Uniforms for NATS STAFF ??
Guest
Posts: n/a
Uniforms for NATS STAFF ??
Management at Scottish are floating the idea of a "dress code" for staff at work.
Two overworked SATCO's have been tasked to set up a working group to have us all wearing suits, ties, etc. presumably Mon- Fri. ( or Mon-Thursday if you are a brainwashed type who dresses down on Friday).
I beleive this will be throughout NATS ,------- and this is not a wind up folks!
Kilts would be a good option for us Jocks @ Scottish Centre, and when asked if anything is worn under the kilt we could reply "No sir , its all in perfectly good working order" (old ones are the best eh?)
Considering NATS is cash strapped, struggling with Swanwick, and short staffed , you have to wonder at this pathetic mentality!
Any comments guys and gals?
Two overworked SATCO's have been tasked to set up a working group to have us all wearing suits, ties, etc. presumably Mon- Fri. ( or Mon-Thursday if you are a brainwashed type who dresses down on Friday).
I beleive this will be throughout NATS ,------- and this is not a wind up folks!
Kilts would be a good option for us Jocks @ Scottish Centre, and when asked if anything is worn under the kilt we could reply "No sir , its all in perfectly good working order" (old ones are the best eh?)Considering NATS is cash strapped, struggling with Swanwick, and short staffed , you have to wonder at this pathetic mentality!
Any comments guys and gals?
Last edited by Ayr_Man; 17th Sep 2003 at 20:31.
Join Date: Jul 2001
Location: Fort Worth ARTCC ZFW
Posts: 1,155
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Shoot, what is wrong with a dress code??? We have one in the states... Your shirt must have a collar ( T-shirts have one. ) and must be clean. No gym clothing except on midnight shifts and shorts must not be frayed. Works rather nicely <G>... That in a nutshell is our dress code.
regards
Scott
regards
Scott
I'm Just A Lawnmower
Join Date: Aug 2002
Location: Over the hills and faraway
Age: 62
Posts: 346
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Scott, your dress code would cause chaos for Ayr_Man and his mates at Scottish Centre
Join Date: Jul 2003
Location: Cheshire, California, Geneva, and Paris
Age: 67
Posts: 867
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
I might be reading too much into this or giving "the management" to much credit for being subtle, but at the moment we can dress how we like ie: shirt and tie, or shorts and stylish Hawaiian shirts if we so chose whatever suits our personality and reinforces our individualism. In the long term NATS wants its staff to conform and to do as they are told irrespective of individuals personal preferances, what better way to break down the individual and manipulate them to conform than to make them wear a uniform to submerge their personality. Some of us are beyond redemption, but it works with students at the college and the dress code can be extended to their operational units and they would not even notice. I may be thought of as paranoid, but it works very well in the military!!!
Join Date: Apr 2000
Location: UK
Posts: 608
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
It's all true.
I saw a memo at work yesterday and it seems likely to happen.
Apparantly, our Prospect rep has already put forward proposals that we will get a uniform allowance.
The figures I heard were £3444pa for ATCO 2's and £2521 for ATCO 3's. Heathrow are likely to get an additional Inner Airport Clothing allowance so that they can continue to use the Duty free shops.
ATCO 1 GS's are likely to be the real winners. Up to £4980pa depending on their previous dress sense. £4980 is a lot of tweed.
The so-called "trendy" young-uns like Point 7 are expected to have to repay anything up to £900. They are that cool. Special cases will be heard for those who are "fashion challenged". Halo comes to mind.
B-L
I saw a memo at work yesterday and it seems likely to happen.
Apparantly, our Prospect rep has already put forward proposals that we will get a uniform allowance.
The figures I heard were £3444pa for ATCO 2's and £2521 for ATCO 3's. Heathrow are likely to get an additional Inner Airport Clothing allowance so that they can continue to use the Duty free shops.
ATCO 1 GS's are likely to be the real winners. Up to £4980pa depending on their previous dress sense. £4980 is a lot of tweed.
The so-called "trendy" young-uns like Point 7 are expected to have to repay anything up to £900. They are that cool. Special cases will be heard for those who are "fashion challenged". Halo comes to mind.
B-L
Join Date: Jul 2003
Location: UK
Posts: 31
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
The only dress code we require in our profession is that we are clean and tidy.
That can mean Jeans and t-shirts, suit and ties.
We are not there as a public face we sit anonymously in front of our radar screens and that is how we like it.
Personal hygiene should be our only consideration when we dress each day.
Moral is so damn low at the moment I cannot truly believe they would waste effort on such a trivial item
That can mean Jeans and t-shirts, suit and ties.
We are not there as a public face we sit anonymously in front of our radar screens and that is how we like it.
Personal hygiene should be our only consideration when we dress each day.
