RAF ATC Officer
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Hi
the money is better in civvie street (eventually. 5 years+) and the transition from mil to civ is not as straight forward as you would imagine. Although the same job, both have different ways of operating. (neither better or worse, before anyone starts)
IMO, the appeal of military life has reduced greatly in years gone by as overseas postings seem to be a thing of the past.(not including war zones that is!)
Having said that this may appeal to some people?
Good luck either way
the money is better in civvie street (eventually. 5 years+) and the transition from mil to civ is not as straight forward as you would imagine. Although the same job, both have different ways of operating. (neither better or worse, before anyone starts)
IMO, the appeal of military life has reduced greatly in years gone by as overseas postings seem to be a thing of the past.(not including war zones that is!)
Having said that this may appeal to some people?
Good luck either way
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Aside from the money, there's a whole world of hassle outside work in the military which just doesn't exist in 'civvy street'. Secondary duties become a major pain and constantly wondering where the next posting/detachment will eventually become a drag. I like going home and forgetting about the day's work completely. My other half can't do that.
I turned down the opportunity to become a civil controller when I was 18 to join the military instead. Do I regret it - absolutely not. I was glad I left the RAF when I did, however, because the Service had gone downhill in several ways. Sure, I would be wealthier now(or maybe the ex-wife would have got a better settlement) but I have so many great 'experiences' to look back on and, in the early days, the sense of loyalty was something that has never been matched.
It was a long and (far too) difficult journey to get my civil licence.
I turned down the opportunity to become a civil controller when I was 18 to join the military instead. Do I regret it - absolutely not. I was glad I left the RAF when I did, however, because the Service had gone downhill in several ways. Sure, I would be wealthier now(or maybe the ex-wife would have got a better settlement) but I have so many great 'experiences' to look back on and, in the early days, the sense of loyalty was something that has never been matched.
It was a long and (far too) difficult journey to get my civil licence.
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Most of the RAF ATCOs I've dealt with have been fairly close to being humans just like other ATC people, with the exception of one lady to whom I offered radar control tuition! Turned out she was the SATCO of the unit with little, if any, sense of humour!
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One big difference already alluded to other than the money is that as an RAF officer, you are an officer first and an ATCO second. This means all the other things that are required as well as controlling aircraft. If all you want to do is control aircraft, then go civil. If you want to control and be an officer, lead and go to places where people might shoot at you, join the Air Force.
I have done both - I have never regretted joining the Air Force but I was ready to leave and did so.
I have done both - I have never regretted joining the Air Force but I was ready to leave and did so.
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For a youngster with no commitments and a thirst for fun, give the RAF a go. For someone who has longer term aspirations and a desire for stability, civil is probably the better way to go. Both jobs are interesting and challenging.
PM me if you want to get a close look at the military side. I would strongly suggest you do the same with NATS.
PM me if you want to get a close look at the military side. I would strongly suggest you do the same with NATS.
Up early for a Saturday morning Lon Mil, shift or flying?
Bra, these guys are generally spot on. Mil ATC will give you a wealth of opportunities that you will not get as a civ atco. But your an officer first, controller second. If you're motivating factor is joining the RAF then go for it. If it's controlling then you might want to think about the civil side. As the others have said, there's a lot of other stuff going on on the mil side. You'll be a flight commander, you'll be expected to carry out roles on the station as secondary duties (that's stuff in your own time) and you even have the opportunity for embarking on an all expenses paid trip to Iraq, Afghanistan or the Falkland Islands. Having said that, imho, military controlling is a lot more fun, especially on the area radar side. Good luck
Bra, these guys are generally spot on. Mil ATC will give you a wealth of opportunities that you will not get as a civ atco. But your an officer first, controller second. If you're motivating factor is joining the RAF then go for it. If it's controlling then you might want to think about the civil side. As the others have said, there's a lot of other stuff going on on the mil side. You'll be a flight commander, you'll be expected to carry out roles on the station as secondary duties (that's stuff in your own time) and you even have the opportunity for embarking on an all expenses paid trip to Iraq, Afghanistan or the Falkland Islands. Having said that, imho, military controlling is a lot more fun, especially on the area radar side. Good luck
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Bra,
Tend to agree with much of the above. I've done both. Enjoyed many years in the RAF, before joining NATS. The RAF still offers you plenty of challenging and exciting (not just being shot at) things to do. The chances are there to do many things you will never get a chance to do do in civvy street. However, the level of b......t and nif naf & trivia associated with being in the RAF has grown significantly over the years. That was one of the many reasons I chose to leave whilst I still had a smile on my face.
Civvy air traffic offers you relative stability and you are indeed well rewarded in comparison. The transition from mil to civil ATC is indeed protracted and painful (particularly financially). That may in time become less of an issue - I hope. However, I tend to slightly disagree with my mil chums on one point. Civil ATC may not have fast pointy things returning to the airfield short of fuel or with an emergency - or indeed both.
