Qantas to lay out roadmap for restart of international flights

[Bad Adventures]

https://www.executivetraveller.com/n...Bx7oXgsj-B8BOw

[Telfer86]

From the article "2022 is expected to see the return of international travel for most Australians – certainly those who've been vaccinated"
Does anyone believe a word of this given the daily infection & daily death rates in both the USA & UK , that are occurring right now
Interesting article in SMH today by Prof John Dwyer , stating the UK is currently getting 800 hospital admissions per day , 90 deaths
Does anyone seriously believe there will be regular scheduled services to USA/UK in 2023 ? Even more grim in developing Asian countries
Does anyone think the State Premiers will sign off on these kind of numbers ?
I was hoping for 50% domestic , 25 % international two years in , - no chance of making those numbers now, that is three years in (at best)

[compressor stall]

Look beyond the moat Telfer.

The fact is the world is opening up again, and fast. The huge COVID numbers are not causing deaths, so more enlightened countries have got the ~80% jab and are opening. Some are not counting cases, just hospitalisations. There is no fear of the virus if you are jabbed. That is the future.

I was on a 380 long haul the other day. Lower floor not a spare seat. Business upstairs 1/3 full. People are starting to move in vast numbers. There is a way to go but the swell is building. Airports are getting busy.

QF is paddling out into the swell looking for incoming wave. They can be on the front of it and savour success, or at the back of it and watch others take take glory to shore. It does cost a lot to be in the water though waiting for permission to ride the wave.

[ruprecht]

Originally Posted by Telfer86

From the article "2022 is expected to see the return of international travel for most Australians – certainly those who've been vaccinated"
Does anyone believe a word of this given the daily infection & daily death rates in both the USA & UK , that are occurring right now
Interesting article in SMH today by Prof John Dwyer , stating the UK is currently getting 800 hospital admissions per day , 90 deaths
Does anyone seriously believe there will be regular scheduled services to USA/UK in 2023 ? Even more grim in developing Asian countries
Does anyone think the State Premiers will sign off on these kind of numbers ?
I was hoping for 50% domestic , 25 % international two years in , - no chance of making those numbers now, that is three years in (at best)

The same John Dwyer who thinks that “Australians would not accept the appalling proposition that we and our government have no duty of care to those who refuse vaccination”?

I have news for John Dwyer. Thats exactly what I think.

[ExtraShot]

The same John Dwyer who thinks that “Australians would not accept the appalling proposition that we and our government have no duty of care to those who refuse vaccination”?

I have news for John Dwyer. Thats exactly what I think.

Yup. Me too.

For all his apparent intellect and qualifications, if that’s what he said, and he thinks we should continue to sacrifice to save those who don’t want to do their bit to save themselves, then the guy sounds like a clown.

[Telfer86]

They are causing deaths 100 per day in UK & several hundred daily in the USA

The question is do you think there is snowflakes chance in hell of the Aussie State Premiers changing their
doctrine of zero risk

Do you think guys like McGowan are going to let people from the most infected developed countries in the world (such as UK)
arrive in WA, same for the Queenslander & Victorian

Vic Premier loves his one hour press conferences , the time in front of the camera, the control - do you think he will just give that up ?

They have a seat at the table now whether people like it or not

But stranger things have happened perhaps WA will allow the Brits to enjoy the WA seaside & remain closed to East Australia
& perhaps QLD will allow American tourists whilst banning NSW & Vic

[neville_nobody]

They are causing deaths 100 per day in UK & several hundred daily in the USA

The question is do you think there is snowflakes chance in hell of the Aussie State Premiers changing their
doctrine of zero risk

Do you think guys like McGowan are going to let people from the most infected developed countries in the world (such as UK)
arrive in WA, same for the Queenslander & Victorian

Vic Premier loves his one hour press conferences , the time in front of the camera, the control - do you think he will just give that up ?

They have a seat at the table now whether people like it or not

100% agree but noone believes it yet. People just think Australians will revolt even though Australians never revolt and generally stand for nothing, whilst ridiculing those that do.

The other situation which could arise is a Federal Labor Government as everyone will blame ScoMo for their woes vote in Labor who will then be held hostage by their own State Premiers.

