Rejected by NATS - Stage 1 Trainee ATCO
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Rejected by NATS - Stage 1 Trainee ATCO
That's me 
I called the HR team to get confirmation as I've heard of cases where people were sent a rejection email by mistake. They did indeed confirm it...drat.
Cheekily, I asked if they could give some form of feedback so I knew which area(s) of the selection I had let myself down on. They told me that overall I performed very well however my diagramming and basic checking need slight improvement.
My first reason for posting is to see if anyone can remind me which tests these were. I'm sure the basic checking test was the one where you have to find the matching number or group of letters in a list. Well, I remember answering a high number of questions here and being very careful to double check answers. I'd be surprised if I got more than one or two wrong out of those I answered. Same goes for diagramming. That was a test with symbols and some instructions for what to do (ie inverse, omit, reverse order etc). Again, I'm pretty sure I answered most of the questions and was very careful to get the right answers.
Of course, maybe the required grade is even higher than what I thought was a high standard. In which case I need to get some practise in for next time.
I'm disappointed that the results aren't considered in an overall manner rather than individual tests. It's never nice to hear that you did really well overall, but still didn't make the grade. However, that does prove that NATS are committed to high standards and won't lower their requirements just because of lack of candidates for the January course.
The email states that I must leave 12 months between tests. At least I have plenty of time to prepare. Does anyone know why they are so strict about this? I can understand a few months so they can change the papers. Is there another reason?
It forces me to take stock of the situation. I am still determined to become an ATCO so I will consider all the entry routes. Over the forthcoming 12 months I will continue to build on my knowledge of ATC and aviation. I may even attempt to move into an aviation job to get some experience.
I'm not looking for sympathy or condolences. Advice would be appreciated. Including advice to "give up hope" if it can be justified.
I called the HR team to get confirmation as I've heard of cases where people were sent a rejection email by mistake. They did indeed confirm it...drat.
Cheekily, I asked if they could give some form of feedback so I knew which area(s) of the selection I had let myself down on. They told me that overall I performed very well however my diagramming and basic checking need slight improvement.
My first reason for posting is to see if anyone can remind me which tests these were. I'm sure the basic checking test was the one where you have to find the matching number or group of letters in a list. Well, I remember answering a high number of questions here and being very careful to double check answers. I'd be surprised if I got more than one or two wrong out of those I answered. Same goes for diagramming. That was a test with symbols and some instructions for what to do (ie inverse, omit, reverse order etc). Again, I'm pretty sure I answered most of the questions and was very careful to get the right answers.
Of course, maybe the required grade is even higher than what I thought was a high standard. In which case I need to get some practise in for next time.
I'm disappointed that the results aren't considered in an overall manner rather than individual tests. It's never nice to hear that you did really well overall, but still didn't make the grade. However, that does prove that NATS are committed to high standards and won't lower their requirements just because of lack of candidates for the January course.
The email states that I must leave 12 months between tests. At least I have plenty of time to prepare. Does anyone know why they are so strict about this? I can understand a few months so they can change the papers. Is there another reason?
It forces me to take stock of the situation. I am still determined to become an ATCO so I will consider all the entry routes. Over the forthcoming 12 months I will continue to build on my knowledge of ATC and aviation. I may even attempt to move into an aviation job to get some experience.
I'm not looking for sympathy or condolences. Advice would be appreciated. Including advice to "give up hope" if it can be justified.
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Do not give up hope. A friend of mine passed on his third attempt and I know loads that passed on their second. I think the main reason they make you wait 12 months is that with the long period in between it is more likely to remain a test of your true aptitude for the job, rather than simply getting better at the tests and passing them through learning and practising rather than natural ability, if that makes sense?? Well you came so close this time you should be fine now you know the exact format of the tests etc. Good luck.
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I couldnt have put it better myself BigBoeing
Its true, i know plenty of people at the college who got through on their 2nd or 3rd attempt...it is no reflection of how good a controller you will be or indeed how well you will cope at the college. I asked how long i could leave it before i reapplied should i fail and the interviewer said theres no harm in trying again after 6 months.
good luck
Its true, i know plenty of people at the college who got through on their 2nd or 3rd attempt...it is no reflection of how good a controller you will be or indeed how well you will cope at the college. I asked how long i could leave it before i reapplied should i fail and the interviewer said theres no harm in trying again after 6 months.
good luck
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Thanks guys/gals.
