Heathrow Holding....
Thread Starter
Joined: Oct 2000
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From: Berkshire, UK
Heathrow Holding....
Our politicians want to reduce aircraft holding. A report on BBC News says: "According to the report, excessive stacking over Heathrow, in west London, had "negative environmental impacts".
When I worked there, aircraft used to hold many miles from Heathrow. Presumably the procedures have changed so they now all hold overhead Heathrow............ or might it just be that our wonderful politicians are, as always, talking out of their bottoms about matters they know nothing about?
When I worked there, aircraft used to hold many miles from Heathrow. Presumably the procedures have changed so they now all hold overhead Heathrow............ or might it just be that our wonderful politicians are, as always, talking out of their bottoms about matters they know nothing about?
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From: London
or might it just be that our wonderful journalists are, as always, talking out of their bottoms about matters they know nothing about?
Thread Starter
Joined: Oct 2000
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From: Berkshire, UK
Del Prado... It was said to be MPs who made the comment, not journalists as you have made it look, although I accept that journalists talk rubbish.
The holding areas are remote from Heathrow - several over fairly open country - so the suggestion that aircraft stack over West London is a total nonsene. That was my point.
The holding areas are remote from Heathrow - several over fairly open country - so the suggestion that aircraft stack over West London is a total nonsene. That was my point.
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From: 5116N00044W
Reduce stacking and consider limiting flights over AONB's and National Parks
The Select Committee press release (UK Parliament - transpn090710) refers to stacking 'around Heathrow, not 'over Heathrow',
Instead of judging the MPs' work by reading 180 words of a BBC News report, why not read the actual Select Committee Report - nearly 300 pages, including evidence - (http://www.publications.parliament.u...an/163/163.pdf). Some of the witnesses called actually seem to be quite knowledgeable, even if they do work in a office!
Instead of judging the MPs' work by reading 180 words of a BBC News report, why not read the actual Select Committee Report - nearly 300 pages, including evidence - (http://www.publications.parliament.u...an/163/163.pdf). Some of the witnesses called actually seem to be quite knowledgeable, even if they do work in a office!
Thread Starter
Joined: Oct 2000
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From: Berkshire, UK
Read the report, thanks. Typical sentence:
<<Stacking—whereby aircraft are kept waiting in the air around the airport before air traffic control gives permission to land>>
"Speedbird 123, this is Heathrow Airport, you have permission to land".
Sorry, I live in a different Universe.
<<Stacking—whereby aircraft are kept waiting in the air around the airport before air traffic control gives permission to land>>
"Speedbird 123, this is Heathrow Airport, you have permission to land".
Sorry, I live in a different Universe.
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From: Greystation
These are the same journalists that this morning on BBC News "Breakfast" program reported that a BA plane evacuated "whilst taxiing along the runway". Quite clearly looks to be still on stand to me..........
Spink Pots
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From: Up in the air
Originally Posted by HEATHROW DIRECTOR
Read the report, thanks. Typical sentence:
<<Stacking—whereby aircraft are kept waiting in the air around the airport before air traffic control gives permission to land>>
"Speedbird 123, this is Heathrow Airport, you have permission to land".
Sorry, I live in a different Universe.
<<Stacking—whereby aircraft are kept waiting in the air around the airport before air traffic control gives permission to land>>
"Speedbird 123, this is Heathrow Airport, you have permission to land".
Sorry, I live in a different Universe.
Do us all a favour and give the elitist claptrap a rest.
Thread Starter
Joined: Oct 2000
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From: Berkshire, UK
Scuzi.. It's not "elitist claptrap", whatever you mean by that. This is a forum for professional people whose working lives are governed by detailed procedures, rules and regulations. It irritates me somewhat to see that those who rule our whole lives and decide our futures cannot, apparently, get things right.
Spink Pots
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From: Up in the air
HD, I can see where you are coming from but surely you must understand that the press have to report such matters in language their readers can understand. On the same note, politicians are not aviation professionals and have to have such matters explained to them in term they understand.
Most people couldn't give a crap if the Heathrow holds are overhead the airfield or 10-20 miles out, or the the difference between an apron, taxiway and runway.
Lambasting them for speaking in laymens terms comes across as elitist.
Most people couldn't give a crap if the Heathrow holds are overhead the airfield or 10-20 miles out, or the the difference between an apron, taxiway and runway.
Lambasting them for speaking in laymens terms comes across as elitist.
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From: The foot of Mt. Belzoni.
PeltonLevel,
HD does not need to waste his hard-earned retirement doing this.
MATS Pt1, (CAP493) clearly defines a Holding Procedure as "A pre-determined manoeuvre which keeps an aircraft within a specified airspace whilst awaiting further clearance"
Or the press/politicians could consult the excellent ATC book by Graham Duke. Check it out yourself, it might save a lot of time/bandwidth on these fora. You might find 'I Spy At The Airport' useful too!
P.S.
Louise Ellman MP won't like RIAT then.
HD does not need to waste his hard-earned retirement doing this.
MATS Pt1, (CAP493) clearly defines a Holding Procedure as "A pre-determined manoeuvre which keeps an aircraft within a specified airspace whilst awaiting further clearance"
Or the press/politicians could consult the excellent ATC book by Graham Duke. Check it out yourself, it might save a lot of time/bandwidth on these fora. You might find 'I Spy At The Airport' useful too!
P.S.
Louise Ellman MP won't like RIAT then.
Last edited by ZOOKER; 11th July 2009 at 20:27.
Thread Starter
Joined: Oct 2000
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From: Berkshire, UK
OK, instead of:
<<Stacking—whereby aircraft are kept waiting in the air around the airport before air traffic control gives permission to land>>
Try something like:
Aircraft are held, some distance from the airport, before being directed by ATC into the landing sequence.
I am sorry that some people don't share my views and descend to insults but it concerns me that Joe Public knows so little about what goes on. I believe that it would be better to educate rather than baffle them. I live to the west of Heathrow and there only have to be a few days of easterlies before the moans appear in the local paper and councillors express concern about "changed flight paths", etc.
<<Stacking—whereby aircraft are kept waiting in the air around the airport before air traffic control gives permission to land>>
Try something like:
Aircraft are held, some distance from the airport, before being directed by ATC into the landing sequence.
I am sorry that some people don't share my views and descend to insults but it concerns me that Joe Public knows so little about what goes on. I believe that it would be better to educate rather than baffle them. I live to the west of Heathrow and there only have to be a few days of easterlies before the moans appear in the local paper and councillors express concern about "changed flight paths", etc.
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From: 5116N00044W
HD
Thanks - it's much better and still brief!
Thinking about it,the original gives the impression that aircraft sort of spiral into the airport.
Thanks - it's much better and still brief!
Thinking about it,the original gives the impression that aircraft sort of spiral into the airport.
Last edited by PeltonLevel; 12th July 2009 at 08:46. Reason: spelling