Pakistan FIR closed

[fox niner]

https://www.theguardian.com/world/2019/feb/27/pakistan-india-jets-shot-down-airstrikes-kashmir


https://cimg7.ibsrv.net/gimg/pprune.org-vbulletin/640x1136/52d0b61e_90d3_49ba_86f3_9515532c232b_5fbb43a8bcbde1fd70660c1 1e91610d3dd5d4e8b.png
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The pakistan fir has been closed off, because the indian and pakistan air force are shooting at each other.

[TPE Flyer]

some interesting diversions on Flight Radar. Aeroflot and Norwegian flights from BKK to name a couple. Though AFL directly over Karachi right now. There is a video posted of an Indian Air Force pilot being beaten like a red headed step child by the Pakistani Police/Army/Civilians.
I expect some international intervention very shortly. Otherwise this could turn into the Worst epsiode of "Neighbours Gone Bad" in history.

[denlopviper]

There is a video posted of an Indian Air Force pilot being beaten like a red headed step child by the Pakistani Police/Army/Civilians.
I expect some international intervention very shortly.

Just saw that video, the pakistan army saved the pilot from being lynched by civilians.

[Longtimer]

Air Canada suspends service to India



Ryan Flanagan, CTVNews.ca
Published Wednesday, February 27, 2019 10:56AM EST Air Canada has redirected one India-bound flight and cancelled another as tensions between that country and neighbouring Pakistan escalate.

An Air Canada spokesperson confirmed to CTV News Wednesday morning that the airline had temporarily suspended its service to India. A flight from Toronto to Delhi was directed to return to Canada, while a flight from Vancouver to Delhi was cancelled.

The spokesperson said Air Canada would resume service to India “once the situation normalizes and we determine it is safe to do so.”Related Stories

Pakistan says 2 Indian warplanes downed, 2 pilots captured (https://www.ctvnews.ca/world/pakistan-says-2-indian-warplanes-downed-2-pilots-captured-1.4314522)
India airstrikes in Pakistan raise fears of escalation (https://www.ctvnews.ca/world/india-airstrikes-in-pakistan-raise-fears-of-escalation-1.4312775)

In addition to the daily flights to Delhi, Air Canada runs four flights a week from Toronto to Mumbai.

Pakistan’s military said Wednesday that it had shot down two Indian planes in its airspace and taken one pilot into custody. Around the same time, the country’s aviation authority announced that it had shut its airspace to all commercial flights.

Hostilities between the two countries have been increasing since a suicide attack in India-controlled Kashmir killed more than 40 Indian soldiers earlier this month.

[Longtimer]

Airlines reroute to avoid Pakistan



19 minutes agohttps://www.bbc.com/news/business-47392300




https://ichef.bbci.co.uk/news/660/cpsprodpb/E658/production/_86986985_thaiairwayscounterinbkk.jpgImage copyright Getty Images Airlines operating flights from the Far East to destinations in Europe are having to reroute their planes away from Pakistan and northern India.

The airspace is closed due to escalating tension between the two countries, following the shooting down of two Indian military jets.

Flights via Pakistan have been cancelled and other flights rerouted.

Thai Airways has taken the more drastic step of suspending all its flights destined for Europe.

With the flight space south of Pakistan becoming crowded, the Bangkok-based airline has not been able to establish alternative routes for its flights.

''By closing the airspace, every flight from Thailand to Europe has been affected. For flights that are going to depart this evening we will call an urgent meeting to consider the impact of such events," said Thai Airways President Sumeth Damrongchaitham.

Singapore Airlines and British Airways are amongst the operators that have had to reroute flights.

[ph-sbe]

Pakistan Air Defence cannot distinguish friend from Foe ?


Maybe the Pakistan Air Defense can, but some group of non-government rebels can't? MH17 comes to mind.

[PuraVidaTransport]

After Malaysia Air 17, there should be no questions or discussions of routing commercial aircraft around any active combat zone, especially one between two old enemies like India and Pakistan. Any airline who continues to fly over or anywhere near that area should have their certificate voided, suspended and torn into tiny little pieces.

[jantar99]

The GC BKK-LHR is above Tibet. So why don't Thai fly to Europe north of Tibet, through China, Kazakh and Russia? It shouldn't be much longer a route.

[WingNut60]

The GC BKK-LHR is above Tibet. So why don't Thai fly to Europe north of Tibet, through China, Kazakh and Russia? It shouldn't be much longer a route.

No majors routinely fly East - West OVER those mountainous areas as far as I know.

Winds at altitude can be pretty horrendous and a forced descent can get a bit tricky.
Though using the winds along the southern edge is certainly common.

Getting far enough north to avoid those problems would probably add 1500 km to the trip.
They would need to pay for that somehow.
And also get approval from the Chinese.

Through the gulf would probably be a better option.

[Dannyboy39]

Isn’t there only 1 routing through that area - L888? Which not just tending to be uncomfortable for passengers but also a routing Chinese ATC don’t like using? Let alone giving it to all this traffic.

[krismiler]

Routing over certain areas of Tibet requires additional passenger oxygen as the terrain won't allow descent ro 10 000' in the event of a depressurisation.

