jetstar limp from one doomed survival plan to another
Read MoreAs part of its aggressive lobbying efforts, Qantas bleats about saving Australian jobs yet does its best to send jobs to foreign workers offshore. It has a “wet lease” deal with Finnair which provides crew on leased planes, its Emirates alliance, crews based in Singapore, the UK, Thailand — known in the region as one of the industry’s worst paid — and New Zealand. It has call centres in South Africa, Ireland and the Philippines and is lobbying for 300 overseas residents to be able to pilot its planes for the first time. It is already recruiting in South Africa, sources said.Australian pilots, especially those newly certified, are heading offshore where wages are substantially higher. While top Qantas pilots can earn as much as $400,000, US freight carriers are offering up to US$700,000. Saudi Arabia’s nascent Riyadh Air, announced only in March with plans of becoming the Middle East’s largest airline, is offering US$500,000 tax-free, pilots familiar with global pay rates said.
As with an increasing number of issues, the Albanese government, which promised so much in its election campaign, is looking all too much like its predecessor in its reluctance to make improvements in the airline sector.
God forbid that Qantas was forced to cut its Chairman’s Lounges in the face of sturdy competition and our politicians — looking at you too, teals — and senior public servants were forced to mix with the hoi polloi, take their turn in the queue and perhaps hear why Australians are angry.
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Even the United premium cabin services beats QF, not only that look at the options across the pacific, so many choices.
As for the ME 3, yes there was a disgusting incident but likewise there are some horrifically racial slurs on here, really not needed.
QF need to step up if they want to compete on the international scene.
SQ via Singapore to anywhere with brilliant service, yes expensive.
Turkish will be a brilliant option if they do come in, wonder if they still have the sky chef onboard?
Completion, wait until the Chinese carriers start to really ramp up again.
Aussies do love QF, Scotty from marketing has done a brilliant job, but given choice many Aussies will prefer others, but hey that’s just outbound, inbound business and tourism demands so much more.
As for pilots on domestic sector's, your’re already seeing it with the likes of Air North and the Sth African push, is it the 457? Be careful what you push for as so many Aussies get the USA break on the E3, the difference is the unions are strong and wages are still on the up. Meanwhile in Aus nekminnit…………
As for the ME 3, yes there was a disgusting incident but likewise there are some horrifically racial slurs on here, really not needed.
QF need to step up if they want to compete on the international scene.
SQ via Singapore to anywhere with brilliant service, yes expensive.
Turkish will be a brilliant option if they do come in, wonder if they still have the sky chef onboard?
Completion, wait until the Chinese carriers start to really ramp up again.
Aussies do love QF, Scotty from marketing has done a brilliant job, but given choice many Aussies will prefer others, but hey that’s just outbound, inbound business and tourism demands so much more.
As for pilots on domestic sector's, your’re already seeing it with the likes of Air North and the Sth African push, is it the 457? Be careful what you push for as so many Aussies get the USA break on the E3, the difference is the unions are strong and wages are still on the up. Meanwhile in Aus nekminnit…………
So 24 aircraft to replace 26 A330s. Sounds about right, typical QF.
Either way, it will be ‘revolutionary’, ‘market leading’, ‘game changing’. It’s bloody embarrassing.
Either way, it will be ‘revolutionary’, ‘market leading’, ‘game changing’. It’s bloody embarrassing.
Meanwhile AIPA fiddles…….
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You forgot some throwaway line about increased utilisation. Throw in another wet lease and we are set for some rapid growth!
