US shutdown. ATC getting close to breaking point?
Thread Starter
Joined: Jan 2004
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From: London
US shutdown. ATC getting close to breaking point?
The inference is that our colleagues across the pond are phoning in sick and picking up a “McJob” to raise cash while they’re not being paid.
BBC story
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/articles/cm277455158o
BBC story
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/articles/cm277455158o
Joined: Dec 2006
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From: Mauritius,soon or latter
We have just passed " non paid" period...I would say that the most common feeling was ..." we are not guilty- why there is no money..."
So, I could understand FAA coleagues..
My question is another: How did you manage 90% of traffic if 80% of people was on sick leave?"
So, I could understand FAA coleagues..
My question is another: How did you manage 90% of traffic if 80% of people was on sick leave?"
Joined: Nov 2006
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From: Waharoa, New Zealand
NYT reports that Duffy is about to shut down parts of the National Airspace System
https://www.nytimes.com/2025/11/04/u...pY_yOiDOAr35Wg
"For his part, Mr. Duffy, the transportation secretary, warned of “mass chaos” in the skies.“You will see mass chaos, you will see mass flight delays, you will see mass cancellations,” he said during a news conference, accusing Democrats of perpetuating what he called a “senseless shutdown.”
“And you may see us close certain parts of the airspace because we just cannot manage it because we don’t have the air traffic controllers,” he said."
https://www.nytimes.com/2025/11/04/u...pY_yOiDOAr35Wg
"For his part, Mr. Duffy, the transportation secretary, warned of “mass chaos” in the skies.“You will see mass chaos, you will see mass flight delays, you will see mass cancellations,” he said during a news conference, accusing Democrats of perpetuating what he called a “senseless shutdown.”
“And you may see us close certain parts of the airspace because we just cannot manage it because we don’t have the air traffic controllers,” he said."
Thread Starter
Joined: Jan 2004
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From: London
Joined: Jan 2011
Aviation Qualifications: ATCO
Posts: 88
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From: in a field
I'm sure this will not help the long term situation. Under these circumstances does OJT and general training continue?
If not the future controller shortage will be made much worse. Reducing training at any point creates issues further on.
If not the future controller shortage will be made much worse. Reducing training at any point creates issues further on.
Joined: Jan 2020
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From: Bucharest
At first I thought this was a hoax, but no, it seems to be real:
The Twitter/X message, in case it's not shown automatically:
https://www.flightaware.com/live/fli...657Z/KJFK/KORF
The Twitter/X message, in case it's not shown automatically:
About to take off
Pilot gets on the intercom, says he got “some weird routing” due to ATC staffing issues
We’ll be flying the entire flight at 8,000ft, “four times lower than normal”
“Upside is you’ll have some great views!”
Wish me luck fam
Pilot gets on the intercom, says he got “some weird routing” due to ATC staffing issues
We’ll be flying the entire flight at 8,000ft, “four times lower than normal”
“Upside is you’ll have some great views!”
Wish me luck fam
https://www.flightaware.com/live/fli...657Z/KJFK/KORF
Last edited by MikeSnow; 6th November 2025 at 18:02. Reason: Added Flight Aware link
Pegase Driver
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From: Europe
At first I thought this was a hoax, but no, it seems to be real:
F
F
Joined: Dec 2011
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From: UK
In fairness, 2 years ago I did JFK-DCA at 8000 due to weather related airspace management. Was actually a lovely flight to be on if a bit weird.
As a side effect here, surely the knock on effect is that commuting crew are going to find it increasingly hard to get to their bases to actually operate the flights that are going?
As a side effect here, surely the knock on effect is that commuting crew are going to find it increasingly hard to get to their bases to actually operate the flights that are going?
Joined: Oct 2004
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From: California
If that is a trend , it is worrying as there are normally a lot of VFR below 10.000 ft and in class E no radio communications is not required for VFR , and transponders are not mandatory either Not a very good idea to put an airliner doing 400Kts cruising in that airspace I would say .
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From: Europe
But even at 250 Kts seeing an avoiding a glider doing 60Kts using the cockpit windows of a E170 is not that evident not to mention the maneuverability , an E170 is not an F16.. .
Thread Starter
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From: London
Can't you ask to wave the 250 speed restriction in the US ? we can in Europe , and it is done rather regularly.
But even at 250 Kts seeing an avoiding a glider doing 60Kts using the cockpit windows of a E170 is not that evident not to mention the maneuverability , an E170 is not an F16.. .
But even at 250 Kts seeing an avoiding a glider doing 60Kts using the cockpit windows of a E170 is not that evident not to mention the maneuverability , an E170 is not an F16.. .
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From: Wildest Surrey
In 1965, I successfully missed a Britannia whilst in the equivalent of Class E airspace while soaring over Bovingdon at 35kts, the base being 1500ft amsl and the bottom of the 'Class E' being 5000ft amsl. I was helped because I was open cockpit so I could hear the Britannia coming; I don''t think he saw me.
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From: Wildest Surrey
If that is a trend , it is worrying as there are normally a lot of VFR below 10.000 ft and in class E no radio communications is not required for VFR , and transponders are not mandatory either Not a very good idea to put an airliner doing 400Kts cruising in that airspace I would say .
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From: Europe
No of course not ., also in the US , it is not filing an IFR PLN which is the issue for me but doing so with a fast jet at low altitude. Although E is officially a "controlled: airspace , separation with VFR is not assured, It is one thing to cross it climbing or descending , as done regularly , but a bit less for an Airliner cruising for over an hour in it at low altitude
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From: in a field
There must be a critical mass of controllers in an organisation. Once you drop below it permanent flow restrictions could be in place for a number of years.
The less experienced at the coal face the more difficult training becomes and with system upgrades the experienced controllers required for development and new system training - things could get critical very easily.
Not allowing for the people who move to greener pastures as things deteriorate.
One thing I observed over the years is that training can be the weakest link. The positive - strict flow regulations might make the training OJT easier.
The less experienced at the coal face the more difficult training becomes and with system upgrades the experienced controllers required for development and new system training - things could get critical very easily.
Not allowing for the people who move to greener pastures as things deteriorate.
One thing I observed over the years is that training can be the weakest link. The positive - strict flow regulations might make the training OJT easier.
Joined: Oct 2006
Posts: 1,658
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From: jersey
In the light of the BBCAffair; is this real ? Who knows, nowadays ? If this is just another attempt to make Trump seem foolish, please refrain from posting any bogus quotes attributable to Trump. He is more than capable of establishing his stupidity without any help from anyone else. If this is a genuine quote; the mind boggles ! How is he going to “quickly replace”ATCOs, for one thing ?
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From: USA
In the light of the BBCAffair; is this real ? Who knows, nowadays ? If this is just another attempt to make Trump seem foolish, please refrain from posting any bogus quotes attributable to Trump. He is more than capable of establishing his stupidity without any help from anyone else. If this is a genuine quote; the mind boggles ! How is he going to “quickly replace”ATCOs, for one thing ?
