Why are people so unkind to Jet*?
I did fly Garuda last year - because the alternative was an LCC.
I was satisfied with Garuda business class as it offered a fair product at a more than fair price.
Of course I was nervous at the potential safety of the airline, but the price and availability were commensurate to that risk.
This is why people are so unkind to Jet Star - they clainm to be a low cost carrier, but for most products they aren't and indeed they are often more expensive than a full service airline.
So what is low cost about Jet Star? It's their expenidture, not their earnings.
Jetstar V Garuda rated for bang for buck -- I would fly Garuda with trepidation but I just won't fly Jet Star. How unkind...........
I was satisfied with Garuda business class as it offered a fair product at a more than fair price.
Of course I was nervous at the potential safety of the airline, but the price and availability were commensurate to that risk.
This is why people are so unkind to Jet Star - they clainm to be a low cost carrier, but for most products they aren't and indeed they are often more expensive than a full service airline.
So what is low cost about Jet Star? It's their expenidture, not their earnings.
Jetstar V Garuda rated for bang for buck -- I would fly Garuda with trepidation but I just won't fly Jet Star. How unkind...........
I think that some people on this forum just prove how much they want something for nothing. It proves how stubborn views with incorrect perceptions about reasonablity from the ill informed is the exact reason why J* does get a very hard time.
It is plainly all about choice. This will continue to change and evolve as time goes by and new carrier come onto the market. Unfortunatly while the capacity isn't there J* will suffer the same teething problems as VB did.
Aarkmark I'm completely confused about what point you are trying to make
"I'm happy with Garuda though I do have concerns about safety...."
"Of course I was nervous at the potential safety of the airline, but the price and availability were commensurate to that risk."
2 questions.. please if you will.
1. So you think a full fare carrier is safer? Even in light of the fact that Garuda have one of the poorest safety records in South East Asia.
2. So you feel that every seat and every ticket should be at fares that QANTAS, J* and VB offer when they are on sale to consitute a fair fare for a LCC?
It is plainly all about choice. This will continue to change and evolve as time goes by and new carrier come onto the market. Unfortunatly while the capacity isn't there J* will suffer the same teething problems as VB did.
Aarkmark I'm completely confused about what point you are trying to make
"I'm happy with Garuda though I do have concerns about safety...."
"Of course I was nervous at the potential safety of the airline, but the price and availability were commensurate to that risk."
2 questions.. please if you will.
1. So you think a full fare carrier is safer? Even in light of the fact that Garuda have one of the poorest safety records in South East Asia.
2. So you feel that every seat and every ticket should be at fares that QANTAS, J* and VB offer when they are on sale to consitute a fair fare for a LCC?
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I've flown Jetstar Intl to BKK in Starclass using staff travel, came back QF J cls also on staff travel. The flight had about 60-80 avail in ecy and about 25 avail in Starclass.
Starclass was ok, but nothing flash. It appears to be the same food and drink as ecy, just served differently (I could be wrong about this). I don't think that you can compare Starclass to be equivalent to Business Class, it is more a Premium Ecy.
Coming back on QF J cls the difference is noticable, this is not comparable to Premium Ecy like Starclass.
The service on both was good and couldn't complain about anything from QF or JQ.
I did look on the Jetstar website for prices, as I was curious about their fare costs. The fares I saw to BKK, were about the same as package deals you can get at Flight Centre and the packages include 3-4 nights accomodation. This is with Thai, where you don't need to add in costs of meals and the like.
In my opinion there is better value than Jetstar out there, and Starclass is not worth the extra cost (on a commercial fare). I have heard that sometimes you can purchase an upgrade on the day for an extra $200 or so. If you have bought the cheapest fare, this could be the cheapest way to get a Starclass seat.
Starclass was ok, but nothing flash. It appears to be the same food and drink as ecy, just served differently (I could be wrong about this). I don't think that you can compare Starclass to be equivalent to Business Class, it is more a Premium Ecy.
Coming back on QF J cls the difference is noticable, this is not comparable to Premium Ecy like Starclass.
The service on both was good and couldn't complain about anything from QF or JQ.
I did look on the Jetstar website for prices, as I was curious about their fare costs. The fares I saw to BKK, were about the same as package deals you can get at Flight Centre and the packages include 3-4 nights accomodation. This is with Thai, where you don't need to add in costs of meals and the like.
In my opinion there is better value than Jetstar out there, and Starclass is not worth the extra cost (on a commercial fare). I have heard that sometimes you can purchase an upgrade on the day for an extra $200 or so. If you have bought the cheapest fare, this could be the cheapest way to get a Starclass seat.
