Qantas's frequent flyer change 'shocking'
Thread Starter
Join Date: Mar 2001
Location: Townsville,Nth Queensland
Posts: 2,717
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Qantas's frequent flyer change 'shocking'
Thurs "Sydney Morning Herald"
Qantas's frequent flyer change 'shocking'
By Kirsty Needham, Consumer Reporter
November 25, 2004
Qantas has overhauled its frequent flyer program, making it easier to earn reward seats on short routes but raising the points needed for most flights.
Frequent flyers have described the changes as shocking, and one industry analyst warned that they are likely to upset international, business and first-class passengers.
Clifford Reichlin, who runs the independent website frequentflyer.com.au, said a reduction in points needed for Sydney to Melbourne or Brisbane seats was a "smokescreen".
"Many members use frequent flyer points to upgrade and these opportunities have been dramatically reduced," said Mr Reichlin. "I find it strange and it will piss off the corporate travellers."
From May upgrades will no longer be available on discount fares and will not be able to be confirmed in advance on international flights.
Qantas's head of marketing, Martin McKinnon, said the changes were a "rebalancing" of the program.
"There were some incredible deals around, almost to a ridiculous point," he said. "In a lot of cases it didn't bear any resemblance to reality.
"No one likes prices going up ... but we had to correct it."
From today, frequent flyers will be able to give points to a family member once a year, or buy additional points to attain a reward booking.
One-way flight redemptions will be introduced from May when a new reward system sees a flight under 600 miles (965 kilometres), such as from Sydney to Melbourne, drop in cost from 20,000 to 16,000 points.
"People who don't have huge points balances now get a chance to use them," said Mr McKinnon.
The measures formed part of Qantas's undertakings to the Australian Competition and Consumer Commission earlier this year as the watchdog investigated claims the frequent flyer program was unfair.
But flights to Perth will need 6000 more points, and a flight to London 18,000 more. A first-class flight to Europe will rise from 275,000 to 384,000 points.
Qantas faced a member backlash on the internet yesterday.
"My points have been devalued by 20 per cent. So much for loyalty," one person wrote to http://www.frequentflyer.com Another said that gold and platinum memberships had had their value cut in half by the changes coupled with recent moves by banks to make earning points harder.
A telephone booking fee will also be introduced for people who need to speak to an operator and stray from the auto-voice prompts.
=========================================
Qantas's frequent flyer change 'shocking'
By Kirsty Needham, Consumer Reporter
November 25, 2004
Qantas has overhauled its frequent flyer program, making it easier to earn reward seats on short routes but raising the points needed for most flights.
Frequent flyers have described the changes as shocking, and one industry analyst warned that they are likely to upset international, business and first-class passengers.
Clifford Reichlin, who runs the independent website frequentflyer.com.au, said a reduction in points needed for Sydney to Melbourne or Brisbane seats was a "smokescreen".
"Many members use frequent flyer points to upgrade and these opportunities have been dramatically reduced," said Mr Reichlin. "I find it strange and it will piss off the corporate travellers."
From May upgrades will no longer be available on discount fares and will not be able to be confirmed in advance on international flights.
Qantas's head of marketing, Martin McKinnon, said the changes were a "rebalancing" of the program.
"There were some incredible deals around, almost to a ridiculous point," he said. "In a lot of cases it didn't bear any resemblance to reality.
"No one likes prices going up ... but we had to correct it."
From today, frequent flyers will be able to give points to a family member once a year, or buy additional points to attain a reward booking.
One-way flight redemptions will be introduced from May when a new reward system sees a flight under 600 miles (965 kilometres), such as from Sydney to Melbourne, drop in cost from 20,000 to 16,000 points.
"People who don't have huge points balances now get a chance to use them," said Mr McKinnon.
The measures formed part of Qantas's undertakings to the Australian Competition and Consumer Commission earlier this year as the watchdog investigated claims the frequent flyer program was unfair.
