"A Current Affair" TV Segment
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Jerricho, I already knew that about Dirty Pierre and Plazbot. They seem to know what they are talking about, so naturally I discounted them long ago as being professional air traffic controllers.
That might elicit certain reactions...
That might elicit certain reactions...
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Just arrived in my inbox;
my bolding. 
Be prepared for some mind numbing and discursive Smith approved polemic from their own inhouse legend.
Ghost writers in the sky.
I hope they have more expert "legal" advice than is usual on what they should, may or may not assert.
Their last legal fracas, intiated by them against AOPA US (now over 400,000 members, near the total pilot population) I expect based on the same expert advice, with the same cast incumbent, cost em over $250,000 of members funds.
Have they been indemnified or financially supported in some way on this little adventure?
The membership, mostly "ex" (over 6,000 at the last count of a once near 11,000) are terminally tired of being used as a dilletante millionaires plaything and the personal soapbox of old hasbeens.
I'll be surprised if they are not the single voice on this programme, which can only have been generated by Smith et al.
Whatever, I am not aware that the membership has been canvassed on nor would, I suspect, support this action in their name.
One can only guess that this is part of the new "let's put AOPA (actually the legend) back on the map" plan, they seem to have forgotten that it was this form of rubbish that IMHO took em off it in the first place.
Anybody got any idea when the final ATSB accident investigation report and coronial will be available on the causes and;
is there anybody who can educate me on when and where the law relieved the pilot of the responsibility for their own navigation whilst conducting an instrument approach outside of a control zone.
Or have the responsibility for those activities now been delegated to Smiths AOPA.
AOPA President Ron Bertram would like to advise that "A Current Affair" (Channel 9) has confirmed and is advertising that its story on the Benalla air crash tragedy will air tonight (Thurs 14th Oct 2004).
Recent scheduling changes have delayed this broadcast but AOPA has been in contact with ACA and they have indicated that it will be shown tonight.
It is a disturbing look at the way that Air Services were involved in this terrible crash and is of the greatest interest to all members of AOPA and those who have to deal with Air Services.
Please check your local guides for broadcast times.
Recent scheduling changes have delayed this broadcast but AOPA has been in contact with ACA and they have indicated that it will be shown tonight.
It is a disturbing look at the way that Air Services were involved in this terrible crash and is of the greatest interest to all members of AOPA and those who have to deal with Air Services.
Please check your local guides for broadcast times.
Be prepared for some mind numbing and discursive Smith approved polemic from their own inhouse legend.
Ghost writers in the sky.
I hope they have more expert "legal" advice than is usual on what they should, may or may not assert.
Their last legal fracas, intiated by them against AOPA US (now over 400,000 members, near the total pilot population) I expect based on the same expert advice, with the same cast incumbent, cost em over $250,000 of members funds.
Have they been indemnified or financially supported in some way on this little adventure?
The membership, mostly "ex" (over 6,000 at the last count of a once near 11,000) are terminally tired of being used as a dilletante millionaires plaything and the personal soapbox of old hasbeens.
I'll be surprised if they are not the single voice on this programme, which can only have been generated by Smith et al.
Whatever, I am not aware that the membership has been canvassed on nor would, I suspect, support this action in their name.
One can only guess that this is part of the new "let's put AOPA (actually the legend) back on the map" plan, they seem to have forgotten that it was this form of rubbish that IMHO took em off it in the first place.
Anybody got any idea when the final ATSB accident investigation report and coronial will be available on the causes and;
is there anybody who can educate me on when and where the law relieved the pilot of the responsibility for their own navigation whilst conducting an instrument approach outside of a control zone.
Or have the responsibility for those activities now been delegated to Smiths AOPA.
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Off the mark again.
Gary
One again you attempt to make something out of nothing. Of course Airservices had something to do with the crash, it was an aeroplane, it was in airspace and it crashed. Ron has said nothing more.
