Getting into East Midlands
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Join Date: Jan 2000
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Getting into East Midlands
Have been operating into East Midlands for a few months now and have a few queries some of you might be able to help with...
1) Why oh why does the ATIS update every half a second, often with no relevant change (240@5kts changing to 250@5kts is of no interest!!). This regularly wastes time in radio exchanges over which info is current. Then with ATC telling crews they are two letters out of date, crews going off air at busy times to get new, though unchanged, ATIS is just plain silly; why not change ATIS every 30 mins at 20 and 50 with extra changes only if required (works well at LHR amongst others).
2) Re the ATIS changing, ground opens and closes like an I don't know what!!! I know they are understaffed at times but if they could change ATIS every 30 mins and tie that up with ground being open for multiples of 30 mins life would be easier for all wouldnt it?
2) That frequency change through Manchester inbound - why? Can't they just let EMA traffic through there under EMA control? You are only with them for maybe a minute and they havent said anything to me in three months except change to EMA...
3) Be below FL100 at SAPCO - fine, understand that they have to say that to keep us in their air but often we cant get any lower and a bus at 100 at SAPCO is gonna need extra track miles or an uncomfortable gear down, speedbrakes out scramble. Not a good idea when you are listening to new but unchanged ATIS's and making frequency changes to controllers who never tell you to do anything else but talk to someone else instead!!
All minor niggles really, a good field to operate from but could be better with the above resolved... If anyone can tell me what I'm missing it would be appreciated.
P.S. Do the hugely agressive managment (eyeballing crews to turn APU's off with dodgy ground power and 220 pax onboard at night - serving notices when they refuse etc etc) hassle the ATCO's there too?
1) Why oh why does the ATIS update every half a second, often with no relevant change (240@5kts changing to 250@5kts is of no interest!!). This regularly wastes time in radio exchanges over which info is current. Then with ATC telling crews they are two letters out of date, crews going off air at busy times to get new, though unchanged, ATIS is just plain silly; why not change ATIS every 30 mins at 20 and 50 with extra changes only if required (works well at LHR amongst others).
2) Re the ATIS changing, ground opens and closes like an I don't know what!!! I know they are understaffed at times but if they could change ATIS every 30 mins and tie that up with ground being open for multiples of 30 mins life would be easier for all wouldnt it?
2) That frequency change through Manchester inbound - why? Can't they just let EMA traffic through there under EMA control? You are only with them for maybe a minute and they havent said anything to me in three months except change to EMA...
3) Be below FL100 at SAPCO - fine, understand that they have to say that to keep us in their air but often we cant get any lower and a bus at 100 at SAPCO is gonna need extra track miles or an uncomfortable gear down, speedbrakes out scramble. Not a good idea when you are listening to new but unchanged ATIS's and making frequency changes to controllers who never tell you to do anything else but talk to someone else instead!!
All minor niggles really, a good field to operate from but could be better with the above resolved... If anyone can tell me what I'm missing it would be appreciated.
P.S. Do the hugely agressive managment (eyeballing crews to turn APU's off with dodgy ground power and 220 pax onboard at night - serving notices when they refuse etc etc) hassle the ATCO's there too?
Join Date: Jul 2002
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I can give you a couple of answers but someone from manchester or TC needs to give you the other 'gen'
the ATIS is mostly automatic-when the software detects a significant change it updates the letter-or to be more correct what the computer thinks is significant. This can be a pressure change or whatever, if the QFE is hovering around a particular reading then this may cause letter changes grouped together.The controller can also cause updates by inputting runway states etc. So a lot of what happens is out of our control, however if I see that the letter has changed and I know that the reason is not significant then I would normally tell the A/C acordingly, or if its quicker, tell you the change-this is something that many of my colleagues also do.
The situation with ground is a little complex at the moment, we will try to open ground as often as possible with the existing staffing-but of necessity it will be ad hock-we do try to work out the most likely times and open up early enough to give notice on the ATIS but we ain't perfect. This situation will improve next year when the extra ATCO's start and ground will hopefully be open more often and at published times-please bear with us.
The problems you have with your arrivals is also something we are aware of and again changes are in train in consultation with our NATS workmates!-if you are a based carrier then your chief pilot may well have some information to pass on to you about this
if there is anything else you want clarified then please dont hesitate to rang ATC and chat-or better still come and check out the best ATC facility in the UK(FOR ITS SIZE!)
just ring the ATC supervisor
the ATIS is mostly automatic-when the software detects a significant change it updates the letter-or to be more correct what the computer thinks is significant. This can be a pressure change or whatever, if the QFE is hovering around a particular reading then this may cause letter changes grouped together.The controller can also cause updates by inputting runway states etc. So a lot of what happens is out of our control, however if I see that the letter has changed and I know that the reason is not significant then I would normally tell the A/C acordingly, or if its quicker, tell you the change-this is something that many of my colleagues also do.
The situation with ground is a little complex at the moment, we will try to open ground as often as possible with the existing staffing-but of necessity it will be ad hock-we do try to work out the most likely times and open up early enough to give notice on the ATIS but we ain't perfect. This situation will improve next year when the extra ATCO's start and ground will hopefully be open more often and at published times-please bear with us.
The problems you have with your arrivals is also something we are aware of and again changes are in train in consultation with our NATS workmates!-if you are a based carrier then your chief pilot may well have some information to pass on to you about this
if there is anything else you want clarified then please dont hesitate to rang ATC and chat-or better still come and check out the best ATC facility in the UK(FOR ITS SIZE!)
just ring the ATC supervisor
