QF Group possible Redundancy Numbers/Packages
Join Date: Jan 2006
Location: Sydney
Posts: 165
Originally Posted by Turnleft080
I do expect some equity to be destroyed during a pandemic, the outflow of $40m a week is testament to that. There’s nothing you, I or AJ can do about that.
Struth 40m a week, as a comparison during Ansett's last years they were losing 7m a week. The value of money in 20 years. I realise different era.
Struth 40m a week, as a comparison during Ansett's last years they were losing 7m a week. The value of money in 20 years. I realise different era.
Salary costs alone were abut $86m a week(4,5bn a year) before covid - thats before you take into account the other costs like office rent, aircraft, overheads etc.
Join Date: Apr 1999
Location: Sydney, N.S.W. Australia
Posts: 147
Originally Posted by unobtanium
Try 5
Andrew David - Domestic and Freight
Tino - International
Olivia - Loyalty
Gareth Evans - Jetstar
And Alan Joyce, CEO of CEO's.
https://www.qantas.com/au/en/qantas-...eadership.html
Andrew David - Domestic and Freight
Tino - International
Olivia - Loyalty
Gareth Evans - Jetstar
And Alan Joyce, CEO of CEO's.
https://www.qantas.com/au/en/qantas-...eadership.html
Join Date: Jun 2019
Location: Denmark
Posts: 385
What is the real number of redundancies here? I think 250 is well short. JQ have already threaten of mass lay offs Given a quoted email from the union which will happen even if the new EBA is signed end of July. QF surely will have to make more cuts to its international and domestic 737 crew.
Now that VA have very deep pockets with Bain I would think they will come out smaller but stronger than QF
Now that VA have very deep pockets with Bain I would think they will come out smaller but stronger than QF
Join Date: Aug 2007
Location: sincity
Posts: 1,079
Originally Posted by Ragnor
What is the real number of redundancies here? I think 250 is well short. JQ have already threaten of mass lay offs Given a quoted email from the union which will happen even if the new EBA is signed end of July. QF surely will have to make more cuts to its international and domestic 737 crew.
Now that VA have very deep pockets with Bain I would think they will come out smaller but stronger than QF
Now that VA have very deep pockets with Bain I would think they will come out smaller but stronger than QF
shorthaul? How so? Rotating stand down with low mgh.... why cuts?
long haul? Indefinite stand down costs little.
redundency costs alot.
Join Date: Dec 2004
Location: melbourne
Posts: 299
Originally Posted by Ragnor
What is the real number of redundancies here? I think 250 is well short. JQ have already threaten of mass lay offs Given a quoted email from the union which will happen even if the new EBA is signed end of July. QF surely will have to make more cuts to its international and domestic 737 crew.
Now that VA have very deep pockets with Bain I would think they will come out smaller but stronger than QF
Now that VA have very deep pockets with Bain I would think they will come out smaller but stronger than QF
When i first saw the figure of 220-250 pilots it seemed very low,with 12 380s & 6 747s gone the figure for those 2 fleets alone would exceed the numbers they are quoting & then theres 330s,787s & the jq 787s,just doesnt add up.
Join Date: Sep 2007
Location: Australia
Posts: 151
QF SH pilots are forecast to all be stood up by the end of this year. There will be no changes to SH. In fact, there has been some discussion about allowing additional LH crew to be trained onto 737 temporarily to save some jobs. Obviously that’s a fair way off and any change would need to be voted on by the SH crew. This would be a mechanism to save junior crew, not to allow old mate 4 eng capt to extend his career for a few more years.
Join Date: Jun 2010
Location: Sydney
Age: 37
Posts: 483
Someone in the webinar made the comment of a LWOP would count towards the 190 total. Well not really. If 190 pilots from the 380 take LWOP then 2-3 years down the track we have the exact same problem again (minus retirements).
Join Date: Jun 2019
Location: Denmark
Posts: 385
Originally Posted by maggot
why?
shorthaul? How so? Rotating stand down with low mgh.... why cuts?
long haul? Indefinite stand down costs little.
redundency costs alot.
shorthaul? How so? Rotating stand down with low mgh.... why cuts?
long haul? Indefinite stand down costs little.
redundency costs alot.
Stand down with roster on roster off does cost more than people allow. You have AL, LSL accrual then you have EPs, sims then paxing for sims then a hotel room human factors, DGs, cost of an ASIC cost of parking the list goes on more than you think. So the 250 is most likely just what Jetstar will do, how many LH and SH pilots will QF fund with a down turn of pax numbers. Just saying 250 is very far from the truth.
