New Airline Picks...not Melbourne, but You Know Where...
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Howard …I did not point out other Australian holiday destinations just the tip of the Ice Berg which happen to be in or around Sydney.
As a holiday destination Australia has more than it’s fair share but my post was to point out that Melbourne is not really one of them.
Of the 8 destinations that you pointed out on top of mine how many are close to Mel……NONE
However I have thought of another which Victoria can lay claim to and that is the Great Ocean Road and it’s attractions.
My point though is that Gilligan talks about market forces but the market is talking and they want to fly to Sydney not Melbourne. I have lived in Melbourne and I liked it but it does not compare to other picture postcard
destinations if you know what I mean
Sunfish and the rest of the flat Earth society are delusional in their non acceptance of how the world works.
Again though this is not about destinations or fictional economics theories or even yacht clubs this is about one persons jealousy and bitterness after Ansett went south.
As a holiday destination Australia has more than it’s fair share but my post was to point out that Melbourne is not really one of them.
Of the 8 destinations that you pointed out on top of mine how many are close to Mel……NONE
However I have thought of another which Victoria can lay claim to and that is the Great Ocean Road and it’s attractions.
My point though is that Gilligan talks about market forces but the market is talking and they want to fly to Sydney not Melbourne. I have lived in Melbourne and I liked it but it does not compare to other picture postcard
destinations if you know what I mean
Sunfish and the rest of the flat Earth society are delusional in their non acceptance of how the world works.
Again though this is not about destinations or fictional economics theories or even yacht clubs this is about one persons jealousy and bitterness after Ansett went south.
Without pouring more fuel on the already burning fire, how can we say the market is at work in regard to demand to fly to YSSY if it's the Federal Govt restricting flights to other places?
I'm not from Melbourne or Sydney so couldn't give a crap which one is better or worse, but it does suprise me somewhat that YSSY apparently accounts for 45% of international travel. I would have thought Brisbane would be more logical being a bit closer to the rest of the world (so to speak) than either YSSY or YMML. Admittedly another 90-120 mins of flight time on a 20hr flight possibly seems significant but it does seem a bit strange. There are plenty of things to see in Brisvegas - gold coast, up to Cairns etc it just seems strange that over half our international travellors want to see the opera house and bridge?
I realise some of that is business but humour me, I am genuinely curious about the whole issue. To me YMML in terms of distance would be least favourable location, with YPPH and YBBN being the obvious choices in terms of distance. Obviously still pretty isolated in YPPH but do you get my drift?
I'm not from Melbourne or Sydney so couldn't give a crap which one is better or worse, but it does suprise me somewhat that YSSY apparently accounts for 45% of international travel. I would have thought Brisbane would be more logical being a bit closer to the rest of the world (so to speak) than either YSSY or YMML. Admittedly another 90-120 mins of flight time on a 20hr flight possibly seems significant but it does seem a bit strange. There are plenty of things to see in Brisvegas - gold coast, up to Cairns etc it just seems strange that over half our international travellors want to see the opera house and bridge?
I realise some of that is business but humour me, I am genuinely curious about the whole issue. To me YMML in terms of distance would be least favourable location, with YPPH and YBBN being the obvious choices in terms of distance. Obviously still pretty isolated in YPPH but do you get my drift?
And for the record...
http://www.news.com.au/heraldsun/sto...47-664,00.html
http://www.news.com.au/heraldsun/sto...47-664,00.html
THE number of international visitors arriving at Melbourne Airport has slumped during the past 18 months by the equivalent of more than three jumbo-jet loads a day.
Airport management blames Canberra bureaucrats for a problem that is costing Victoria tens of millions of dollars in tourist income.
Overseas visitors landing in Melbourne spend an average $3500 each during their stay, according to official surveys.
Asian and Middle East airlines, such as Air Vietnam and Qatar Airlines, have sought and been refused flight rights to Melbourne.
Both want to take the place of carriers no longer operating to and from Melbourne.
Figures released by the airport yesterday show that international passenger arrivals fell by 500,000 during the 12 months to June 30 last year -- enough people to fill 1245 Boeing 747 jumbos.
While many of these visitors will eventually arrive in Victoria via internal flights, road or rail, the loss of direct flights is a worrying trend for the airport and tourism operators.
Airport management blames Canberra bureaucrats for a problem that is costing Victoria tens of millions of dollars in tourist income.
Overseas visitors landing in Melbourne spend an average $3500 each during their stay, according to official surveys.
Asian and Middle East airlines, such as Air Vietnam and Qatar Airlines, have sought and been refused flight rights to Melbourne.
Both want to take the place of carriers no longer operating to and from Melbourne.
Figures released by the airport yesterday show that international passenger arrivals fell by 500,000 during the 12 months to June 30 last year -- enough people to fill 1245 Boeing 747 jumbos.