Hi Bulla,
As I wrote my last post I was trying not to be confusing. I will attempt to explain now.
I won't fly Jet star because I simply don't like it. It has taken airline customer service, and working conditions for it's staff to new lows in Australian aviation. It has cut safety by replacing qualified and experienced staff where ever it can with cheaper options. These cuts have been far more radical than those made by any other AUS airline. For these reasons I question the airline's true safety performance. I dislike their customer lack of service model, and so make the personal choice that I do not want to consume their product. Lastly, each time I compare (which isn't often) the equivalent Jet Star flights to other airlines, I find their prices the same or more expensive, so my point is WHY PAY MORE FOR LESS ?????
I chose to fly Garuda to Indonesia because it offered a true business class. As an added bonus the true business class was offered at a reasonable price. Further, no other airline at the time offered flights other than by Singapore to Bali on business class. My experience with Garuda business class was actually excellent and in my opinion, excellent value for money.
Whilst I have safety concerns for both Jet Star and Garuda, the latter offers superior customer service, at reasonable prices, and so who would I prefer to fly with - the answer is Garuda all day long.
As I wrote my last post I was trying not to be confusing. I will attempt to explain now.
I won't fly Jet star because I simply don't like it. It has taken airline customer service, and working conditions for it's staff to new lows in Australian aviation. It has cut safety by replacing qualified and experienced staff where ever it can with cheaper options. These cuts have been far more radical than those made by any other AUS airline. For these reasons I question the airline's true safety performance. I dislike their customer lack of service model, and so make the personal choice that I do not want to consume their product. Lastly, each time I compare (which isn't often) the equivalent Jet Star flights to other airlines, I find their prices the same or more expensive, so my point is WHY PAY MORE FOR LESS ?????
I chose to fly Garuda to Indonesia because it offered a true business class. As an added bonus the true business class was offered at a reasonable price. Further, no other airline at the time offered flights other than by Singapore to Bali on business class. My experience with Garuda business class was actually excellent and in my opinion, excellent value for money.
Whilst I have safety concerns for both Jet Star and Garuda, the latter offers superior customer service, at reasonable prices, and so who would I prefer to fly with - the answer is Garuda all day long.
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I often open the flight-deck door after arriving at the gate so that I can say goodbye to our customers as they disembark.
On one occasion recently, a passenger stopped to ask the most curious question;
"Why did you wait so long to put the wheels down?" He went on to explain that he'd played many, many flight simulator games and that experience granted him the right to demand from me the truth. So, in faux-disbelief, I told him;
"I put the gear down at 2000 feet, at around 7 miles from the runway, sir."
"Just as I thought!" he proudly exclaimed. "Expect to hear from your manager. I'll be reporting your reckless attitude towards flying to the authorities!"
The point I wish to make is this: arkmark - you, like my story's protagonist, are an idiot. You freely admit to not being technically qualified in any area of the aviation industry and yet you have no qualms rabbitting on about one of the field's most technically involved, scrutinised and monitored facets; Safety.
By all means, don't fly Jetstar if you don't like them. That's good enough reason without trying to parlay your impressions of commercial air travel (derived, no doubt, from the crash sequence in "Lost" - thanks Channel 7) into a coherent argument.
P.S - Luckily, arkmark, business class is at the front of those wonderful Garuda aeroplanes you wax-so-lyrically about. Their jets always fly backwards into hills, so you should be safe!
On one occasion recently, a passenger stopped to ask the most curious question;
"Why did you wait so long to put the wheels down?" He went on to explain that he'd played many, many flight simulator games and that experience granted him the right to demand from me the truth. So, in faux-disbelief, I told him;
"I put the gear down at 2000 feet, at around 7 miles from the runway, sir."
"Just as I thought!" he proudly exclaimed. "Expect to hear from your manager. I'll be reporting your reckless attitude towards flying to the authorities!"
The point I wish to make is this: arkmark - you, like my story's protagonist, are an idiot. You freely admit to not being technically qualified in any area of the aviation industry and yet you have no qualms rabbitting on about one of the field's most technically involved, scrutinised and monitored facets; Safety.
By all means, don't fly Jetstar if you don't like them. That's good enough reason without trying to parlay your impressions of commercial air travel (derived, no doubt, from the crash sequence in "Lost" - thanks Channel 7) into a coherent argument.
