Ryanair comments on NATS service
Thread Starter
Join Date: Mar 2001
Location: Costa del CYYZ
Posts: 72
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Ryanair comments on NATS service
Taken from:
http://www.ryanair.com/news/nats.html
"NAT's wants more money for a poor service - what do you think?
Today, Thursday 7th November, NATS failed to open 7 of 24 Air Traffic Control sectors over the UK as a result of "staff shortages".
Ryanair apologises to the 5,000 Ryanair passengers who were delayed as a result of this continuing failure by NATS. Ryanair calls on NATS to recompense passengers who have been seriously disrupted by their performance.
On 1st October 2002, Ryanair requested a meeting with the Secretary of State, Rt. Hon. Alistair Darling, MP to discuss how this atrocious service might be improved. To date, we have received no response from the Secretary of State. We have, however, received a proposal from the UK CAA that NATS be allowed to increase its charges without any guarantees to improve its woeful services.
Ryanair believes that simply giving more money to a monopoly which has failed to meet both its financial and operational targets is a bad idea and insists that service standards be applied to any change in charges. Members of the public can register their views on
The UK CAA proposes that NAT's (the monopoly provider of UK Air Traffic Control services) be allowed to increase its charges without any guarantees of improvement in its abysmal services or compensation for passengers. (ref: CAA proposal on NAT's application to re-open the eurocontrol charge, October 2002)
Do you agree with the CAA proposal - should NAT's get more money for poor service. "
Talk about a complete slap in the face for those of us who are doing the best we can with the hand we have been dealt.
The incredible thing is Ryanair benefit in the TMA at least from outstanding service with shortcuts, straight in approaches and high speeds........yet as other airlines deal with the situation with good grace and appreciate the efforts we are making to do as much as we can, RYR yet again sees fit to basically say we are crap.
Gee, thanks Ryanair, glad to see all my efforts at doing the best I can for you are so well appreciated. I think in future my philosophy will be that you can f**k off.
BTW.........Why can they also not spell NATS correctly, it's not a very difficult word to spell ! And note they claim NATS is the monopoly provider of UK ATC services........I suspect ATCOs at EGNX, EGHH, EGGP etc etc may be a bit shocked ! Perhaps getting facts correct is not a strong suit of Ryanair.
I am also very interested to hear RYR's proposals for bailing out of NATS, as they are opposed to the raising of charges, I imagine they are full of ideas for attracting investment for the future and keeping NATS afloat.....After all if the skies of the UK closed Michael might find his profit margin squeezed slightly.
Funny thing is I couldn't find Ryanair's alternative anywhere......Fancy that !
Intersting too that Ryanair does not seem so keen to recompense its beloved passengers when they have been seriously disrupted by Ryanair's own performance........
Oh and finally, where the hell were Ryanair when we were telling the government that PPP was a bad idea.......were they on our side fighting for the company to remain under state control......hmmmmmmm.
Come on Ryanair take this up with the culprits, NATS (recently well paid) Management, stop slating us for doing the best we can.
http://www.ryanair.com/news/nats.html
"NAT's wants more money for a poor service - what do you think?
Today, Thursday 7th November, NATS failed to open 7 of 24 Air Traffic Control sectors over the UK as a result of "staff shortages".
Ryanair apologises to the 5,000 Ryanair passengers who were delayed as a result of this continuing failure by NATS. Ryanair calls on NATS to recompense passengers who have been seriously disrupted by their performance.
On 1st October 2002, Ryanair requested a meeting with the Secretary of State, Rt. Hon. Alistair Darling, MP to discuss how this atrocious service might be improved. To date, we have received no response from the Secretary of State. We have, however, received a proposal from the UK CAA that NATS be allowed to increase its charges without any guarantees to improve its woeful services.
Ryanair believes that simply giving more money to a monopoly which has failed to meet both its financial and operational targets is a bad idea and insists that service standards be applied to any change in charges. Members of the public can register their views on
The UK CAA proposes that NAT's (the monopoly provider of UK Air Traffic Control services) be allowed to increase its charges without any guarantees of improvement in its abysmal services or compensation for passengers. (ref: CAA proposal on NAT's application to re-open the eurocontrol charge, October 2002)
Do you agree with the CAA proposal - should NAT's get more money for poor service. "
Talk about a complete slap in the face for those of us who are doing the best we can with the hand we have been dealt.
The incredible thing is Ryanair benefit in the TMA at least from outstanding service with shortcuts, straight in approaches and high speeds........yet as other airlines deal with the situation with good grace and appreciate the efforts we are making to do as much as we can, RYR yet again sees fit to basically say we are crap.
Gee, thanks Ryanair, glad to see all my efforts at doing the best I can for you are so well appreciated. I think in future my philosophy will be that you can f**k off.
BTW.........Why can they also not spell NATS correctly, it's not a very difficult word to spell ! And note they claim NATS is the monopoly provider of UK ATC services........I suspect ATCOs at EGNX, EGHH, EGGP etc etc may be a bit shocked ! Perhaps getting facts correct is not a strong suit of Ryanair.
I am also very interested to hear RYR's proposals for bailing out of NATS, as they are opposed to the raising of charges, I imagine they are full of ideas for attracting investment for the future and keeping NATS afloat.....After all if the skies of the UK closed Michael might find his profit margin squeezed slightly.
