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Express Freighter EBA

Old 11th Aug 2022, 12:24
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Express Freighter EBA

Widely reported, as the engineering industrial action looms:

ďOn Thursday, 100 pilots at cargo airline Express Freighters Australia accepted Qantasís offer of a backdated two-year wage freeze followed by a 2 per cent annual increase after 69 per cent of its union members voted in favour of the agreement. This is the offer extended to the entire group including the licensed engineers.

Any truth here ?

Rgds to all.
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Old 11th Aug 2022, 14:06
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Originally Posted by Australia2 View Post
Widely reported, as the engineering industrial action looms:

“On Thursday, 100 pilots at cargo airline Express Freighters Australia accepted Qantas’s offer of a backdated two-year wage freeze followed by a 2 per cent annual increase after 69 per cent of its union members voted in favour of the agreement. This is the offer extended to the entire group including the licensed engineers.

Any truth here ?

Rgds to all.
Not sure about the specifics of the EFA deal but basic wage numbers are only one part of an EBA, they could be offset by provisions or incentives in other parts of the contract.
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Old 11th Aug 2022, 14:07
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Well if thatís true thatís very poor. Maybe not a surprise if you know the backgrounds of a lot of the group there.
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Old 12th Aug 2022, 03:35
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Well when your weak a pi$$ union tell the pilots to vote yes what do you expect? Both afap and aipa indicated that they supported the proposed deal.

The deal was absolute garbage. Barely above the award and significant reductions in the conditions compared to the award.

The only reason that the deal was voted up was due to the back pay and the company indicating that the deal would be off if they said no. And as usual the pilots and the weak unions fell for it!
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Old 12th Aug 2022, 09:45
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Originally Posted by Australia2 View Post
Widely reported, as the engineering industrial action looms:

ďOn Thursday, 100 pilots at cargo airline Express Freighters Australia accepted Qantasís offer of a backdated two-year wage freeze followed by a 2 per cent annual increase after 69 per cent of its union members voted in favour of the agreement. This is the offer extended to the entire group including the licensed engineers.

Any truth here ?

Rgds to all.
So a net loss of approximately 15% over 4 years taking into account inflation, can't understand why people are bailing on aviation
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Old 12th Aug 2022, 11:04
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Originally Posted by airdualbleedfault View Post
So a net loss of approximately 15% over 4 years taking into account inflation, can't understand why people are bailing on aviation
In this inflationary environment itís effectively a pay cut, agreed.

Unfortunately it now sets the tone for QF, JQ, Q/link, Network and soon to be Alliance. (In no particular order)

We certainly seem disconnected down here from the supply & demand metrics of world wide aviation.

Resignations and shortages will be the only thing that mandates change.

Best wishes to all for the weekend. 🍺
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Old 12th Aug 2022, 13:04
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What was the % yes vote?
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Old 12th Aug 2022, 14:10
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Originally Posted by strim View Post
What was the % yes vote?
69% in favour was reported.
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Old 12th Aug 2022, 15:32
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Originally Posted by davidclarke View Post
The only reason that the deal was voted up was due to the back pay and the company indicating that the deal would be off if they said no.
Gee that's a surprise, I've never heard them try that before. Oh wait.......
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Old 13th Aug 2022, 00:40
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Originally Posted by davidclarke View Post
Well when your weak a pi$$ union tell the pilots to vote yes what do you expect? Both afap and aipa indicated that they supported the proposed deal.

The deal was absolute garbage. Barely above the award and significant reductions in the conditions compared to the award.

The only reason that the deal was voted up was due to the back pay and the company indicating that the deal would be off if they said no. And as usual the pilots and the weak unions fell for it!
Maybe a lot will take the backpay and walk!
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Old 15th Aug 2022, 08:02
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https://www.qantasnewsroom.com.au/me...opping-demand/

EA gets voted up, new jets announced. Itís the Qantas Group way now!

Is there a pay increase for the larger more efficient aircraft, or is Qantas the only winner (yet again)?
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Old 15th Aug 2022, 08:07
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Originally Posted by Transition Layer View Post
https://www.qantasnewsroom.com.au/me...opping-demand/

EA gets voted up, new jets announced. Itís the Qantas Group way now!