But flights to Perth will need 6000 more points, and a flight to London 18,000 more. A first-class flight to Europe will rise from 275,000 to 384,000 points.
Qantas faced a member backlash on the internet yesterday.
"My points have been devalued by 20 per cent. So much for loyalty," one person wrote to http://www.frequentflyer.com Another said that gold and platinum memberships had had their value cut in half by the changes coupled with recent moves by banks to make earning points harder.
A telephone booking fee will also be introduced for people who need to speak to an operator and stray from the auto-voice prompts.
=========================================
Join Date: Sep 2001
Location: Wanna Be Up There...
Age: 53
Posts: 279
Likes: 0
Received 1 Like
on
1 Post
Given that it is virtually impossible to book an overseas flight with frequent flyer points it is all pretty much academic anyway isn't it?
Personally I use mine to buy kitchen appliances and the occassional trip to Sydney to see a show for me and the missus.
And as for going to Perth, does anyone do that of their own free will anyway?
Personally I use mine to buy kitchen appliances and the occassional trip to Sydney to see a show for me and the missus.
And as for going to Perth, does anyone do that of their own free will anyway?
C'mon guys, give the Rat a chance. Most FFs are free-loaders (the Visa-at-Coles trick or juicy company travel perks) so they don't really deserve them anyway. The program is called a FREQUENT FLYER program, not a "hand out free travel" program.
Oz wanted cheap fares, they got 'em with Virgin and Jetstar, neither of which have loyalty programs; how else is QF to compete if not tightening up on FFs? And let's not forget even QF fares have dropped markedly...far more than a piddly 39,000 points to Sydney. Spend $39,000 on your Visa and get a free trip to Sydney, which would've only cost you $400 return with QF. Big deal.
If you pay when you fly, fair enough. Otherwise, stop whinging.
Oz wanted cheap fares, they got 'em with Virgin and Jetstar, neither of which have loyalty programs; how else is QF to compete if not tightening up on FFs? And let's not forget even QF fares have dropped markedly...far more than a piddly 39,000 points to Sydney. Spend $39,000 on your Visa and get a free trip to Sydney, which would've only cost you $400 return with QF. Big deal.
If you pay when you fly, fair enough. Otherwise, stop whinging.
Just Binos
Join Date: Oct 2000
Location: Mackay, Australia
Age: 71
Posts: 1,397
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
If the Rat didn't want the supermarket ferals flying with them, they wouldn't have bothered handing out points to various cards. A bit late to get snobbish now, Capt Bloggs; most passengers don't wear ties these days.
Me, I'm a confessed feral. In the days when QF could get away with $700 MKY-BNE return, I was grateful for a return flight for 30,000 points. Now I can get the same one hour flight for $39 to a max of $89 each way on the day of travel, having to grovel to QF for the one seat they put aside a month in advance doesn't enter the equation anymore.
Scrap 'em all, QF, I'll trade all mine in for a bottle of scotch and fly with the cheapies. Or is the plan to wait till DJ goes broke then remove Jetstar from the market?
Hmm, maybe I'll hang on to those points after all; one day they might buy me an ashtray for my motorbike.
Me, I'm a confessed feral. In the days when QF could get away with $700 MKY-BNE return, I was grateful for a return flight for 30,000 points. Now I can get the same one hour flight for $39 to a max of $89 each way on the day of travel, having to grovel to QF for the one seat they put aside a month in advance doesn't enter the equation anymore.
Scrap 'em all, QF, I'll trade all mine in for a bottle of scotch and fly with the cheapies. Or is the plan to wait till DJ goes broke then remove Jetstar from the market?
Hmm, maybe I'll hang on to those points after all; one day they might buy me an ashtray for my motorbike.
Join Date: Mar 2002
Location: Under the Equator
Posts: 605
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
After 10 years of solid loyalty as a customer and gold card holder, despite cheaper fares elsewhere - the loyalty has not been returned as my points have been devalued. - not to mention a gradual reduction in service quality over last couple of years.
