Military LARS - "Zone" or "Radar"?
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Military LARS - "Zone" or "Radar"?
Can any military ATCOs out there tell me why some military LARS providers use the callsign 'Zone' when talking to LARS traffic outisde their MATZ, but other times 'Radar'?
NS
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Some units have a dedicated controller to handle transits (LARS and otherwise)... C/s Zone, others leave it to the APP controller to manage all by their ownsome... c/s Radar (or sometimes Approach)
No difference to you in the air. but vital when we controllers are liaising inter-unit and need to identify a particular control position? Hope that helps?
No difference to you in the air. but vital when we controllers are liaising inter-unit and need to identify a particular control position? Hope that helps?
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Hmmm, so now we have the old 'approach or radar' question as well!
I was actually thinking of the situation where you call LARS for a FIS with no intention of going anywhere near the MATZ, but the response is still "Zone" - and apparently from the same controller who is providing RAS/RIS to traffic also not going through the MATZ.
I was actually thinking of the situation where you call LARS for a FIS with no intention of going anywhere near the MATZ, but the response is still "Zone" - and apparently from the same controller who is providing RAS/RIS to traffic also not going through the MATZ.
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Absolutely... Approach used to, I believe, differentiate non-radar... but that is less and less the case nowadays.
Some UK military units use the callsign ZONE on their LARS console, it has nothing to do with whether you are flying in their Military Aerodrome Traffic Zone or not... misnamed, possibly, but the unit may have several radar controllers in the team (e.g. Approach, Departures, Director) so the use of "Radar" is thought by some to be confusing? I am not sure there is any firm callsign protocol (but am sure others will correct me if so?)
Suggest, if there is no callsign published, you call the unit by name (e.g. "Shawbury this is G....") and follow their lead?
Some UK military units use the callsign ZONE on their LARS console, it has nothing to do with whether you are flying in their Military Aerodrome Traffic Zone or not... misnamed, possibly, but the unit may have several radar controllers in the team (e.g. Approach, Departures, Director) so the use of "Radar" is thought by some to be confusing? I am not sure there is any firm callsign protocol (but am sure others will correct me if so?)
Suggest, if there is no callsign published, you call the unit by name (e.g. "Shawbury this is G....") and follow their lead?
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Zone or Radar
Not too sure about Pierres answer. I am a 'Zone' controller and am also confused.
Lets see if I can clarify. All transit traffic whether through the MATZ or otherwise at our unit is controlled by the radio callsign XXX Zone, this is true whether the zone position is manned or whether the task is being fufilled by the approach controller. however on the landlines each controller identifies themselves as the position from which they are operating, ie. XXX Zone, or XXX Approach for Zone, or XXX Sup for Zone or XXX Director for Zone.
Where the term Radar is used in the radio callsign is when controlled airspace is involved. For example Brize Radar. From my understanding they have up to three controllers working transit traffic. LARS 1, LARS 2, and Zone. LARS 1 and 2 (if manned) deal with traffic transiting the local area on a north and south dividing line. If a track wishes to transit the class D around them they are transferred to the Zone controller, however all controllers have the radio callsign Brize Radar but when answering landlines refer to their control position either Brize LARS 1, 2 or Brize Zone depending on the manning.
Hope a) thats correct. and b) it helps.
As a pilot if you call all mil units XXX Zone apart from Brize Radar, you shouldn't go far wrong.
:Standing braced for BZN Controllers to shoot my theory down in flames:
Lets see if I can clarify. All transit traffic whether through the MATZ or otherwise at our unit is controlled by the radio callsign XXX Zone, this is true whether the zone position is manned or whether the task is being fufilled by the approach controller. however on the landlines each controller identifies themselves as the position from which they are operating, ie. XXX Zone, or XXX Approach for Zone, or XXX Sup for Zone or XXX Director for Zone.
Where the term Radar is used in the radio callsign is when controlled airspace is involved. For example Brize Radar. From my understanding they have up to three controllers working transit traffic. LARS 1, LARS 2, and Zone. LARS 1 and 2 (if manned) deal with traffic transiting the local area on a north and south dividing line. If a track wishes to transit the class D around them they are transferred to the Zone controller, however all controllers have the radio callsign Brize Radar but when answering landlines refer to their control position either Brize LARS 1, 2 or Brize Zone depending on the manning.
Hope a) thats correct. and b) it helps.
As a pilot if you call all mil units XXX Zone apart from Brize Radar, you shouldn't go far wrong.
:Standing braced for BZN Controllers to shoot my theory down in flames:
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OK, I've got it now:
- if they have a Zone which you want to transit, you call them Radar
- if you're not going through their Zone you call them Zone
I should have known it would be the obvious solution
NS
- if they have a Zone which you want to transit, you call them Radar
- if you're not going through their Zone you call them Zone
I should have known it would be the obvious solution
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If you aren't landing at or departing from an airfield, and are on a VHF frequency, then you are probably going to end up talking to Zone.
(although some posh military airfields call it LARS).
(unless it is quiet and Approach is doing everything).
(or it's Culdrose, which if memory serves me right doesn't have Zone or LARS.).
(or the controller has just come off another consol and can't remember where they are sat - despite the large words above their head!).
Or as Pierre just said, call them by the Airfield name and everyone is happy!
(although some posh military airfields call it LARS).
(unless it is quiet and Approach is doing everything).
(or it's Culdrose, which if memory serves me right doesn't have Zone or LARS.).
(or the controller has just come off another consol and can't remember where they are sat - despite the large words above their head!).
Or as Pierre just said, call them by the Airfield name and everyone is happy!