However, it does have enough trouser-filling moments to keep the pulse rate up! 
Both careers are challenging and rewarding in their own right. Do a few visits to some mil and civil units and form your own impression.
WJMcP
Tend to agree with much of the above. I've done both. Enjoyed many years in the RAF, before joining NATS. The RAF still offers you plenty of challenging and exciting (not just being shot at) things to do. The chances are there to do many things you will never get a chance to do do in civvy street. However, the level of b......t and nif naf & trivia associated with being in the RAF has grown significantly over the years. That was one of the many reasons I chose to leave whilst I still had a smile on my face.
Civvy air traffic offers you relative stability and you are indeed well rewarded in comparison. The transition from mil to civil ATC is indeed protracted and painful (particularly financially). That may in time become less of an issue - I hope. However, I tend to slightly disagree with my mil chums on one point. Civil ATC may not have fast pointy things returning to the airfield short of fuel or with an emergency - or indeed both.
However, it does have enough trouser-filling moments to keep the pulse rate up! Both careers are challenging and rewarding in their own right. Do a few visits to some mil and civil units and form your own impression.
WJMcP
Last edited by Wee Jock McPlop; 1st Oct 2006 at 10:15.
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Hi Bra,
I've done both sides of the house, been in the RAF at Airfields and Area units, and have now transitioned into the civilian side of control.
Like Wee Jock says,
The move now (if you choose NATS) is better, except for a couple of small things:
1. There WILL be a drastic paycut to start at the college of ATC, be warned.
However the financial rewards will more than make up for this. 
2. Even though you would have a military ATC licence, you will still have to do the training. And this would only be towards 1 validation (be it Aerodrome, Approach or Area).
I actually prefer the civilain ATC, purely from a numbers point of view. I find it more of a challange. I get a bigger buzz with the number of planes i control (at the same time) now than the fast pointy ones i used to control (only in large numbers if it was a formation!!).
I can't tell if your thinking about which way to go or are about to leave the RAF and are testing the water? Whatever you decide will be the correct one. Both are good careers, but both have their downsides too!
I've done both sides of the house, been in the RAF at Airfields and Area units, and have now transitioned into the civilian side of control.
Like Wee Jock says,
The move now (if you choose NATS) is better, except for a couple of small things:
1. There WILL be a drastic paycut to start at the college of ATC, be warned.
However the financial rewards will more than make up for this. 2. Even though you would have a military ATC licence, you will still have to do the training. And this would only be towards 1 validation (be it Aerodrome, Approach or Area).
I actually prefer the civilain ATC, purely from a numbers point of view. I find it more of a challange. I get a bigger buzz with the number of planes i control (at the same time) now than the fast pointy ones i used to control (only in large numbers if it was a formation!!).
I can't tell if your thinking about which way to go or are about to leave the RAF and are testing the water? Whatever you decide will be the correct one. Both are good careers, but both have their downsides too!
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This is my current situation:
I am an energy expending 19 year old, A-levels under the belt, University place sorted. I am currently undertaking a gap year in the USA, and I return in August next year. Uni begins next September for me (Broadcast Journalism - Uni of Gloucestershire).
Already failed selection with NATS at the initial testing stage, still I can't complain because it was a great all expenses paid trip to London! Controlling is really what I want to do, I would give anything for the opportunity. Aviation is my life, I was lucky enough to gain sponsorship to get my NPPL last year.
I plan to re-apply for NATS, and also give Eurocontrol a shot. Ideally I would love to be controlling in Civvy street. If I was lucky, I will leave Uni to go straight in. However, if I can't get anywhere with this I may try for the RAF. I am an action/energy thirsty chap and am attracted to some of the opportunities that the force has to offer.
That's pretty much my life in a nutshell. If the above plans fail, I'm becomming a busker!
Bra.
I am an energy expending 19 year old, A-levels under the belt, University place sorted. I am currently undertaking a gap year in the USA, and I return in August next year. Uni begins next September for me (Broadcast Journalism - Uni of Gloucestershire).
Already failed selection with NATS at the initial testing stage, still I can't complain because it was a great all expenses paid trip to London! Controlling is really what I want to do, I would give anything for the opportunity. Aviation is my life, I was lucky enough to gain sponsorship to get my NPPL last year.
I plan to re-apply for NATS, and also give Eurocontrol a shot. Ideally I would love to be controlling in Civvy street. If I was lucky, I will leave Uni to go straight in. However, if I can't get anywhere with this I may try for the RAF. I am an action/energy thirsty chap and am attracted to some of the opportunities that the force has to offer.
That's pretty much my life in a nutshell. If the above plans fail, I'm becomming a busker!
Bra.
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Another sweeping judgement by DwB after 11 lines of text. Bra just said he failed initial testing with NATS - how do you come to the conclusion that he would be better suited in civvy street?!
