Ruckus on Jetstar Aircraft
This whole issue can be killed off if they just put a cutout of the standard cabin bag dimensions on security xray machines like they do in the US. That way security can tell them that the bag is oversized and to go check it in. It will save the airline personnel then telling them later on. That way all passengers of all airlines are treated the same.
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They often have security personnel before security at the Brisbane international terminal, checking hand luggage. They check size as well as weight & they are quite ruthless.
I've sometimes thought they were a little over zealous in the performance of their duties & have had the odd argument regarding the weight of my flight bag when in civies, but perhaps more of this might go some of the way to solving the problem
I've sometimes thought they were a little over zealous in the performance of their duties & have had the odd argument regarding the weight of my flight bag when in civies, but perhaps more of this might go some of the way to solving the problem
Valid point givemewings.
Lets see travelled on the bogan bus last Friday, bogan #1 complete with oversized backpack, pillow and doona climbs aboard and starts trying to find a space for its belongings. Bogan #2 arrives on board and tries to find its seat, pretty easy really row 1 starts at the front of the bogan mover and row 30 is at the back, not reall tricky and the seat number's do run in sequential order, not for this fruitcake we get on at the front and fight our way down to the back, and then we start to organise the locker to fit our backpack which weighs at least 20kgs-before anyone disputes the figure I know exactly how much it weighed because it landed on headed not once but f3cking twice. The reason it finished up on top me was because the overheaded locker is only a certain size and therefore no about of grunting, pushing or shoving was going to make it fit. Bogan #3 arrives 5'6'' but with a backpack the same size, but as she does a three point turn in the aisle she promptly smacks the old dear across from me into the middle of next week, as she swings the backpack up into the locker!
Lets see travelled on the bogan bus last Friday, bogan #1 complete with oversized backpack, pillow and doona climbs aboard and starts trying to find a space for its belongings. Bogan #2 arrives on board and tries to find its seat, pretty easy really row 1 starts at the front of the bogan mover and row 30 is at the back, not reall tricky and the seat number's do run in sequential order, not for this fruitcake we get on at the front and fight our way down to the back, and then we start to organise the locker to fit our backpack which weighs at least 20kgs-before anyone disputes the figure I know exactly how much it weighed because it landed on headed not once but f3cking twice. The reason it finished up on top me was because the overheaded locker is only a certain size and therefore no about of grunting, pushing or shoving was going to make it fit. Bogan #3 arrives 5'6'' but with a backpack the same size, but as she does a three point turn in the aisle she promptly smacks the old dear across from me into the middle of next week, as she swings the backpack up into the locker!
I find it most interesting that most people here do not support the customer. Now you might ask, why I would ask such a question, well without the customer you people ( read pilots) have no job, I will say that again, since it is clear that there are some, shall we say, slow people here, without the traveling public there would be a very much reduced requirement for pilots and, ofcourse. all the other people that make aviation happen. In my experience, I have found as many, shall we say, "tossers" that are pilots,aircraft and airline owners and operaters as I have found "tosser" customers.
Just sayen.
Just sayen.
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The customers got their flight cancelled because of people that can't control themselves.
The customers paid for a ticket to go from a-b and got a free circus act thrown in.
Actually I think I'm pretty much on the side of the customer just not that of the ones that can't behave like adults.
The customers paid for a ticket to go from a-b and got a free circus act thrown in.
Actually I think I'm pretty much on the side of the customer just not that of the ones that can't behave like adults.
Well you may be right, but, if I was walking down a street looking for a cafe to have a meal and I was told by a spruiker that the meals inside were, say, $10 then I went inside and had a meal and found it was $20, I think I would feel justified in complaining loudly.
Just sayin'
Just sayin'
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well without the customer you people ( read pilots) have no job
"tossers" that are pilots
"Without those tosser pilots...... "yuse bogans" would still be travelling on a greyhound bus...or if yer really lucky....the Titanic "
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Sure but Jetstar and the others have very clear policies in black and white written on their website on the emails they send on the ticket. Its not a trick I found it pretty clear.
I understand what you're saying but ultimately its up to the person buying the ticket to check what the catch is or if there is one. A mini due diligence before hitting the pay button. No point then fronting up hoping for the best and losing it when it goes as per the details on the website!
Then ruining everybody's day by having some sort of a spack attack!
I understand what you're saying but ultimately its up to the person buying the ticket to check what the catch is or if there is one. A mini due diligence before hitting the pay button. No point then fronting up hoping for the best and losing it when it goes as per the details on the website!
Then ruining everybody's day by having some sort of a spack attack!
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I find it most interesting that most people here do not support the customer.
Aside from giving staff the
s, this remainder also annoy, inconvenience and compromise the safety of the decent pax. These are the people that turn up drunk with overweight luggage that they'll stuff into overhead bins so it dongs someone on the head at the other end, that fail to comply with even basic safety directives and basically ruin everyone else's day.
"I think they were trying to bring an oversized bag onto the plane after they had been told they couldn't, and next thing you know they were shouting their heads off," he said.
