REX Drop Minimum's
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Any truth that Virgin is no longer charging for the job? Hearing it a bit around the traps in the past week, but not found anything official. Thought it would be a hot topic with it's own thread?
Sounds like they may have a good supply of guys who were not willing to buy a job.
If this is true Rex had better make some urgent short term adjustments to the existing EBA.
Sounds like they may have a good supply of guys who were not willing to buy a job.
If this is true Rex had better make some urgent short term adjustments to the existing EBA.
wethereyet
heard the same rumour about 3 days ago, but thought it strange nothing on prune.
Made a few enquiries, and the unofficial goss is that it has been approved and an announcement may be imminent?
If I were a betting man, I would say that they are finishing up the latest round of recruits before dropping the bomb shell.
Then watch out! REX's official attrition rate of 20% will go through the roof.
Not like we didn't warn 'em.
heard the same rumour about 3 days ago, but thought it strange nothing on prune.
Made a few enquiries, and the unofficial goss is that it has been approved and an announcement may be imminent?
If I were a betting man, I would say that they are finishing up the latest round of recruits before dropping the bomb shell.
Then watch out! REX's official attrition rate of 20% will go through the roof.
Not like we didn't warn 'em.
Geared trim tab
Senior management and the boards responsibility is to the shareholders not the staff. Therefore they will make sure that is where the soaring profits go, of course leaving a little bit for themselves as a bonus.
Senior management and the boards responsibility is to the shareholders not the staff. Therefore they will make sure that is where the soaring profits go, of course leaving a little bit for themselves as a bonus.
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Wethereyet
The VB rumour remains strong and appears to be correct
My sources also tell me, Jet* will rapidly follow suit, newbies will be bonded instead of upfront type rating cost
It seems the bean counters will still extract the cash from you, one way or another
The VB rumour remains strong and appears to be correct
My sources also tell me, Jet* will rapidly follow suit, newbies will be bonded instead of upfront type rating cost
It seems the bean counters will still extract the cash from you, one way or another
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With a soaring profit surely there's now money which could be used to retain Pilots.
.....sadly management will never entertain a simple concept to address retention !Staff will therefore continue to vote with their feet !
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Have heard some interesting figures recently for ya...
Approx 40 pilots have left VirginBlue this year alone.
They are gearing up for 12 pilots per month for whenever.
94 flights cancelled in Feb due crew shortage.
Announcment about not paying for endorsment scheduled for July, expect serious bond and training wage.
Some Rex pilots interested but only if endorsement fee dropped.
Rex management think that the annual bonus will appease pilots but really its gets taxed to bu&&ery so no real help. Conditions are the way to go if they want to retain. Think min-rest-overnights, bidding etc
Approx 40 pilots have left VirginBlue this year alone.
They are gearing up for 12 pilots per month for whenever.
94 flights cancelled in Feb due crew shortage.
Announcment about not paying for endorsment scheduled for July, expect serious bond and training wage.
Some Rex pilots interested but only if endorsement fee dropped.
Rex management think that the annual bonus will appease pilots but really its gets taxed to bu&&ery so no real help. Conditions are the way to go if they want to retain. Think min-rest-overnights, bidding etc
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Rex management can do an aweful lot with $17 mil, things look up for the company with that profit announcement, better SAABs coming in (1 every 5 weeks), shares doing better than DJ etc. Shame they wont notice it.
I reckon they should put 4 mil aside, give hard working staff (not bludgers like some in rex) pay rises, enhance services and work hard at it to piss the stinking red rat out of the airways.....chances of that happening = nil
I reckon they should put 4 mil aside, give hard working staff (not bludgers like some in rex) pay rises, enhance services and work hard at it to piss the stinking red rat out of the airways.....chances of that happening = nil
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Better SAAB....isnt that a contridiction in terms.....
I belive REX are going to be in serious trouble if VB and JQ offer bonds or the like for new hires...every REX and Eastern pilot would apply for sure....
They can jam their profit share, the poor FO's only get a percentage of the main share anyway...probably around $2500, sure that'l make them stay.....
I belive REX are going to be in serious trouble if VB and JQ offer bonds or the like for new hires...every REX and Eastern pilot would apply for sure....