Virgin, Emirates, AirNZ, JAL & United for me now...
My Bank did the same trick with their points & service. So I changed.
Come on open skies for SQ on the Pacific routes.
QF can stick their club & points, my QF shares will be disposed of today as I think this will result in a backlash from business travellers as there ARE alternatives now.
Virgin, Emirates, AirNZ, JAL & United for me now...
My Bank did the same trick with their points & service. So I changed.
Come on open skies for SQ on the Pacific routes.
QF can stick their club & points, my QF shares will be disposed of today as I think this will result in a backlash from business travellers as there ARE alternatives now.
PPRuNeaholic
Join Date: Jun 2000
Location: Cairns FNQ
Posts: 3,255
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Looks like I did the right thing by using my points for my trip to the UK next August, while the "old" rate is still current. This will be my fourth points trip to London and, by the sounds of it, undoubtedly my last as well... 
I've been amazed at how far ahead one needs to book, in order to take advantage of one's points.
Unless Binos has got is sussed right, it won't be worth accumulating FF points in future.
I've been amazed at how far ahead one needs to book, in order to take advantage of one's points.Unless Binos has got is sussed right, it won't be worth accumulating FF points in future.
OK. Sell my AN Golden Wing points to the highest bidder... anybody out there?
Now the real world:
Going to the golden west?
1. Use credit card for ticket on internet.
2. ignore the ferals in row 64.
3. enjoy WA to the max while you decide where to unload the Credit Card points - the lava lamp or the dreamcatcher??
4. Remember that airline points are generally worthless anyway...
Now the real world:
Going to the golden west?
1. Use credit card for ticket on internet.
2. ignore the ferals in row 64.
3. enjoy WA to the max while you decide where to unload the Credit Card points - the lava lamp or the dreamcatcher??
4. Remember that airline points are generally worthless anyway...
Thread Starter
Join Date: Mar 2001
Location: Townsville,Nth Queensland
Posts: 2,717
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Flyers advised to switch loyalties
Mon "The Australian"
Flyers advised to switch loyalties
Steve Creedy, Aviation writer
November 29, 2004
QANTAS frequent-flyers hit by a big rise in the number of points required to claim tickets on many long-haul flights may be better off joining a loyalty scheme run by an overseas airline, experts have advised.
The flying kangaroo's 4.1million frequent-flyers were told last week that changes due to be introduced on May 25 would make it harder to get sought-after upgrades and mean it would take an estimated 20 to 40per cent more points to redeem tickets on many longer routes.
Perth travellers will be particularly hard hit, with a return economy ticket to Sydney increasing 6000 points to 36,000 points and business-class redemptions rising from 45,000 points to 72,000 points.
A return economy-class redemption from Melbourne to London increases from 110,000 points to 128,000, while a business-class ticket rises from 220,000 points to 256,000.
Experts such as Clifford Reichlin, the principal of frequentflyer.com.au, say some frequent-flyers could benefit from joining schemes run by Qantas alliance partners that charge fewer points for an overseas ticket.
Members of frequent-flyer schemes run by partner airlines can redeem tickets on Qantas and vice versa. Points balances are not transferable.
"It's my gut feeling that it could well be better for Australians to join the American Airlines frequent-flyer program and redeem those points locally on Qantas," Mr Reichlin said.
He said joining the American scheme would not suit everyone and there would be restrictions on earning points through credit cards. Passengers would also have to look carefully at the way points were earned.
But people who travelled regularly to the US could benefit from switching schemes, he said.
Travel analyst Mayur Patel calculated that a return economy award to Hong Kong would cost 60,000 points on Qantas from May 25, but only 45,000 on Cathay Pacific. Mr Patel said Qantas members not receiving the big points-earning bonuses given to the airline's most-frequent flyers could benefit by joining the Cathay scheme.
