Are you a French ATCO based in CDG?
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Alexban
From ICAO Executive Committee
and
Note the phrase is: "English language should be used" not "English language must be used."
From ICAO Executive Committee
Currently there are six official ICAO languages, with Arabic and Chinese having recently been added
Recommendation in Annex 10 recommends that —Pending the development and adoption of a more suitable form of speech for universal use in aeronautical radiotelephony communications, the English language should be used
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which is the other international language of the air that you know of? I would be interested to know about it,as we had no training in other than english (as airline pilots),so maybe we can not fly in those areas where they use the language you know about
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Perhaps I could also learn to speak to the language of every country I fly to in case of similar problems
At the moment that would mean I need French, German, Spanish, Italian, Portugese, Greek, Dutch and Czech! As I already get by in German and Spanish, Personally, I think I'm doing quite well
At the moment that would mean I need French, German, Spanish, Italian, Portugese, Greek, Dutch and Czech! As I already get by in German and Spanish, Personally, I think I'm doing quite well
Think about that : France is a central (big) point not to say THE central point of air traffic in Europe . Wouldn't it be wise to learn a bit of French , knowing that you are very likely to overfly the country and that French controllers and pilots like to use their own language which is one of the ICAO languages unlike German ...
for example.How do they work in Spain or Italy ? Do they always speak English ? I doubt it !!!
I tend to agree with a lot of people on this thread : all these complaints just for the fact that we are talking about France and French people.
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Euskaldun
If you were a pilot, you wouldn't need to even ask that question. It's called spatial awareness.
Your proposals are absolutely impractical. How many years training in each langugae would you make a pilot have before being allowed to fly to another country?
As for Squawk7777, We're not in Latin America here. We're in Europe.
The argument for speaking one language has been made time and again. Your narrowmindedness and refusal to see any other point of view other than your own or labelling it as 'French-bashing' just shows up your ignorance.
If you were a pilot, you wouldn't need to even ask that question. It's called spatial awareness.
Your proposals are absolutely impractical. How many years training in each langugae would you make a pilot have before being allowed to fly to another country?
As for Squawk7777, We're not in Latin America here. We're in Europe.
The argument for speaking one language has been made time and again. Your narrowmindedness and refusal to see any other point of view other than your own or labelling it as 'French-bashing' just shows up your ignorance.
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We're not in Latin America here. We're in Europe.
Other point of view? The few points you mentioned and my replies to them haven't been picked up by you and discussed further. Seems to me you're just scratching the surface to blame a certain language/country.
spatial awareness? It seems like if one factor is missing out of your equation you're unable to see the big picture? C'mon! You can't be for real! What happens when you fly into non-radar environment? The military on UHF? Seperate tower freq's with intersecting runways/approach paths?
Unable to adjust? Certainly not a professional attitude!
Ohcirrej
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And here we go again.
http://www.pprune.org/forums/showthr...hreadid=165980
http://www.pprune.org/forums/showthr...hreadid=147974
And my favorite (there is some good discussion in this one
)http://www.pprune.org/forums/showthr...hreadid=103933
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My first language is not english, far from it. But I still speak very good english. It is sad to see how bad french, italian know their english. If you can't get your finger out and learn a language (english) you should not be in ATC. And for sure not flying.
Learning another language is EASY. Only stupid and lazy people cannot speak at least two or more.
Learning another language is EASY. Only stupid and lazy people cannot speak at least two or more.
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Have you ever speculated how hard the English ATCOs would be to understand if the official RT language was French?
Just a thought, I do agree on the French arrogance issue however.
Just a thought, I do agree on the French arrogance issue however.
Ohcirrej
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Have you ever speculated how hard the English ATCOs would be to understand if the official RT language was French?
('Sup 7777 me old mucker........you be nice now.)
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My first language is not english, far from it
You'd better go and have a few more lessons if you want to write stupid comments like
Only stupid and lazy people cannot speak at least two or more
But I still speak very good english
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carbheatin.....
To be pedantic..[who mee?] it is "Shanwick" aka Shannon/Prestwick Oceanic ans although "Gailic" [sp] is spoken in both Eire and Scotland I [as an ignorant Englishman] don't think that those Celtic languages are the same.