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Thread Starter
Misogyny, hoarding, massive complaints — Joyce leaves a shocking mess behind
Qantas, our most complained-about company, continues to enjoy the favour of the government — even as its misbehaviour becomes clearer.BERNARD KEANE
AUG 02, 2023
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ALAN JOYCE (IMAGE: AAP/JOEL CARRETT)Outgoing Qantas CEO Alan Joyce may have been beloved of financial markets and the right-wing media, but what might be called “the Joyce model” — underinvestment, attacks on workers, gorging on taxpayer handouts, trying to undermine competitors, offering appalling service and blaming customers when they complain — is looking more and more rotten as his long-delayed (how appropriate!) departure in November nears.Earlier this year Sydney Airport exposed one of Joyce’s anti-competitive tricks, pointing out that Qantas sought slots for significantly more than its 2019 capacity, but then cancelled vast numbers of flights, leaving competitors without slots. (Virgin also cancelled flights, but had sought only 95% of its 2019 capacity.)
Now it’s de-Joyced, Qantas should be returned to the people
Read MoreAfter former Transport Workers’ Union head and now Senator Tony Sheldon had a crack at Qantas, the airline responded on Monday by saying it was all the fault of Sydney’s weather — which at least makes a change from blaming travellers.The Australian Financial Review — which was banned from Qantas lounges because Joyce didn’t like Joe Aston regularly pointing out his flaws — reported today that the airline industry’s complaints “advocate” has been sitting on a report showing a mammoth surge in airline customer complaints in 2022. Unsurprisingly, Qantas dominated the complaints. The airline’s response — things are all better now, don’t worry about what happened in 2022.
But Qantas is the most complained-about company in the country, the Australian Competition and Consumer Commission (ACCC) reported earlier this year. It was using its duopoly with Virgin to gouge customers, the ACCC said in June.
Just to make it a real red-letter day for Qantas, the Herald Sun this morning revealed a misogynist online group operated by male Qantas pilots — allegedly as part of a thriving sexist culture within the airline, partly directed at incoming CEO Vanessa Hudson.
Whether the Herald Sun will now be banned from Qantas lounges remains to be seen. The airline no longer inflicts far-right Sky News on lounge members, but forces passengers using wi-fi to see News Corp content. That means exposing passengers to
Aston’s criticism of Joyce apparently required special intervention, but racism and misinformation are provided as a standard feature.
As Michael Sainsbury pointed out in Crikey on Monday, Australians angered at the systematic trashing of Qantas as a reliable quality airline and its incessant attacks on its own workforce might be wondering why the Albanese government is bending over backwards to protect Qantas from competition by refusing applications from Qatar Airways and Turkish Airlines to add international capacity.
Labor has also allowed the ACCC’s airline monitoring brief to lapse, meaning there is no regular oversight of the kind that identified Qantas’s price-gouging.
And the government — despite Sheldon’s fulminations — is also resisting doing anything about the lack of a genuinely independent complaints body for airlines. The ACCC called for an industry ombudsman in June (as well as fines for cancelling flights) but the government is delaying any consideration of an independent complaints body until 2024.
It continues a pattern whereby governments of both stripes seem to regularly elevate Qantas’ interests above the public interest. With government protection like that, it’s unsurprising that Qantas believes it can do whatever it likes — and maybe that won’t change once Joyce has left the departure lounge
Another astute piece from Mr Aston, un-paywalled for tomorrows paper.
Aug 2, 2023 – 8.15pm
Joe Aston, Australian Financial Review
It’s easy to forget that Anthony Albanese has been in Canberra for a very long time. Entitlement to largesse is a lifelong practice
The recent decision by the Albanese government to block Qatar Airways from launching 28 new flights per week between Doha and Australia has caused quiet amazement in the corridors of Parliament House.
Transport Minister Catherine King’s clarification last week elevated the matter to high farce. She insisted the decision was not related to a human rights incident at Doha Airport in 2020 and instead linked it to her desire “to decarbonise the transport sector”. That was such an arrant non sequitur that the only rational response was laughter.
Anthony Albanese and his son Nathan. Alex Ellinghausen
The dazzling irony is that King offered this implausible explanation for yet another government measure fortifying Qantas’ market power as she stood in London touring Britain’s high-speed rail lines – a mode of travel Qantas’ lobbying machine has successfully obstructed in Australia for at least the past 30 years.