Consumer groups have condemned the Qantas changes, which one described as a "spit in the face" to members. Qantas head of marketing Martin McKinnon said the May redemption changes corresponded with a 9 per cent average price increase over three years for economy travellers, and 14 per cent overall.
==========================================
Flyers advised to switch loyalties
Steve Creedy, Aviation writer
November 29, 2004
QANTAS frequent-flyers hit by a big rise in the number of points required to claim tickets on many long-haul flights may be better off joining a loyalty scheme run by an overseas airline, experts have advised.
The flying kangaroo's 4.1million frequent-flyers were told last week that changes due to be introduced on May 25 would make it harder to get sought-after upgrades and mean it would take an estimated 20 to 40per cent more points to redeem tickets on many longer routes.
Perth travellers will be particularly hard hit, with a return economy ticket to Sydney increasing 6000 points to 36,000 points and business-class redemptions rising from 45,000 points to 72,000 points.
A return economy-class redemption from Melbourne to London increases from 110,000 points to 128,000, while a business-class ticket rises from 220,000 points to 256,000.
Experts such as Clifford Reichlin, the principal of frequentflyer.com.au, say some frequent-flyers could benefit from joining schemes run by Qantas alliance partners that charge fewer points for an overseas ticket.
Members of frequent-flyer schemes run by partner airlines can redeem tickets on Qantas and vice versa. Points balances are not transferable.
"It's my gut feeling that it could well be better for Australians to join the American Airlines frequent-flyer program and redeem those points locally on Qantas," Mr Reichlin said.
He said joining the American scheme would not suit everyone and there would be restrictions on earning points through credit cards. Passengers would also have to look carefully at the way points were earned.
But people who travelled regularly to the US could benefit from switching schemes, he said.
Travel analyst Mayur Patel calculated that a return economy award to Hong Kong would cost 60,000 points on Qantas from May 25, but only 45,000 on Cathay Pacific. Mr Patel said Qantas members not receiving the big points-earning bonuses given to the airline's most-frequent flyers could benefit by joining the Cathay scheme.
Consumer groups have condemned the Qantas changes, which one described as a "spit in the face" to members. Qantas head of marketing Martin McKinnon said the May redemption changes corresponded with a 9 per cent average price increase over three years for economy travellers, and 14 per cent overall.
==========================================
Join Date: Oct 2002
Location: aus
Posts: 206
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
It's certainly time to reconsider the value of my ANZ Qantas visa card.
Just another sure sign of the underlying Qantas attitude toward it's market, I just can't wait until there is a genuine quality carrier in Australia again. Maybe the only answer is business jets.
Just another sure sign of the underlying Qantas attitude toward it's market, I just can't wait until there is a genuine quality carrier in Australia again. Maybe the only answer is business jets.
Join Date: Apr 2000
Location: Oz
Posts: 754
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
So rtforu,
Maybe you could explain how QF has a monopoly and how much taxpayer/government support QF gets compared to other airlines?
While you're at it, throw in a few words about what the other airlines are doing with their frequent flyer programs so we can all see how hard done by QF 'frequent flyers' are!
Maybe you could explain how QF has a monopoly and how much taxpayer/government support QF gets compared to other airlines?
While you're at it, throw in a few words about what the other airlines are doing with their frequent flyer programs so we can all see how hard done by QF 'frequent flyers' are!
Bring on SQ
After they devalued my points 2 years ago. They're doing it again.
Last nail in the coffin.
Bring on Singapore airlines I say.
Qantas can go get f^&ked. No more of my corporate dollar goes there.
They don't seem to distinguish between the customer that gets their points from buying petrol at Coles, to those who buy $250K of tickets a year! Stupid marketing.
Last nail in the coffin.
Bring on Singapore airlines I say.
Qantas can go get f^&ked. No more of my corporate dollar goes there.
They don't seem to distinguish between the customer that gets their points from buying petrol at Coles, to those who buy $250K of tickets a year! Stupid marketing.