Of course, I stand to be educated/corrected
watp,iktch
To be pedantic..[who mee?] it is "Shanwick" aka Shannon/Prestwick Oceanic ans although "Gailic" [sp] is spoken in both Eire and Scotland I [as an ignorant Englishman] don't think that those Celtic languages are the same.
Of course, I stand to be educated/corrected
watp,iktch
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Hi chiglet,
Notwithstanding the significant traffic SNN centre deals with via VHF prior/post track entry/exit; afaik SNN also has the exclusive communications function for "Shanwick"; our scottish cousins are left to do the real work??
And yes, you are perfectly correct in saying there are some subtle differences between Scots and Irish "Gaelic" (pronounced like a homosexual sex act
), yet these are quite "pedantic" differences like a different spelling for the same word.
Notwithstanding the significant traffic SNN centre deals with via VHF prior/post track entry/exit; afaik SNN also has the exclusive communications function for "Shanwick"; our scottish cousins are left to do the real work??
And yes, you are perfectly correct in saying there are some subtle differences between Scots and Irish "Gaelic" (pronounced like a homosexual sex act
), yet these are quite "pedantic" differences like a different spelling for the same word.
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Just a thought, I do agree on the French arrogance issue however.
My first language is not english, far from it. But I still speak very good english. It is sad to see how bad french, italian know their english. If you can't get your finger out and learn a language (english) you should not be in ATC. And for sure not flying.
Learning another language is EASY. Only stupid and lazy people cannot speak at least two or more.
Learning another language is EASY. Only stupid and lazy people cannot speak at least two or more.
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Ok everybody just chill , or I start doing all my work in broad glaswegian, show all you froggies and feignin sasanachs a hard language to follow.
Carbheatin
"subtle differences between Scots and Irish "Gaelic" (pronounced like a homosexual sex act ), yet these are quite "pedantic" differences like a different spelling for the same word. "
Dont you be starting now
Carbheatin
"subtle differences between Scots and Irish "Gaelic" (pronounced like a homosexual sex act ), yet these are quite "pedantic" differences like a different spelling for the same word. "
Dont you be starting now
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Language of aviation
Interesting thread, this!
Multiple languages on any ATC frequency will, I say again WILL cause loss of situational awareness to flight crews without those specific language skills. Stop, punkt, arrete...
This has lead to several airproxes (read "near disasters") in a major aerodrome just to the east of France, and many more in busy upper airspace in that region.
There must be one language, and one language only in these situations - English.
All involved in international aviation activities in Europe must speak and understand it clearly. To argue otherwise is to invite eventual catastrophe.
I love the French, and their language, but safety must come first, at all other costs.
Yodeller out.
Multiple languages on any ATC frequency will, I say again WILL cause loss of situational awareness to flight crews without those specific language skills. Stop, punkt, arrete...
This has lead to several airproxes (read "near disasters") in a major aerodrome just to the east of France, and many more in busy upper airspace in that region.
There must be one language, and one language only in these situations - English.
All involved in international aviation activities in Europe must speak and understand it clearly. To argue otherwise is to invite eventual catastrophe.
I love the French, and their language, but safety must come first, at all other costs.
Yodeller out.
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Woodpecker
You mention an ASR, if you are operating on a UK AOC, you, as the aircraft commander, are required to personally file a Manadatory Occurrence Report (ANO Article 142, nee 117) with the CAA. If this had been done it would have been forwarded to DGAC France (ie their CAA) for investigation. Did your ASR go to CDG or was the response received from DGAC?
From past experience (investigating incidents, not causing them!) I have found DGAC to be very thorough with their investigation process. Please advise where the response to the incident came from.
Cher Eva San
Formidable!
Amities,
TCAS FAN
You mention an ASR, if you are operating on a UK AOC, you, as the aircraft commander, are required to personally file a Manadatory Occurrence Report (ANO Article 142, nee 117) with the CAA. If this had been done it would have been forwarded to DGAC France (ie their CAA) for investigation. Did your ASR go to CDG or was the response received from DGAC?
From past experience (investigating incidents, not causing them!) I have found DGAC to be very thorough with their investigation process. Please advise where the response to the incident came from.
Cher Eva San
Formidable!
Amities,
TCAS FAN