View Poll Results: Which airline would you like to work for:
JetStar?
59
23.32%
Virgin Blue?
157
62.06%
Neither
37
14.62%
Voters: 253. This poll is closed
Jet* or Virgin Blue - what would you choose?
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Jet* or Virgin Blue - what would you choose?
Jet* or Virgin Blue - what would you choose?
I would like to know what would be the reasons for people to choose between Jet* and Virgin Blue, if you were offered a position at either company.
I have looked at some different factors.
- Lifestyle
- Industry respect
- Remuneration package
- Career progression within the company
- Prospects that are available to those who wish to move on 5-10 years later to other companies.
If you had a choice, what would it be and for what reasons??
At this stage for me it would be VB, convince me otherwise!
I would like to know what would be the reasons for people to choose between Jet* and Virgin Blue, if you were offered a position at either company.
I have looked at some different factors.
- Lifestyle
- Industry respect
- Remuneration package
- Career progression within the company
- Prospects that are available to those who wish to move on 5-10 years later to other companies.
If you had a choice, what would it be and for what reasons??
At this stage for me it would be VB, convince me otherwise!
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Good question!!.
But (32 Mega)you failed to mention your reasons for choosing VB.
I expect there will be some who will have to face this decision.
For me;
Lifestyle-Jetstar;home almost every night oppossed to 10-14 O/nights a month.
Renumeration Package,Jetstar;base maybe similar but overtime is easily achievable;so if you get called out on reserve at least you know most times you'll get payed for it.
Career Progression-Jetstar;There shouldn't be much debate with this one.With the the amount of wide bodies on firm order and narrow probably to come,Commands will be much quicker,and don't forget,Jetstar will operate Planes that will be in demand world wide as opposed to your first Command in VB on Jungle Jets.
As for International, there is no guarantee that VB will be doing any International and if they do there is nothing in the new EBA to suggest that current crews will get the gig.
Industry Respect,well Mega I know this was second on your list but I've left it to last ,and I expect that it is from some of the twisted,derangerd comments that come from prune about Jetstar that you've chosen to use this as one of your;Differnt Factors.
So will you enlighten us to what you mean or expect the differences to be between the two Airlines with regard to "Industry Respect".
Jetstar Pilots are no different from anyone else.The're still a bunch of people who went through school,decided that they might like to fly a plane for a living,did the training, got the experience, had a look at the different Airline opportunities in OZ and decided to apply. If they did OK they got the Job,no different from any other Airline process in OZ.
So if you have different reasons for joining VB well good luck to you,hope you get a slot,but everyone has an option and all options are above board and everyone can hold their head high.
But (32 Mega)you failed to mention your reasons for choosing VB.
I expect there will be some who will have to face this decision.
For me;
Lifestyle-Jetstar;home almost every night oppossed to 10-14 O/nights a month.
Renumeration Package,Jetstar;base maybe similar but overtime is easily achievable;so if you get called out on reserve at least you know most times you'll get payed for it.
Career Progression-Jetstar;There shouldn't be much debate with this one.With the the amount of wide bodies on firm order and narrow probably to come,Commands will be much quicker,and don't forget,Jetstar will operate Planes that will be in demand world wide as opposed to your first Command in VB on Jungle Jets.
As for International, there is no guarantee that VB will be doing any International and if they do there is nothing in the new EBA to suggest that current crews will get the gig.
Industry Respect,well Mega I know this was second on your list but I've left it to last ,and I expect that it is from some of the twisted,derangerd comments that come from prune about Jetstar that you've chosen to use this as one of your;Differnt Factors.
So will you enlighten us to what you mean or expect the differences to be between the two Airlines with regard to "Industry Respect".
Jetstar Pilots are no different from anyone else.The're still a bunch of people who went through school,decided that they might like to fly a plane for a living,did the training, got the experience, had a look at the different Airline opportunities in OZ and decided to apply. If they did OK they got the Job,no different from any other Airline process in OZ.
So if you have different reasons for joining VB well good luck to you,hope you get a slot,but everyone has an option and all options are above board and everyone can hold their head high.
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Thumbs up,
thank you for your reply. I agree, every one should hold their head high!
I included industry respect into this as it can influence ones decision.
I am open to either airline and it is from the posts and information through pprune, newspapers, ASX and others that I have at this stage considered VB suitable. However, I can also see myself in a Jetstar position within a year or two if I decided this path. I am trying to research what is most suitable to my lifestyle and how satisfied I would be in making an important decision as such.
As for my reasons, I do think respect has a lot to do with picking a career path and both should be respected, but at the moment it swings in one direction more so than the other.