Whether Airservices was in any way culpable is a matter for the ATSB and subsequently the coroner. Unfortunately though ambulance chasers and some on PPRuNe will have their say. It reminds me of the front page picture of a dead (burned) family in the Cairns Post last year (Aztec at Mareeba), you will remember I solicited an apology for that apology of a news article.
I personally have little time for some of the more outlandish statements attributed to some people, unfortunately I include your comment above as one of these.
Gary, in my opinion you are putting out the fire with AVGAS, that in my view doesn't help either your reputation or that of GA.
Andrew
One again you attempt to make something out of nothing. Of course Airservices had something to do with the crash, it was an aeroplane, it was in airspace and it crashed. Ron has said nothing more.
Whether Airservices was in any way culpable is a matter for the ATSB and subsequently the coroner. Unfortunately though ambulance chasers and some on PPRuNe will have their say. It reminds me of the front page picture of a dead (burned) family in the Cairns Post last year (Aztec at Mareeba), you will remember I solicited an apology for that apology of a news article.
I personally have little time for some of the more outlandish statements attributed to some people, unfortunately I include your comment above as one of these.
Gary, in my opinion you are putting out the fire with AVGAS, that in my view doesn't help either your reputation or that of GA.
Andrew
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Gary, in my opinion you are putting out the fire with AVGAS, that in my view doesn't help either your reputation or that of GA.
Andrew you are very much smarter than that. And in case anybody else missed the point, the news of my given name is not news around here and has never been a secret.
You of course are entitled to your opinion, and I thank you for stating it personally without your colleagues resorting to their usual absurd and idiotic behaviour, the like of "poison dwarf" calling anonymous users here cowards
amongst other things here, then getting all bent out of shape when challenged on it himself. It's a joke, I imagine this will fuel another frenzy on that other forum, whose name we dare not say.
Ron has said nothing more.
So, and we seem to agree,
Whether Airservices was in any way culpable is a matter for the ATSB and subsequently the coroner.
It is a disturbing look at the way that Air Services were involved in this terrible crash and is of the greatest interest to all members of AOPA and those who have to deal with Air Services.
There is nothing AOPA can gain from their part in this, there is no link with the Mareeba crash (and I agree with you) apart from some publicity. The adage that any publicity is good publicity has some significant exceptions, this is one of them.
Why aren't we hearing from your mate Smith, wouldn't it be smarter to let him make the running and then if it gets up you could weigh in. But I think he is much smarter than that and in any event you are probably unable to prevent your hitherto limelight deprived "friend" from making a public come back.
I personally have little time for some of the more outlandish statements attributed to some people,
in the first place, in the same places during his last CASA incarnation.I look forward to being proved wrong after tonight, otherwise be prepared to wear it
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Gary, in my opinion you are putting out the fire with AVGAS,
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Well I wasn't surprised.
Nice bit of fiction by Ray and Dick.
Love the line from Ray that the Air traffic controllers didn't care - nice to have words put in to your mouth is it Ray?
Dick - you are a disgrace.
I was waiting for one, just one, fact - I am still waiting (like most arguments you make).
It's not like any of the issues were glossed over - they were simply avoided completely.
Worse, you have exploited a grieving family.
I will bet the demographics of that show are spooky - low IQ, and right-right wing conservative voters.
And remember: "More Australians get their 'news' from CH9 than any other news source".
The only thing more depressing than that thought is that the recently re-elected Reich believs they have a mandate to dispose of cross-media ownerhsip legislation. So soon, EVERYTHING will be the same quality as ray martin - the best journalist money can buy.
When will this country wake up and get passionate about something.
Nice bit of fiction by Ray and Dick.
Love the line from Ray that the Air traffic controllers didn't care - nice to have words put in to your mouth is it Ray?
Dick - you are a disgrace.
I was waiting for one, just one, fact - I am still waiting (like most arguments you make).
It's not like any of the issues were glossed over - they were simply avoided completely.
Worse, you have exploited a grieving family.
I will bet the demographics of that show are spooky - low IQ, and right-right wing conservative voters.
And remember: "More Australians get their 'news' from CH9 than any other news source".