P.S - Luckily, arkmark, business class is at the front of those wonderful Garuda aeroplanes you wax-so-lyrically about. Their jets always fly backwards into hills, so you should be safe!
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"I put the gear down at 2000 feet, at around 7 miles from the runway, sir."
Dear Fliggins,
I am afraid it is you my friend who is the idiot. You make gross assumptions and I certainly you don't do this when flying aircraft.
Actually by being one of the pilot types who likes to greet his humble passengers you sound very ego driven to me.
I, my friend, prior to starting my own very successful business that now employs a lot of people, was in fact an airline employed supervising LAME in charge of a team of people who were directly respoinsible for your safety in the air, every day. I ran the team with safety for everyone as a primary concern.
You are too ignorant to read between the lines, study my language and read my posts to realise that I have far more knowledge of your industry than you yourself have.
The odds are that I was there longer than you ever will be. Even better, I made myself the ability to move on.
Because of my industry experience, my personal observations during that time, and now as a PAX who hasn't touched an aeroplane for quite some time other than to consume it's services, who travells for business regularly, I feel I have quite a lot of insight to offer as to why myself and most people who I know in business choose not to fly Jet Star.
You are too emotional to not understand that there is often well thought out rationale behind consumers choices then either you don't apply that in your own life or you are simply not capable of intraspection.
Tell me - is Jet Star your first airline job ? It sure sounds like it !!!!!!
I am afraid it is you my friend who is the idiot. You make gross assumptions and I certainly you don't do this when flying aircraft.
Actually by being one of the pilot types who likes to greet his humble passengers you sound very ego driven to me.
I, my friend, prior to starting my own very successful business that now employs a lot of people, was in fact an airline employed supervising LAME in charge of a team of people who were directly respoinsible for your safety in the air, every day. I ran the team with safety for everyone as a primary concern.
You are too ignorant to read between the lines, study my language and read my posts to realise that I have far more knowledge of your industry than you yourself have.
The odds are that I was there longer than you ever will be. Even better, I made myself the ability to move on.
Because of my industry experience, my personal observations during that time, and now as a PAX who hasn't touched an aeroplane for quite some time other than to consume it's services, who travells for business regularly, I feel I have quite a lot of insight to offer as to why myself and most people who I know in business choose not to fly Jet Star.
You are too emotional to not understand that there is often well thought out rationale behind consumers choices then either you don't apply that in your own life or you are simply not capable of intraspection.
Tell me - is Jet Star your first airline job ? It sure sounds like it !!!!!!
Sorry Aarmark,
to say jetstar is as unsafe as Garuda is just a shot of how ill informed you are about safety.
To say they hire the "cheaper crews" is a sign of ignorance as to how aviation works.
To quote Fare type and its comparison to safety shows that you have never dealt with the regulator, nor have you ever consulted an aviation related risk/hazard analysis. As someone with so much experience this is disconcerting. It sounds like a very old train of though. And if you have been around for so long you know better about how it all works.
Your comments are crude, presumptuous and ill informed.
You dont like the product.. thats fine as its not everyone cup of tea. Enjoy Garuda
to say jetstar is as unsafe as Garuda is just a shot of how ill informed you are about safety.
To say they hire the "cheaper crews" is a sign of ignorance as to how aviation works.
To quote Fare type and its comparison to safety shows that you have never dealt with the regulator, nor have you ever consulted an aviation related risk/hazard analysis. As someone with so much experience this is disconcerting. It sounds like a very old train of though. And if you have been around for so long you know better about how it all works.
Your comments are crude, presumptuous and ill informed.
You dont like the product.. thats fine as its not everyone cup of tea. Enjoy Garuda
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Anyone gots the inside word on the DRW-CNS-CNS-BNE saga which took place recently [with a side trip to TVL for some]??
Not a bad days work for a direct DRW-BNE service.
AND they've just received an award in the UK for "operational management"!
G'day
Not a bad days work for a direct DRW-BNE service.
AND they've just received an award in the UK for "operational management"!
G'day
Hi Bulla,
I sure don't like the product, as I have made clear, and yes I will enjoy Garuda, and Qantas, and Singapore, and Emirates, and any other carrier who I choose for myself and my staff.
Your assumptions are also incorrect, but at least your polite.
I sure don't like the product, as I have made clear, and yes I will enjoy Garuda, and Qantas, and Singapore, and Emirates, and any other carrier who I choose for myself and my staff.
Your assumptions are also incorrect, but at least your polite.
head...........that's about all I need to say!!
