Hong Kong

[ZRH]

Anybody have any idea about life in HK?? I have done no research at all. Whats it like over there and if it sounds ok, who do I apply to?
Details about salary, leave, pension fund, job availability etc etc would be highly appreciated.
Tks

[Tweety]

ZRH

Things getting a little uncomfortable in Zurich since the midair. I have heard that some of the Skyguide management have been arrested?

As for HK, likewise I have been looking and have visited the centre recently and spoken to the Personel Chief there and unfortunately they are not hiring at this stage.

Best to watch flight international for openings but iwas told they have to proceed the the localisation policy with the Chinese.

Bye for now

[Proceed As Cleared]

Tweety,

some of the Skyguide management have been arrested

Now, either you know more than anyone else (including the media) or this is utter bollocks (I tend to believe the latter).

ZRH,

There's only one bloke from SA working in Zurich. And I know him.

[WetFeet]

I may be wrong but it is my understanding that the expats working at HK are on fairly short contracts now due to the requirement to replace them with HK Nationals.

For info on HK and an email link to an ATCO there, type Hong Kong ATC into your favourite search engine. He'll be able to tell you more.

[TwoDogs]

Hey Soggy Toes

..
don't send them in my direction. I am getting kicked outa here in a coupla weeks. They will get nothing positive from me.
If they want to find out the good stuff about Hong Kong they need to find someone who
a) has a contract here
b) enjoys it
c) is prepared to speak honestly about the place

...and for that I think you will need a VERY good search engine

[throw a dyce]

ZRH I spent one contract in HK which was just over 3 years so this might be of help.In our case the pay was according to previous experience with the top of the ATCO 2 scale at about 79000 HKD before tax(15% max).You got an accomodation allowance on top,but most of that was used to get something decent as rents are very high.Also a travelling allowance for annual leave.Contract length was 3 years with a 25% gratuity at the end.You could apply for extensions on that or another 3years.
Leave is 28 days for under 40's and 36 days for over 40's plus casual days;1 for every completed month.They have a very complicated way of doing the leave and very creative ways of screwing you on leave.Need I say more!
They are persuing the localisation policy because it's Civil Service policy so new expat jobs are non existent at the moment.I left on very good terms but I couldn't get back if I wanted.Also it all depends on how the Chinese like you,and it doesn't take much to get a black mark.
I don't think the localisation policy is going well at the moment as the locals are having problems on Approach,but no doubt any rumours of expat jobs will hit this news stand first.You could always ask Civil Aviation Dept,HK and see what they say.As for working and living there,well it depends on who you ask.Some would quite happily see the place nuked and are there for the money.Others love the place and are having a great time.I really enjoyed it,but 3 years was enough of the pollution ,noise,congestion etc.Depends on what you make of it I guess.
I believe there are/were two from HK in Skyguide,so they might help you more.Hope this is a help.

[Rice Whine]

Leave is 28 days for under 40's and 36 days for over 40's plus casual days;1 for every completed month.They have a very complicated way of doing the leave and very creative ways of screwing you on leave.Need I say more!

..you forgot to mention the wonderful TOIL system ... whereby if you work overtime they credit you with "time off in lieu" of pay. Good system except that, when you work less hours than they deem to be reasonable (and their roster writing practically guarantees it), you owe them hours.
If you go "negative toil" you can finish up being rostered for a month of 5 days on 1 off, 8 or 9 hour shifts just so you don't owe them time.

They have ....very creative ways of screwing you on leave

They sure do ..... pity they don't devote as much time and effort attempting to satisfy requests for leave.

[Barnaby the Bear]

I could be wrong, but I believe the college at Bournemouth have been training a number of Hong Kong students. All local's. So I doubt many outside jobs available.

[Bev Bevan]

Barnaby - correct.

[ZRH]

Tks for the gen guys. Prospects dont look too good for Hong Kong.
Proceed: There are actually 2 blokes from SA working in Zürich. But whats that got to do with the price of eggs?

[throw a dyce]

Rice Whine,
I think the Toil system was invented to keep 25 jobs going on the 4th floor.I escaped the 5 on 1 off toil clawback by keeping a record of EVERY shift worked for 3 years and getting them to prove that I was in Neg toil.They couldn't as the records were not complete,and even made up during 2 months.Got 64 hours back but what a fight.Is it true that the 10th day working has resulted in over 4000 hours positive toil for everyone which they can't pay back because of staff shortages.Is it even mentioned in the civil Service Regs.Is 5on 1 off to cover this kind of crap system safe.

[Rice Whine]

throw a dyce...all of the above is true, although I am not sure about the figure of 4000 hours. It wouldn't surprise me tho as some of the local controllers have hundreds of hours.
The problem with TOIL is that those who are still working here are afraid to say anything for fear of putting their next contract at risk and those who have left or are about to leave really don't care. - end result is that nobody challenges what is in all probability an illegal system, even by HKCAD standards.
it recently came to light that Govt. doctors had been refused their legal "one day off a week" for years until finally somebody said something. I'm surprised they don't have us working 7 days a week.