QANTAS - Sharing Of Flying
Join Date: Feb 2001
Location: Melbourne, Victoria, Australia
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I'm going to take a risk here . . . so please be gentle!
Having read all the posts on this thread very carefully, and with the greatest respect to all the intelligent and informative posters, it seems to me that the merge between Qantas and Australian Airlines (nee TAA) has not worked.
The real test of any merger is when the going gets tough and the extent to which the proponents withdraw into their respective corners. A cursory reading of these posts indicates this is what is going on.
Following this logic, why doesn’t the company again split into ‘international’ and ‘domestic’ operations . . . and let them each compete against the integrated Jet*?
But even more poignantly, I have to say that as a very frequent customer I don’t even understand the real differences between SH and LH except as an accident of history . . . most of the posters are speaking in a language (terms, condition, EBAs, etc) beyond what the paying punters understand.
But what do I know . . . ??
Having read all the posts on this thread very carefully, and with the greatest respect to all the intelligent and informative posters, it seems to me that the merge between Qantas and Australian Airlines (nee TAA) has not worked.
The real test of any merger is when the going gets tough and the extent to which the proponents withdraw into their respective corners. A cursory reading of these posts indicates this is what is going on.
Following this logic, why doesn’t the company again split into ‘international’ and ‘domestic’ operations . . . and let them each compete against the integrated Jet*?
But even more poignantly, I have to say that as a very frequent customer I don’t even understand the real differences between SH and LH except as an accident of history . . . most of the posters are speaking in a language (terms, condition, EBAs, etc) beyond what the paying punters understand.
But what do I know . . . ??
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thats probably the most accurate post i have ever read in here lol
the merger between Australian Airlines and Qantas was a nightmare from a cabin crew perspective when crew started moving from their traditional area of work into the other. If SH and LH had just replicated TN and QF there wouldnt have been any problems but the TAA girls who had been rejected as Qantas Flight Atendants years before were desperate to be International Flight Attendants and the ACTU ensured that got their seniority. that was the start of ALLLLLLLLL the problems
Since then its just been pure tribalism
the merger between Australian Airlines and Qantas was a nightmare from a cabin crew perspective when crew started moving from their traditional area of work into the other. If SH and LH had just replicated TN and QF there wouldnt have been any problems but the TAA girls who had been rejected as Qantas Flight Atendants years before were desperate to be International Flight Attendants and the ACTU ensured that got their seniority. that was the start of ALLLLLLLLL the problems
Since then its just been pure tribalism
Join Date: May 2005
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iirriver88.......... your post is probably one of the most offensive I have seen on here...you now have zero credibility.
Machine gun...from memory all the flight attendants that have been shown the door (not that many) were mostly tossers that we all hated flying with anyway!
i cant think of one that didn't deserve to be walked out the door, actually what is most annoying is that many of them got a package to leave!
Some of the clause 11 may have been dubious at best! however the remarks from the majority of crew when those nightmare f/a were shown the door was " about time"
As far as those managers go well I don't want to see any of them lose their jobs, I have never had a problem with any of them as I have always done my job!
Machine gun...from memory all the flight attendants that have been shown the door (not that many) were mostly tossers that we all hated flying with anyway!
i cant think of one that didn't deserve to be walked out the door, actually what is most annoying is that many of them got a package to leave!
Some of the clause 11 may have been dubious at best! however the remarks from the majority of crew when those nightmare f/a were shown the door was " about time"
As far as those managers go well I don't want to see any of them lose their jobs, I have never had a problem with any of them as I have always done my job!
Join Date: Feb 2005
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Fat Boy Slim and his victims
There were several who were shown the door and didnt receive a package.These people were treated very poorly indeed.Two are friends.They are not tossers but just happened to fit into a particular demographic.One is now very sick as a direct result of the treatment received at the hands of FBS.
He deserves to be booted out for the unecessary misery he has caused.
Which particular "nightmares"did you have in mind?
The reason they received a package was down to incompetent way their cases were handled.Not only did management not follow their own protocols.They didnt know what the protocols were.
