Monday Pay Talks Deadline.......
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Poondon maybe you could enlighten us. France and Spain could you tell us the starting salary, scale length, working hours per week, number of working days per year, minimum years to retirement and percentage of salary on retirement ? I would love to make a comparison with our overall package.
In the meantime I'm another one happy to prime my powder for the WPP negotiation.
In the meantime I'm another one happy to prime my powder for the WPP negotiation.
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Pay attention chaps, French, Spanish and Portugese conditions and salaries were discussed at length on this forum before the initial ballot.
Having sat and pondered, my thoughts are:
*Management have proved to be devious liers having 'found' resources to make a slightly improved offer after saying categorically there wasn't a cent left in the barrel.
*the magic 10% figure some seem to salivate over is only nearly attainable if you compound all the bits of the offer onto your current salary. If you add each year's bits onto that year's starting salary, the figures look much more modest...and for modest read disappointing.
*The above thought is especially pertinent to the 1.8% which will only be implimented in the last month of this (Management defined) pay deal timescale, and is nothing more than a bargaining chip for management when it comes to the next pay round.
Plus, how anyone can include this in the calculation of the overall increase is beyond me as you aint going to see it for another 15 months.
It's the usual story......jam tomorrow.
*There's an extra 1% NI to be deducted.
*The offer of overtime is a three-pronged tool for management:
1. They hope it will be a softener to make the offer look more attractive
2. It's a desperate attempt by them to cover up for the woeful shortstaffing and mismanagement of recruiting/training in the past.
3. The moment we accept overtime in principle, then Management can close the book on any WPP issues concerning hours and fatigue.
*Have all unit managers agreed to buy back TOIL at the quoted rate or will they be duty bound to do so ? I think we should all be clear on our respective unit's position.
I think Prospect have acted as they should; they represented us and are now coming back to us with the new offer. Whether I believe they are right to recommend it is another issue altogether.
Management, despite their front men, are seriously cacking their corporate M&S Y-fronts because, for once, we've had the mettle to stand up to them.
We still have the upper hand, the motivation and now the inertia to reject this offer and press for a real substantial increase to all our basic salaries.
My view remains that this offer is devious, paltry and inadequate; as such, my opinion remains that to say NO is the only way I will be able to vote.
160
Having sat and pondered, my thoughts are:
*Management have proved to be devious liers having 'found' resources to make a slightly improved offer after saying categorically there wasn't a cent left in the barrel.
*the magic 10% figure some seem to salivate over is only nearly attainable if you compound all the bits of the offer onto your current salary. If you add each year's bits onto that year's starting salary, the figures look much more modest...and for modest read disappointing.
*The above thought is especially pertinent to the 1.8% which will only be implimented in the last month of this (Management defined) pay deal timescale, and is nothing more than a bargaining chip for management when it comes to the next pay round.
Plus, how anyone can include this in the calculation of the overall increase is beyond me as you aint going to see it for another 15 months.
It's the usual story......jam tomorrow.
*There's an extra 1% NI to be deducted.
*The offer of overtime is a three-pronged tool for management:
1. They hope it will be a softener to make the offer look more attractive
2. It's a desperate attempt by them to cover up for the woeful shortstaffing and mismanagement of recruiting/training in the past.
3. The moment we accept overtime in principle, then Management can close the book on any WPP issues concerning hours and fatigue.
*Have all unit managers agreed to buy back TOIL at the quoted rate or will they be duty bound to do so ? I think we should all be clear on our respective unit's position.
I think Prospect have acted as they should; they represented us and are now coming back to us with the new offer. Whether I believe they are right to recommend it is another issue altogether.
Management, despite their front men, are seriously cacking their corporate M&S Y-fronts because, for once, we've had the mettle to stand up to them.
We still have the upper hand, the motivation and now the inertia to reject this offer and press for a real substantial increase to all our basic salaries.
My view remains that this offer is devious, paltry and inadequate; as such, my opinion remains that to say NO is the only way I will be able to vote.
160
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Dontdoit, can't speak for anyone else, but I'm knackered after every shift these days.
As much as I'd love to do all the o/t being offered and clear a few credit cards, the six day cylce alone is leaving me too tired for much else.
And I'm only mid-twenties.
As much as I'd love to do all the o/t being offered and clear a few credit cards, the six day cylce alone is leaving me too tired for much else.