They can jam their profit share, the poor FO's only get a percentage of the main share anyway...probably around $2500, sure that'l make them stay.....
And the hits just keep on com'n.
Recently REX sent a personal message to the suitable applicants it has on file.
All 129 of them!
40 failed to respond.
20 said "No thanks I have a better offer elsewhere"
That leaves 69 "available". This assuming that they take up the offer, are able to pass the interview process, and can be successfuly checked to line.
With the expected attrition conservatively put at 60 by years end, well you do the math!
Forget about any further expansion. The 25 "new" Saabs to be delivered over the next 2 years are supposed to cover a fleet expansion of 15 aircraft. That alone will require an additional 150 pilots!
Can anyone in management see a problem here?
The only thing that will save REX is a substantial increase in T&C's. Nothing less that a 40% payrise will have any real effect. And don't tell me they can't afford it. It will add up to approx $4.50 a ticket!
The alternative, do nothing, and as I said you do the math.
Recently REX sent a personal message to the suitable applicants it has on file.
All 129 of them!
40 failed to respond.
20 said "No thanks I have a better offer elsewhere"
That leaves 69 "available". This assuming that they take up the offer, are able to pass the interview process, and can be successfuly checked to line.
With the expected attrition conservatively put at 60 by years end, well you do the math!
Forget about any further expansion. The 25 "new" Saabs to be delivered over the next 2 years are supposed to cover a fleet expansion of 15 aircraft. That alone will require an additional 150 pilots!
Can anyone in management see a problem here?
The only thing that will save REX is a substantial increase in T&C's. Nothing less that a 40% payrise will have any real effect. And don't tell me they can't afford it. It will add up to approx $4.50 a ticket!
The alternative, do nothing, and as I said you do the math.
All the regional airlines here in the United States are also experiencing a shortage of pilots.
They are losing pilots who are moving on to the majors, those that are currently hiring new staff, and not rehiring pilots still on furlough, of which there are approximately 8000.
Many are also leaving because they simply cannot afford to live on, what is basically a minimum wage.
The regionals have drop their hiring minimums here, from what used to be a pretty standard 1200 total and 200 multi engine minimum, to less than 500 total and 50 multi engine, and most can still not get enough. successful applicants to fill classes.
Most of the people taking these jobs are new pilots who have recently been instructing, as a result, most flying schools are now desperate for flight instructors, as most of them are all moving on to the regional airlines as soon as they have the above minimums.
Some regional airlines still fly 19 seat turboprop's, such as Beach 1900's but most fly Brazilia's or Saab's, in conjunction with a large percentage of Canadair and Embraer Regional Jets. Many regionals only fly RJ's.
There are almost a thousand regional jobs available here every month, nationwide, and despite struggling to fill classes, management at all these airlines have done absolutely nothing in the past two or three years since hiring began again in earnest in this country to increase wages beyond their current levels, which will see the first year FO's flying a regional jet, earning less than 20,000 US dollars a year.
That 20,000 US dollars a year is the same as earning $20,000 a year Australian, forget exchange rates as a dollar here buys as little as a dollar in Australia.
Pilots are usually faced with living in in very expensive cities, and on that money cannot pay rent, insurance and, and food for themselves, let alone anything else.
Pilots such as myself who are presently unemployed, and have close to 3000 hours total time simply cannot afford to work for what effectively works out at just above minimum wage, when total duty hours per month are taken into account.
The salary of these airlines even after two to three years still remains below $30,000 per year, and in some regional airlines it can take five to six years before getting command, at which time the salary is still only approximately $40,000.
Every regional airline in this country could easily afford to pay every flight crew captain and first officer, a combined total of more than $50,000 a year on top of what they are currently being paid. If they simply raise the cost of a ticket by $1-$2.
Sadly, as is the case in Australia, as I have been reading on many threads on this forum, management is simply only interested in profit margins, their own salaries and bonuses and treat their most valuable employees, their crews and maintenance staff, as if they are liabilities instead of assets.
If some other pilot loss figures mentioned in the above posts are correct, it is apparent that that REX and many other Australian airlines will not have sufficient crews to staff all flights as is already occurring at virgin blue, Jet Star and some others.