The only thing more depressing than that thought is that the recently re-elected Reich believs they have a mandate to dispose of cross-media ownerhsip legislation. So soon, EVERYTHING will be the same quality as ray martin - the best journalist money can buy.
When will this country wake up and get passionate about something.
Last edited by Uncommon Sense; 14th Oct 2004 at 09:06.
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I don't normally go in for posting to forums although I enjoy reading them; however, (pause for effect...)
I was incensed by the dribble and absolute hypocrisy that came from DBN's mouth. To say I am angry is an understatement. Unfortunately, most of what I want to say is unprintable.
I was incensed by the dribble and absolute hypocrisy that came from DBN's mouth. To say I am angry is an understatement. Unfortunately, most of what I want to say is unprintable.
What a load of disgraceful crap...I still don't see the link between the TNP accident and the QF 737 at Canberra.
At least it was a good reminder why I never watch ACA. As always, it caters for the lowest common denominator.
Dick Smith you are a disgrace.
TL
At least it was a good reminder why I never watch ACA. As always, it caters for the lowest common denominator.
Dick Smith you are a disgrace.
TL
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WHAT A FRIGGIN' farce! Another platform to launch ********'s "case".
What the bloody hell did Airservices have to do with TNP hitting terrain? In the end, it all comes down to AVIATING, and the pilot obviously did something wrong, VERY wrong. No amount of Airservice anything was going to help him.
So, we got no facts, a lot of BS from the ********, and a scanty report about Qantas' almost CFIT at YSCB, supposedly because a controller was late, almost causing the CFIT (according to ********), and yet Qantas supposedly couldn't AVIATE and NAVIGATE???????? WTF?????????!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
The whole thing reeks of BS, deception, a ********'s Revenge agenda, typically crap journalism, and absolutely positively no mention of AVIATING.
I can just see how ********'s Nat. Airspace Reform was going to solve all that - on the contrary - resorting back to tried and true would be a better step than his farce!
I'll go back to watching the Simpsons again....
OOPS! Forgot the automatic substitution. Read all those asterisks as D!ckhe4d (Dick Smith, the electronics wizard, in an electronics land of Oz. I am NOT a Dick Smith Wizz kid....
)
What the bloody hell did Airservices have to do with TNP hitting terrain? In the end, it all comes down to AVIATING, and the pilot obviously did something wrong, VERY wrong. No amount of Airservice anything was going to help him.
So, we got no facts, a lot of BS from the ********, and a scanty report about Qantas' almost CFIT at YSCB, supposedly because a controller was late, almost causing the CFIT (according to ********), and yet Qantas supposedly couldn't AVIATE and NAVIGATE???????? WTF?????????!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
The whole thing reeks of BS, deception, a ********'s Revenge agenda, typically crap journalism, and absolutely positively no mention of AVIATING.
I can just see how ********'s Nat. Airspace Reform was going to solve all that - on the contrary - resorting back to tried and true would be a better step than his farce!
I'll go back to watching the Simpsons again....
OOPS! Forgot the automatic substitution. Read all those asterisks as D!ckhe4d (Dick Smith, the electronics wizard, in an electronics land of Oz. I am NOT a Dick Smith Wizz kid....
)
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ACA what a load of garbage. They can't even get simple facts correct for eg. "RAAF Blackhawk Helicopter pilot", wrong try Army, "GB" being a Qantas Skipper - wrong try Second Officer.
I'm still trying to follow Dicks argument here with regard to the two examples sited and Airservices. Since when did the intoduction of NAS involve increased Radar coverage. Dick try and be consistent with your arguments and may be you will have a bit more credibility.
I'm still trying to follow Dicks argument here with regard to the two examples sited and Airservices. Since when did the intoduction of NAS involve increased Radar coverage. Dick try and be consistent with your arguments and may be you will have a bit more credibility.
The show was a complete crock. And Ray Martin's unbiased journalism??? It reinforces why any thinking person doesn't watch ACA.