And I'm only mid-twenties.
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Some thoughts Ladies & Gentlemen,
I have spent a considerable degree of time reading through all of the information available to us from Prospect and Management regarding the whole of this pay round from last October to date.
I have also spent time reading about the aviation industry in this country and in Europe/USA.
There have been some who have posted here who are anti the deal and who are either advocating that others should also vote no because they will, or are just telling us that they will be voting no. That is their right and they have exercised it.
The deal is not brilliant. But these are some facts:
1. It does add up to an increase of 10% (damn as near with compound interest) on basic salary by Dec 31st 2003.
Yes there is the extra NI to pay, but NATS have to pay that as well - so they wont be too receptive to that argument!
And as for inflation - well the headline rate for June was 1.5 %. True, things can change - which is why a 2 yr deal isn't always a good plan, but if things stay as they are then inflation is easily covered by the offer.
2. The overtime and all that it entails may well be put into practice if the offer goes through at the rates stated and subject to agreements with local reps, managements and individual ATCOs. BUT IT IS VOLUNTARY, and does not extend beyond 2003 at present.
Would it not make sense that money to pay the overtime will come out of existing budgets which are set for each unit based on a pre-determined number of staff? If so, those units that do not have said staff should have the said money left over to pay overtime. This may well help individual ATCOs finances, let alone those colleagues who otherwise might be overloaded day in, day out without the help of overtime workers.
3. If the offer is voted in (subject also to PCS wrangles...) and no-one does the overtime then the rate offered will no doubt increase. If they need it badly, they will pay for it - and much more if no-one volunteers. I strongly suspect that at the present rate they will be killed in the rush. There is always someone who will do it - especially for £300+ net/day. Don't believe those who tell you otherwise.
4. The only catch to the deal is the introduction of OPM. This can help us. Yes it can be used as a tool to reduce PSS - but only if we let it. Bandbox sectors/positions and it may show where savings can be made. OPM was on its way regardless of the deal.
5. NATS finances are not rosy - and yes IT IS OUR PROBLEM!! This is a commercial company - even if "Not for profit." If we push too far and the unthinkable happens and TAG are removed do you think President Blair, Prescott et al will simply re-nationalise us. NEVER. (Well, except perhaps during a prolonged war, god forbid).
I firmly believe that if the negotiators who, despite what you may think, are skilled and knowledgeable on this subject, think that this is the best option - I can find no possible reason to disagree with them. I have tried to find one. Believe me.
Just because I am leaning in favour of this deal does not make me spineless. (I have time to change my mind!) The WPP and PSS clause in the deal is of far greater significance in the very near future and one where big money might be made for little hurt. It is also one where big action may be required and dry powder may be useful.
If this vote goes 51% against then what do you think will really happen? There will be no more offers made. We will be taken on. With 49% in favour, management would fancy their chances. This may well apply to any vote that isn't say as strong as 70% against. They could split the ATCOs if we are not careful. Let alone the merciless treatment we would receive from the press. And yes, that does matter - especially when say 49% don't (in this example) want to fight.
Think carefully and discuss carefully.
To win is not about winning battles, but winning the war. It is a clever workforce that knows when to quit and when to fight. What are we? Quitting now isn't to quit for good. Oh no! Quit whilst you are ahead. Come back later. Dry powder can only be used once. The threat is more potent than the reality.
Disclaimer.
I am not a rep. I am therefore not BEC. I am definitely not management.
Sorry to have gone on!
The touch paper having been lit, he/she sat back to watch the fireworks...
Be safe.
SS.
I have spent a considerable degree of time reading through all of the information available to us from Prospect and Management regarding the whole of this pay round from last October to date.
I have also spent time reading about the aviation industry in this country and in Europe/USA.
There have been some who have posted here who are anti the deal and who are either advocating that others should also vote no because they will, or are just telling us that they will be voting no. That is their right and they have exercised it.
The deal is not brilliant. But these are some facts:
1. It does add up to an increase of 10% (damn as near with compound interest) on basic salary by Dec 31st 2003.
Yes there is the extra NI to pay, but NATS have to pay that as well - so they wont be too receptive to that argument!
And as for inflation - well the headline rate for June was 1.5 %. True, things can change - which is why a 2 yr deal isn't always a good plan, but if things stay as they are then inflation is easily covered by the offer.
