Lowest minimums ever for twin FO job?
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ShockWave, thanks for your reply.
My dream job (
) would be to fly for Qantas my entire career, and realistically, I'd like to apply as soon as possible. I've looked at their website and just looking at the requirements for DESO, wouldn't 500 hours command time take less time (albeit on a single), than the 1000 odd hours RPT turbine time? Don't get me wrong, I'm looking forward to my time in GA to get invaluable life experience, but I rather not spend an eternity there when there's a chance I could be sitting in a shiny jet! 
I know Qantas hardly ever recruit pilots with only 500 hours command (on a single), but how long would 1000hours on turbines take? I was thinking a few years at least?
Some may call me young and naive, but I know what my ultimate goal is (have known for a very long time), and I don't want to be too old before I can apply!
Any of you older more experienced drivers out there, feel free to send me a nasty PM telling me to get my head screwed on straight, I'm all for learning and getting advice.
Regards.
My dream job (
) would be to fly for Qantas my entire career, and realistically, I'd like to apply as soon as possible. I've looked at their website and just looking at the requirements for DESO, wouldn't 500 hours command time take less time (albeit on a single), than the 1000 odd hours RPT turbine time? Don't get me wrong, I'm looking forward to my time in GA to get invaluable life experience, but I rather not spend an eternity there when there's a chance I could be sitting in a shiny jet! I know Qantas hardly ever recruit pilots with only 500 hours command (on a single), but how long would 1000hours on turbines take? I was thinking a few years at least?
Some may call me young and naive, but I know what my ultimate goal is (have known for a very long time), and I don't want to be too old before I can apply!
Any of you older more experienced drivers out there, feel free to send me a nasty PM telling me to get my head screwed on straight, I'm all for learning and getting advice.
Regards.
Join Date: Sep 1999
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DJ.
My advice for what it may be worth. Do not limit your options or goals in life or work. Just like flying.... always have at least 2 more options you are happy with, never ever put yourself or your aircraft into a position of only having one option if you can help it.
I am not familiar with QF requirements on hours or their web site so can only speculate what they are looking for. Web sites had not been invented when I was at your stage!
I did six years flogging around GA getting command hours before getting into an airline, which was all great experience but not as relevant to airline operations as being an F/O in a regional airline for a year or so.
GA as a career is a tough life and not rewarding financially. What if you don't get an airline job? Will GA be enough for you?
If you get a job with a regional airline as an F/O, you may get into an airline job after a year or so or you will get a command on a nice turbo-prop. That will then enable you to gain more experience on bigger aircraft until your company gets jets or you move on to bigger things. If you get sick of the turbo props in oz you will be able to work for other airlines over seas and perhaps get to the bigger jets that way.
What if you get the qantas job but decide you don't like it? or they decide they don't like you? What other options will you be left with? 500 GA hours is not much of a fallback, nor is S/O time.
Very few jobs now days are jobs for life. Keep your options and expectations open.
My advice for what it may be worth. Do not limit your options or goals in life or work. Just like flying.... always have at least 2 more options you are happy with, never ever put yourself or your aircraft into a position of only having one option if you can help it.
I am not familiar with QF requirements on hours or their web site so can only speculate what they are looking for. Web sites had not been invented when I was at your stage!
I did six years flogging around GA getting command hours before getting into an airline, which was all great experience but not as relevant to airline operations as being an F/O in a regional airline for a year or so.
GA as a career is a tough life and not rewarding financially. What if you don't get an airline job? Will GA be enough for you?
If you get a job with a regional airline as an F/O, you may get into an airline job after a year or so or you will get a command on a nice turbo-prop. That will then enable you to gain more experience on bigger aircraft until your company gets jets or you move on to bigger things. If you get sick of the turbo props in oz you will be able to work for other airlines over seas and perhaps get to the bigger jets that way.
What if you get the qantas job but decide you don't like it? or they decide they don't like you? What other options will you be left with? 500 GA hours is not much of a fallback, nor is S/O time.
Very few jobs now days are jobs for life. Keep your options and expectations open.
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Here's my take on working for QF. I'm not a pilot, but I do work for them.
It seems to me that a QF pilot is about the best paid flying job in Aust, but it is now not the best place to work.
I personally know of people who haven't even applied for QF and now have a shiny jet job. All these people had more than the minimums required for QF. While at this point in time their pay may not be the same as QF they should have a command quicker than anyone as a SO in QF. These people like to fly (isn't that what the job is about) and couldn't see themselves as a SO.
The jobs may not be in Australia, but with paying hardly any tax and an accomodation allowance, I think they will be in front money and experience wise of anyone who joins now as a SO.
While these jobs may not be in Australia, they are not far away.
Good luck with getting into QF if that is your dream, but I would keep my eyes and ears open as to what else is out there. I liked the look of Kingfisher in India, especially for the calander
.
It seems to me that a QF pilot is about the best paid flying job in Aust, but it is now not the best place to work.
I personally know of people who haven't even applied for QF and now have a shiny jet job. All these people had more than the minimums required for QF. While at this point in time their pay may not be the same as QF they should have a command quicker than anyone as a SO in QF. These people like to fly (isn't that what the job is about) and couldn't see themselves as a SO.
The jobs may not be in Australia, but with paying hardly any tax and an accomodation allowance, I think they will be in front money and experience wise of anyone who joins now as a SO.
While these jobs may not be in Australia, they are not far away.