[ExtraShot]

Do you think once the 80% vax rate is reached (perhaps it should include 12 years and up or something not 16 but that’s beside the general point), and people have done their bit, that people will be happy to just sit and watch others in the same county but just happen to be in a different state enjoying international travel, freedoms and the ability to return to jobs and businesses while they are still forced into cowering, isolation and lockdown? I don’t.

I say lockdown because zero Covid is a fantasy that won’t happen once other jurisdictions open up. WA and QLD for example will still have truckies, airline crew, defence, pollies and the like all traveling in and out. They can’t supply themselves with everything they need in isolation. We’ve seen that Quarantine is porous. The virus will one way or another be in WA and QLD and they’ll be locked down repeatedly forever trying to repel it. Completely unrealistic.

The premiers won’t want to give up their power, some seem to be relishing it. But the political capital, no matter how great, will eventually run out.

[SHVC]

I was watching the Today show this morning, there was a segment with QLD senator AS regarding on opening domestic borders and the games S Miles is playing, 2 minutes 39sec is when he pops up.
Now KS presses Amanda on what the PM will do if the states don't do what they signed up for. What powers could the PM enact that he hasn't been able to so far?

S Miles

[Foxxster]

I certainly won’t be booking internationally until I see at least 4 to 6 months of.

Life in the country or countries I want to visit carrying on as normal. By that I mean no lockdowns, no closure of their internal or external borders, no events like sporting, theatre etc being cancelled etc etc

no quarantine required either before you leave the country or upon return to Australia

no internal border closures. No point flying from Sydney to say Hawaii or wherever but on return not being able to get back to your home state of Qld or WA etc.

I cannot see all this happening at the start of 2022. For example the UK is now cancelling many theatre productions despite being opened up. And many European countries seem to change from green to orange to red etc. many people travel to Europe to see more than one country.

[neville_nobody]

Do you think once the 80% vax rate is reached (perhaps it should include 12 years and up or something not 16 but that’s beside the general point), and people have done their bit, that people will be happy to just sit and watch others in the same county but just happen to be in a different state enjoying international travel, freedoms and the ability to return to jobs and businesses while they are still forced into cowering, isolation and lockdown?

As I said Australians stand for nothing, and the majority are not affected by Covid 19, in fact it has been a economic boom for them. Any Tradesman with an investment property is absolutely killing it right now. Any government worker is not affected. Healthcare has carried on. In reality it's only Airlines and Travel Agents who are suffering.

QLD and WA have years to run in their Electoral Cycles so people can bitch all they like but it ain't going change. Unless you can find a real legal challenge and finance the court case you are powerless. The problem for isolationist states will be the impending economic implosion as they start running out of labour, and the economic impact of "being safe" starts to hit.

[ExtraShot]

Originally Posted by neville_nobody

As I said Australians stand for nothing, and the majority are not affected by Covid 19, in fact it has been a economic boom for them. Any Tradesman with an investment property is absolutely killing it right now. Any government worker is not affected. Healthcare has carried on. In reality it's only Airlines and Travel Agents who are suffering.

QLD and WA have years to run in their Electoral Cycles so people can bitch all they like but it ain't going change. Unless you can find a real legal challenge and finance the court case you are powerless. The problem for isolationist states will be the impending economic implosion as they start running out of labour, and the economic impact of "being safe" starts to hit.

But McGowan has stated in no uncertain terms he wants continue Zero Covid, Zero Deaths even after 80% of the adult population has done the right things. An utter impossibility if the other states do go along with the agreed pathway because of the way supply chains and other things operate in this country along with the transmissibility of Covid Delta. At that point, WA is locking down and continuing isolation in perpetuity while watching the rest of the country run wild and free, and they are doing so to protect those who've largely refused to look after themselves with vaccination. People won't cop it. I honestly believe that's where his political capital runs out. Agreed, Australians don't generally protest, and his electoral comeuppance is a long way off, but he seems to largely operate at the whim of his political backers (local mining, media and property development magnates)., and As you say, the labour difficulties will start to really bite (hint, they are already in the residential construction industry), and that's where we might see change.

Qantas is right to establish a pathway out, there will be states that allow them to do it, eventually others will be coerced into joining. If not at 80% vax, then when?

[ruprecht]

Not to mention the largish community of expat Poms and South Africans in Perth.

[donpizmeov]

Originally Posted by ruprecht

Not to mention the largish community of expat Poms and South Africans in Perth.