2. The overtime and all that it entails may well be put into practice if the offer goes through at the rates stated and subject to agreements with local reps, managements and individual ATCOs. BUT IT IS VOLUNTARY, and does not extend beyond 2003 at present.
Would it not make sense that money to pay the overtime will come out of existing budgets which are set for each unit based on a pre-determined number of staff? If so, those units that do not have said staff should have the said money left over to pay overtime. This may well help individual ATCOs finances, let alone those colleagues who otherwise might be overloaded day in, day out without the help of overtime workers.
3. If the offer is voted in (subject also to PCS wrangles...) and no-one does the overtime then the rate offered will no doubt increase. If they need it badly, they will pay for it - and much more if no-one volunteers. I strongly suspect that at the present rate they will be killed in the rush. There is always someone who will do it - especially for £300+ net/day. Don't believe those who tell you otherwise.
4. The only catch to the deal is the introduction of OPM. This can help us. Yes it can be used as a tool to reduce PSS - but only if we let it. Bandbox sectors/positions and it may show where savings can be made. OPM was on its way regardless of the deal.
5. NATS finances are not rosy - and yes IT IS OUR PROBLEM!! This is a commercial company - even if "Not for profit." If we push too far and the unthinkable happens and TAG are removed do you think President Blair, Prescott et al will simply re-nationalise us. NEVER. (Well, except perhaps during a prolonged war, god forbid).
I firmly believe that if the negotiators who, despite what you may think, are skilled and knowledgeable on this subject, think that this is the best option - I can find no possible reason to disagree with them. I have tried to find one. Believe me.
Just because I am leaning in favour of this deal does not make me spineless. (I have time to change my mind!) The WPP and PSS clause in the deal is of far greater significance in the very near future and one where big money might be made for little hurt. It is also one where big action may be required and dry powder may be useful.
If this vote goes 51% against then what do you think will really happen? There will be no more offers made. We will be taken on. With 49% in favour, management would fancy their chances. This may well apply to any vote that isn't say as strong as 70% against. They could split the ATCOs if we are not careful. Let alone the merciless treatment we would receive from the press. And yes, that does matter - especially when say 49% don't (in this example) want to fight.
Think carefully and discuss carefully.
To win is not about winning battles, but winning the war. It is a clever workforce that knows when to quit and when to fight. What are we? Quitting now isn't to quit for good. Oh no! Quit whilst you are ahead. Come back later. Dry powder can only be used once. The threat is more potent than the reality.
Disclaimer.
I am not a rep. I am therefore not BEC. I am definitely not management.
Sorry to have gone on!
The touch paper having been lit, he/she sat back to watch the fireworks...
Be safe.
SS.
Last edited by Standard Speeds; 20th Jul 2002 at 11:31.
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WHAT BOLLOCKS!!!!!
Quit while you are ahead and come back and fight at some other time is what the union have said for years.
You are still not paid enough and you certainly do not get the recognition for the job you do.
Fight all the way and start to kick ass.
The government/management need you more than you need them dont forget that!
Quit while you are ahead and come back and fight at some other time is what the union have said for years.
You are still not paid enough and you certainly do not get the recognition for the job you do.
Fight all the way and start to kick ass.
The government/management need you more than you need them dont forget that!
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Standard Speeds.
What makes you think that the government would not re-nationalize us? What DO you think would happen if TAG went bust?(even if we had nothing to do with it!!).
I am now well into my third decade with NATS and I have heard it all before
As I said in my first ever posting on Prune in the other thread and i WILL SHOUT IT :-
What makes you think that the government would not re-nationalize us? What DO you think would happen if TAG went bust?(even if we had nothing to do with it!!).
I am now well into my third decade with NATS and I have heard it all before
As I said in my first ever posting on Prune in the other thread and i WILL SHOUT IT :-
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Sorry I hit the wrong key!!!!
THE ONLY DECENT PAY RISE I HAVE EVER HAD CAME AFTER THE LAST TIME WE TOOK INDUSTRIAL ACTION
I`m sorry but I have been around long enough to know that if we do not take action now people will not do it just for WPP or anything else you stated. Look what people said about PPP and our pension scheme!!
THE ONLY DECENT PAY RISE I HAVE EVER HAD CAME AFTER THE LAST TIME WE TOOK INDUSTRIAL ACTION
I`m sorry but I have been around long enough to know that if we do not take action now people will not do it just for WPP or anything else you stated. Look what people said about PPP and our pension scheme!!