Good luck with getting into QF if that is your dream, but I would keep my eyes and ears open as to what else is out there. I liked the look of Kingfisher in India, especially for the calander
.
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It seems to me that a QF pilot is about the best paid flying job in Aust, but it is now not the best place to work.
DJ, get your 1000-1500 hrs, minimum, in GA because if you go for a QF gig it will be the last time you fly anything, especially in command, for a long, long time. Although QF is your dream job now, you will grow out of the honeymoon phase eventually.
Unless you truly do not care, being the only guy in the cockpit (and the bar
) who hasn't really flown anything will eventually come back to haunt you.
Unless you truly do not care, being the only guy in the cockpit (and the bar ) who hasn't really flown anything will eventually come back to haunt you
I am happy in the knowledge that after roughly 5 years as an S/O, I'll be an F/O "flying" for Mainline, on better terms and conditions than JQ and DJ pilots on similar aircraft.
And in the meantime, I've earnt a ****load of coin as an S/O, travelled to places I never imagined and had a great lifestyle at home because I get loads of time off.
Yeah QF really sux.
TL
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SOs are pilots, too.....
Calm down TL. Don't be so sensitive about it! Who said anyone needs to feel ashamed???
DJ has a long career ahead of him and if he loves flying, doing his GA time is something he should consider because the fact is, as an SO, you don't really fly the aircraft except in the sim. Some SOs I know find this demoralising.
It's a bit late for DJ to discover this when he's in the job! Maybe there's more in it for him than just the coin?
Sorry if I worded it badly; I didn't mean to belittle you or anyone else.
Standing around the bar getting pissed and telling flying stories is obviously not the focus of aviation but it is a part of the lifestyle. Obviously its importance varies from one pilot to the next and you consider it low on your priorities but in my case, I'm glad I did my GA time. And I got to where you are, too, so I'm happy.
Just pointing out the possibilities to Mr. DreamJob, that's all, no need to get all riled...!!!
DJ has a long career ahead of him and if he loves flying, doing his GA time is something he should consider because the fact is, as an SO, you don't really fly the aircraft except in the sim. Some SOs I know find this demoralising.
It's a bit late for DJ to discover this when he's in the job! Maybe there's more in it for him than just the coin?
Sorry if I worded it badly; I didn't mean to belittle you or anyone else.
Standing around the bar getting pissed and telling flying stories is obviously not the focus of aviation but it is a part of the lifestyle. Obviously its importance varies from one pilot to the next and you consider it low on your priorities but in my case, I'm glad I did my GA time. And I got to where you are, too, so I'm happy.
Just pointing out the possibilities to Mr. DreamJob, that's all, no need to get all riled...!!!
No worries Scotty, I didn't really mean to come across that way, assume you're with QF in which case we will have to share a few "flying" stories over a beer somewhere. The GA stories that we all tell are still the better ones anyway! (Cept for maybe the "who shagged who" stories in QF that circulate around the place )
And dreamjob, F/O time on a 1900 is great, Command time on a 210/PA31 etc is great too, there really is no right or wrong answer, and either way you'll still be able to apply to QF within a couple of years. Good luck with it all!
Cheers,
TL
)And dreamjob, F/O time on a 1900 is great, Command time on a 210/PA31 etc is great too, there really is no right or wrong answer, and either way you'll still be able to apply to QF within a couple of years. Good luck with it all!
Cheers,
TL
I knew TL would turn up in this thread.
I hear that even you might be able to walk into a turbo prop job at the mo. just don't slouch
with all that coin its time you bought me a beer
Powder to the People
I hear that even you might be able to walk into a turbo prop job at the mo. just don't slouch
with all that coin its time you bought me a beer
Powder to the People
Seasonally Adjusted
Don't get me wrong, I'm looking forward to my time in GA to get invaluable life experience, but I rather not spend an eternity there when there's a chance I could be sitting in a shiny jet!
BTW, does the jet have to be shiny, would you accept a job in a dull faded one?
Moderator
As folks are finding out now .. it all depends on supply and demand.
For instance, I was lucky enough to pick up an entry FO slot in the 70s with next to no experience (around 500-600 hours total, no I/F to speak of, and a brand new endorsement on an Apache ... I can still remember Hugh busily operating the "failed" engine to keep us from falling out of the sky during asy circuit work ..). As I was rapidly getting past the then age limit, I guess I was lucky that Henry took pity on me when cleaning out the bottom of the applications drawer ...
Those fellows who were running through their initial commands at the time generally had secured jobs 10-12 years earlier with around 200 hours and no twin exposure at all ...
Now, if I were ten years younger ...
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So, I often wonder why all the fuss with 500 multi-engine minimums when the majority of the time, those 500 twin hours are flown symmetrically! So hats off to Vincent Aviation for lowering the twin minimum requirements .. at last there's an operator in Oz that uses common sense in this regard. (Oh, and Qantas as well, since no multi engine time is required there as well to apply).
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Common sense in Austrailan Aviation?, please let me know where it is as I would love to find some!!
Thats not fair there are some good operaters and pilots out there but some of the stuff taught in GA needs a bit of a sort out.
I find the lower time the pilot the better they are!! Dont have to spend all the time untraining them!!
Thats not fair there are some good operaters and pilots out there but some of the stuff taught in GA needs a bit of a sort out.
I find the lower time the pilot the better they are!! Dont have to spend all the time untraining them!!