It is genuinely difficult to fathom the hold Qantas seems to have over this government. Air fares are at record highs (and a key factor in high inflation) while customer service levels are recovering from record lows.
In the year to June 30, 2022, the Australian Competition and Consumer Competition received more complaints about Qantas than any other company – the airline blamed COVID-19 disruption but claimed “things have improved and we are getting Qantas back to its best”.
And yet King forced the ACCC to discontinue its airline monitoring program in June by refusing to extend its funding. It’s scandalous, but it’s only in keeping with the long tradition of every Australian government indulging Qantas to an immoderate extent. If there’s any evidence to the contrary, please show it to me.
To be understood, all of this must be viewed through the lens of Anthony Albanese’s incredibly tight relationship with Qantas CEO Alan Joyce, a bond that jars so badly with Albo’s misty-eyed working-class origin story.
What Australian company has in recent years done more to bleed mug punters and even its own workers? Qantas illegally sacked 1700 baggage handlers in November 2020 (all while sucking back $2.7 billion of non-recourse government COVID-19 subsidies). An appeal was heard in May by the High Court, where every presiding justice is a member of the Chairman’s Lounge.
Everyone knows Joyce personally curates the Chairman’s Lounge membership list. Did Qantas offer this extravagant benefit to Albanese or did Albanese request it for his son? When asked this week, neither the airline nor the Prime Minister’s Office would explain. But did any of them really think a university student sweeping into the Chairman’s Lounge like a lord wouldn’t stand out like dog’s balls?
Albanese has never disclosed Nathan’s membership in his statement of registrable interests with the parliament. The PM might argue it’s not required if his son is not technically a dependent (although the Labor leader did say in 2022 that “We’re close, we live together”).
Irrespective of the sophistry relied upon, his son has received this benefit only because of his father’s position. It should be declared, especially by the guy who was elected on an integrity platform. Ask yourself: would Ben Chifley have done this?
Otherwise, where does it end? Should young Nathan get an unlimited balance in his SportsBet account or perhaps a discount from Meriton on his first apartment, all beyond our line of sight?
I have sympathy for Nathan. This is not even about him. This is about the prime minister’s inability to resist a secret freebie, a sly gratuity of public office, or to grasp how compromised he looks.
Albanese was regulating Qantas as transport minister for six years in the Rudd and Gillard governments. What other favours might Qantas have done him (or those close to him) that he felt were unnecessary to declare?
It’s easy to forget Albo has been in Canberra for a very long time. Entitlement to largesse is a lifelong practice. He will barely have opened his own wallet in 30 years. Yet, he’s no worse than the next institutionalised MP, just one inhabitant of a swamp full of chancers.
Remember, it always starts small. It’s the little favours. Please, let the valet take your car. Only the best table in the house. Don’t worry, I know a guy. We’ll make your problem disappear. Before you know it, it’s become normal for your family to be ushered through airports like royalty.
This is what ultimately comes from public officials accepting gifts from Qantas, an industrial-scale, multi-generational influence peddler. They are better than the mafia.
This is how they do it, and why Qantas gets whatever it wants from government, whenever it wants it. It’s why no matter how poorly the company treats Australian voters, the officials that voters depend upon to keep the company accountable can be depended upon to look the other way.
Alan Joyce puts Albo’s son in Qantas Chairman’s Lounge
Aug 2, 2023 – 8.15pm
Joe Aston, Australian Financial Review
It’s easy to forget that Anthony Albanese has been in Canberra for a very long time. Entitlement to largesse is a lifelong practice
The recent decision by the Albanese government to block Qatar Airways from launching 28 new flights per week between Doha and Australia has caused quiet amazement in the corridors of Parliament House.
Transport Minister Catherine King’s clarification last week elevated the matter to high farce. She insisted the decision was not related to a human rights incident at Doha Airport in 2020 and instead linked it to her desire “to decarbonise the transport sector”. That was such an arrant non sequitur that the only rational response was laughter.