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RogerOut, you do have to give and take a little (OPM etc) however in reality I think you will find that NATS are saving a good deal more than 6% with the pensions holiday - if my memory serves me well the "employer" contribution to the NATS (ex CAA) pension scheme was in the region of 12%!!!!!!!!! - all of which makes your point even more strongly!
It's also true however that NATS will also have to pay increased employer NI contributions, so as pointed out this is hardly a point that will gain much sympathy from NATS. Also whether we "care" that NATS is part private or not does not alter the fact that it is - and the government will certainly not re-nationalise (except for war).
It's also true however that NATS will also have to pay increased employer NI contributions, so as pointed out this is hardly a point that will gain much sympathy from NATS. Also whether we "care" that NATS is part private or not does not alter the fact that it is - and the government will certainly not re-nationalise (except for war).
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The only trouble with keeping your powder dry is that it starts to cake and then does not go off as expected!
I for one will be voting no to the pay offer as I think it should be a recognition of past good work and future worth to the company. I believe that management do not recognise anything other than "you're a number, shut up and do what you are told".
Also has anyone else spotted that they are relying on 6, yes 6, Atcos per day at LACC to work on overtime, and 3 at LTCC. How can you do this on a 6 on 4 off system and still keep within SCRATCOH? Please answer as I can't work it out.
But please everyone vote no as the previous offer was with no strings, now, they offer more but they are aiming for their pound of flesh as well..................
I for one will be voting no to the pay offer as I think it should be a recognition of past good work and future worth to the company. I believe that management do not recognise anything other than "you're a number, shut up and do what you are told".
Also has anyone else spotted that they are relying on 6, yes 6, Atcos per day at LACC to work on overtime, and 3 at LTCC. How can you do this on a 6 on 4 off system and still keep within SCRATCOH? Please answer as I can't work it out.
But please everyone vote no as the previous offer was with no strings, now, they offer more but they are aiming for their pound of flesh as well..................
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Not strictly on topic, but I note that another chance to inject some fresh ideas into the management of LACC has been missed. The early retirement of the present GM was an ideal chance for TAG to put a new person in who might offer some ideas on how to improve things (new broom and all that). But no, under the insistence of C&Ham the GM LTCC has been moved up and everybody shuffles along. More of the usual sh!t to follow, I suppose.
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Looks to me like management screwed up big time...
They must've thought that this capitulation would at least get them clear of the threat of industrial action - even if they admit they have no idea how they propose to pay for it!!!
And yet now, not only are not all ATCOs exactly biting their hand off... they now find themselves in a major dispute with PCS and the Prospect engineers
Perhaps the famous "Mission Statement and Guiding Principles" could be better shortened to "D'oh!"
Just on the constant reference to the pension scheme... I'm afraid none of us are in a position to complain about the pensions holiday. As it is a final salary scheme, the company can do what they like as long as the money is there to cover their commitments. As there's a significant surplus, that mone is there's to do what they like with. And the savings (of around 12%) aren't going into a high interest account.. they're being used to keep the company trading! Sad isn't it...
They must've thought that this capitulation would at least get them clear of the threat of industrial action - even if they admit they have no idea how they propose to pay for it!!!
And yet now, not only are not all ATCOs exactly biting their hand off... they now find themselves in a major dispute with PCS and the Prospect engineers
Perhaps the famous "Mission Statement and Guiding Principles" could be better shortened to "D'oh!"
Just on the constant reference to the pension scheme... I'm afraid none of us are in a position to complain about the pensions holiday. As it is a final salary scheme, the company can do what they like as long as the money is there to cover their commitments. As there's a significant surplus, that mone is there's to do what they like with. And the savings (of around 12%) aren't going into a high interest account.. they're being used to keep the company trading! Sad isn't it...
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EG: I do hope that you are correct, in which case I will eat my words.
Undercover: I think you are missing the point. The days of final salary schemes in this country are numbered. What is to stop the company deciding to wind up the final salary scheme, converting each person's pension entitlement or fund at that point into a money purchase scheme? Correct me if I'm wrong, but the small print does not include the phrase: 'We will continue with a final salary scheme for exisiting members forever'.
