Annoying RT
 

With radio frequencies becoming more and more congested why do I have to spend all day listening to people clogging up busy airwaves with 10 words of drivel when 3 will do? For example;

• “TODAY we are requesting FL370”

Can we not assume that any request you make is for today and not any other day?

• “London IT'S THE ****, FL200 heading 250”

Why?

• “**** request”

Why not just pass your request?

• “You're on Guard”

I know and so are you!

The list goes on.:ugh:

**** insert generic callsign

Annoying RT
 

....is whatever interrupts me from reading the newspaper.

Foxy

How about...."Departure **** climbing through 110 for 150 requesting higher" Really?

Or a big on in the US the legendary blanket broadcast by a pilot of "BLOCKED". How about pay attention or just say nothing, we often are working multi-freqs.

CZHU

If it's long winded it is good airmanship to let the cotroller know before you launch into a whole spiel, especially if it's busy.

One I hate to hear controllers say, usually when they've made a mistake.

"Fastjet123, stop your climb INITIALLY FL120":ugh:

It's a dynamic situation; things change requiring different solutions.

If it's busy why make the request, wait for the next sector. Asking the Dep Controller for FL360 is probably not generating any response that you will see except http://www.augk18.dsl.pipex.com/Smileys/masturbate.gif

And don't I know it. You usually only hear the "INITIALLY" when a cock up has been realised.:E

Otherwise it's the correct phraseology, "stop climb FL120".

"Initially" only on mistakes
 

That's not necessarily true... I will clear you "initially" to FL 310 when I know your requested is further up but I cannot "now" because of traffic. I use the "Initially" to inform you that you can expect further climb within my sector.

If in an occasion you were cleared to a certain level but then had to be stopped for many possible reasons, some being; not giving the expected rate to get above traffic we've been monitoring you against or a change in situation where the opposite descending going down faster than expected and that the crossing will be more efficient at different levels, *cough* a cock-up *cough*, you will be told to stop climb "initially" so that you know you can expect further climb.

That "initially" most of the times gets rid of the "climbing FL310, however our requested today is"

some use it others don't, but those that do don't necessarily do it on mistakes.

Apologies, I should have mentioned that I was talking about a TMA environment where the word "initially" is an utter waste of breath.
Honestly, if you stop a 747-400 going to Los Angeles at FL90, is he going to think he's staying there for the rest of the flight?:hmm:

Worst waste of breath and frequency time: "Who was that for?" Especially when I'm working multiple frequencies and the aircraft the transmission was intended for has already answered!

Note to pilots: I ignore this one. Completely.

Now, if you key up and say, "Bugsmasher 111, was that for us?" I'll give you a polite yes or no, and a repeat if you need it.

It works both ways...Some fellow controllers have 3 airplanes on the frequency and it sounds like they have 25. :eek:The smooth guys say as little as possible and never seem to be too busy. :D

Scuzi,
Third attempt to get your view across - I think thats what we're talking about!
Get all the PERTINENT information in on the first call(or post)!

Happy xmas

I must be one of those guys that sounds like there's 20 aircraft on frequency when there's realy only 3. :}

Merry xmas.

Lon More, that's the best icon I've ever seen and I am in tears just now.

Sometimes those three can make you a lot busier than 20 all streamed and seperated.

What annoys me is (usually as you are about to turn the three for an intercept heading) someone who just launches in with their life story.....and the three sail through!:ugh:

OR.......the little hellos and private messages some guys think it is ok to pass to each other.Really bl**dy annoying!.

In that case why do controllers ask "...XXX123, say your requested level"?

Is it not annotated on the flight-plan strip?

Is it not 'Airmanship' to advise an ATC sector as soon as practicable if you request a level differant from the one originally filed for?

And LATCC controllers please note, as drivers we see many differant standards of 'controlling' just as you probably see differing levels of compliance to instructions therefore some 'newie' crews entering the UK FIR for the first time may have differant expectations of the provided ATC services.

A Controller simply saying "Contact **** on ***.** leaves the system open to mis-use.
I think the practice of 'Contact **** on ***.** with heading & speed only', or "Contact Director Callsign only" are excellant proven phrases that could be incorporated more into R/T discipline to reduce frequency congestion...

....as well as FIR boundary-direct-to-FIR boundary given as a matter of course instead of having to tie up the frequency by grovelling....(I jest!)
:ok:

Yeah, but that's the level filed by the ops folk and not your requested level. And what if they filed a really low level for you due to slot restrictions, but the ATCO can get you higher? That's why he is asking. Just to help you get a smoother flight, or is it because he doesn't want you in his airspace? Can't remember which.

How come? Don't we have standard RT Procedures to cover this?

Shouldn`t say "on" anyway....it`s not "on" anything.

Should be "Contact agency, frequency"

If we are at a level because of flow restrictions, how do you know that your giving a higher level is not going to cause a problem 30 minutes or 1 hour further down the line? Do you check which regulation is restricting us before removing the restriction?

We get a copy of the FPL (it is a requirement) and so we have the exact same level info as ATC do as well as ops. If the level is going to be changed at the planning stage then there are things we have to considder such as new fuel requirement, new flow restrictions at that level etc.

