Virgin Interviews en-mass!!!
hey i take this 'coles' analogy quite seriously, i work for qantaslink.
infact Towering Q i think you'll find the standard call is "any flybys" and then "cash out".
aspiring to be a senior checkout checker
.
infact Towering Q i think you'll find the standard call is "any flybys" and then "cash out".
aspiring to be a senior checkout checker
.
I think you need to be careful comparing wages between countries
What is the cost of living
What are the conditions - both working and living
For example - you might earn up to 100000 UK pounds per year working for Ryanair, but that doesnt equate to 100000 pounds converted to OZ dollars say 250 k AUD - the buying power isnt there
PLUS you pay for your uniforms, you pay for your airport parking, you pay for your manuals, you pay for your sim, and they treat you like ****
Emirates is the same - you appear to get well paid and not taxed BUT you pay a lot in indirect taxes, you can be slung out of the country at any time (you are a "guest" in their country), you have to work long hours and dont get any more days off that VB pilots currently do - and your not living in your own country
As for the US.
The glory days are gone there.
Was talking to some US Airways pilots the other day and their wages have DECREASED by 40% in the last 2 years.
A comparison with Australian conditions
An Embraer Captain in the US makes about USD 60K from what I am told
Should Australian pilots push for more? YES
Should Australian pilots regard themselves as hard done by? No probably not
As for Coles wages - there are actually people raising families on what Coles pays - we are not doing so bad in comparison
My point is be realistic - dont sell yourselves short, but dont push so heard that you get nothing...know where the line is
What is the cost of living
What are the conditions - both working and living
For example - you might earn up to 100000 UK pounds per year working for Ryanair, but that doesnt equate to 100000 pounds converted to OZ dollars say 250 k AUD - the buying power isnt there
PLUS you pay for your uniforms, you pay for your airport parking, you pay for your manuals, you pay for your sim, and they treat you like ****
Emirates is the same - you appear to get well paid and not taxed BUT you pay a lot in indirect taxes, you can be slung out of the country at any time (you are a "guest" in their country), you have to work long hours and dont get any more days off that VB pilots currently do - and your not living in your own country
As for the US.
The glory days are gone there.
Was talking to some US Airways pilots the other day and their wages have DECREASED by 40% in the last 2 years.
A comparison with Australian conditions
An Embraer Captain in the US makes about USD 60K from what I am told
Should Australian pilots push for more? YES
Should Australian pilots regard themselves as hard done by? No probably not
As for Coles wages - there are actually people raising families on what Coles pays - we are not doing so bad in comparison
My point is be realistic - dont sell yourselves short, but dont push so heard that you get nothing...know where the line is
Seasonally Adjusted
Senior Checkout Checker Hoss.
A considerate consumer should pass the barcode section of their flybuys card over the swipe thingy whilst the checkout operator is processing the purchases.
This reduces their workload at a critical time and can be particularly helpful if they are being checked to line.
A considerate consumer should pass the barcode section of their flybuys card over the swipe thingy whilst the checkout operator is processing the purchases.
This reduces their workload at a critical time and can be particularly helpful if they are being checked to line.
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Originally Posted by KRUSTY 34
Seriously though; My company has finally admitted that we now face the the most serious threat in our history. Hala bl@#dy luya.
The "pilot shortage" will be averted.
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...................one billion indians who will happily step in to accept the going rate just to get themselves (and a hundred or so of their closest relatives) into a civilised country
Repro,your attempt at a wind up seems to be falling on deaf ears! Keep trying.
But just to set the record straight,your figures for a DJ 737 skipper are about 5 years out of date. Current offer on the table approx 170k + o/time above 71hrs (in 28 days).
Not quite there,but getting close,and by no stretch of the imagination is it "peanuts".
Regards,
Monkey.
But just to set the record straight,your figures for a DJ 737 skipper are about 5 years out of date. Current offer on the table approx 170k + o/time above 71hrs (in 28 days).
Not quite there,but getting close,and by no stretch of the imagination is it "peanuts".
Regards,
Monkey.
Unfortunately there is no shortage of pilots amongst one billion indians who will happily step in to accept the going rate just to get themselves (and a hundred or so of their closest relatives) into a civilised country.
That ain't going to happen because all those Indians do not have the coin to pay for their training. Same in China. There might be a billion people, but how come all these Chinese airlines pay for the entire cost of training their pilots. Same in Singapore, Malaysia, Taiwan, Hong Kong, Thailand, Japan etc etc
IT got burned by India because those people can live in their own country and work through the Internet for peanuts, same with call centres, not so in aviation.
The competitive advantage in wages only works if people stay in their 3rd world country. If Mr Harshvardhan wanted to migrate from India to Australia and be a 737 FO he ain't going to survive on Indian wages. You'll need to pay him Australian wages and so the competitive advantage is lost.
Personally I'd be more worried about a MPL license that is where airlines will start paying people peanuts if they can get CASA to rewrite the rules.
The only people you will see moving into Australian Aviation will be from USA or south Africa, maybe a few Europeans. Don't forget that half the pilots in Europe would not have the minimum experience requirements to fly a PA 31 in Australia let alone a jet.
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flamingmoe, sounds like things are looking up.
But I still think your being short changed.
How does US$12,000 a month NET,
Free accomodation and monthly tickets home for 10 days sound.
Infact, I can live cheaper overseas than I can in Brisbane.
Australia's getting very expensive.
I know of a few Qantas F/O's that are bailing out and going overseas.
That has to be a fair indication of the state of aviation in Aus.
But I still think your being short changed.
How does US$12,000 a month NET,
Free accomodation and monthly tickets home for 10 days sound.
Infact, I can live cheaper overseas than I can in Brisbane.
Australia's getting very expensive.