More importantly, actuarial advice earlier this year was NOT to take a pensions holiday due uncertainty over the future state of the market and NATS' future pensions commitment. NATS/CAA decided to proceed anyway. You cannot miss the fact that stockmarkets are now down around the level they were 5 years ago. What do you think NATS/CAA does with its money to produce the growth needed to meet its pension commitments? I'll bet a large percentage is invested in the stock market. I wonder what state their portfolio is in now compared to how it was when they decided to take the pensions holiday...
During this time, the money saved by the holiday may well have gone into running the company, but where is the surplus money in the company which might soon be needed to prop up the pension fund??
I'm willing to bet that pensions will be a big issue in the coming years.
Undercover: I think you are missing the point. The days of final salary schemes in this country are numbered. What is to stop the company deciding to wind up the final salary scheme, converting each person's pension entitlement or fund at that point into a money purchase scheme? Correct me if I'm wrong, but the small print does not include the phrase: 'We will continue with a final salary scheme for exisiting members forever'.
More importantly, actuarial advice earlier this year was NOT to take a pensions holiday due uncertainty over the future state of the market and NATS' future pensions commitment. NATS/CAA decided to proceed anyway. You cannot miss the fact that stockmarkets are now down around the level they were 5 years ago. What do you think NATS/CAA does with its money to produce the growth needed to meet its pension commitments? I'll bet a large percentage is invested in the stock market. I wonder what state their portfolio is in now compared to how it was when they decided to take the pensions holiday...
During this time, the money saved by the holiday may well have gone into running the company, but where is the surplus money in the company which might soon be needed to prop up the pension fund??
I'm willing to bet that pensions will be a big issue in the coming years.
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PooDon - Maybe the reason there is silence is because we have seen the arguments and await clarification of the deal at members meetings.
As for you point that
I have been in ATC since 1971 so the following comes without reference to R/T, radar recordings or Staff Notices -
The first staffing crisis in UK ATC came in the 1960s. Difficulty in retaining ATCOs or recruiting additional non service people lead to the Radley ( ? ) report. This took the unprecedented step of breaking the ATCOs away from their Civil Service grade salaries and turning a literally bicycle owning workforce into car owners overnight.
The 1970s saw the IPCS Union negotiate the introduction of the 5 Watch at most major units in the UK. ( Aberdeen caught up at the turn of the century !!). This radically altered the working conditions of ATC staff and went from the old 4 Watch A(M/N)SO to the almost universal MMAANNSOOO. This gave ATC staff 18 more days off per year.
There were huge pay rises in the 1970s but only because of inflation. I think the peak was around 1976 / 77 when we received a 26% pay rise. The big problem was inflation was around 23% . Our pay was determined by the Pay Revue Unit (PRU) which simply averaged the private sector pay rises over the previous year and awarded it to the Civil Service. Occasionally a bit was added to anticipate the effect of rampaging inflation.
1981. The Civil Service strikes were as a result of the Government scrapping the PRU at the same time as they were telling Health and Teaching staff to go to some form of revue body. It didn't seem to matter to Thatcher or the public that the Government were applying double standards. As members of the Civil Service Trade Unions we went on strike. The result was and increased pay offer of about 2.5% but no return to the PRU. We were then "free" to collectively bargain with the Government who just slapped us with pay policy after pay policy. Pay rises usually just reached inflation and sometimes not even matched it.
This political strike motivated a lot of otherwise conservative ATCOs into long term work for the trade Union movement. Barry Gibbs, Doug Bush, Dave Vaughan, Paul Louden, Tony Cowell, Alan Taylor, Billy Rodger, Graham Clarkson and Robin Morris all served as reps and BEC members in the next decade. Hopefully this rising of Trade Union interest amongst ATCOs will produce leaders of similar ability for the next decade.
The ATCO restructuring of the early 1980s saw the demise of the old grading structure. ATCO IVs disappeared and ATCO II artificial barrier to pay progression ( called PPR) was dropped. If you were near the bottom of the ATCO grades or scales you got a massive rise.
The ATCOs Branch of IPCS supported the formative committee of UKATS financially and more importantly it gave them Union protection against a hostile CAA management. Only when the personal threat to the members disappeared did Union membership cease to be a condition of UKATTS. This has left UK ATC with one of the best travel schemes in the world.
