And still they try and blame him... Ben Macdui F15s (Merged)
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And still they try and blame him... Ben Macdui F15s (Merged)
Last edited by terrain safe; 7th Feb 2006 at 21:55. Reason: More obvious thread title (cheers Dick!)
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Last I heard was that Spot Williams was on gardening leave living near Dundee. This is truly outrageous. The longest and most expensive court marshal in RAF (if not British) history exhonerated Spot and now two years after that and five after the accident the Board of Inquiry has the temerity to say that he was partly guilty after all. All this after clear evidence given to the CM that the RAF investigators tried to rig the facts to fit their theory.
To most people who are aware of the case, it seems likely that the two F15's were flying visually below cloud well before the crash when the preceding Tornado sortie had aborted due to bad weather in the area.
All controllers who do not know about the case please do a search on here (Spot Williams is a good search entry) and take heed of how you could be stiched up if the authorities choose.
I hold out little hope of reversing this as the track record is poor in these matters. Just remember the Chinook on the Mull of Kintyre.
A I
To most people who are aware of the case, it seems likely that the two F15's were flying visually below cloud well before the crash when the preceding Tornado sortie had aborted due to bad weather in the area.
All controllers who do not know about the case please do a search on here (Spot Williams is a good search entry) and take heed of how you could be stiched up if the authorities choose.
I hold out little hope of reversing this as the track record is poor in these matters. Just remember the Chinook on the Mull of Kintyre.
A I
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F15 Accident
The full findings of the Board of Inquiry can be found on the MOD UK website. I have only had a very brief read and will reply more thoroughly after a proper look at the full report.
In essence, it would appear that the full reporting chain still believe the F15s followed a straight line descent in IMC into the ground. To support their theory, they believe that the eyewitnesses saw Tornados (AXIS formation) and not the F15s. This despite the leader of AXIS formation stating at the Court Martial that the flight was flying in loose trail and not in close formation as the eyewitnesses reported the F15s. The F15s crashed in very close formation. Further to that, AXIS formation landed 30 minutes before the estimated time of the crash.
If the new BoI has persuaded the leader of AXIS formationto change his recollection of their route on the day to coincide with eye witness positions then surely perjury will have been committed? The original verbal testimony of the route was given under oath at the GCM and a map of the route was presented as an exhibit (I have a copy of that map). The only other aircraft in the area that day were the F15s. The eyewitnesses could not have seen the Tornados on the route given in evidence.
One of the crassest questions asked by the chief prosecutor (and there were quite a few) at the GCM was : " If you take away the eyewitnesses, there is no evidence that the aircraft were seen to the east of Ben McDui, isn't that true?"
The original BoI was accused of fudging evidence to fit their theory of the cause of the accident; I hope this latest saga is not a repeat performance. The RAF seems to find eyewitnesses very inconvenient !!
In essence, it would appear that the full reporting chain still believe the F15s followed a straight line descent in IMC into the ground. To support their theory, they believe that the eyewitnesses saw Tornados (AXIS formation) and not the F15s. This despite the leader of AXIS formation stating at the Court Martial that the flight was flying in loose trail and not in close formation as the eyewitnesses reported the F15s. The F15s crashed in very close formation. Further to that, AXIS formation landed 30 minutes before the estimated time of the crash.
If the new BoI has persuaded the leader of AXIS formationto change his recollection of their route on the day to coincide with eye witness positions then surely perjury will have been committed? The original verbal testimony of the route was given under oath at the GCM and a map of the route was presented as an exhibit (I have a copy of that map). The only other aircraft in the area that day were the F15s. The eyewitnesses could not have seen the Tornados on the route given in evidence.
One of the crassest questions asked by the chief prosecutor (and there were quite a few) at the GCM was : " If you take away the eyewitnesses, there is no evidence that the aircraft were seen to the east of Ben McDui, isn't that true?"
The original BoI was accused of fudging evidence to fit their theory of the cause of the accident; I hope this latest saga is not a repeat performance. The RAF seems to find eyewitnesses very inconvenient !!
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The RAF court martial cleared Flt Lt Williams of causing the deaths of the two pilots.
Killed instantly
Killed instantly
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F15 Board of Inquiry Report - Support Group Response
The Support Group response to the BoI report can be found on the Military Aircrew forum under the thread above. Many thanks
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Ben Macdui F-15 Crash _ BOI Report
The RAF's Board of Inquiry Report to the Ben Macdui Crash is available form the MoD Website
http://www.mod.uk/DefenceInternet/Ab...sOfInquiry.htm
An interesting read!!
http://www.mod.uk/DefenceInternet/Ab...sOfInquiry.htm
An interesting read!!
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F15 Board of Inquiry Report - Support Group Response
If you found that interesting, look for the thread as above on the Military Aircrew Forum !
You can find it here
http://www.pprune.org/forums/showthread.php?t=210872
PPRuNe Radar
You can find it here
http://www.pprune.org/forums/showthread.php?t=210872
PPRuNe Radar
Last edited by PPRuNe Radar; 13th Feb 2006 at 12:09.