One way tickets only for them fella?

Good news is travel outside fortress Australia bounced back very quickly.
Now vaccination is picking up in Oz it will there as well.

Hope you are doing well mate.

[Telfer86]

2022 is only Four months away

I think we would be lucky to re-establish a bubble with NZ by February 2022

If you think you will be going OS in 2022 with the control freaks we have as State Premiers , well I think that is very very optimistic , almost delusional

Its all very well quoting what might be occurring in Europe , America etc , - it just isn't relevant to the guys that control things here

You saw the hubris of Statie in Aussie last year who took out highest body count trophy - never once admitted fault, deflected , denied & spinning
Its about polls , it's about face time on telly & its about number of likes on your social media platforms

WA opening to South Africa & UK - are you serious ? SA isn't it the most infected country in Africa with SFA vaccinations

It would be lucky for someone from Melbourne to get to WA(or QLD) by start of 2022 , NSW forget it - you will be in your home state over the summer holidays

The vax target was set to be pretty much unachievable

There are dead bodies on the streets in most of the Vietnamese regional towns

Anyone still think they will be yodelling on the Swiss Alps during the upcoming Ski Season ?

[SHVC]

OS travel will not happen in 2022 that’s a certainty. NSW having the highest vaccination rate in the world and currently will not reach the target of 70% fully vaccinated until end of October 2 mo the away, that means the rest of Australia is well behind and won’t be there Until 2022. I will be surprised if domestic flying starts out of NSW before March/April 2022. At the current rate, there won’t be a restaurant to visit in Sydney, there won’t be a corner store left and what capacity the QF group, VA will look like will be interesting.

Im going out of my mind seeing the world open up, ppl going to packed concerts, dining out and just enjoying life. Here we are like this with no end on site.

[ExtraShot]

Anyone still think they will be yodelling on the Swiss Alps during the upcoming Ski Season ?

No, but that really shouldnt be the discussion. Qantas' roadmap out will likely be over the course of 2022-23. It will no doubt start with bubbles, and go from there. It will likely be gradual, and in line with the guidance provided by Morrisons four step pathway out. It will then be up to the Feds, Qantas, along with other business leaders to push the narrative for the Premiers to adhere to the agreed steps, none of which state Zero Cases, Zero Deaths as being part of the pathway out. Jetstar (Virgin) Jane was on the money in terms of the reality of the situation earlier in the year. She was pilloried for saying (shock, horror), that (GASP!)... that the disease will become endemic similar to the flu and some people sadly will die from it... unfortunately I believe Alan Joyce went missing and should have been there loudly supporting her. On the 13/07 the Western Australian CHO Andy Robertson appeared on talkback radio in Perth as pretty much said exactly the same thing as Jane did, and there was no outrage at all, go figure - https://www.6pr.com.au/tougher-restr...ning-from-nsw/ ( from about the 11 minute mark).

Qantas have to prepare for something, they have been given the proposed steps, with no doubt additional advice from people within government and will formulate a path forward on that. What else do they have to work with?

[Chris2303]

Originally Posted by Telfer86

2022 is only Four months away

I think we would be lucky to re-establish a bubble with NZ by February 2022

I wouldn't guarantee it. My feeling is that our erstwhile PM may be forced to listen to public opinion before she reopens the Tasman, instead of the bleating of the opposition and big business. It is the latter two groups that have forced upon us 107 positive cases (total) today.

[krismiler]

Australia is late in the vaccination game due to delay in granting approval and complacency. Initially very few people were infected due to locking the borders early on. However, slowly but surely, similar to other countries such as Taiwan and Thailand which avoided early outbreaks, the virus is now endemic. Zero COVID cases is now impossible, we have to live with it. Vaccinated people with negative tests prior to travel are an acceptable risk. Opening up will result in a slight increase in case numbers, and some people will die but the world can't remain shut out indefinitely.

Fortunately we can study the experiences of other countries which have already opened up and avoid their mistakes. A few months ago, approval ratings for the politicians were running high when COVID was seen as being kept out by strict quarantine requirements, now we have the public rioting while unpopularity grows daily. That might get them to change course.

[Bad Adventures]

‘O/S travel won’t happen in 2022, that’s a certainty.’ Is it lol. What other doomsday pearls of wisdom do you have for us Nostradamus.