Anthony Albanese and his son Nathan. Alex EllinghausenThe dazzling irony is that King offered this implausible explanation for yet another government measure fortifying Qantas’ market power as she stood in London touring Britain’s high-speed rail lines – a mode of travel Qantas’ lobbying machine has successfully obstructed in Australia for at least the past 30 years.
It is genuinely difficult to fathom the hold Qantas seems to have over this government. Air fares are at record highs (and a key factor in high inflation) while customer service levels are recovering from record lows.
In the year to June 30, 2022, the Australian Competition and Consumer Competition received more complaints about Qantas than any other company – the airline blamed COVID-19 disruption but claimed “things have improved and we are getting Qantas back to its best”.
[size=16px]Breaking news: the ACCC told this column on Wednesday that Qantas remained the most complained about company in Australia in the year to June 30, 2023![/size]
And yet King forced the ACCC to discontinue its airline monitoring program in June by refusing to extend its funding. It’s scandalous, but it’s only in keeping with the long tradition of every Australian government indulging Qantas to an immoderate extent. If there’s any evidence to the contrary, please show it to me.
To be understood, all of this must be viewed through the lens of Anthony Albanese’s incredibly tight relationship with Qantas CEO Alan Joyce, a bond that jars so badly with Albo’s misty-eyed working-class origin story.
What Australian company has in recent years done more to bleed mug punters and even its own workers? Qantas illegally sacked 1700 baggage handlers in November 2020 (all while sucking back $2.7 billion of non-recourse government COVID-19 subsidies). An appeal was heard in May by the High Court, where every presiding justice is a member of the Chairman’s Lounge.
Tinpot republics
Speaking of the Chairman’s Lounge, which comfortably generates the highest return on invested capital in the entire Qantas Group, you would not believe who has earned himself access to the pleasures hidden behind its discreet entrance. None other than the prime minister’s 23-year-old son, Nathan Albanese. It’s the stuff tinpot African republics are made of.Everyone knows Joyce personally curates the Chairman’s Lounge membership list. Did Qantas offer this extravagant benefit to Albanese or did Albanese request it for his son? When asked this week, neither the airline nor the Prime Minister’s Office would explain. But did any of them really think a university student sweeping into the Chairman’s Lounge like a lord wouldn’t stand out like dog’s balls?
Albanese has never disclosed Nathan’s membership in his statement of registrable interests with the parliament. The PM might argue it’s not required if his son is not technically a dependent (although the Labor leader did say in 2022 that “We’re close, we live together”).
Irrespective of the sophistry relied upon, his son has received this benefit only because of his father’s position. It should be declared, especially by the guy who was elected on an integrity platform. Ask yourself: would Ben Chifley have done this?
Otherwise, where does it end? Should young Nathan get an unlimited balance in his SportsBet account or perhaps a discount from Meriton on his first apartment, all beyond our line of sight?
I have sympathy for Nathan. This is not even about him. This is about the prime minister’s inability to resist a secret freebie, a sly gratuity of public office, or to grasp how compromised he looks.
Albanese was regulating Qantas as transport minister for six years in the Rudd and Gillard governments. What other favours might Qantas have done him (or those close to him) that he felt were unnecessary to declare?
It’s easy to forget Albo has been in Canberra for a very long time. Entitlement to largesse is a lifelong practice. He will barely have opened his own wallet in 30 years. Yet, he’s no worse than the next institutionalised MP, just one inhabitant of a swamp full of chancers.
Remember, it always starts small. It’s the little favours. Please, let the valet take your car. Only the best table in the house. Don’t worry, I know a guy. We’ll make your problem disappear. Before you know it, it’s become normal for your family to be ushered through airports like royalty.
This is what ultimately comes from public officials accepting gifts from Qantas, an industrial-scale, multi-generational influence peddler. They are better than the mafia.
This is how they do it, and why Qantas gets whatever it wants from government, whenever it wants it. It’s why no matter how poorly the company treats Australian voters, the officials that voters depend upon to keep the company accountable can be depended upon to look the other way.
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