1987 Working Practices agreement saw a productivity agreement which paid for significant rises. Each ATCO had spine point rises and some in the middle benefited from the shortening of the pay scales.
Following that the ATCO early retierment scheme was negotiated. This allows ATCOs access to retirement conditions which no other staff enjoy. CAA management accepted the scheme and ploughed in millions of pounds to top up the fund for this extra bonus. ATCOs paid no extra.
At the same time a sceptical CAA management were persuaded by IPCS to back the Committee on the Regulation of ATCO Hours ( CRATCOH ) and back the legal limitation of ATCO hours championed by Tony Cowell and the ATCOs Branch through many years of debate. We are one of the few countries in the world to have the protection of this type of legislation.
The 1990s saw some ATCO's Branch members spend years defeating Thatcher and then Major Government proposals to fully privatise NATS and flog it off to the financial markets. We were eventually double crossed by this Government but still managed to retain many guarantees in legislation which never existed under any other privatisation. Not least of this is your final salary pension scheme which under joint TU and management governance has become one of the best pension schemes in the UK.
Reacting to ATCO pressure around the UK NATS again restructured the ATCO grades around 1990. The introduction of ATCO 3 and spine points for all ATCO 2s was a direct result of negotiation. The ATCO 3s may not have liked it but the alternatives were far worse. For no changes in working practices the ATCO 2s gained.
The 1997 Working Practices Agreement again gave spine point rises and bonuses to all ATCOs in return for productivity. This negotiation reduced the number of ATCOs by about 115 but we were at least that number short. A very limited number of early starts were agreed but management made major concessions in returning annual leave to debiting by days and not hours to the benefit of all ATCOs. Minimum shift length times mean that management cannot bring you in for extra days to cover short peaks of traffic.
This year's negotiations have probably produced the biggest above inflation pay rise ever negotiated in the annual pay round. That includes other multi year deals we have settled. Almost no concessions were made on productivity. A daily rate in excess of normal overtime rate is established as the baseline for any additional attendance.
Management still have to come back for productivity negotiations under any new WPP negotiation. You will have your say on the policies to be adopted in those negotiations and a ballot to vote for or against the final proposal.
In summary, never in the last 40 years have ATCOs gained more from industrial action than they have through negotiation.
As for you point that
THE ONLY DECENT PAY RISE I HAVE EVER HAD CAME AFTER THE LAST TIME WE TOOK INDUSTRIAL ACTION
The first staffing crisis in UK ATC came in the 1960s. Difficulty in retaining ATCOs or recruiting additional non service people lead to the Radley ( ? ) report. This took the unprecedented step of breaking the ATCOs away from their Civil Service grade salaries and turning a literally bicycle owning workforce into car owners overnight.
The 1970s saw the IPCS Union negotiate the introduction of the 5 Watch at most major units in the UK. ( Aberdeen caught up at the turn of the century !!). This radically altered the working conditions of ATC staff and went from the old 4 Watch A(M/N)SO to the almost universal MMAANNSOOO. This gave ATC staff 18 more days off per year.
There were huge pay rises in the 1970s but only because of inflation. I think the peak was around 1976 / 77 when we received a 26% pay rise. The big problem was inflation was around 23% . Our pay was determined by the Pay Revue Unit (PRU) which simply averaged the private sector pay rises over the previous year and awarded it to the Civil Service. Occasionally a bit was added to anticipate the effect of rampaging inflation.
1981. The Civil Service strikes were as a result of the Government scrapping the PRU at the same time as they were telling Health and Teaching staff to go to some form of revue body. It didn't seem to matter to Thatcher or the public that the Government were applying double standards. As members of the Civil Service Trade Unions we went on strike. The result was and increased pay offer of about 2.5% but no return to the PRU. We were then "free" to collectively bargain with the Government who just slapped us with pay policy after pay policy. Pay rises usually just reached inflation and sometimes not even matched it.
This political strike motivated a lot of otherwise conservative ATCOs into long term work for the trade Union movement. Barry Gibbs, Doug Bush, Dave Vaughan, Paul Louden, Tony Cowell, Alan Taylor, Billy Rodger, Graham Clarkson and Robin Morris all served as reps and BEC members in the next decade. Hopefully this rising of Trade Union interest amongst ATCOs will produce leaders of similar ability for the next decade.