While many of these visitors will eventually arrive in Victoria via internal flights, road or rail, the loss of direct flights is a worrying trend for the airport and tourism operators.
The "Everyone wants to go to Sydney" market argument is a little thin because after 20+ hours travelling from say. London or New york, you will get out anywhere you can.
To put it another way, if you based your international airport at say Newcastle or Woolongong people would get out of the aircraft there and head for the nearest hotel.
The issue is a real one because international investors will not normally locate to a place where they cannot get immediate direct flights to their home base - and thats why the IT and overseas finance industries located into Sydney - they simply couldn't get anywhere else, in effect "corraled" by Qantas.
As for the number of international tourists who want to get to Melbourne, you'd be surprised, and in addition as someone who was married to a Pom and also has American relatives, you would be surprised at the number of people who have explained to me "It's so hard to get to Melbourne".
I guess the only good thing going is that the Sydney basin is now full and I hope the overcrowding continues. Victoria, and Melbourne in particular has more than enough room to grow.
Thanks for nothing Qantas.
To put it another way, if you based your international airport at say Newcastle or Woolongong people would get out of the aircraft there and head for the nearest hotel.
The issue is a real one because international investors will not normally locate to a place where they cannot get immediate direct flights to their home base - and thats why the IT and overseas finance industries located into Sydney - they simply couldn't get anywhere else, in effect "corraled" by Qantas.
As for the number of international tourists who want to get to Melbourne, you'd be surprised, and in addition as someone who was married to a Pom and also has American relatives, you would be surprised at the number of people who have explained to me "It's so hard to get to Melbourne".
I guess the only good thing going is that the Sydney basin is now full and I hope the overcrowding continues. Victoria, and Melbourne in particular has more than enough room to grow.
Thanks for nothing Qantas.
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Hang on Gilligan I'm getting my violin out but it's so hard to play because I'm crying so much...
Notice the quote from Gilligan is from a MEL paper which has never been known to be pro Mel and the figures come from...Mel Airport..
Gilligan,If people want to fly to mel why do the airlines leave and fly into Sydney....I'll give you a hint ...it's because the pax want to....If you want to live in Mexico fine but don't complain about the lack of services.
By the way you have not answered why Vic has to buy at least 25% of it's power from NSW.If you guys had the infrastructure you might do a little better or maybe you should sell the airport to the Mac Bank.
Hang on I forgot this is all about Ansett ..........duohh.........sorry
Notice the quote from Gilligan is from a MEL paper which has never been known to be pro Mel and the figures come from...Mel Airport..
Gilligan,If people want to fly to mel why do the airlines leave and fly into Sydney....I'll give you a hint ...it's because the pax want to....If you want to live in Mexico fine but don't complain about the lack of services.
By the way you have not answered why Vic has to buy at least 25% of it's power from NSW.If you guys had the infrastructure you might do a little better or maybe you should sell the airport to the Mac Bank.
Hang on I forgot this is all about Ansett ..........duohh.........sorry
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I'm a bit hesitant to get involved in this regular catfight of yours but as a frequent visitor who comes every year my thoughts are this.
Once you have visited the regular tourist highlights of Sydney the place becomes a bit dull, it is a nice place to visit for a week or so but any longer and it can't compete with Melbourne.Melbourne is a much more interesting place and has far more to offer.
Incidentally the last time i arrived from the USA i had to come via Brisbane because the Melbourne flights were all full.If Qantas aren't interested in increasing longhaul services to MEL why does the government protect the route for them, whenever i have flown longhaul with Qantas they are always full so they seem to be able to cope with competition. If other airlines want to fly to Melbourne then let them..
Once you have visited the regular tourist highlights of Sydney the place becomes a bit dull, it is a nice place to visit for a week or so but any longer and it can't compete with Melbourne.Melbourne is a much more interesting place and has far more to offer.
Incidentally the last time i arrived from the USA i had to come via Brisbane because the Melbourne flights were all full.If Qantas aren't interested in increasing longhaul services to MEL why does the government protect the route for them, whenever i have flown longhaul with Qantas they are always full so they seem to be able to cope with competition. If other airlines want to fly to Melbourne then let them..
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A little insight to Melbourne airport.
I was recently marooned in MEL International due to a QF delay of 4 hours plus on the wrong side of customs i.e. Checked in.
With time to burn I wandered around to check the International terminals board of fair only to find a few shops with selling kitsch clothing with Australian Icons stitched onto them, a surf shop and not much more.
Now as a seasoned traveller I had a good book with me (for the youth reading this thread check out "wikipedia" to see what a book is). While reading this book I realised I had nothing to look forward to on the coming delayed flight except for QF long haul cabin crew service.