Join Date: Aug 2007
Location: sincity
Posts: 1,079
Originally Posted by normanton
Someone in the webinar made the comment of a LWOP would count towards the 190 total. Well not really. If 190 pilots from the 380 take LWOP then 2-3 years down the track we have the exact same problem again (minus retirements).
Join Date: Jul 2002
Location: Brisbane
Age: 49
Posts: 230
Originally Posted by Ragnor
how many LH and SH pilots will QF fund with a down turn of pax numbers. Just saying 250 is very far from the truth.
You have been provided a figure with reasons behind it. If you call bulls!t then I suspect no figure that is given will be adequate.
There wouldn't be a QF/J*/VA pilot in the bottom third or quarter of their respective lists that isn't looking over their shoulder right now.
Join Date: May 2006
Location: Australia
Posts: 331
I doubt they’ll offer them 737 slots.
At the moment those LHaulers approaching 65 can’t rely on a 737 slot to keep going.
If there isn’t one there they can’t take it.
I bet the company will want that demographic to take the VR package.
Especially seeing that most of them are on the 74 and 380.
The bigger issue is how long can they keep them stood down.
I doubt a reasonable person would expect that to be three years?
At the moment those LHaulers approaching 65 can’t rely on a 737 slot to keep going.
If there isn’t one there they can’t take it.
I bet the company will want that demographic to take the VR package.
Especially seeing that most of them are on the 74 and 380.
The bigger issue is how long can they keep them stood down.
I doubt a reasonable person would expect that to be three years?
Join Date: Aug 2018
Location: Melbourne
Posts: 382
Originally Posted by Ragnor
What is the real number of redundancies here? I think 250 is well short. JQ have already threaten of mass lay offs Given a quoted email from the union which will happen even if the new EBA is signed end of July. QF surely will have to make more cuts to its international and domestic 737 crew.
Now that VA have very deep pockets with Bain I would think they will come out smaller but stronger than QF
Now that VA have very deep pockets with Bain I would think they will come out smaller but stronger than QF
So far the JQ pilot redundancies are around half a dozen F/Os from NZ and none from Australia. PER and NTL closing but those aircraft being redeployed to MEL & BNE.
Yes, Virgin will now have deep pockets, but they will likely be a more rational competitor with Bain steering them to a mid market carrier. In the Aus domestic market we already have Tiger gone, VA reducing to 40-50 737s, VA A330s gone.
My reading of the situation is that most of the shrinking of the domestic market will be absorbed by a downsized Virgin, and QF group should return to a similiar capacity of 2019 by mid 2021. But that’s only my opinion, I could be wrong.
Join Date: May 2010
Location: In the Trees
Posts: 156
Originally Posted by ECAMACTIONSCOMPLETE
I didn’t see any such email, unless you’re referring to the NZ operation communication regarding stand down provisions being included into their agreement.
So far the JQ pilot redundancies are around half a dozen F/Os from NZ and none from Australia. PER and NTL closing but those aircraft being redeployed to MEL & BNE.
Yes, Virgin will now have deep pockets, but they will likely be a more rational competitor with Bain steering them to a mid market carrier. In the Aus domestic market we already have Tiger gone, VA reducing to 40-50 737s, VA A330s gone.
My reading of the situation is that most of the shrinking of the domestic market will be absorbed by a downsized Virgin, and QF group should return to a similiar capacity of 2019 by mid 2021. But that’s only my opinion, I could be wrong.
So far the JQ pilot redundancies are around half a dozen F/Os from NZ and none from Australia. PER and NTL closing but those aircraft being redeployed to MEL & BNE.
Yes, Virgin will now have deep pockets, but they will likely be a more rational competitor with Bain steering them to a mid market carrier. In the Aus domestic market we already have Tiger gone, VA reducing to 40-50 737s, VA A330s gone.
My reading of the situation is that most of the shrinking of the domestic market will be absorbed by a downsized Virgin, and QF group should return to a similiar capacity of 2019 by mid 2021. But that’s only my opinion, I could be wrong.
Respective unions have a massive job ahead of them to try and keep redundancies down.