The ATCO restructuring of the early 1980s saw the demise of the old grading structure. ATCO IVs disappeared and ATCO II artificial barrier to pay progression ( called PPR) was dropped. If you were near the bottom of the ATCO grades or scales you got a massive rise.
The ATCOs Branch of IPCS supported the formative committee of UKATS financially and more importantly it gave them Union protection against a hostile CAA management. Only when the personal threat to the members disappeared did Union membership cease to be a condition of UKATTS. This has left UK ATC with one of the best travel schemes in the world.
1987 Working Practices agreement saw a productivity agreement which paid for significant rises. Each ATCO had spine point rises and some in the middle benefited from the shortening of the pay scales.
Following that the ATCO early retierment scheme was negotiated. This allows ATCOs access to retirement conditions which no other staff enjoy. CAA management accepted the scheme and ploughed in millions of pounds to top up the fund for this extra bonus. ATCOs paid no extra.
At the same time a sceptical CAA management were persuaded by IPCS to back the Committee on the Regulation of ATCO Hours ( CRATCOH ) and back the legal limitation of ATCO hours championed by Tony Cowell and the ATCOs Branch through many years of debate. We are one of the few countries in the world to have the protection of this type of legislation.
The 1990s saw some ATCO's Branch members spend years defeating Thatcher and then Major Government proposals to fully privatise NATS and flog it off to the financial markets. We were eventually double crossed by this Government but still managed to retain many guarantees in legislation which never existed under any other privatisation. Not least of this is your final salary pension scheme which under joint TU and management governance has become one of the best pension schemes in the UK.
Reacting to ATCO pressure around the UK NATS again restructured the ATCO grades around 1990. The introduction of ATCO 3 and spine points for all ATCO 2s was a direct result of negotiation. The ATCO 3s may not have liked it but the alternatives were far worse. For no changes in working practices the ATCO 2s gained.
The 1997 Working Practices Agreement again gave spine point rises and bonuses to all ATCOs in return for productivity. This negotiation reduced the number of ATCOs by about 115 but we were at least that number short. A very limited number of early starts were agreed but management made major concessions in returning annual leave to debiting by days and not hours to the benefit of all ATCOs. Minimum shift length times mean that management cannot bring you in for extra days to cover short peaks of traffic.
This year's negotiations have probably produced the biggest above inflation pay rise ever negotiated in the annual pay round. That includes other multi year deals we have settled. Almost no concessions were made on productivity. A daily rate in excess of normal overtime rate is established as the baseline for any additional attendance.
Management still have to come back for productivity negotiations under any new WPP negotiation. You will have your say on the policies to be adopted in those negotiations and a ballot to vote for or against the final proposal.
In summary, never in the last 40 years have ATCOs gained more from industrial action than they have through negotiation.
Join Date: Nov 1999
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If TAG did go bust who would take responsibility for a shortfall in the pension fund ?
On the subject of overtime ;
In order to satisfy SRATCOH, I believe anyone doing additional attendances must be rostered on spins rather than nights for day 8 or 9 attendances. Therefore, can all those not volunteering expect permanent nights.
EVEN IF YOU DO NOT VOLUNTEER FOR OVERTIME THIS WILL HAVE A MASSIVE IMPACT ON YOUR ROSTER
On the subject of overtime ;
In order to satisfy SRATCOH, I believe anyone doing additional attendances must be rostered on spins rather than nights for day 8 or 9 attendances. Therefore, can all those not volunteering expect permanent nights.
EVEN IF YOU DO NOT VOLUNTEER FOR OVERTIME THIS WILL HAVE A MASSIVE IMPACT ON YOUR ROSTER
Join Date: Jul 2002
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findo
nice speach mate
is that going to form the basis of your triumph when addressing the bec on the next pile of ***** they advise us to accept.
your rise up the ladder of power is almost assured nats management need the easily appeased like yourself
prospect rejected the idea of a two year deal earlier why turn tail now
we should all vote no to this devicive insult if not it will all end in tears not far down the line
ps totally agree with joko1020 top point
nice speach mate
is that going to form the basis of your triumph when addressing the bec on the next pile of ***** they advise us to accept.
your rise up the ladder of power is almost assured nats management need the easily appeased like yourself
prospect rejected the idea of a two year deal earlier why turn tail now
we should all vote no to this devicive insult if not it will all end in tears not far down the line
ps totally agree with joko1020 top point