Moral is so damn low at the moment I cannot truly believe they would waste effort on such a trivial item
I'm Just A Lawnmower
Join Date: Aug 2002
Location: Over the hills and faraway
Age: 62
Posts: 346
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
I hope that Prospect is going to tell management to sod off over this issue. Personally I find it a bit pathetic that ab initio trainees have to wear a collar and tie right up until their first validation. Not only are they under pressure to perform, they have to feel hot and stuffy as well. Once they have that important bit of paper, it gives them both the opportunity to perform acts of gross air traffic control and dress like tramps like the rest of us.
The last time I wore a tie to work was for a validation board in 1990 and that was under sufference.
The last time I wore a tie to work was for a validation board in 1990 and that was under sufference.
Join Date: Jul 2003
Location: Cheshire, California, Geneva, and Paris
Age: 67
Posts: 867
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
I have not seen the proposal, is this just for airport staff or for all staff including ATC centres where the public are not allowed. Why are the more senior personnel getting larger allowances?, surely clothes cost the same for everyone. If we are taking about uniforms will air traffic controllers have more gold braid and big wings on their chests to differentiate themselves from other members of staff, although I am sure that there are some egos out there who would love that!!!.
Join Date: Aug 2001
Location: Southampton
Posts: 300
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
The uniform/dress code idea gets floated every few years and then dies a natural death as reality sinks in. When the CAA in Australia became a "Government Business Enterprise" a corporate uniform was proposed and opinion was sought. The staff were overwhelmingly against the idea, most on principle and the rest because they knew it would be inflammatory and ultimately unenforceable. Apart from one grizzled old Ops Controller, who was all for the idea, with one condition - all staff should have a uniform sporting five gold bars.
Join Date: Jun 1999
Location: Suffolk
Age: 65
Posts: 97
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
We could all just come into work starkers then NATS could cut our salaries as we wouldn't have to buy any clothes for work at all.........I might just e-mail that in as an idea to save money.
Join Date: Feb 2003
Location: uk today, dunnunda tomorrow....
Age: 44
Posts: 74
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
dunn-dun-dun-dun-daaaar
Can just see the headline - "Near miss due to excessive Kipper Tie covering screen"......... (no offence Birmingham Tower!)
Do some of these management bods think before they make unrealistic/unpopular proposals? Are they on some performance targets to introduce new measures, hence forgetting the importance of Staff morale etc. when ploughing ahead with this weeks "good idea".
Glad to hear that once I get close to getting into Hurn (come on HR, you can do it!), I won't have to discard my nice comfy suits, nor will I be having to get used to a completely new style of management. Any ex-NHS lot in Nats management then?
Roll on 2005,2006,2007 or whenever it might be..............
(no offence Birmingham Tower!)Do some of these management bods think before they make unrealistic/unpopular proposals? Are they on some performance targets to introduce new measures, hence forgetting the importance of Staff morale etc. when ploughing ahead with this weeks "good idea".
Glad to hear that once I get close to getting into Hurn (come on HR, you can do it!), I won't have to discard my nice comfy suits, nor will I be having to get used to a completely new style of management. Any ex-NHS lot in Nats management then?
Roll on 2005,2006,2007 or whenever it might be..............
Moderator
Join Date: Jul 1997
Location: Europe
Posts: 3,228
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
52xmax
Surely you mean coutture ?? 
Oh no, I've seen much worse spelling than this before !!! 
Todays management cuture
This has been the worst spell in ATC in the UK for sometime
Join Date: Jun 2003
Location: Costa del Hampshire
Posts: 96
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Clothing allowance to be used on “Company-style” threads? – won’t work, especially if different amounts are paid to different grades. The moment any new concept is proposed, but with differing levels of renumeration between grades, then the rumblings of discontent start up across the board. Always has done – always will.
Company-issued uniform would be a genuinely better option. Saves wear and tear on your own stuff; don’t need to think what to wear each day – might even get dry cleaning vouchers as well! And hopefully we can all be mature enough about it not to squabble over who get's the gold braid and badges, and who doesn't!
Company-issued uniform would be a genuinely better option. Saves wear and tear on your own stuff; don’t need to think what to wear each day – might even get dry cleaning vouchers as well! And hopefully we can all be mature enough about it not to squabble over who get's the gold braid and badges, and who doesn't!
Ohcirrej
Join Date: Feb 2003
Location: This is the internet FFS.........
Posts: 2,921
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Uh oh........been rumbled.
Dress code, yeah right. We can't sort out ATC delays, couldn't open a "state of the art" centre on time, morale in tatters, halk of Manchester applying to go to Canada............but we're all goning to look very professional!