I know of a few Qantas F/O's that are bailing out and going overseas.
That has to be a fair indication of the state of aviation in Aus.
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Originally Posted by neville_nobody
That ain't going to happen because all those Indians do not have the coin to pay for their training.
Originally Posted by neville_nobody
IT got burned by India because those people can live in their own country and work through the Internet for peanuts, same with call centres, not so in aviation.
The competitive advantage in wages only works if people stay in their 3rd world country. If Mr Harshvardhan wanted to migrate from India to Australia and be a 737 FO he ain't going to survive on Indian wages. You'll need to pay him Australian wages and so the competitive advantage is lost.
The competitive advantage in wages only works if people stay in their 3rd world country. If Mr Harshvardhan wanted to migrate from India to Australia and be a 737 FO he ain't going to survive on Indian wages. You'll need to pay him Australian wages and so the competitive advantage is lost.
Originally Posted by neville_nobody
Personally I'd be more worried about a MPL license that is where airlines will start paying people peanuts if they can get CASA to rewrite the rules.
Originally Posted by neville_nobody
Don't forget that half the pilots in Europe would not have the minimum experience requirements to fly a PA 31 in Australia let alone a jet
This idea in Aust that you need thousands of hours to fly a piston twin is very outdated. As employers are beginning to find.
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Got the invite too...
With the new rumoured bond instead of pay for rating... what will the new T&C's be?
Training wages? Salary decrease?
What is the current deal anyway if anyone knows?
With the new rumoured bond instead of pay for rating... what will the new T&C's be?
Training wages? Salary decrease?
What is the current deal anyway if anyone knows?
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Minima and others
I believe you guys have been put in an unenviable position - as per another post I made I really do believe VB (and QF also) are in a state of flux, people are leaving which in its own way is great as everyone sees movement however too much loss of experience over a short time weakens an organisation, tie that in with the expansion asperations of VB in particular and things get really interesting (and I would suggest the regulator should get a little bit nervous too!)
I would suggest VB Flight Ops management themselves do not know quite what direction to take - they are fighting fires on many fronts and the concept of a lack of "suitable" pilots for recruitment is something probably outside of their experience and they are having a hard time understanding how things have changed - bearing in mind most of the management went through a period where was a huge surplus of extremely well trained, available pilots (for whatever reason
). Some people are unable to see anything outside of their own experiences, nothing ever changes!!
So for you guys - at the very least to attend an interview and go through a sim session will be great experience, the more experience you have in interview sessions will only lessen (a little bit) the anxiety of future interviews; further I would suggest for the above reasons EVERYONE should tick the "willing to pay for endorsement" box to get the interview.
Anyone who wants to think I am saying this just to try to make life hard for VB, well fair thought but wrong. Sorry!
One of the things I have learnt - if you are offered a position you have a choice to accept or decline, if never offered a position you have no choice.
The aviation game is very different from when I started (you lucky bastards and, err, ladies ) and promotional prospects and movement are unprecedented, if offered ANY position you have to decide whether it is a good deal, average deal or a poor deal - and accept or politely decline.
Good luck to all and the hardest thing to remember - when you get in the sim enjoy the biggest, best video game you will ever experience. Hard under the pressure, I agree, but try!
I believe you guys have been put in an unenviable position - as per another post I made I really do believe VB (and QF also) are in a state of flux, people are leaving which in its own way is great as everyone sees movement however too much loss of experience over a short time weakens an organisation, tie that in with the expansion asperations of VB in particular and things get really interesting (and I would suggest the regulator should get a little bit nervous too!)
I would suggest VB Flight Ops management themselves do not know quite what direction to take - they are fighting fires on many fronts and the concept of a lack of "suitable" pilots for recruitment is something probably outside of their experience and they are having a hard time understanding how things have changed - bearing in mind most of the management went through a period where was a huge surplus of extremely well trained, available pilots (for whatever reason
). Some people are unable to see anything outside of their own experiences, nothing ever changes!!So for you guys - at the very least to attend an interview and go through a sim session will be great experience, the more experience you have in interview sessions will only lessen (a little bit) the anxiety of future interviews; further I would suggest for the above reasons EVERYONE should tick the "willing to pay for endorsement" box to get the interview.
Anyone who wants to think I am saying this just to try to make life hard for VB, well fair thought but wrong. Sorry!
One of the things I have learnt - if you are offered a position you have a choice to accept or decline, if never offered a position you have no choice.
The aviation game is very different from when I started (you lucky bastards
and, err, ladies ) and promotional prospects and movement are unprecedented, if offered ANY position you have to decide whether it is a good deal, average deal or a poor deal - and accept or politely decline.Good luck to all and the hardest thing to remember - when you get in the sim enjoy the biggest, best video game you will ever experience. Hard under the pressure, I agree, but try!
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Any one have any idea on what you're being interviewed for? Last couple of people I know got 737. (Last month) Could be the start of the Embraer thing. Gonna need a few crews for that I guess. Then again, could be for the threatened AWA's too........ read the fine print my friends.....
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I like the idea of ticking yes, doing the interview for practice (unlike Q and J* it's free I believe) and then saying no to the conditions if you are not happy with them. Sends a better message than clicking no, and you've taken up one sim spot and gives the peoplewho actually want the job a better chance.
Now hopefully everyone says no and I'll be garanteed a job, ha. just kidding
It would be good if some from VB could post the new offer, and any info on Bases and pay for the EMB... not thatI clicked yes or anything just curious.
Mind you my email address is "[email protected]"
Now hopefully everyone says no and I'll be garanteed a job, ha.
just kiddingIt would be good if some from VB could post the new offer, and any info on Bases and pay for the EMB... not thatI clicked yes or anything just curious.
Mind you my email address is "[email protected]"