So I thought a refreshing ale would kill some time and relax my mood.
low and behold ??
No bar to be found which is UN-Australian. Shame Shame Shame
Just a small kiosk with 2 staff trying valiantly to serve food, espresso coffee, bottle beer etc to 406 bored and frustrated pax from the delayed flight plus any others hoping for some refreshment before their flight.
I won’t say SYD international is even good but its head and shoulders above Melbourne facility. No wonder BA pulled out.
I was recently marooned in MEL International due to a QF delay of 4 hours plus on the wrong side of customs i.e. Checked in.
With time to burn I wandered around to check the International terminals board of fair only to find a few shops with selling kitsch clothing with Australian Icons stitched onto them, a surf shop and not much more.
Now as a seasoned traveller I had a good book with me (for the youth reading this thread check out "wikipedia" to see what a book is). While reading this book I realised I had nothing to look forward to on the coming delayed flight except for QF long haul cabin crew service.
So I thought a refreshing ale would kill some time and relax my mood. low and behold ??
No bar to be found which is UN-Australian. Shame Shame Shame
Just a small kiosk with 2 staff trying valiantly to serve food, espresso coffee, bottle beer etc to 406 bored and frustrated pax from the delayed flight plus any others hoping for some refreshment before their flight.
I won’t say SYD international is even good but its head and shoulders above Melbourne facility. No wonder BA pulled out.
Evertonian
Ahh, but its a viscious circle Bolty. If the airlines aren't coming, or the Govt. is not allowing them (as above & the crux of this particular issue for me), why would any proprietor bother to staff a complete set of facilities for 1 delayed flight?
If other ports are not marketed properly to tourists, then why would anyone expect people to come. Of course, the thousands of people that cartexchange spoke are excluded from that when it comes to MEL.
As it happens, BA has pulled out of MEL more often than Boris in a broom closet! And I can assure you, the departures lounge is much better than it was the first time they withdrew!
If other ports are not marketed properly to tourists, then why would anyone expect people to come. Of course, the thousands of people that cartexchange spoke are excluded from that when it comes to MEL.
As it happens, BA has pulled out of MEL more often than Boris in a broom closet! And I can assure you, the departures lounge is much better than it was the first time they withdrew!
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So what about Cathay, Virgin Atlantic and Emirates? All can look after A345/6 whereas I'm not sure anyone in QF would have the cover.
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Buster
You spoke to two Spanish tennis players and within 20 min found a computer to post on - seriously, is "getting a life" at sometime in your life anything of a priority??
And the upside to the downside (yes increadibly bad english but stiff, live with it) I like Melbourne, am happy to call it home and don't give a rats a**e what other people think!
Further for Buster - I have been a lurker on Pprune for many years, only just recently been brave enough to join (quiet sensative type you understand.)
Have always enjoyed your posts
although a word of warning - if you fly as well as you "play with words" you have Bugger All chance of getting into management!!
Just a kindly word of thought.
You spoke to two Spanish tennis players and within 20 min found a computer to post on - seriously, is "getting a life" at sometime in your life anything of a priority??
And the upside to the downside (yes increadibly bad english but stiff, live with it) I like Melbourne, am happy to call it home and don't give a rats a**e what other people think!
Further for Buster - I have been a lurker on Pprune for many years, only just recently been brave enough to join (quiet sensative type you understand.)
Have always enjoyed your posts
although a word of warning - if you fly as well as you "play with words" you have Bugger All chance of getting into management!!Just a kindly word of thought.
Evertonian
Ooohh...Lurkers 
Just one small step to stalker!!!
Now, the new gym equipment we have has cable & I reckon an internet connection if I look hard enough! (25% Power courtesy of NSW
) I had to race to a PC to make sure I remembered the correct pronunciation of "Muchos Grandos Melbourn...os!" which translated to "Geez Manuel, this place ****s on Sydney!"
As you can see, it was worth the extra sprint!
Nearest I got to flying was going to the pointy end & saying; "An extra tonne of fuel eh? Where do ya want it? Here in the cockpit?"
Just one small step to stalker!!!Now, the new gym equipment we have has cable & I reckon an internet connection if I look hard enough! (25% Power courtesy of NSW
) I had to race to a PC to make sure I remembered the correct pronunciation of "Muchos Grandos Melbourn...os!" which translated to "Geez Manuel, this place ****s on Sydney!"As you can see, it was worth the extra sprint!
Nearest I got to flying was going to the pointy end & saying; "An extra tonne of fuel eh? Where do ya want it? Here in the cockpit?"
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Buster
So you went into the cockpit and "gently" indicated that the chances of their getting extra fuel was "f**k all!"
My humblest apologies - obviously, with your tact and discretion you are already a manager; maybe a GD protoge!!