Is there a pay increase for the larger more efficient aircraft, or is Qantas the only winner (yet again)?
Sourced on the open market! Hope theyre as good as the 734F that was acquired the same way🤣
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Old 15th Aug 2022, 09:18
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Originally Posted by dr dre View Post
Not sure about the specifics of the EFA deal but basic wage numbers are only one part of an EBA, they could be offset by provisions or incentives in other parts of the contract.
Well said Dr Dre,
There is more than one way to get a pay rise into your contract. Those who actually know what the pilots voted on would be aware that the pay increase is more than what is being quoted. Of course Qantas arenít going to mention that, it would spoil the Group-wide wage policy.
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Old 15th Aug 2022, 09:20
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Originally Posted by Beer Baron View Post
Well said Dr Dre,
There is more than one way to get a pay rise into your contract. Those who actually know what the pilots voted on would be aware that the pay increase is more than what is being quoted. Of course Qantas arenít going to mention that, it would spoil the Group-wide wage policy.
Except the EBA will be public in a few days when it gets ratified and sent to the FWC, so I don't exactly know what the point is in keeping things secret?
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Old 15th Aug 2022, 09:33
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Originally Posted by Gunner747400 View Post
Except the EBA will be public in a few days when it gets ratified and sent to the FWC, so I don't exactly know what the point is in keeping things secret?
The media arenít really going to go hunting through each individual contract, make a detailed analysis of the exact payments made per hour with all the trimmings on a multitude of hours flown, and then report the earth shattering news to the world that a few pilots are actually getting a little bit more than a pay freeze at the end of the day.

The ďgroup wages policyĒ that is mentioned every time an EBA is voted up is to make it seem to investors that the company is reigning in staff wages and that makes investors happy, pushing the share price up. However whilst the standard hourly rate may be frozen thereís a dozen ways the actual money flowing into your bank account every fortnight can be altered. Changes to minimum guarantee, changes to overtime rates, shift penalties, different calculations for credit hours, new allowances etc. Obviously these arenít really communicated beyond the pilots voting on that specific EBA.
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Old 15th Aug 2022, 09:36
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Originally Posted by dr dre View Post
The media arenít really going to go hunting through each individual contract, make a detailed analysis of the exact payments made per hour with all the trimmings on a multitude of hours flown, and then report the earth shattering news to the world that a few pilots are actually getting more than a pay freeze at the end of the day.

The ďgroup wages policyĒ that is mentioned every time an EBA is to make it seem to investors that QF is reigning in overpaid staff wages and that makes investors happy, pushing the share price up. However whilst the standard hourly rate may be frozen thereís a dozen ways the actual money flowing into your bank account every fortnight can be altered. Changes to minimum guarantee, changes to overtime rates, shift penalties, different calculations for credit hours, new allowances etc. Obviously these arenít really communicated beyond the pilots voting on that specific EBA.
So all positive things that could be used as precedent in other entities next EBA agreements?

Good to know. I'll be sure to check it out when it drops on the FWC.
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Old 15th Aug 2022, 09:42
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Originally Posted by Gunner747400 View Post
So all positive things that could be used as precedent in other entities next EBA agreements?

Good to know. I'll be sure to check it out when it drops on the FWC.
I donít know for sure about that specific deal, just speculating how a good deal could be made whilst technically the hourly rates donít move.

There could be other non monetary incentives added to get the deal over the line, more days off, improvements to lifestyles and rosters, more leave, better hotelsÖÖ
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Old 15th Aug 2022, 23:21
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Originally Posted by Beer Baron View Post
Well said Dr Dre,
There is more than one way to get a pay rise into your contract. Those who actually know what the pilots voted on would be aware that the pay increase is more than what is being quoted. Of course Qantas arenít going to mention that, it would spoil the Group-wide wage policy.

The base rates went up more than the 2% wage policy, but the only reason they went above this was to get the base salary above the award!!!!

One of the base rates went up nearly 9%. This shows just how far below the award EFA pilots were, yet over the last 3 years the company nor the union attempted to do anything about it.
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Old 16th Aug 2022, 01:03
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Originally Posted by davidclarke View Post
The base rates went up more than the 2% wage policy, but the only reason they went above this was to get the base salary above the award!!!!

One of the base rates went up nearly 9%. This shows just how far below the award EFA pilots were, yet over the last 3 years the company nor the union attempted to do anything about it.
The EFA blokes should have made an application to have their EA cancelled. Give the IR Grubs a taste of their own medicine.
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Old 16th Aug 2022, 01:18
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Exactly. What was the union doing flying around on a below award EA anyway?? What do you pay your subscription for?
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