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There is no mention of his burning desire to fight for the queen, sit in a dusty bunker or be beasted for weeks on end through Officer training at Cranwell.
Bra, if you want to join the RAF then do so. My advice, for what it's worth, is that using the RAF to get the career you want (which you wouldn't exactly get) would be fool hardy and you could find yourself in a very unhappy place. That said, to keep me out of the firing line of pro' RAF brigade, and the argument balanced, you could have the time of your life!
If you have the time of your life though, it will be down to being in the RAF and not because you are a controller in the RAF!
Plug on with NATS and Eurocontrol for now... Good luck mush, it's a great ride!
PS, I failed initial NATS tests too but subsequently loved working for them. Second application gets you alot of brownie points for commitment!
Last edited by choclit runway; 2nd Oct 2006 at 12:48. Reason: Wanted to
Choclit runway, as part of the RAF brigade I wouldn't put you in the firing line, I completely agree. Having read Bra's second post I don't think that his reasons for joining the RAF, at the moment, would be enough to get him through selection, let alone training.
Nothing against Bra, but as I said in my post, you've got to want to be in the RAF first, with an idea that controlling could be a fun thing to do whilst in the RAF. For what it's worth mate, crack on with your degree, try not to kill too many brain cells while you're doing it and then see what you think when you get to the other side. Enjoy!
Nothing against Bra, but as I said in my post, you've got to want to be in the RAF first, with an idea that controlling could be a fun thing to do whilst in the RAF. For what it's worth mate, crack on with your degree, try not to kill too many brain cells while you're doing it and then see what you think when you get to the other side. Enjoy!
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I agree with Whowhenwhy - Bra's motivation for joining the RAF isn't exactly strong.
He did, however, say he was "an action/energy thirsty chap". You don't see many of those sitting around LACC bitching about whether they're 'mobile grades' or not!
(Having listened to some of the BS about military ATC that comes out of some instructors/students mouths at Hurn, I think only people that have done both are able to compare the two fairly!)
He did, however, say he was "an action/energy thirsty chap". You don't see many of those sitting around LACC bitching about whether they're 'mobile grades' or not!
(Having listened to some of the BS about military ATC that comes out of some instructors/students mouths at Hurn, I think only people that have done both are able to compare the two fairly!)
Last edited by Number2; 2nd Oct 2006 at 18:42.
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As another that has gone the mil-civvie route, I agree with the posts before. Motivation to join the RAF has to be strong, Oficer first ,controller second(although sometimes third with some peoples secondary duties
) It is a major commitment signing on the dotted line. Not so easy to just walk away if it doesn't suit. I enjoyed my time in the RAF and aspects of it that were great and not achievable in civvie street.
What you got to look at is Uni for 3 years then if you go the mil option another year...cranwell and shawbury.....all hard work. but a rewarding career. The next stage if you were to switch eventually would almost certainly start with a huge paycut whilst....yes back studying for up to 9-10 months at hurn dependent on what discipline followed by probably 12-24 months training at unit. ATC is a continual evolving career and you will find that most of your life studying comes with the job...Military and civil.
Worthwhile though either way
) It is a major commitment signing on the dotted line. Not so easy to just walk away if it doesn't suit. I enjoyed my time in the RAF and aspects of it that were great and not achievable in civvie street. What you got to look at is Uni for 3 years then if you go the mil option another year...cranwell and shawbury.....all hard work. but a rewarding career. The next stage if you were to switch eventually would almost certainly start with a huge paycut whilst....yes back studying for up to 9-10 months at hurn dependent on what discipline followed by probably 12-24 months training at unit. ATC is a continual evolving career and you will find that most of your life studying comes with the job...Military and civil.
Worthwhile though either way
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Can you join the TA eqv in the RAF as an officer, with specialist skills in controlling, and do that for the "fun and energetic" bit of life... wouldn't be able to do it for a while, whilst training, I suspect, but it gives one pension, one payscale to climb etc....
I'm sure other people on here, (ie those who've been in the RAF, or are in NATS ) will have more of a clue...
James.
I'm sure other people on here, (ie those who've been in the RAF, or are in NATS
) will have more of a clue...James.
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Number 2
life in civvy street = life not in military [nothing to do with ATC]
If Bra isn't dedicated to the RAF, he/she would not likely be suited to it's particular style of life [note: not "lifestyle"]. Ditto the Navy, Army or Scouts [if they have an ATC badge].
You've said the same yourself, so why accuse me of making a sweeping statement?
DwB
P.S. fanks Choclit
how do you come to the conclusion that he would be better suited in civvy street?!
If Bra isn't dedicated to the RAF, he/she would not likely be suited to it's particular style of life [note: not "lifestyle"]. Ditto the Navy, Army or Scouts [if they have an ATC badge].
You've said the same yourself, so why accuse me of making a sweeping statement?
DwB
P.S. fanks Choclit
Last edited by Dances with Boffins; 6th Oct 2006 at 12:53.