View Poll Results: My reaction to the NATS pay proposal is:
Great !! Well done to NATS for finding money for a small, responsible award.
6
2.55%
Times are hard, so this is the best we could have hoped for.
21
8.94%
I'm not happy, but we must push for a better award next year.
16
6.81%
I'm totally opposed to this so-called rise. Given a vote, I'd favour industrial action.
192
81.70%
Voters: 235. This poll is closed
NATS pay offer
Join Date: Mar 2001
Location: Costa del CYYZ
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Just to add fuel onto the rumour mill fire.........
I have been told at work that BA and BMI pilots are being offered pay rises of between 6-8%.............No idea how true this is, but if it is true...........makes you think, no?
Would be great if any pilots could confirm/deny this, as if true I believe it might add some weight to our argument, particularly as these two airlines are part owners, and of course let's not forget another, easyJet who don't seem to be short of cash at the moment either, nor Airtours, Britannia and Monarch who have all just completed very expensive new corporate image makeovers and liveries........these airlines short of money.....I don't think so !
I have been told at work that BA and BMI pilots are being offered pay rises of between 6-8%.............No idea how true this is, but if it is true...........makes you think, no?
Would be great if any pilots could confirm/deny this, as if true I believe it might add some weight to our argument, particularly as these two airlines are part owners, and of course let's not forget another, easyJet who don't seem to be short of cash at the moment either, nor Airtours, Britannia and Monarch who have all just completed very expensive new corporate image makeovers and liveries........these airlines short of money.....I don't think so !
Join Date: May 2002
Location: uk
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What is our joint ATCO/ATSA/ATCE doing?
It is recommending that the the lower paid staff accept the offer, but the higher paid hold out for more!
Everybody needs/deserves a pay raise, after all the brown stuff, we've been put thru these past years. Any bets on whether Dicky E is getting a big bonus.
Are they representing the best interests of ALL their member?
What next everybody negotiates their our contact?
United we stand, divided we get walked all over by Airline Fat Cats
It is recommending that the the lower paid staff accept the offer, but the higher paid hold out for more!
Everybody needs/deserves a pay raise, after all the brown stuff, we've been put thru these past years. Any bets on whether Dicky E is getting a big bonus.
Are they representing the best interests of ALL their member?
What next everybody negotiates their our contact?
United we stand, divided we get walked all over by Airline Fat Cats
Join Date: Mar 2002
Location: Sunny Warwickshire
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Anybody heard Brian Montague on the weekly message, he seems to think that this pay offer will represent a 9% increase over the 2 years (since the wage bill will go up 9% due annual increments etc) we are technically being offered 9% over 2 years.
Wasn't it Mark Twain who said lies damned lies and statistics???
This whole offer is a waste of time, traffic levels pre 911 were rising year on year, the regional airports have seen massive increases in movements (look at the PH figures)
It's time we made a stand and say to management that we DESERVE to be paid more.
A graduate working at Debenhams in London, 22 yrs old, no experience, no responsibility gets paid circa 30K.
A newly valid controller at a regional airport responsible for thousands of lives each day gets 32K (inc UHP)
Is this right???? I think not
Wasn't it Mark Twain who said lies damned lies and statistics???
This whole offer is a waste of time, traffic levels pre 911 were rising year on year, the regional airports have seen massive increases in movements (look at the PH figures)
It's time we made a stand and say to management that we DESERVE to be paid more.
A graduate working at Debenhams in London, 22 yrs old, no experience, no responsibility gets paid circa 30K.
A newly valid controller at a regional airport responsible for thousands of lives each day gets 32K (inc UHP)
Is this right???? I think not
Join Date: Nov 2001
Location: London Whipsnade Wildlife Park
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So is he saying that all staff at the top of their respective grades will get 9%?
I DOUBT IT!
Part of what he is offering, the incremental grades, staff will get, if eligible, anyway!
My mate at TC will now be able to sponsor my food at Whipsnade now he is getting a 9% rise. Actually he can take me out for the day to visit my mates at Woburn!
I DOUBT IT!