They were laughed out of the commission and rightly so
He deserves to be booted out for the unecessary misery he has caused.
Which particular "nightmares"did you have in mind?
The reason they received a package was down to incompetent way their cases were handled.Not only did management not follow their own protocols.They didnt know what the protocols were.
They were laughed out of the commission and rightly so
Join Date: Mar 2009
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One nasty, vindictive and spiteful piece of work. Can't wait to see the back of fat boy slim AKA "the bearded lady".
The "visitors" really have brought nothing positive to the company with most quite obviously relishing their brief to harass, intimidate and bully.
Forgive me for the corporate speak but "The business" will be so much better off without The Tarrantular, The Kiwi Sociopath and the Bearded Lady.
Bye bye visitors, hello re-engagement.
The "visitors" really have brought nothing positive to the company with most quite obviously relishing their brief to harass, intimidate and bully.
Forgive me for the corporate speak but "The business" will be so much better off without The Tarrantular, The Kiwi Sociopath and the Bearded Lady.
Bye bye visitors, hello re-engagement.
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Join Date: Apr 2008
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Defecation....and the Warehouse Of Excellence
hmmmm....I would have to agree with my fellow cart-pushers on this one....the attempt at portraying an analogous relationship between managerial function/responsibility and defecation was inappropriate and disturbing. The individual in question should perhaps consider alternative ways to express such resounding sentiments in the future.
Pegasus747...were the Beehives not successful in getting into Qantas because it was always traditionally crewed by the stewards?
Does anyone know what is going to happen to the Warehouse of Excellence? Next month's bid books don't show any conscriptions. I am sooooo happy this factory warehouse (formerly occupied by previous tenants...the manufacturers of Noni-B women's apparel) has been temporarily shut down (if that case may be). I wasn't looking forward to dreaming up some strange exotic toilet-seat acquired disease to put on my sick leave form in order to chuck a sickie for the day.
Oh THANK YOU LORD for sparing me the inhuman agony of being drowned in the fem-centric gushes of the Customer Service department et al. and how we need to be 'Energetic' [puke
], 'Intuitive' [vomit] 'Caring' [cringe] etc. Thank you Lord for also not subjecting me to the teeth-pulling sufferring of having to sit with a stranger from some obscure part of the company (like forward bookings yield management) and having to talk about what they do and what I do....blah! blah! Sorry have to puke again [puke]
Pegasus747...were the Beehives not successful in getting into Qantas because it was always traditionally crewed by the stewards?
Does anyone know what is going to happen to the Warehouse of Excellence? Next month's bid books don't show any conscriptions. I am sooooo happy this factory warehouse (formerly occupied by previous tenants...the manufacturers of Noni-B women's apparel) has been temporarily shut down (if that case may be). I wasn't looking forward to dreaming up some strange exotic toilet-seat acquired disease to put on my sick leave form in order to chuck a sickie for the day.
Oh THANK YOU LORD for sparing me the inhuman agony of being drowned in the fem-centric gushes of the Customer Service department et al. and how we need to be 'Energetic' [puke
], 'Intuitive' [vomit] 'Caring' [cringe] etc. Thank you Lord for also not subjecting me to the teeth-pulling sufferring of having to sit with a stranger from some obscure part of the company (like forward bookings yield management) and having to talk about what they do and what I do....blah! blah! Sorry have to puke again [puke]
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Domestos,
Has it ever occurred to you that maybe that guy from "forward bookings yield management" is also cringing about going to the warehouse of excellence and having to sit next to a too perfectly groomed, "hey I wear a FA uniform", limp wristed, shallow, flight attendant? If the W of E is really going to close, then he will also thank the Lord that he doesn't have to listen to FA's talking about how to perfectly line a tray and correctly pour a glass of wine "in the air, darling!"
And, no, I'm not from "forward bookings yield management". Also, there is probably not much point in yield management on past bookings. But of course you wouldn't need to know that as the airline revolves around FA's, so there's no point knowing what other people do in the airline.