I honestly do not like the slagging that other pilots give either Jet* or VB in any respect, but would it influence you in getting a career with another airline down the track if you were to choose one over the other now. In regards to Cathay, M-Rats etc.
At this stage, I am still with VB, but you have swayed me toward Jet* slightly. Like I said before, I can be convinced otherwise. I am open to suggestions from both sides and others that are in the same situation that you and I find ourselves in would be interested to know what would best suit them.
thank you for your reply. I agree, every one should hold their head high!
I included industry respect into this as it can influence ones decision.
I am open to either airline and it is from the posts and information through pprune, newspapers, ASX and others that I have at this stage considered VB suitable. However, I can also see myself in a Jetstar position within a year or two if I decided this path. I am trying to research what is most suitable to my lifestyle and how satisfied I would be in making an important decision as such.
As for my reasons, I do think respect has a lot to do with picking a career path and both should be respected, but at the moment it swings in one direction more so than the other.
I honestly do not like the slagging that other pilots give either Jet* or VB in any respect, but would it influence you in getting a career with another airline down the track if you were to choose one over the other now. In regards to Cathay, M-Rats etc.
At this stage, I am still with VB, but you have swayed me toward Jet* slightly. Like I said before, I can be convinced otherwise. I am open to suggestions from both sides and others that are in the same situation that you and I find ourselves in would be interested to know what would best suit them.
Jetstar Pilots are no different from anyone else.The're still a bunch of people who went through school,decided that they might like to fly a plane for a living,did the training, got the experience, had a look at the different Airline opportunities in OZ and decided to apply. If they did OK they got the Job,no different from any other Airline process in OZ.
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The reality is that you take the first job that is offered to you. Really simple, the rest is dream time stuff. Neither company respects their empoyees from reports I have heard.
All pretty valid points so far, but I am surprised that noone has suggested the options for basing as one of their criteria. As I understand it, Jetstar has bases in AVV, CNS, ADL, SYD, NTL, HBA and CHC, as well as MEL and BNE, whereas VB has only MEL and BNE.
On the other hand the SE Queensland base for Jetstar requires pilots to be available from OOL or BNE - a bonus for some, a drawback for others. Given that different people have different tastes and hail from different places, this must also be something to consider.
Either option seems to offer good opportunities for future promotion.
As far as "industry respect" goes, well I think if you were applying to an overseas carrier at some time in the future they would regard your experience equally from either carrier; both have good operational standards.
Overall however, as Coaldemon says, you take the first opportunity you are offered.
On the other hand the SE Queensland base for Jetstar requires pilots to be available from OOL or BNE - a bonus for some, a drawback for others. Given that different people have different tastes and hail from different places, this must also be something to consider.
Either option seems to offer good opportunities for future promotion.
As far as "industry respect" goes, well I think if you were applying to an overseas carrier at some time in the future they would regard your experience equally from either carrier; both have good operational standards.
Overall however, as Coaldemon says, you take the first opportunity you are offered.
32 M If you actually have a choice between the two then you are in an enviable position, fact is grab the first offer and go for it. Its all about foot in the door etc....best of luck.
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Is it true with Jet* that if you move to Melbourne your progression to Capt. will be quicker than the other bases?
Picking either Jet* or VB is an option - the first one that offers you a go right, and so is just applying to one as well!
Picking either Jet* or VB is an option - the first one that offers you a go right, and so is just applying to one as well!
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Question time for you
I personally have no idea which would be the better company to work for... but in the end I'd choose the one that would allow me to be the happiest. Family wise I'd safely assume that to be JQ. However, I'd like to enquire as to how the daily lifestyles in each company differ. BARE WITH ME:
1) Are equipment changes common at either? Or is it more likely that the aircraft you fly firstly will be the aircraft you fly for the entire day? I assume at JQ there must be occasional swaps because there are times when an aircraft (say VQP) leaves HBT in the morning and doesn't come back all day??? There are notable similar occurances from other bases too. So I assume ac/crew changes are a must at JQ? How does this compare to DJ?
2) What are the daily flying activities like? Obviously at DJ the crews fly all around the country. But at JQ will you eventually just be flying the same few routes from your base? Eg: Would a HBT or SYD pilot ever find himself/herself flying AVV-PER? Or would a CNS pilot likely ever fly into LST? Likewise, would a NTL crew member fly the same routes day in and day out, or is there some variety in the system? In order for there NOT to be overnights, I would assume that greatly limits the number of ports/routes the crews may operate???
3) Are there certain "regular" shifts??? - Are there regular AM sign-ons with pm sign-offs? or Pm sign-ons with late pm sign-offs??? Morning shift vs. arvo shift sort of stuff, or are shifts scattered throughout the day? How does this apply at Virgin (I assume it would be more scattered)?