Could be some legal action as a result of allegations methinks
Could be some legal action as a result of allegations methinks
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wonder who paid for the T-shirt worn by the 'blind ATC' .. better still, wonder who dreamed up that brilliant piece of advertising!
very ordinary really.
very ordinary really.
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Ummm, I got a little confused watching this, for want of a better term, "program".
I may just be a low time heli guy, but wasnt the whole idea of NAS to reduce the "interference" of ATC?
Wasnt Dicks whole idea that talking on the radio was such a bad idea for pilots, that it was far better to remove all of those confusing frequencies off the chart?
I must say that my favourite bit was when Dick said he was taking Air Services to court because they were reducing the control of ATC. Last time I checked he was suing them because nobody (except Dick) liked the system, so they were scapping it, and like little kid running to mum wants to sue.
Personally I found that segment deplorable, another proud chapter in modern Australian journalism.
Great to see that trial by media is alive and well
I may just be a low time heli guy, but wasnt the whole idea of NAS to reduce the "interference" of ATC?
Wasnt Dicks whole idea that talking on the radio was such a bad idea for pilots, that it was far better to remove all of those confusing frequencies off the chart?
I must say that my favourite bit was when Dick said he was taking Air Services to court because they were reducing the control of ATC. Last time I checked he was suing them because nobody (except Dick) liked the system, so they were scapping it, and like little kid running to mum wants to sue.
Personally I found that segment deplorable, another proud chapter in modern Australian journalism.
Great to see that trial by media is alive and well
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smith
I agree with all of you canning smith.
Please go to, smithhead on tv.
I am serious, its the only way, I think, that we, the Professionals can get rid of this amateur CLOWN FOR EVER
Cheers
ROBROY.
the only time I have signed in Capitals.
Please go to, smithhead on tv.
I am serious, its the only way, I think, that we, the Professionals can get rid of this amateur CLOWN FOR EVER
Cheers
ROBROY.
the only time I have signed in Capitals.
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How about everybody stops and takes a deep breath? 
There. Thats better.
Now have a look at this rationally and logically. Yes there were inaccuracies. It's TV - and specifically - it's ACA. Youv'e gotta expect it.
DS seemed to be arguing for different things this time. Now he seemed to be more interested in the fact that radar and ATC assistance wasn't available. Prima Facie - his statements were fair enough.
The QF 737 in YSCB - if that acft had been under radar control - would the incident have occurred? Possibly not. I dont know for sure.
The Benalla crash. If under RAS, would the accident have occurred? If the warnings had been acted upon, or if they were required to be acted upon, or if indeed they even sounded, would the accident have occurred? Possibly not.
The concept of ASA being run for a profit. Make much sense? Possibly not....
My point is this. Don't go off the deep end without taking a logical, rational and unemotional look at what was stated. I dont particularly like DS or ACA, but think first, act later. My impression was that DS was simply posturing, and politicing, rather than fighting for a particular cause. Question is - why was he doing this?
But take the segment for what it is - sensationalist journalism designed to scare the sh1t out of the average punter...
There. Thats better.Now have a look at this rationally and logically. Yes there were inaccuracies. It's TV - and specifically - it's ACA. Youv'e gotta expect it.
DS seemed to be arguing for different things this time. Now he seemed to be more interested in the fact that radar and ATC assistance wasn't available. Prima Facie - his statements were fair enough.
The QF 737 in YSCB - if that acft had been under radar control - would the incident have occurred? Possibly not. I dont know for sure.
The Benalla crash. If under RAS, would the accident have occurred? If the warnings had been acted upon, or if they were required to be acted upon, or if indeed they even sounded, would the accident have occurred? Possibly not.
The concept of ASA being run for a profit. Make much sense? Possibly not....
My point is this. Don't go off the deep end without taking a logical, rational and unemotional look at what was stated. I dont particularly like DS or ACA, but think first, act later. My impression was that DS was simply posturing, and politicing, rather than fighting for a particular cause. Question is - why was he doing this?
But take the segment for what it is - sensationalist journalism designed to scare the sh1t out of the average punter...