It is ridiculous to think of highly trained and skilled professionals such as ourselves, who have millions of dollars worth of equipment and dozens or hundreds of passengers lives in our hands every day are treated so shabbily by management at companies throughout the world.
If other highly skilled and trained professionals who have spent a fortune on their self education such as doctors and lawyers were faced with similar terms and conditions, after completing basic training, let alone more advanced courses, then without a doubt, there would also be a dire shortage worldwide of doctors and lawyers and other highly skilled professionals. As we all know there is certainly not a shortage of doctors and lawyers in most places in the US or Australia had no shortage of people signing up at university to study in these fields. Many people who have no particular passion for either one of these fields, for example, primarily enter them for the financial rewards usually on offer.
They are losing pilots who are moving on to the majors, those that are currently hiring new staff, and not rehiring pilots still on furlough, of which there are approximately 8000.
Many are also leaving because they simply cannot afford to live on, what is basically a minimum wage.
The regionals have drop their hiring minimums here, from what used to be a pretty standard 1200 total and 200 multi engine minimum, to less than 500 total and 50 multi engine, and most can still not get enough. successful applicants to fill classes.
Most of the people taking these jobs are new pilots who have recently been instructing, as a result, most flying schools are now desperate for flight instructors, as most of them are all moving on to the regional airlines as soon as they have the above minimums.
Some regional airlines still fly 19 seat turboprop's, such as Beach 1900's but most fly Brazilia's or Saab's, in conjunction with a large percentage of Canadair and Embraer Regional Jets. Many regionals only fly RJ's.
There are almost a thousand regional jobs available here every month, nationwide, and despite struggling to fill classes, management at all these airlines have done absolutely nothing in the past two or three years since hiring began again in earnest in this country to increase wages beyond their current levels, which will see the first year FO's flying a regional jet, earning less than 20,000 US dollars a year.
That 20,000 US dollars a year is the same as earning $20,000 a year Australian, forget exchange rates as a dollar here buys as little as a dollar in Australia.
Pilots are usually faced with living in in very expensive cities, and on that money cannot pay rent, insurance and, and food for themselves, let alone anything else.
Pilots such as myself who are presently unemployed, and have close to 3000 hours total time simply cannot afford to work for what effectively works out at just above minimum wage, when total duty hours per month are taken into account.
The salary of these airlines even after two to three years still remains below $30,000 per year, and in some regional airlines it can take five to six years before getting command, at which time the salary is still only approximately $40,000.
Every regional airline in this country could easily afford to pay every flight crew captain and first officer, a combined total of more than $50,000 a year on top of what they are currently being paid. If they simply raise the cost of a ticket by $1-$2.
Sadly, as is the case in Australia, as I have been reading on many threads on this forum, management is simply only interested in profit margins, their own salaries and bonuses and treat their most valuable employees, their crews and maintenance staff, as if they are liabilities instead of assets.
If some other pilot loss figures mentioned in the above posts are correct, it is apparent that that REX and many other Australian airlines will not have sufficient crews to staff all flights as is already occurring at virgin blue, Jet Star and some others.
It is ridiculous to think of highly trained and skilled professionals such as ourselves, who have millions of dollars worth of equipment and dozens or hundreds of passengers lives in our hands every day are treated so shabbily by management at companies throughout the world.
If other highly skilled and trained professionals who have spent a fortune on their self education such as doctors and lawyers were faced with similar terms and conditions, after completing basic training, let alone more advanced courses, then without a doubt, there would also be a dire shortage worldwide of doctors and lawyers and other highly skilled professionals. As we all know there is certainly not a shortage of doctors and lawyers in most places in the US or Australia had no shortage of people signing up at university to study in these fields. Many people who have no particular passion for either one of these fields, for example, primarily enter them for the financial rewards usually on offer.
Last edited by aussie027; 4th Jun 2007 at 19:16. Reason: Typos
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Re: Recruiting Numbers
My info from QF is that the rough quota is 300 over the next 2 years! We know that they are about to start with the first hires since early last year, but now the race is on.