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Excellent response, arkmark. Allow me to dissect your post (this'll be fun!);
"I, my friend, prior to starting my own very successful business that now employs a lot of people". Congratulations. Which one of us has the bigger ego?
"(I) was in fact an airline employed supervising LAME in charge of a team of people who were directly respoinsible for your safety in the air, every day. I ran the team with safety for everyone as a primary concern." Then you should know better, shouldn't you?
"The odds are that I was there longer than you ever will be. Even better, I made myself the ability to move on." To the first part of your sentence, I doubt it. To the second part of it - why is this relevant? I'm fully aware that there is a world full of opportunities outside of aviation. I'm quite happy in my chosen profession, however and have no desire to leave.
"You are too ignorant to read between the lines, study my language and read my posts to realise that I have far more knowledge of your industry than you yourself have." Ignorant is a name I've not often been called. The closest you have ever come to advertising your aviation credentials was when you stated; "(I)haven't touched an aircraft for any reason than to consume it's services for a long time now". Forgive me for not deducing that you were at one time a LAME. Perhaps you should work on your communication skills.
Tell me - is Jet Star your first airline job ? It sure sounds like it !!!!!! No. It's not.
Ratpoison;
My "backbone" was never in question. Actually, it was harder for me to resist the urge to call this particular gentleman names and instead display a modicum of restraint.
"I, my friend, prior to starting my own very successful business that now employs a lot of people". Congratulations. Which one of us has the bigger ego?
"(I) was in fact an airline employed supervising LAME in charge of a team of people who were directly respoinsible for your safety in the air, every day. I ran the team with safety for everyone as a primary concern." Then you should know better, shouldn't you?
"The odds are that I was there longer than you ever will be. Even better, I made myself the ability to move on." To the first part of your sentence, I doubt it. To the second part of it - why is this relevant? I'm fully aware that there is a world full of opportunities outside of aviation. I'm quite happy in my chosen profession, however and have no desire to leave.
"You are too ignorant to read between the lines, study my language and read my posts to realise that I have far more knowledge of your industry than you yourself have." Ignorant is a name I've not often been called. The closest you have ever come to advertising your aviation credentials was when you stated; "(I)haven't touched an aircraft for any reason than to consume it's services for a long time now". Forgive me for not deducing that you were at one time a LAME. Perhaps you should work on your communication skills.
Tell me - is Jet Star your first airline job ? It sure sounds like it !!!!!! No. It's not.
Ratpoison;
My "backbone" was never in question. Actually, it was harder for me to resist the urge to call this particular gentleman names and instead display a modicum of restraint.
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calling a passenger a fwit, now theres a good idea.
Arkmark, you mention ego, re-read your post, if thats not ego driven I dont know what is , Quote:
I, my friend, prior to starting my own very successful business that now employs a lot of people, was in fact an airline employed supervising LAME in charge of a team of people who were directly respoinsible for your safety in the air, every day. I ran the team with safety for everyone as a primary concern.
to realise that I have far more knowledge of your industry than you yourself have.
The odds are that I was there longer than you ever will be. Even better, I made myself the ability to move on.
You keep flying garuda, how many hull losses will be enough to sway you? they are at 10 and counting?
Arkmark, you mention ego, re-read your post, if thats not ego driven I dont know what is , Quote:
I, my friend, prior to starting my own very successful business that now employs a lot of people, was in fact an airline employed supervising LAME in charge of a team of people who were directly respoinsible for your safety in the air, every day. I ran the team with safety for everyone as a primary concern.
to realise that I have far more knowledge of your industry than you yourself have.
The odds are that I was there longer than you ever will be. Even better, I made myself the ability to move on.
You keep flying garuda, how many hull losses will be enough to sway you? they are at 10 and counting?
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my 2 cents
also had the experience flying garuda business class. a very substandard product. the beer was warm, so was the champagne and the wine was comparable to aussie cask (some american label on it). as breakfast out of oz we had a half frozen sandwich. business class seating was like sitting on a couple of metal bars with a very basic ife with if i remember correctly had 3 movies. not worth the money. there is always a choice.
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Touche
I agree with you cunning!
Arkmark, to accuse others of having an Ego and in the next breath to be talking about "I have done this and I have done that". Hahahhahahaha. Maate, that's a crack up! I laughed till I was sick and vomited.
Arkmark, to accuse others of having an Ego and in the next breath to be talking about "I have done this and I have done that". Hahahhahahaha. Maate, that's a crack up! I laughed till I was sick and vomited.