Join Date: Aug 2018
Location: Melbourne
Posts: 382
Originally Posted by ANCDU
ECAM I think Jetstar is in line for a big hit too, a lot of aircraft used to do Bali, Tasman and the pacific, and not from NZ. Just by numbers if you say just a fifth of the narrow body fleet was flying internationally that’s a lot of crew that have no work. It’s no use transferring airframes from PER to MEL if their flying doesn’t exist anymore. This is a time when all unions needs to work with management to try and save the careers of those near the bottom of the airlines respective lists. There’s just not enough flying domestically in Australia for the number of pilots, in any of the major airlines.
Respective unions have a massive job ahead of them to try and keep redundancies down.
Respective unions have a massive job ahead of them to try and keep redundancies down.
That leaves about 5 extra NB frames that did the Bali flying, however we were 2 frames short prior to COVID due to the aircraft sent to Network with no decrease in the JQ domestic schedule and about 50 pilots short, about to embark on a big round of recruitment with many guys flying close to 100 hrs a month.
The official word from GE was no pilot redundancies from the Aus operation.
The company hasn’t been shy about letting JQ Asia and JQNZ know about redundancies so if there were plans in the works to let Aussie guys go they would’ve let us know. But of course plans can change.
Also worth noting is that while the broader QF group is having 20% of their workforce slashed, the figure for JQ is 6% (mainly head office).
It seems the biggest threat is closing more smaller bases and transferring the flying to the big 3.
Last edited by ECAMACTIONSCOMPLETE; 29th Jun 2020 at 05:31.
Join Date: Nov 2018
Location: Darwin
Posts: 11
Who’s going to take LWOP? There’s no jobs to go to this time (except maybe the guys that can get back into the airforce).
Obviously the company loves the idea because it gets people off the books for a few years without having a cough up the cash for redundancy. Having your cake and eating it too.
Obviously the company loves the idea because it gets people off the books for a few years without having a cough up the cash for redundancy. Having your cake and eating it too.
Nunc est bibendum
Join Date: Apr 1999
Location: Sydney, Australia
Posts: 5,309
Any 747 or A380 pilot over the age of 63 should be wishing for a VR offer. Even if the company offered just the leave they would accrue over the next 12-24 months whilst stood down and to cash out their current leave balance, with the tax rates applied for redundancy the crew member would be well in front of what they’d get otherwise just sticking it out on stand down.
Anything above that number that AIPA can negotiate is a win for those crew.
Of course it depends on whether one thinks those crew can be kept stood down beyond March next year, whether the international borders are open and so on. So still a bit of a mess to work through.
One thing for sure. There are no winners in all of this. Everyone loses. Some will just lose less than others.
Anything above that number that AIPA can negotiate is a win for those crew.
Of course it depends on whether one thinks those crew can be kept stood down beyond March next year, whether the international borders are open and so on. So still a bit of a mess to work through.
One thing for sure. There are no winners in all of this. Everyone loses. Some will just lose less than others.
Join Date: May 2011
Location: BNE
Posts: 0
QF to resume TT 20 July 2020
Qantas plans to resume Trans-Tasman services from July 20, 2020 with the following:
Brisbane – Auckland 14 weekly
Brisbane – Christchurch 7 weekly
Brisbane – Queenstown 3 weekly
Melbourne – Auckland 27 weekly
Melbourne – Christchurch 5 weekly
Melbourne – Queenstown 3 weekly
Melbourne – Wellington 7 weekly
Sydney – Auckland 34 weekly
Sydney – Christchurch 7 weekly
Sydney – Queenstown 14 weekly
Sydney – Wellington 14 weekly
from routesonline
Brisbane – Auckland 14 weekly
Brisbane – Christchurch 7 weekly
Brisbane – Queenstown 3 weekly
Melbourne – Auckland 27 weekly
Melbourne – Christchurch 5 weekly
Melbourne – Queenstown 3 weekly
Melbourne – Wellington 7 weekly
Sydney – Auckland 34 weekly
Sydney – Christchurch 7 weekly
Sydney – Queenstown 14 weekly
Sydney – Wellington 14 weekly
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Join Date: Jul 2002
Location: Brisbane
Age: 49
Posts: 230
Originally Posted by Keg
Any 747 or A380 pilot over the age of 63 should be wishing for a VR offer.
Join Date: Jun 2011
Location: The World
Posts: 909
Originally Posted by Overspeed1
Who’s going to take LWOP? There’s no jobs to go to this time.
Obviously there won’t be as many taking up the offer as those who took up other airline pilot positions in previous eras of LWOP. But I think a few will.
