RWY heading/RWY track/straight ahead

[machbias]

I know that this is an old one, but could any Air Trafffic Controller clarify the meaning of clearances such as, "fly runway heading" or "fly straight ahead?"

Recently, I was taking off from an airport and the controller issued a "fly runway heading after departure" clearance.
I elected to fly the clearance using the "TRACK SEL" mode on my MCP and this caused a bit of an argument with the check pilot on board.

My understanding is that ATC issues this clearance when it wants me to fly in a straight line from the runway to avoid conflict with other traffics nearby. If I use the "HEADING SEL" mode, I could end up left or right of that straight line and violating some aispace.

Therefore, when ATC issues runway heading clearances, does it want me to fly on the runway heading regardless of drift, or to fly a straight line on the runway track?

Thanks

[terrain safe]

Personally if I say runway heading I want you to fly that heading,any drift either side of the extended centreline is my problem, as the traffic you are given the heading against maybe on the same heading and you tracking may lead to you converging. So always fly the heading, if there is a problem with the wind you will told to fly a track. Hope this helps.

[spekesoftly]

In the UK, if you are instructed to fly 'Runway Heading', and do so, you have correctly complied with your clearance, irrespective of any drift. The trouble is, IMHO, that some ATCOs use the term rather loosely, and in reality expect you to track the extended runway centre line! With "After departure climb straight ahead" there should be no ambiguity. Next time you're given "Runway Heading", especially if there's any significant cross-wind, I suggest you query it with ATC.

[radarman]

Spekesoftly has it about right - do precisely what ATC says and you're covered. IMHO there is alot of confusion these days between controllers and crews because many ATC procedures are stubbornly stuck in the 1960's and haven't caught up with the advances in the cockpit. I bet there are a fair few controllers who don't know when or where a modern jet will be flying headings, and when track. We have problems with A320's announcing they will fly an approach using 'track', but SRG insist we say 'heading'. Likewise our approach plates give the SRA glidepath as 2.8 degrees, but we have to tell pilots to descend for a three degree glidepath. Just like the old days of Meteors and Vampires! Modern flight decks enable aircraft to be flown incredibly accurately - it's about time ATC caught up.

[machbias]

Runway heading ....

Thank you very much one and all.

Summarizing, if I am cleared to fly runway heading and the wind is calm, regardless of what I've selected on my mode control panel, ATC will see my airplane flying on the runway heading, let's say, 152, and on a straight line.

If there is, say, a crosswind of 15 kts, if I am told to fly runway heading, ATC will see my airplane pointing to 152, but drifting left or right if I've selected heading sel on the MCP; if I have selected track mode, ATC will see me fly fly straight, but my heading will be somewhere around 145 or 165 (depending on the crosswind direction, of course), which wouldn't impress some of you.
I've got the idea.

Thanks again

[This is a crisis]

Runway Heading

I quite agree there is a lot of confusion on this one.
If you look in the phraseology section of MATS Part 1, there is actually no approved standard phrase 'fly runway heading'
If an ATCO wants you to go straight ahead (which is usually what they are after in these circumstances) then the approved phrase is 'after departure climb straight ahead' or 'track extended centreline'. IMHO you should never hear the phrase 'fly runway heading'. If an ATCO wants you to actually fly the runway heading he should say 'after departure climb heading xxx degrees'
I have often given the instruction 'climb straight ahead' to have it read back as 'fly runway heading' - and have also been caught out when I have expected the aircraft to climb straight ahead and it has gone veering off in all directions!!

[Atcham Tower]

Mr Crisis is right; "runway heading" was dumped from the phraseology years ago but many pilots and controllers seem unaware of it. I frequently get my "climb straight ahead" read back as "climb straight ahead on runway heading". Doh! Admittedly, only in a very strong crosswind does it make much difference what the aircraft actually flies, but it is about time that this irritating little source of confusion was eradicated. An ATSIN might be appropriate.

[Spitoon]

This one should be simple but it comes up time and time again.

It may not be in the UK phraseology book but runway heading is a heading - point the aircraft in that direction.

Straight ahead is a line you can draw on the map ectending the runway centreline - it's a track to make good. As a controller I do not concern myself greatly with how the pilot may fly that track but I am fully aware of TRK mode in modern aircraft and I know that if the runway has an ILS the localiser back-beam may be a bit of a help.

I guess the problem arises because controllers often use the two terms interchangably when it makes little difference (i.e. little wind or when it's just to get the aircraft going in a general direction) - and in these circumstances I'm not going to know whether he instruction was correctly interpreted and implemented or not. But I do use the terms correctly (OK I admit it, I know I'm not supposed to but do sometimes say runway heading), and when it matters I hope and expect that pilots understand what the clearance means.

Of course speke is right, if you are unclear what a clearance requires you should ask, but for me there is nothing ambiguous about the two phrases.

[Atcham Tower]

Originally Posted by Spitoon

but for me there is nothing ambiguous about the two phrases.

Not for me either, but it seems that there IS in much of the rest of the aviation world!

[ComJam]

Does anyone really expect us to use the Localiser back-beam for C/L tracking once airborne??

[stillin1]

ComJam, IMHO mehthinks you are just being silly now
simplistically - fly runway hdg and / or, fly straight ahead... (when called before Take off) = if you maintain the extended track for the runway the ATCO will be a happy bunny. Maintain heading = maintain heading

KISS, disappearing up one's own bottom is generally to be avoided

Tis the same semantics as affirm Vs affermative, the words change the desired effect remains the same

[terrain safe]

Tis the same semantics as affirm Vs affermative, the words change the desired effect remains the same

Not quite. You are not supposed to say affirmative as it has the same ending as negative and can lead to confusion. One of the recommendations to come out of the Tenerife disaster I think.

[ComJam]

Stillin1, it was Spitoon that suggested it, not me!

[Arthur Fox-Ache]

Seem to remember the phrase "Track extended runway centerline", but can't find reference to it in the book.

Arfur

[stillin1]

Not quite. You are not supposed to say affirmative as it has the same ending as negative and can lead to confusion

My point entirely mon brave! = means the same thing, only one is "correct"

Comjam, bugga, soz you are correct. Humble apologies

[ATCO2]

Rwy Hdg

Hi everyone,

Regarding a runway heading, I have a question for ATCOs. Is that clearance applicable below MVA and in case where the climb gradient is much higher than normal is. Shoud you specify rate of climb in that case because of high ROC and it is due to obstacles left/right?

Thanks in advance

[husky767]

Nice subject to talk about. I am a controller from Kuwait and I advice you to read FAA document 7110.65,there is a good stuff inside it about the phrase " Runway Heading". take care....

[refplus20]

Pilot/Controller Glossary (P/CG)
Effective 2/16/06
Includes Change 1, effective 8/3/06
Quote .... RUNWAY HEADING- The magnetic direction that corresponds with the runway centerline extended, not the painted runway number. When cleared to "fly or maintain runway heading," pilots are expected to fly or maintain the heading that corresponds with the extended centerline of the departure runway. Drift correction shall not be applied; e.g., Runway 4, actual magnetic heading of the runway centerline 044, fly 044. .... unquote.

[2 sheds]

Why would ATC ever want a departing aircraft to fly a runway heading, with no regard to the probable drift?

[choclit runway]

Originally Posted by 2 sheds

Why would ATC ever want a departing aircraft to fly a runway heading, with no regard to the probable drift?

Quite.... it's not in the book so we shouldn't be using it! If a pilot needs to ask the question then the question answers itself. It is confusing so dont use it (although I did last night after a go around)! Wont again though.