Dress code, yeah right. We can't sort out ATC delays, couldn't open a "state of the art" centre on time, morale in tatters, halk of Manchester applying to go to Canada............but we're all goning to look very professional!
Join Date: Jan 2001
Location: I sell sea shells by the sea shore
Posts: 856
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
We've been here before folks.....
There was a cretin, sorry, certain watch manager at LATCC who one day in the not too distant past took exeption to the "dress" of some of his ATCOs and ATSAs (ok they weren't all wearing dresses, but you get the idea
)
Anyway, he decides to put out a note saying that all male staff were to wear a "collar and tie" and smart trousers (not sure what he insisted for the ladies: Dresses?
)
Next day said staff turn up..... wearing the most wonderful collection of colourful Hawian shirts, shorts and other assorted beachwear. (ok, so some wore jeans)
Notice removed. Manager concerned not visible to staff for a few days.
Anyway, two more things come to mind.
1) Didn't the staff at EGNT have uniforms once? I recall a visit there and they all had airline style shirts and black trousers.
2) Since NATS is now part owned by TAG they must have access to a plentiful supply of uniforms.... BAW / BMI / BAL / Easy.... Anyone for an Orange Sweatshirt? No? I thought not.
The whole thing is a bad idea IMHO. Airlines staff all have uniforms depending on their function. WHY? Because they are in the public eye and generate an "Image" for the airline. We aren't (and don't want to be).
Not all professional pilots wear a "uniform" either. Durring flight testing of the B777, shown on CH4 at length, the test pilots and engineers wore Polo shirts and jeans. Comfortable atire for the job they were doing. The same should be true for ATCOs. We know what is comfortable atire for us personally, so let us decide
There you go..... 500 up!
rgds BEX
There was a cretin, sorry, certain watch manager at LATCC who one day in the not too distant past took exeption to the "dress" of some of his ATCOs and ATSAs (ok they weren't all wearing dresses, but you get the idea
) Anyway, he decides to put out a note saying that all male staff were to wear a "collar and tie" and smart trousers (not sure what he insisted for the ladies: Dresses?
)Next day said staff turn up..... wearing the most wonderful collection of colourful Hawian shirts, shorts and other assorted beachwear. (ok, so some wore jeans)
Notice removed. Manager concerned not visible to staff for a few days.
Anyway, two more things come to mind.
1) Didn't the staff at EGNT have uniforms once? I recall a visit there and they all had airline style shirts and black trousers.
2) Since NATS is now part owned by TAG they must have access to a plentiful supply of uniforms.... BAW / BMI / BAL / Easy.... Anyone for an Orange Sweatshirt? No? I thought not.
The whole thing is a bad idea IMHO. Airlines staff all have uniforms depending on their function. WHY? Because they are in the public eye and generate an "Image" for the airline. We aren't (and don't want to be).
Not all professional pilots wear a "uniform" either. Durring flight testing of the B777, shown on CH4 at length, the test pilots and engineers wore Polo shirts and jeans. Comfortable atire for the job they were doing. The same should be true for ATCOs. We know what is comfortable atire for us personally, so let us decide
There you go..... 500 up!
rgds BEX
Join Date: May 2003
Location: Sarf England
Posts: 138
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
BALIX said:
REALLY? Is that just a ScOACC thing? Not much of that happens at LACC! Actually, on second thoughts, I believe MACC have the same code. But that's only because of certain objectionable members of the training department. 
Good to see a unanimous feeling of disgust at such a w@nk proposal. Management should concentrate on the more important things, such as avoiding a mutiny by members of Manchester ACC.
Maybe it's because "management" feel that the strength of ill-will towards them is such that they don't want to be identified by their shirt-and-tie attire. Maybe they want to blend in. But as we're not the customer-facing ones, we should be allowed to wear what we please; whatever makes us most comfortable and prepared for the task of separating aeroplanes.
LTP
Personally I find it a bit pathetic that ab initio trainees have to wear a collar and tie right up until their first validation.
REALLY? Is that just a ScOACC thing? Not much of that happens at LACC! Actually, on second thoughts, I believe MACC have the same code. But that's only because of certain objectionable members of the training department. Good to see a unanimous feeling of disgust at such a w@nk proposal. Management should concentrate on the more important things, such as avoiding a mutiny by members of Manchester ACC.
Maybe it's because "management" feel that the strength of ill-will towards them is such that they don't want to be identified by their shirt-and-tie attire. Maybe they want to blend in. But as we're not the customer-facing ones, we should be allowed to wear what we please; whatever makes us most comfortable and prepared for the task of separating aeroplanes.
LTP
Moderator
Join Date: Jul 1997
Location: Europe
Posts: 3,228
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
I think it's actually "Couture"
Est là-bas Français dans la maison s'il vous plait ?? Merci mon amis.