ATSOCAS training out here in the little places......
A two hour stint after an early - TOIL
A two hour stint today before a late - TOIL

No mention of money at all, standard rate O/T might have been nice, but that's life among the clover for you.
Greed (as Yahoo mentioned it) is maybe a bit strong, but it's up there somewhere.

They think that you can get by without the AAVA's? , ok here's an idea. How about you stop doing them now(a pipe dream i know, as there are too many people willing to sell their hard won time off for ,what is ,way below market value) during the quiet time of year, and see if they can still provide the same level of service.If you are as overmanned as they say you are, Then there should be no detriment to service provision. If however you are right , then they will be phoning people to do AAVA's, which you should all refuse!. That way you can make your point that if thats what winter is like then 3 months unpaid leave in summer is never going to work. As i say though, people not doing AAVA's???? what was i thinking. You'll start saying next that ATCO's will start selling their annual leave next!! :}:}........

WHAT??? they already do!!!! :eek:

:(

Rather than saying:

"Unit X gets this for additional attendances, new training etc, and we don't, so they must be greedy"

Maybe we should say this....

"Fair play to Unit X and their local union committee who negotiated the agreement. Maybe next time we have a training commitment our local union committee can use Unit X as an example to get more than we got last time..... "

An AAVA is voluntary

People will be required to do iFacts training, i.e. not voluntary.

The only other way round it is for people to be scheduled do training on their normal watch days, then AAVA the shortfall!!

Although I think the money being talked about is incredulous (bearing in mind AC ATCOs already get a very good deal with the amount of AAVAs they get offered per year etc), I do think that the rate should be higher than AAVA as it is a required attendance on a day off.

Surely they (swanwick atco's) cant be offered more than the 21 (?) aava's per year thats supposed to be the limit? Or have i missed something?

I will do them if offered, but then i would also support a union motion to suspend the agreement pending its improvement! But then I need the money. Until the rules change tho, i will still try and get maximum use of my quota in the quiet months! :)

No they can't and no, you're not.

Whatever agreement they try to push for Ifacts, fair play to what they can get but i won't hold any breath...i have heard that whatever deal is brought in it is purely a voluntary basis for the individual.....bearing in mind there is a requirement to do 13 days training in a period of 5 months 6 on core watch and the other 7 being covered by extra staff(where are they going to get those):eek::eek::eek: will need a bit of persuading to get people in, considering the overtime take up in AC is only 40% of staff, considerably less than TC.

Those of you that state you would accept no pay rise - have you seen the value of the pound recently? My pay has gone down around 33% over the last few months in global terms. As participants in the global economy where most of the food and energy that we HAVE to purchase is not priced in pounds, then we have all suffered a significant pay decrease in real terms. We MUST stand up to maintain our conditions. Government and management hope that we are too stupid to realise this. Don't prove them right.

I'm guessing you weren't offering to give some of it back when the pound peaked at over $2?
The relative cost of imported energy (for example) is factored in to the charges imposed by domestic suppliers to us as customers. Their price rises are justified against the same set of measurements as your pay is: UK cost of living. You can't move the goalposts for measurement just to suit each argument... That would make you... well... a bank. :=

I wont accept a pay freeze due to the fact our company continues to make a healthy profit and inflation continues to be a positive figure.

45 before POL

I think the reason the take up of AAVAs at LAC is a much lower percentage than at LTC is because LAC get offered so many more than LTC.

If people are only offered 3 or 4 a year (on average), they are likely to take nearly if not all of them.

If people are offered 15 plus per year, then statistically, chances are the percentage off take up will be less because people will not want to do all of them.

However, the management do need to come up with some decent renumeration package to ensure that iFacts training happens - unless of course they do it next summer when, according to scaremongering, we willbe so overborne with staff that time out of the Ops room will not be a problem, even on rostered days!!!!