Despite the obvious negative feelings, I'm actually feeling more determined.
I'm spurred on by the fact that I've had 3 very positive responses (1 by PM).
Despite the obvious negative feelings, I'm actually feeling more determined.
I'm spurred on by the fact that I've had 3 very positive responses (1 by PM).
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Hi there,
The fact you only need a 'slight improvement' would suggest that you should try again. Next time you will know exactly what is coming (I've done the tests twice and they were very similar) and hopefully that'll be enough to get through.
Waiting 12 months is a pain in the derriere but if you're serious then it's not THAT long. That's the thought process I went through before deciding to reapply.
Good luck my friend
The fact you only need a 'slight improvement' would suggest that you should try again. Next time you will know exactly what is coming (I've done the tests twice and they were very similar) and hopefully that'll be enough to get through.
Waiting 12 months is a pain in the derriere but if you're serious then it's not THAT long. That's the thought process I went through before deciding to reapply.
Good luck my friend
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Hi,
I also failed stage one at Nats, so in the meantime I applied to Eurocontrol and passed all 5 stages, just awaiting my medical now. This is another option you could take, I certainly wouldn't give up! Now you have me wondering was I sent the email by mistake! haha probably not
I also failed stage one at Nats, so in the meantime I applied to Eurocontrol and passed all 5 stages, just awaiting my medical now. This is another option you could take, I certainly wouldn't give up! Now you have me wondering was I sent the email by mistake! haha probably not
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EUROCONTROL isn't an option currently. They appear to be ageist, which I'm sure is against European Law.
I'm only 28 and it riles me that companies take this one-size-fits-all attitude that younger people learn better. Personally speaking, I've never been as primed for learning as I am now. I understand how learning happens and how I learn. I've also learned to take responsibility for my own learning - ie if I don't understand something then I'll make every effort to explain my issues until someone can clear it up for me.
However, life goes on. Nobody owes me anything so I'll refuse to feel sorry for myself and get my **** together for next year.
I'm only 28 and it riles me that companies take this one-size-fits-all attitude that younger people learn better. Personally speaking, I've never been as primed for learning as I am now. I understand how learning happens and how I learn. I've also learned to take responsibility for my own learning - ie if I don't understand something then I'll make every effort to explain my issues until someone can clear it up for me.
However, life goes on. Nobody owes me anything so I'll refuse to feel sorry for myself and get my **** together for next year.
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It's a real shame that the 'screening process' has so very little to do with finding suitable candidates for ATC jobs. Been that way for ever. To me, 'street smarts', 'multi-tasking', 'cool', points more to the ideal candidate than some of the tests the kids are put through today. The ideal candidate would be either a super busy barman, or someone working the cash at fast food place. Only difference: don't drop a drink!
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I have to question NATS selection tests when they can let a potentially good employee slip through the net. I am one of many who have experienced this, and who are now qualified ATCO's.
So to the OP, don't give up!!
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I'm afraid some here are missing the point.
The stage 1 selection tests do not and cannot select those who will make good ATCOs and discard those who will not.
What they do accomplish, however, is test according to a set standard in areas of mental calculation and agility in which it has been shown that successful ATCOs perform highly. Therefore statistically, those who attain a good mark in all the disciplines have a higher chance of successfully completing the training and making a good ATCO.
There is continual feedback into the system as results are analysed and those selected by the system are tracked through to validation. Changes to the selection system are experimented upon. More tests might be added to stage one next year.
I do not believe there is a selection process extant that has a 100% success rate, be it ATC or anything else.
The stage 1 selection tests do not and cannot select those who will make good ATCOs and discard those who will not.
What they do accomplish, however, is test according to a set standard in areas of mental calculation and agility in which it has been shown that successful ATCOs perform highly. Therefore statistically, those who attain a good mark in all the disciplines have a higher chance of successfully completing the training and making a good ATCO.
There is continual feedback into the system as results are analysed and those selected by the system are tracked through to validation. Changes to the selection system are experimented upon. More tests might be added to stage one next year.