4) Overnighting at Virgin: What sort of layover times are the norm? 10hrs? 12 hrs?
5) Do the operations vary greatly between bases at either carrier (hours flown, overtime, overnights, early starts, late finishes etc...)?
6) How many aircraft do JQ have based at each base? Correspondingly, roughly how many crew are there at each base?
***If ANYONE can answer some of that I'd be not only greatful, but rather impressed
Just a few things that I'd been wondering for QUITE some time now. Cheers in advance, and I hope I'm not robbing the thread to badly, I'm sure the answers will help paint a clearer picture for the many aspiring LCC wannabees
1) Are equipment changes common at either? Or is it more likely that the aircraft you fly firstly will be the aircraft you fly for the entire day? I assume at JQ there must be occasional swaps because there are times when an aircraft (say VQP) leaves HBT in the morning and doesn't come back all day??? There are notable similar occurances from other bases too. So I assume ac/crew changes are a must at JQ? How does this compare to DJ?
2) What are the daily flying activities like? Obviously at DJ the crews fly all around the country. But at JQ will you eventually just be flying the same few routes from your base? Eg: Would a HBT or SYD pilot ever find himself/herself flying AVV-PER? Or would a CNS pilot likely ever fly into LST? Likewise, would a NTL crew member fly the same routes day in and day out, or is there some variety in the system? In order for there NOT to be overnights, I would assume that greatly limits the number of ports/routes the crews may operate???
3) Are there certain "regular" shifts??? - Are there regular AM sign-ons with pm sign-offs? or Pm sign-ons with late pm sign-offs??? Morning shift vs. arvo shift sort of stuff, or are shifts scattered throughout the day? How does this apply at Virgin (I assume it would be more scattered)?
4) Overnighting at Virgin: What sort of layover times are the norm? 10hrs? 12 hrs?
5) Do the operations vary greatly between bases at either carrier (hours flown, overtime, overnights, early starts, late finishes etc...)?
6) How many aircraft do JQ have based at each base? Correspondingly, roughly how many crew are there at each base?
***If ANYONE can answer some of that I'd be not only greatful, but rather impressed
Just a few things that I'd been wondering for QUITE some time now. Cheers in advance, and I hope I'm not robbing the thread to badly, I'm sure the answers will help paint a clearer picture for the many aspiring LCC wannabees
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VB for me.
Wonder which would offer an easier/quicker way to get in the game.......
VB with jungle jets
Jetstar with nose ballast on international flights. [2nd FO]
VB do definately have better hosties
Wonder which would offer an easier/quicker way to get in the game.......
VB with jungle jets
Jetstar with nose ballast on international flights. [2nd FO]
VB do definately have better hosties
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Hawk, 15K ( a captains bonus, BTW ) is less than 10 hours O/T for a Jet* jock p/month, or 8-10 callouts on days off ( per year ) plus 4-5 hours o/t a month, which at present is more than achievable. ( most skippers in the 150-160k bracket )
While we are on the subject of working on days off, VB pay a pittance for this.
Ohforsure, equipment changes happen in both carriers, not all that regularly.
Most Jet* bases fly to a number of ports, bigger bases ML,SY, SEQ obviously have a bit more variety, but after you've been to a place a few times its all 2000m+ of bitumen.
Shifts are generally either morning or arvo, and generally get your 75 hours in less than 15 duty days which leaves either 15 days off or alot of o/t.
Mates at VB tell me most ( not all ) o/nights are short 12 hours or so, the glory days of 36 hour layovers are well and truly over.
18 wheeler, used to be of the same opinion, until I started spending a few hours in the flight deck of an Airbus v a Boeing, no contest for comfort and ergo's. Having said that, cant wait for the 787 to arrive
One small thing nobody mentioned, alot harder to get into Jet* with QF phsyco test, this seems to cull >50%.
While we are on the subject of working on days off, VB pay a pittance for this.
Ohforsure, equipment changes happen in both carriers, not all that regularly.
Most Jet* bases fly to a number of ports, bigger bases ML,SY, SEQ obviously have a bit more variety, but after you've been to a place a few times its all 2000m+ of bitumen.
Shifts are generally either morning or arvo, and generally get your 75 hours in less than 15 duty days which leaves either 15 days off or alot of o/t.
Mates at VB tell me most ( not all ) o/nights are short 12 hours or so, the glory days of 36 hour layovers are well and truly over.
18 wheeler, used to be of the same opinion, until I started spending a few hours in the flight deck of an Airbus v a Boeing, no contest for comfort and ergo's. Having said that, cant wait for the 787 to arrive
One small thing nobody mentioned, alot harder to get into Jet* with QF phsyco test, this seems to cull >50%.