Has it ever occurred to you that maybe that guy from "forward bookings yield management" is also cringing about going to the warehouse of excellence and having to sit next to a too perfectly groomed, "hey I wear a FA uniform", limp wristed, shallow, flight attendant? If the W of E is really going to close, then he will also thank the Lord that he doesn't have to listen to FA's talking about how to perfectly line a tray and correctly pour a glass of wine "in the air, darling!"
And, no, I'm not from "forward bookings yield management". Also, there is probably not much point in yield management on past bookings. But of course you wouldn't need to know that as the airline revolves around FA's, so there's no point knowing what other people do in the airline.
Join Date: Nov 2001
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TAA and Qantas
Women were largely excluded from Qantas as its history was predominantly male.The flying boats were crewed by ex merchant navy personnel.The managment felt that because of the arduous nature of flying it was best done by men.There were hostesses but they made up less than 10% of crew numbers.If you were female and wanted to fly the domestic carriers were the best choice.It was only in the mid 80s that Qantas started balancing up the male/female ratio.Today mor than 70% of Qantas(LH) CC are female.
For some reason Ansett and Qantas crews got on better with each than did TAA.
The tribalism we see today had its nexus in the 60s and 70s.Its basically down to the resentment that TAA crew have toward QF crew.Tall women in comfortable shoes ruled TAA while the blokes ran Qantas.Imagine the glee when TAA took Qantas over.
Jimmy bowtie bought all his mates into fill QF management positions.The Redtail men were removed.So began the Qantas demise.Borghetti was one of the last of those men
For some reason Ansett and Qantas crews got on better with each than did TAA.
The tribalism we see today had its nexus in the 60s and 70s.Its basically down to the resentment that TAA crew have toward QF crew.Tall women in comfortable shoes ruled TAA while the blokes ran Qantas.Imagine the glee when TAA took Qantas over.
Jimmy bowtie bought all his mates into fill QF management positions.The Redtail men were removed.So began the Qantas demise.Borghetti was one of the last of those men
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Join Date: Apr 2008
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Kotoyebe
I think someone fed me bull
when I first became a flight attendant....I geniunely thought that the airline was only made up of flight attendants (limp wrists and other flexible body parts) and pilots...perhaps a few ground staff who operate the CitiFlyer check in desk during the week....but that's it. You will have to excuse me for my ignorance as I have been ill-informed all this time. [Note to myself....read more Cabin Crew News to find out about other people + investigate the company telephone directory and try to add more friends to Facebook].
If you are gonna have a personal slur at me for being 'limp wristed' etc., then babe, you are gonna have to try a wee bit harder....I'm simply more handsome, taller, broader, and well endowed than you.......and with that comes a lot of thick skin.
Try as you may....I'm simply not interested in meeting someone who works in telephone sales or yield management or the person who dry cleans the inseat covers.....I'm at Qantas to work and earn money to put bread (and sometimes pink fluffy cupcakes) on the table.....not to indulge in expanding my social horizons.
Now if you'll excuse me...I have some hair to shave off the bottom of my feet......DARLING!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
when I first became a flight attendant....I geniunely thought that the airline was only made up of flight attendants (limp wrists and other flexible body parts) and pilots...perhaps a few ground staff who operate the CitiFlyer check in desk during the week....but that's it. You will have to excuse me for my ignorance as I have been ill-informed all this time. [Note to myself....read more Cabin Crew News to find out about other people + investigate the company telephone directory and try to add more friends to Facebook].If you are gonna have a personal slur at me for being 'limp wristed' etc., then babe, you are gonna have to try a wee bit harder....I'm simply more handsome, taller, broader, and well endowed than you.......and with that comes a lot of thick skin.
Try as you may....I'm simply not interested in meeting someone who works in telephone sales or yield management or the person who dry cleans the inseat covers.....I'm at Qantas to work and earn money to put bread (and sometimes pink fluffy cupcakes) on the table.....not to indulge in expanding my social horizons.
Now if you'll excuse me...I have some hair to shave off the bottom of my feet......DARLING!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
Join Date: Oct 1999
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No Information
Just wondering, it has been VERY quiet on the information front from all. Usually get bombarded with emails etc, but since the announcement- NOTHING. Anyone have any idea when we might find out what our collective future might hold?