"That was followed by a bit of pushing and shoving."
"That was followed by a bit of pushing and shoving."
) and there are no coppers 10 minutes away. People who behave like a pack of chimpanzees on the ground should not be trusted to go the distance on a flight. IMHO over the past fifteen years there has been far too much latitude in what constitues acceptable behaviour for an airline pax and we are all now reaping the whirlwind.
QSK?
"Can anyone give a reason why the airlines don't enforce the cabin baggage requirement more stringently? Is it because they are scared they will lose customers if they are too diligent?"
I have to say, that every time that I've flown internationally out of SYD I have always had my carry-on checked by the ticket counter personnel.
Perhaps it depends on the location, and the emphasis that folks there place on this - other locations haven't given me the same scrutiny.
I have to say, that every time that I've flown internationally out of SYD I have always had my carry-on checked by the ticket counter personnel.
Perhaps it depends on the location, and the emphasis that folks there place on this - other locations haven't given me the same scrutiny.
The issue here is not that the bags were oversized but the way those passengers chose to react to being told they could not bring on their bags.
They chose to abuse/intimidate staff and other pax. IF the part about pushing/shoving is true then damn well good on Jetstar for refusing carriage. In my opinion once you have touched the staff in an abusive way you can damn well swim to the mainland!!! It is NEVER acceptable!! You wouldn't do it in a bar to the bouncer and expect to stay, now would you?
I'm not sure about now but last time I flew with Jetstar they had a hand luggage system where they would approve the size and tag the hand luggage at check in. At the gate if it didn't have a tag it didn't get on- no exceptions. This worked well and the staff didn't feel pressure to make exceptions as the policy was clear and had been decided by someone else (with a scale) that th bag was ok or not.
IF this model is still operating then my guess is the pax DIDN'T have tags and kicked off when told their bags would not be coming onboard.
Policing the size of check-in bags ONLY works when
a) pax check in with a human being and
b) when the pax actually bring the bag to the counter, instead of getting Auntie Mabel to watch it round the corner, out of sight, as they KNOW it's too big. That's not trying to save a buck that's trying to sneak round rules that are there for SAFETY.
Damn straight I side with the passengers- the ones who do not deserve to put up with bs like this and did the right thing by listening to the rules.
CASA and the airlines need to grow a backbone & deal with this, asap before someone gets hurt. I've been very lucky to narrowly avoid being clonked by bags on a couple of occasions, which should never have been there in the first place.
The setup at BNE sounds like what used to also happen at Perth ITB, sadly last time I passed through there the "bag Nazi" was no longer there. One guy they had was so onto the "I'll go to the toilet & pretend I've been back to check in" trick for too-heavy bags that I once saw him send the same woman back FOUR times as she wasn't actually going to check her bag in at all!
I guess they don't want to pay for that extra person any more. FWIW, I've been to the US several times in the last few months and haven't seen anything that measures bag size at the x-ray, are you talking domestic only??
They chose to abuse/intimidate staff and other pax. IF the part about pushing/shoving is true then damn well good on Jetstar for refusing carriage. In my opinion once you have touched the staff in an abusive way you can damn well swim to the mainland!!! It is NEVER acceptable!! You wouldn't do it in a bar to the bouncer and expect to stay, now would you?
I'm not sure about now but last time I flew with Jetstar they had a hand luggage system where they would approve the size and tag the hand luggage at check in. At the gate if it didn't have a tag it didn't get on- no exceptions. This worked well and the staff didn't feel pressure to make exceptions as the policy was clear and had been decided by someone else (with a scale) that th bag was ok or not.
IF this model is still operating then my guess is the pax DIDN'T have tags and kicked off when told their bags would not be coming onboard.
Policing the size of check-in bags ONLY works when
a) pax check in with a human being and
b) when the pax actually bring the bag to the counter, instead of getting Auntie Mabel to watch it round the corner, out of sight, as they KNOW it's too big. That's not trying to save a buck that's trying to sneak round rules that are there for SAFETY.
Damn straight I side with the passengers- the ones who do not deserve to put up with bs like this and did the right thing by listening to the rules.
CASA and the airlines need to grow a backbone & deal with this, asap before someone gets hurt. I've been very lucky to narrowly avoid being clonked by bags on a couple of occasions, which should never have been there in the first place.
The setup at BNE sounds like what used to also happen at Perth ITB, sadly last time I passed through there the "bag Nazi" was no longer there. One guy they had was so onto the "I'll go to the toilet & pretend I've been back to check in" trick for too-heavy bags that I once saw him send the same woman back FOUR times as she wasn't actually going to check her bag in at all!
I guess they don't want to pay for that extra person any more. FWIW, I've been to the US several times in the last few months and haven't seen anything that measures bag size at the x-ray, are you talking domestic only??
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On a different note, was traveling BNE-MEL last week up front on QF. Got on early. Plenty of suits stopping to use the business class overhead lockers before proceding to economy class seats.
Poor buggers. GFC has forced their companies to cut costs and fly them in economy but they'll be damned if their bags are going economy too!!