Funny thing is I couldn't find Ryanair's alternative anywhere......Fancy that !
Intersting too that Ryanair does not seem so keen to recompense its beloved passengers when they have been seriously disrupted by Ryanair's own performance........
Oh and finally, where the hell were Ryanair when we were telling the government that PPP was a bad idea.......were they on our side fighting for the company to remain under state control......hmmmmmmm.
Come on Ryanair take this up with the culprits, NATS (recently well paid) Management, stop slating us for doing the best we can.
Join Date: Mar 2001
Location: swanwick
Posts: 94
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Expeditedescent
don't take it so personally. 7 of 24 sectors closed, I'd be pi$$ed off if I was trying to run a business. It wasn't specifically aimed at ATCOS ATSAS ATCES or any one else, just NATS as a whole. Hopefully this will make the right people sit up and take a close look at the people to blame for this mess.
BTW I'm not pro RYR or any other airline, I,m just somebody who enjoys the job but is hacked off with the politics and bull**** that surrounds it.
roger
don't take it so personally. 7 of 24 sectors closed, I'd be pi$$ed off if I was trying to run a business. It wasn't specifically aimed at ATCOS ATSAS ATCES or any one else, just NATS as a whole. Hopefully this will make the right people sit up and take a close look at the people to blame for this mess.
BTW I'm not pro RYR or any other airline, I,m just somebody who enjoys the job but is hacked off with the politics and bull**** that surrounds it.
roger
Unpalatable though such comments must seem to many dedicated NATS ATCOs, perhaps only derogatory customer feedback will force their management to take the necessary remedial action.
Join Date: Feb 2000
Location: solent-on-sea
Posts: 443
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
I have to say, as a NATS ATCO, quite often I think NATS service provision is a joke.
Closed sectors, reduced flow rates due to lack of staff, it's about time someone that might be listened to complained about it. Perhaps if the people that pay the fees start asking questions they might actually get answers, unlike the staff, who simply get told everything will be alright.
Closed sectors, reduced flow rates due to lack of staff, it's about time someone that might be listened to complained about it. Perhaps if the people that pay the fees start asking questions they might actually get answers, unlike the staff, who simply get told everything will be alright.
Join Date: Nov 2000
Posts: 359
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
I suppose RYR are quite right to seek compensation - everyone has the right to complain about service.
Mind you - if we all got money off at the supermarket whenever they had less than all the checkouts open, Im sure a lot of stores would go down the tubes.
Now, if RYR are prepared to compensate their passengers for EVERY delay caused by their own extremely tight scheduling/knackered aircraft/over booking etc etc then I certainly dont have a problem - I fly RYR a lot because a couple of their regional UK destinations are extremely handy for me. It's not often they are on time - and the service is crap. And on the times they take of late and arrive on time, not once have I heard them say "we made up lost time because ATC gave us some nice short cuts"
Here's a thought - why dont we open every NATS sector and rewrite massively reduced sector flow rates into MATS part2?. Then they can't complain that there are closed sectors and they can't complain that we are not working to capacity - because every sector will be operating at maximum (albeit artificially low
) flow rate.
One last thing - I know it's not a personal attack on ATCOs. And although we shouldn't take it out on the pilots, maybe we should not make such an effort with RYR, and certainly not climb them above FPL levels (cause they are always trying to beat restrictions anyway)
anyway - that's the contents of my head on this one
Mind you - if we all got money off at the supermarket whenever they had less than all the checkouts open, Im sure a lot of stores would go down the tubes.
Now, if RYR are prepared to compensate their passengers for EVERY delay caused by their own extremely tight scheduling/knackered aircraft/over booking etc etc then I certainly dont have a problem - I fly RYR a lot because a couple of their regional UK destinations are extremely handy for me. It's not often they are on time - and the service is crap. And on the times they take of late and arrive on time, not once have I heard them say "we made up lost time because ATC gave us some nice short cuts"
Here's a thought - why dont we open every NATS sector and rewrite massively reduced sector flow rates into MATS part2?. Then they can't complain that there are closed sectors and they can't complain that we are not working to capacity - because every sector will be operating at maximum (albeit artificially low
) flow rate.One last thing - I know it's not a personal attack on ATCOs. And although we shouldn't take it out on the pilots, maybe we should not make such an effort with RYR, and certainly not climb them above FPL levels (cause they are always trying to beat restrictions anyway)
anyway - that's the contents of my head on this one
Join Date: Oct 2002
Location: where ever I lay my head
Posts: 142
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Yup very good idea, giving back money when there are delays.. exactly the concept RYR uses themselves...
No monopoly on ATC would be fun: do I take NATS at FL260 or shall I take the Tesco special at FL200... At least at Tesco I can use my reward card...
No monopoly on ATC would be fun: do I take NATS at FL260 or shall I take the Tesco special at FL200... At least at Tesco I can use my reward card...
Join Date: May 2002
Location: UK
Posts: 351
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Its worth noting that all the remarks he makes are aimed at NATS management - not ATC staff directly. Whilst I think the guy is a complete ar$hole I partly sympathise as he is trying to run a profitable business.
Its just more nails in the coffins of management. It would be nice if one of these whinging gits came up with a workable proposal though.
Its just more nails in the coffins of management. It would be nice if one of these whinging gits came up with a workable proposal though.