Join Date: Jan 2008
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as far as JJ goes, as stated in a previous post he is from Mel...that says it all.
OCCR if you have finished patting Pegasus on the back how about some answers.Did the union suggest any alternative to reducing the crew by one and by doing making the crew surplus even larger?
Of course they did,they don't need any advice and know everything.The company must be shaking in their boots every time they meet.
I suggested an alternative to reducing the crew complement and all I received in return was the usual ridicule from the faaa supporters team that is activated here whenever they are asked a question that they are uncomfortable with.
It looks as though the S/H union is not the only one with dictatorial leadership.
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The Usual Suspects
There arent many CC posters on PPrune.Just the usual suspects who are the self appointed keepers of the moral high ground....JJ et al.
You do not reperesent the moajority opinion in either domestic or LHaul.
The majority of those in LH are happy with the association and its conciliatoy approach to the company.
Dixon has gone and circumstances have changed .Joyce appears not to be dysfunctional.
Critcize whatever you like but be proactive,do some research and come up with some sensible alternatives to those that you lampoon.
To date its all criticism and nought else.As has been pointed out Melbourne seems to be the home of the lunatic fringe.Particularly the domestics.The back door bennies who want to do secret deals with the company without consultation with theri long haul colleagues.
If you post here expect to be held accountable and stop bleating when you are not agreed with or are in turn lampooned
You do not reperesent the moajority opinion in either domestic or LHaul.
The majority of those in LH are happy with the association and its conciliatoy approach to the company.
Dixon has gone and circumstances have changed .Joyce appears not to be dysfunctional.
Critcize whatever you like but be proactive,do some research and come up with some sensible alternatives to those that you lampoon.
To date its all criticism and nought else.As has been pointed out Melbourne seems to be the home of the lunatic fringe.Particularly the domestics.The back door bennies who want to do secret deals with the company without consultation with theri long haul colleagues.
If you post here expect to be held accountable and stop bleating when you are not agreed with or are in turn lampooned
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There arent many CC posters on PPrune
Mrpaxing,I have to agree with you and it doesn't take much to notice the idea of lowering the divisor is not an idea that they want to hear.
if all they can do is poke fun at Melbourne then their list of ideas is incredibly thin.
I still did not get an answer but thats par for the course.
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jj...
I don't know the answer to your questions as I am not on the union.
If you take the time to read my previous posts you will find that I have been very critical of the FAAA and they have attacked me on this site quite a few times, However I agree with many of the things the current officials put into action.
I think they have done an outstanding job with the last EBA and they have the support of the current LH membership.
You have to give them credit where its due, who would want their job having to listen to people like you all day.
Before you start criticizing the officials maybe you should start asking questions around that Luna Park base of yours and see if its true that they have approached management to do separate deals!
I don't know the answer to your questions as I am not on the union.
If you take the time to read my previous posts you will find that I have been very critical of the FAAA and they have attacked me on this site quite a few times, However I agree with many of the things the current officials put into action.
I think they have done an outstanding job with the last EBA and they have the support of the current LH membership.
You have to give them credit where its due, who would want their job having to listen to people like you all day.
Before you start criticizing the officials maybe you should start asking questions around that Luna Park base of yours and see if its true that they have approached management to do separate deals!
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Paranoia
So now we have a conspiracy?
No wonder the domestics are in such disarray.
Next you will worrying about someone with the "mudguard" username
No wonder the domestics are in such disarray.
Next you will worrying about someone with the "mudguard" username
Last edited by blackguard; 22nd Apr 2009 at 06:25.
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I am sure that there are many crew that are prepared to take a pay cut with a reduced divisor. but i think at this stage its not something that the majority want to do.
I appreciate that many are prepared to take the pay cut sacrifice by reducing the divisor but as the Union has just said in a newsletter it hasnt got to that stage yet
I appreciate that many are prepared to take the pay cut sacrifice by reducing the divisor but as the Union has just said in a newsletter it hasnt got to that stage yet