After that is anyone's guess, but with a minimum 85 new a/c continuing to arrive and the retirement of all the 65 yo Captains, I can't see that rate slackening off in the short term. Another thread also suggests the expansion of the cadet program, but I'm pretty sure that's not going to be anough to plug all the gaps at QLink!
After that is anyone's guess, but with a minimum 85 new a/c continuing to arrive and the retirement of all the 65 yo Captains, I can't see that rate slackening off in the short term. Another thread also suggests the expansion of the cadet program, but I'm pretty sure that's not going to be anough to plug all the gaps at QLink!
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Krusty
The news spreads fast...
I heard that management had a crisis meeting regarding pilot numbers and out of the 129 applications on file only 20 were possible new hires...
All if not most had already got into other airlines....
Suffer I say, a lot of mates of mine missed out on REX for who knows what reason..... They will soon be very short.......This really could be the begining of the end of them......
Paying the pilots more now is too late the horse has bolted....
Every pilot in this country who was treated like crap in GA and regionals like REX can soon have the last laugh....!!!!
The news spreads fast...
I heard that management had a crisis meeting regarding pilot numbers and out of the 129 applications on file only 20 were possible new hires...
All if not most had already got into other airlines....
Suffer I say, a lot of mates of mine missed out on REX for who knows what reason.....
They will soon be very short.......This really could be the begining of the end of them......Paying the pilots more now is too late the horse has bolted....
Every pilot in this country who was treated like crap in GA and regionals like REX can soon have the last laugh....!!!!
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This bond that DJ and JQ are coming up with....is it really a bond or type of 'loan'. Last time I went to school, a bond is where one pays in full to receive that money back at the end of the products usage? Can someone shed some light?
BOND at REX?
ok, so copied that there is not endorsement cost met by the employee at REX. Do they bond you for a certain time or what?
Interested as i would really like to work for REX and out of the loop.
Interested as i would really like to work for REX and out of the loop.
DUXNUTZ,
Great handle by the way.
REX does not charge for endorsement, training etc.., but you will be bonded to the tune of $15k pro-rated over 2 years. ei: Leave after 12 months and you will owe $7.5K.
Mind you, If you have the mins for REX, you may like to wait 5 mins and go directly to one of the majors. Word around is that the abolition of the pay for your own rating at these carriers is just around the corner.
The Kavorka,
I'm afraid mate you may well be right. If it is only 20 that are suitable then it is worse than I thought.
The official attrition rate is approx 20%. Once the large number of current pilots who have been given start dates in AUG & SEPT give their required minimun notice, that rate will go through the roof!
I can't believe that they (management) are still saying everything is OK!
Great handle by the way.
REX does not charge for endorsement, training etc.., but you will be bonded to the tune of $15k pro-rated over 2 years. ei: Leave after 12 months and you will owe $7.5K.
Mind you, If you have the mins for REX, you may like to wait 5 mins and go directly to one of the majors. Word around is that the abolition of the pay for your own rating at these carriers is just around the corner.
The Kavorka,
I'm afraid mate you may well be right. If it is only 20 that are suitable then it is worse than I thought.
The official attrition rate is approx 20%. Once the large number of current pilots who have been given start dates in AUG & SEPT give their required minimun notice, that rate will go through the roof!
I can't believe that they (management) are still saying everything is OK!
Last edited by KRUSTY 34; 5th Jun 2007 at 21:32.
Thanx Krusty!
Had no idea about the 2 years but much prefer the bond. I think if they upped the pay to match Qlink i wouldn't even hesitate.
As it stands i have the bare mins for everyone (1000 hrs multi-crew turbine but only 500hrs as PIC) but realise Virgin etc can cherry pick the cream of the crop so happy to wait. Don't know who can afford 30k for an endorsement. I have the opportunity to interview for an E-170 gig (USA) so might do that to get some time on type for when they come dunnunda.
Had no idea about the 2 years but much prefer the bond. I think if they upped the pay to match Qlink i wouldn't even hesitate.
As it stands i have the bare mins for everyone (1000 hrs multi-crew turbine but only 500hrs as PIC) but realise Virgin etc can cherry pick the cream of the crop so happy to wait. Don't know who can afford 30k for an endorsement. I have the opportunity to interview for an E-170 gig (USA) so might do that to get some time on type for when they come dunnunda.