(and I meant that in a nasty-but-oh so nice type of way!)
So you went into the cockpit and "gently" indicated that the chances of their getting extra fuel was "f**k all!"
My humblest apologies - obviously, with your tact and discretion you are already a manager; maybe a GD protoge!!
(and I meant that in a nasty-but-oh so nice type of way!)
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C’mon people they are both dumps (SYD & MEL), tell me why there is so many people moving up here to Queensland? No you don’t have to tell me why because standard of living is way way down in SYD & MEL, hell holes, both of them, Mel a little more so than Syd because of that ridiculous winter game they play that you score points for missing the goals in. 
The biggest problem we face up here is the amount of Victorians & New south Welshpeople moving in and wrecking it, much as they did in their home towns /cities. It don’t take long to find Sydney a little dull, and having been shown all the best that Melbourne has to offer by some local Melbournians, well……..is that the best you can do?
Yeah sure there are some nice places around the harbour, the bridge is iconic, the (some) Melbourne architecture is impressive, but to live there? LIVE there?, that’s’ no life!!!
I really think we should separate from the rest of Australia, reclaim our rightful southern border, and apply ludicrously difficult visa requirements to visit our wonderful republic in the sun. Vic and NSW Folk are welcome as temp slave labourers only.
The biggest problem we face up here is the amount of Victorians & New south Welshpeople moving in and wrecking it, much as they did in their home towns /cities. It don’t take long to find Sydney a little dull, and having been shown all the best that Melbourne has to offer by some local Melbournians, well……..is that the best you can do?
Yeah sure there are some nice places around the harbour, the bridge is iconic, the (some) Melbourne architecture is impressive, but to live there? LIVE there?, that’s’ no life!!!
I really think we should separate from the rest of Australia, reclaim our rightful southern border, and apply ludicrously difficult visa requirements to visit our wonderful republic in the sun. Vic and NSW Folk are welcome as temp slave labourers only.
Evertonian
I'll second that...and Pauline can be your Queen! Joh can be your deity (You, you, you, you...etc), Cane Toads can be on your coat of arms...
Rugby can be your National sport & you can have it! A bunch of "No neck Nancies" running around sticking their fingers up each others jetsies!!! Dear, oh dear...at least you get some points for "trying" As for goals, they can't be kicked unless someone carefully places it on the ground & everyone else stands back while some squib thinks about kicking it? Strewth! Real goals are kicked on the run, with the goals at right angles to you and real "men" (not those Sydney ones) about to push you face first into the fence!
Rugby can be your National sport & you can have it! A bunch of "No neck Nancies" running around sticking their fingers up each others jetsies!!! Dear, oh dear...at least you get some points for "trying"
As for goals, they can't be kicked unless someone carefully places it on the ground & everyone else stands back while some squib thinks about kicking it? Strewth! Real goals are kicked on the run, with the goals at right angles to you and real "men" (not those Sydney ones) about to push you face first into the fence!
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Hey Boys and Girls did you hear that NASA has done some work with their satellites and found that Tasmania is moving closer to the Mainland by about 1.5 mm a year……..yep Melbourne sucks
Someone was having a shot at the best city in Oz because it has the pillow biters parade once a year.If you want to see a real set of girls just watch the moomba parade..
And don't get me started on the land of the brown paper bag.Have you guys up in Queensland got electricity yet?
Someone was having a shot at the best city in Oz because it has the pillow biters parade once a year.If you want to see a real set of girls just watch the moomba parade..
And don't get me started on the land of the brown paper bag.Have you guys up in Queensland got electricity yet?
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Like I said you guys stay down there……………
We’ve electricity – “Don’t you worry about that”
And keep up that VFL stuff, an expansive, messy free for all BUT it does open the door to such quality events as that “International Rules” – Ha Ha Ha Ha - LMAO, do you get points for missing in that one too?
Been nice stirring you now, but I have to run, off to eat Moreton bay Bugs and mangos, exchange a few brown paper bags with the local member, and sink a few ice cold XXXXs with Queen Pauline, who, as it so happens proposed some policies later taken up by that shining light of honesty & integrity, none other than dear old Kim Il John of Kirribilli.
We’ve electricity – “Don’t you worry about that”
And keep up that VFL stuff, an expansive, messy free for all BUT it does open the door to such quality events as that “International Rules” – Ha Ha Ha Ha - LMAO, do you get points for missing in that one too?
Been nice stirring you now, but I have to run, off to eat Moreton bay Bugs and mangos, exchange a few brown paper bags with the local member, and sink a few ice cold XXXXs with Queen Pauline, who, as it so happens proposed some policies later taken up by that shining light of honesty & integrity, none other than dear old Kim Il John of Kirribilli.