I do not believe there is a selection process extant that has a 100% success rate, be it ATC or anything else.
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All of what Gonzo says!
Equally, having passed the selection and college courses doesn't guarantee achieving validation -
I believe the general rule of having 12 months in between applying is so that the applicant will maybe have had more experiences which may stand them in good stead for next time. (I realise that you are 28 - I don't mean to patronise you - some folk who apply are only 18)
And it isn't cheeky to ask for feed back - how else would you know what to improve?!
Good luck for next time
louby
Equally, having passed the selection and college courses doesn't guarantee achieving validation -
I believe the general rule of having 12 months in between applying is so that the applicant will maybe have had more experiences which may stand them in good stead for next time. (I realise that you are 28 - I don't mean to patronise you - some folk who apply are only 18)
And it isn't cheeky to ask for feed back - how else would you know what to improve?!
Good luck for next time
louby
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Did you ever get in to NATS in the end?
I have recently failed the stage 1 test and was gutted but having read this thread I am definately going to spend the next 12 months studying ATC related information so that I can re-apply.
I have recently failed the stage 1 test and was gutted but having read this thread I am definately going to spend the next 12 months studying ATC related information so that I can re-apply.
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Wow, a blast from the past.
My circumstances were such that I didn't end up reapplying. I ended up finding my way back into a more reliable income and I've forged a decent career over the past few years. I'm really happy in my work and current employer and can see that being the case for a good few years.
Sure, I'm not working with aircraft in any shape or form and I still have that pang but I have a reasonable chance that I can afford to train as a pilot (possibly glider or microlight). I had to compromise my career ambitions with the reality that I had got myself and my family into a terrible debt situation and no obvious way out. It wasn't the time to gamble any more.
Your situation may be different. All the best whatever you decide.
My circumstances were such that I didn't end up reapplying. I ended up finding my way back into a more reliable income and I've forged a decent career over the past few years. I'm really happy in my work and current employer and can see that being the case for a good few years.
Sure, I'm not working with aircraft in any shape or form and I still have that pang but I have a reasonable chance that I can afford to train as a pilot (possibly glider or microlight). I had to compromise my career ambitions with the reality that I had got myself and my family into a terrible debt situation and no obvious way out. It wasn't the time to gamble any more.
Your situation may be different. All the best whatever you decide.
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This is interesting.
In 1978/79, myself and a group of friends
went through what, by modern standards, was a basic 'ATCO selection test'.
Out of about 39 selected to do the course, about 93% made it. Some of the 'failures' subsequently 'made the cut'. Of the folks who passed initially, 3 became senior captains with major airlines.
Having spent many hours as an OJTI/examiner, I don't know what the answer is. If I did, maybe I wouldn't be typing this, probably sipping Bacardi in the Caribbean or a large single-malt on the west coast.
I sat, as a 'mentor' with some students who had come through 'The College' with flying colours, but, when presented with a palette of live traffic, couldn't do it.
This is the problem. I read recently that present-day student ATCOS wait about 3 years before they talk to their first 'live' aircraft. I spoke to mine after 6 weeks.
In 1978/79, myself and a group of friends
went through what, by modern standards, was a basic 'ATCO selection test'.
Out of about 39 selected to do the course, about 93% made it. Some of the 'failures' subsequently 'made the cut'. Of the folks who passed initially, 3 became senior captains with major airlines.
Having spent many hours as an OJTI/examiner, I don't know what the answer is. If I did, maybe I wouldn't be typing this, probably sipping Bacardi in the Caribbean or a large single-malt on the west coast.
I sat, as a 'mentor' with some students who had come through 'The College' with flying colours, but, when presented with a palette of live traffic, couldn't do it.
This is the problem. I read recently that present-day student ATCOS wait about 3 years before they talk to their first 'live' aircraft. I spoke to mine after 6 weeks.
Last edited by ZOOKER; 27th Nov 2012 at 23:01.
Way back in the early '70s, long before the FIR was done by FISO Assistants, it was done by ATCO 3's and 4's and they often let us assistants do a bit of talking to aircraft, consequently I spoke to aircraft before my ATCO Cadet course.
Last edited by chevvron; 29th Nov 2012 at 00:36.