Part of what he is offering, the incremental grades, staff will get, if eligible, anyway!
My mate at TC will now be able to sponsor my food at Whipsnade now he is getting a 9% rise. Actually he can take me out for the day to visit my mates at Woburn!
Join Date: Apr 2002
Location: Ecosse
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As for there not being any money, how come the 'high-heid-yins' say one minute that NATS is skint, and the next that the settlement reached with EDS over the cancellation of the Oceanic FDPS contract was settled "well within" the budget NATS had set? I was never great at bean-couting, but if the cash set aside for the EDS litigation was not exhausted, where has the surplus disappeared to?
Thread Starter
Join Date: Mar 2000
Location: Bermuda Shorts and Cessna Caravans
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Of course, management in their generosity and deep understanding of the job will no doubt factor in all the extra blood sweat and tears expended during all those 'unexpected' faults/problems/manual modes; not only at LACC, but also the massive (and I mean MASSIVE) extra workload it puts on MACC/TC sectors, plus all the problems compounded delays create for those fine colleagues up in the room with a view. 
The extra work we have all put in during the last 3 months alone has been enough to make the current pay offer seem derisory in the extreme and totally inadequate.
It is an insult to our collective intelligence, and pretty well sums up exactly in what regard management hold us.
Enough of the vocal platitudes management; put the money where your mouth is for once.
The extra work we have all put in during the last 3 months alone has been enough to make the current pay offer seem derisory in the extreme and totally inadequate.
It is an insult to our collective intelligence, and pretty well sums up exactly in what regard management hold us.
Enough of the vocal platitudes management; put the money where your mouth is for once.
Join Date: Sep 1999
Location: Jockland
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So; Mr Montague.
Or can I call you Brian?
As a shareholder in NATS, I would very much like to know how much you; personally, will be receiving in bonus payments, if we; your loyal staff, are daft enough to accept your crappy pay offer.
Care to enlighten us?
Or can I call you Brian?
As a shareholder in NATS, I would very much like to know how much you; personally, will be receiving in bonus payments, if we; your loyal staff, are daft enough to accept your crappy pay offer.
Care to enlighten us?
Thread Starter
Join Date: Mar 2000
Location: Bermuda Shorts and Cessna Caravans
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Good question...are bonuses and their amounts declared anywhere?
As shareholders, are we not legally entitled to be privvy to this data ?????
160
As shareholders, are we not legally entitled to be privvy to this data ?????
160
Join Date: Nov 1999
Location: Mae Sai
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Same boat
G'day all - sounds like you guys find yourself in the same rickety old boat that we're in Dunnunda. Is there an e-copy of your offer floating around somewhere for those that are interested in comparing the salient points? Cheers.
Join Date: Nov 2001
Location: Here to Eternity
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Mr Montague left us some time ago now folks... Away back to Ireland for a nice new job. Also for family reasons I believe.
We have an "acting" replacement I believe... acting at what I'm not too sure.
We have an "acting" replacement I believe... acting at what I'm not too sure.
Join Date: Jul 2002
Location: Basingstoke
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ATCO Payscale Theorem
Engineers and ATSAs can never earn as much as ATCOs
This theorem can now be supported by a mathematical equation based upon the following 2 postulates:
Postulate 1: Knowledge is Power
Postulate 2: Time is Money
As every engineer knows:
Power=Work/Time
and since:
Knowledge=Power
and
Time=Money
it is therefore true that
Knowledge = Work/Money
solving this equation for Money, we get:
Money= Work/Knowledge
Thus, as Knowledge approaches zero, Money approaches infinity, regardless of the amount of work done
QED
This theorem can now be supported by a mathematical equation based upon the following 2 postulates:
Postulate 1: Knowledge is Power
Postulate 2: Time is Money
As every engineer knows:
Power=Work/Time
and since:
Knowledge=Power
and
Time=Money
it is therefore true that
Knowledge = Work/Money
solving this equation for Money, we get:
Money= Work/Knowledge
Thus, as Knowledge approaches zero, Money approaches infinity, regardless of the amount of work done
QED