Regards,

DFC

Pilots and controllers wasting words, never, apart from all of the preceeding

ATC: HMA80, direct [waypoint], descend FL150, speed 270kts.
HM80: HMA80 confirmed direct [waypoint], descend FL150, speed 270kts?
ATC: HMA80 AFFIRM, direct [waypoint], descend FL150, speed 270kts.
HM80: Direct [waypoint], descend FL150, speed 270kts, HMA80.

:ugh:

Nooo, we never check. :hmm: Maybe I should've put in my post earlier that we do check who the restricting centre is or where the restriction lies. Takes about 2 minutes with CFMU in Brussels.

Me: ABC, traffic is a Dash8, 12 o'clock, left to right, 7500, report sighting.
ABC: Affirm.

:ugh:

It's like pulling teeth sometimes.....

Cheers,

NFR.

"visual on top"

Colleague of mine at EGLL who went on to become a senior Manager who had slightly lost the picture on GMC:

"The Trident with the Vanguard just behind, what's your callsign?"

XX INT: Contact XX Director callsign only 123.456

ABC: Roger, Director 123.456 callsign only.

ABC: XX Director ABC123 heading 270,speed 220kts, descending to alt 4000ft, B737 with information L.


:ugh:

777... loved that! I had one once like that. He called me with his life story, etc.. He'd just got through line 27 of his granny's soup recipe when a voice in the background shouted: "Nooooo.. he wants callsign only". The bloke carried on "...... oo, or sorry, er, XXX123 on frequency". Only took 17 minutes....

Thanks for confirming that.

One other issue which does not happen very often but on short sectors, we may have planned at a lower (not very efficient level) and we actually don't want a better level because the reduction in fuel burn combined with a better tail wind could mean that we have to hold and burn off fuel at destination because we got airbourne planning on a max landing weight arrival.

However, since you will not know that it is always nice to be offered a better level or even a short-cut.

Regards,

DFC

Had many like that HD...meanwhile the one you should have chucked to tower is now at 2mile final with the AIR guy on the priority line trying to find out where he is...
The one waiting for the turn onto the ILS has gone through the localiser and is heading straight towards one of your outbounds...
The one downwind waiting for a base leg turn is now heading outside CAS having missed the turn....
Not to mention the one on the go around :}

you wait until you get those damn biggin hill ouybounds into the mix!!!

All those who start their transmission with 'And callsign......' predominately GA.

Can sound like PAN Callsign.

Just my pet hate. 'PAN acknowledge squawk emergency' usually sorts them out'

How about any R/T from the tower to an aircraft doing 90 kts on the landing roll? It's all pointless as we're not paying any attention to it and you'll have to call us again and 20 kts.

annoying RT
 

Heard a good one in North Queensland (regional Australia) where a lightie pilot, who rarely flew in controlled airspace, made a great call on first contact - callsign, acft type, position, intentions, level request etc, and then finished with the laconic Nth QLD "thanks, mate eh". (Seems everyone north of Mackay finishes their sentences with "eh")

For those without an Aussie accent, say "mate eh" out loud, with a lot of nasality and running the 2 words together .... sounds a lot like "Mayday"! It took the approach controller 2 further transmissions (each reply ending with mate, eh) after he said: "Roger Mayday, what is the nature of your emergency?" before he realised the guy was just being friendly!

While we're in North QLD, also heard a great exchange between TVL approach and a very chatty yank pilot.

ATC: (trying to get a "visual" report in order to issue a visual approach) "N123CE report inflight conditions".
ACFT: (broad west coast US accent, somewhat bewildered and consequently talking quite slowly) "N123CE, ah, thanks for asking, we're pretty comfortable up here, ah, it's about 24 degrees and ah, yeah, we've just had some coffee, ah, thanks for asking..."

Entire approach room in hysterics except for the controller who had about 10 on frequency including another 2 under vectors, TWR asking for dep instructions and was also trying to coordinate outbounds with sector. :D

Or (normally) Il-76'es after landing with all engines in full reverse and making enough noise to wake up dead people reports "on ground" as they roll past the tower...

<<How about any R/T from the tower to an aircraft doing 90 kts on the landing roll? It's all pointless as we're not paying any attention to it and you'll have to call us again and 20 kts.>>
Yeah, I was taught that at an early stage... but if I had a quid for every pilot who has spoken to me a) during the roll-out or b) during take-off I'd be as rich as them.. As OMRK reminds us... recall the Aeroflots who always said: "On the ground" the moment their wheels touched or "airborne" the moment they were off the deck? Or the landers on 09L.. "OK to roll down to 16?" and all, and all..
My best was a 747 at Heathrow, about 10 seconds into the roll off from 10L around 8am one morning.. He said "We're not too familair with this runway, will you just run through the SID for us". And, if you fly into LL, do you remember the Christmas Cracker riddles on the ATIS?? The number of crews who responded by asking us similar questions as they were landing or taking off..... Well, I could go on.

Conditional line-up clearances incorrectly read-back are a pet hate of mine, eg. "C/S after the landing Boeing 737 via Foxtrot 1 line-up & wait RWY**". Too often read back as "Line-up after the Boeing 737", don't want to point the finger but this is a regular occurence at my aerodrome, normally by GA.

How about: "Reds,check..."

They annoy the t*ts off me!

"Charlie, Charlie." is my pet hate!

I'm not certain, but I believe Charlie Charlie is a close relative of Roger Dee...

Probably a good job this one has been re-registered then. :E