Poor buggers. GFC has forced their companies to cut costs and fly them in economy but they'll be damned if their bags are going economy too!!
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Solution
All airlines contribute to a national advertising campaign something along the lines of ..................SAFETY.
The federal gov't has introduced new laws requiring all cabin baggage to fit this size/shape gauge, by 1st of December 2011 ALL PASSENGERS will have to comply. Failure to comply will result in the items being confiscated and become federal government property and disposed of along with all your nail cutters and knitting needles.
There will be no exceptions.
And then do it. zero tolerence no matter who you are.
It pi$$es me off when I take a soft backpack style laptop bag, that fits nicely and some moron with a wheeled "overnight case" jams said bag into the locker with the wheels trying to puncture my laptop screen from the outside.
Enough is enough
All airlines contribute to a national advertising campaign something along the lines of ..................SAFETY.
The federal gov't has introduced new laws requiring all cabin baggage to fit this size/shape gauge, by 1st of December 2011 ALL PASSENGERS will have to comply. Failure to comply will result in the items being confiscated and become federal government property and disposed of along with all your nail cutters and knitting needles.
There will be no exceptions.
And then do it. zero tolerence no matter who you are.
It pi$$es me off when I take a soft backpack style laptop bag, that fits nicely and some moron with a wheeled "overnight case" jams said bag into the locker with the wheels trying to puncture my laptop screen from the outside
.Enough is enough
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Nobody is interested in safety because accidents never happen. Have a look around during the safety demo. Not even with QF32 will you manage to convince people. "The chances of it happening to me are..."
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All,
I have travelled extensively in the United States and trust me what we have to deal with in Australia is a mouse poo sized issue compared to the United States. Many flights that I have been on in the US involves starting the boarding process for a 737-800 at push back -40. Passengers bring on there huge "carry on" bags and the lockers are chockers. Boarding in 4 or 5 groups depending upon a number of factors such as how much you paid for the ticket, frequent flyer, etc.
It has become the norm over there, part of the culture of air travel. With the delays, changes, oversold flights, standby system, everything means the traveller must remain flexible. The old rule is never get separated from your baggage. You can chop and change as you get stuffed around.
Strict enforcement of a policy, a law, a term and condition will mean that it will become acceptable, the norm.
Australia has 23 million people. The US 300 million. We need continued investment in infrastructure and fair and reasonable rules that give the customer, and employees the powers to enforce their rights and obligations.
The average Australian "Bogan" now travels often enough to now what he or she can get away with. Stop hiding fees and hidden extras. Keep the airfare system simple. Simple, just like the people that pay for the ticket.
I have travelled extensively in the United States and trust me what we have to deal with in Australia is a mouse poo sized issue compared to the United States. Many flights that I have been on in the US involves starting the boarding process for a 737-800 at push back -40. Passengers bring on there huge "carry on" bags and the lockers are chockers. Boarding in 4 or 5 groups depending upon a number of factors such as how much you paid for the ticket, frequent flyer, etc.
It has become the norm over there, part of the culture of air travel. With the delays, changes, oversold flights, standby system, everything means the traveller must remain flexible. The old rule is never get separated from your baggage. You can chop and change as you get stuffed around.
Strict enforcement of a policy, a law, a term and condition will mean that it will become acceptable, the norm.
Australia has 23 million people. The US 300 million. We need continued investment in infrastructure and fair and reasonable rules that give the customer, and employees the powers to enforce their rights and obligations.
The average Australian "Bogan" now travels often enough to now what he or she can get away with. Stop hiding fees and hidden extras. Keep the airfare system simple. Simple, just like the people that pay for the ticket.
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Jabba has correctly identified it - unless there is an across the board direction for all domestic airlines to comply with a fixed carry on limit then it will be a case of each airline waiting for their competition to impose the draconian rule.
The pax mantra is check in nothing, carry on everything, get on early and claim the locker space. If seated in economy, put your bag in biz class locker as you walk through.
While wating for my flight yesterday I watched a CC boarding pax in Syd get 'overuled' and the passenger then carried on a largish wheelie and two other duffle type bags.
It is first and foremost a safety issue and I really wonder how a 737-400 can be safe with just one CC down the back during boarding and all those pax just leaving the bags in aisle for the CC to sort out when there is no overhead space.
Actually for the CASA watchers: - how many covert audits have been done in connection with this issue? (observed from the last row)
AT
The pax mantra is check in nothing, carry on everything, get on early and claim the locker space. If seated in economy, put your bag in biz class locker as you walk through.
While wating for my flight yesterday I watched a CC boarding pax in Syd get 'overuled' and the passenger then carried on a largish wheelie and two other duffle type bags.
It is first and foremost a safety issue and I really wonder how a 737-400 can be safe with just one CC down the back during boarding and all those pax just leaving the bags in aisle for the CC to sort out when there is no overhead space.
Actually for the CASA watchers: - how many covert audits have been done in connection with this issue? (observed from the last row)
AT