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cunning,
While I am not defending either J* or VB conditions - as they are both sub-standard, the VB retention payment of $15000/year for Capts, and the % that FO's get, is not related to having to do overtime or working on days off.
If you want work on days off, and do extra flying then good for you. Most people I know want to spend as little time at work as possible. Days off are gold, especially for those with families.
Regarding the pittance VB pay for working on a day off, not many people agree to work on days off for that very reason. Only the brown-noses, and you get them everywhere! By working days off you are allowing the company to employ less pilots, and denying FO's Command Upgrades.
While I am not defending either J* or VB conditions - as they are both sub-standard, the VB retention payment of $15000/year for Capts, and the % that FO's get, is not related to having to do overtime or working on days off.
If you want work on days off, and do extra flying then good for you. Most people I know want to spend as little time at work as possible. Days off are gold, especially for those with families.
Regarding the pittance VB pay for working on a day off, not many people agree to work on days off for that very reason. Only the brown-noses, and you get them everywhere! By working days off you are allowing the company to employ less pilots, and denying FO's Command Upgrades.
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easy choice!!!
JQ, command in 2-5 years vs VB around 8-10 at present
JQ, fly a330 if you choose, then 787 when it arrives
same money give or take and more money to be made if you choose to go to JQ int.
bun chuckers mostly the same!! I've seen some pretty bad ones on both airlines.
managment same for both airlines, tight a#$"@
endorsment cost same
again easy choice!!!!
JQ, command in 2-5 years vs VB around 8-10 at present
JQ, fly a330 if you choose, then 787 when it arrives
same money give or take and more money to be made if you choose to go to JQ int.
bun chuckers mostly the same!! I've seen some pretty bad ones on both airlines.
managment same for both airlines, tight a#$"@
endorsment cost same
again easy choice!!!!
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I do think that the opinions do differ somewhat here, which is great!
I was all for VB at the start, but very much so think that Jet* is becomming the better option.
If there was less slagging of Jet* pilots in the industry, I am sure the pole would be quite different to what it is now. In a few years Jet* recruiting may have a higher pool to choose from.
I am wondering though, isn't it true that many of the first Jet* pilots have not even done a psych test. How many of these guys would fail now if they tried. It seems to me though they can still fly ok.
Also, a question I had earlier was that if you joined one of these companies, would it make any difference to further employment prospects later on. I have heard that for most Jet* pilots it could be a career choice and would make it difficult to move. This was touched on, that it would not make a difference to further jobs, but experience would.
Ok, so that may sound true, but even now, is there many guys (I know it's early days), getting out of Jet* and into better paying jobs throughout the rest of the world.
Chimbu Warrior
"As far as "industry respect" goes, well I think if you were applying to an overseas carrier at some time in the future they would regard your experience equally from either carrier; both have good operational standards."
My Question, is one airline favoured over an other in the broader circles. Does Cathay, Emirates favour one over the other.
Now if I decide to join one, it would be most likely that after 8-12 years I may think of moving on if it was VB, or 5-10 years if it were Jet*, to a better paying job. I want to know if joining either company could affect any further career prospects further down the line (more than just experience alone).
Now, only if one of these two would get a bonding system. That would make all the difference to my decision.
I was all for VB at the start, but very much so think that Jet* is becomming the better option.
If there was less slagging of Jet* pilots in the industry, I am sure the pole would be quite different to what it is now. In a few years Jet* recruiting may have a higher pool to choose from.
I am wondering though, isn't it true that many of the first Jet* pilots have not even done a psych test. How many of these guys would fail now if they tried. It seems to me though they can still fly ok.
Also, a question I had earlier was that if you joined one of these companies, would it make any difference to further employment prospects later on. I have heard that for most Jet* pilots it could be a career choice and would make it difficult to move. This was touched on, that it would not make a difference to further jobs, but experience would.
Ok, so that may sound true, but even now, is there many guys (I know it's early days), getting out of Jet* and into better paying jobs throughout the rest of the world.
Chimbu Warrior
"As far as "industry respect" goes, well I think if you were applying to an overseas carrier at some time in the future they would regard your experience equally from either carrier; both have good operational standards."
My Question, is one airline favoured over an other in the broader circles. Does Cathay, Emirates favour one over the other.
Now if I decide to join one, it would be most likely that after 8-12 years I may think of moving on if it was VB, or 5-10 years if it were Jet*, to a better paying job. I want to know if joining either company could affect any further career prospects further down the line (more than just experience alone).
Now, only if one of these two would get a bonding system. That would make all the difference to my decision.