[ironbutt57]

Routing over certain areas of Tibet requires additional passenger oxygen as the terrain won't allow descent to 10 000' in the event of a depressurisation.

most airlines have published "escape routes" to deal with this, some have longer-lasting oxygen generators...there were many routes over eastern Turkey with the same issue..

[Bleve]

From BKK, L888 is a shorter route to Europe than going south through the ME. But it has significant challenges. First there is the very high terrain. Safety heights are above 20,000 ft for lengthy periods. In the event of a depressurisation, you need to have sufficient O2. A 15 minute chemical O2 generator is not going to be enough. Escape procedures to cover a depressurisation or engine failure are complex and will most likely require special crew training. If you have got all those operational & technical details sorted, the final challenge will be obtain Chinese approval to fly the route. So unless an airline has already configured their aircraft, trained their crews and obtained Chinese approval to fly L888, it’s not going to happen (quickly).

[perantau]

If a B777 with fuel for Europe loses an engine over the Himalayas, the driftdown altitude may be lower than the MSA.

[listria]

Just seen a Twitter news release from Thai Airways to say they will be operating European flights via China....no details of the actual route however

[jantar99]

Seems my English is not good enough. I did mean to fly north of Tibet, not above it.

[ironbutt57]

If a B777 with fuel for Europe loses an engine over the Himalayas, the driftdown altitude may be lower than the MSA.

escape routes designated by the airline, or their inflight performance provider

[jantar99]

Pardon me for flooding this a bit :) Looks like at least two Thai flights - to Stockholm and Moscow - took the L888 route today. As well as Azur Air on B763ER Krabi-Moscow ZF7734/KTK7734 is aiming to the same route as well.

If you're keen to know more about the establishment of L888, escape routes etc., google for "L888 flight route", images - there's a presentation from Qantas on a blue backgound covering the creation and early days of L888.

[Anvaldra]

Coming back home. 3 flights departed Peshavar

https://cimg2.ibsrv.net/gimg/pprune.org-vbulletin/1009x603/from_peshavar_529ff73346a940003dbdb6c14f822b10b4353f30.png

[bumpy737]

Just saw that video, the pakistan army saved the pilot from being lynched by civilians.

They should release him tomorrow...

[standbykid]

This one is 'getting out of Dodge' too... I wonder who ordered that up? https://www.flightradar24.com/AWC692/1fa6f90b

[howard meredith]

Interesting Doncaster UK to ISB then ISB back to Lgw?

[DaveReidUK]

Interesting? Why?

Titan are based at Stansted. The aircraft positioned to Doncaster in order to operate a flight to Islamabad, then returned to Gatwick.

The previous poster isn't alone in finding that routeing intriguing. :O

YMMV.

[Hotel Tango]

I don't follow what is so intriguing. Perhaps the return sector was empty and Titan next need to operate the aircraft out of LGW on some other charter?

[Dee Vee]

Airlines reroute to avoid Pakistan


well, I guess that proves it!

https://cimg7.ibsrv.net/gimg/pprune.org-vbulletin/1126x724/w5pxucn_32167f84b172ecdb24b2084b3290e6638cbf2e06.jpg

[ironbutt57]

FIR still a bit empty, flights showing all canceled out of Islamabad until 0900local...

[jimjim1]

https://cimg1.ibsrv.net/gimg/pprune.org-vbulletin/881x768/delhi_tashkent_0febf9c43b01df1e655eb60f1f45fe334611822f.png

https://cimg7.ibsrv.net/gimg/pprune.org-vbulletin/881x767/delhi_tashkent_ok_3175921ca88a77eeca5300f756ae62bcfdce2e54.p ng

[slack]

any international crews layover in either country , BA etc. ? Won't be me.

[EK7777]

Coming back home. 3 flights departed Peshavar

Foreign airlines, SV, EK, QR and a few others requested special permission to leave the country.

Interesting Doncaster UK to ISB then ISB back to Lgw?

The Titan Air B767 was flying deportees from UK back to Pakistan.

[bumpy737]

https://www.reuters.com/article/us-india-kashmir-pakistan-airports/pakistan-re-starting-some-flights-to-fully-re-open-commercial-airspace-monday-idUSKCN1QI4A5

[inducedrag]

https://theprint.in/world/pakistani-airspace-closure-continues-to-affect-worlds-flights-air-india-worst-hit/206524/

[JanetFlight]

Just re-opened it seems...

https://www.caapakistan.com.pk/NOTAMS/NotamView.aspx

[inducedrag]

Pakistan's airspace has been reopened to civil aviation with immediate effect, the Civil Aviation Authority said on Tuesday, following months of restrictions imposed in the wake of a standoff with India earlier this year.

"With immediate effect Pakistan airspace is open for all type of civil traffic on published ATS (Air Traffic Service) routes," according to a notice to airmen (NOTAMS) published (https://www.caapakistan.com.pk/upload/Notams/A0710-19.txt) on the authority's website.

An official at the authority, reached by telephone, confirmed that the change was in effect.

Read: Pakistan extends airspace ban along eastern border (https://www.dawn.com/news/1493725)

Pakistan had on February 26 fully closed its airspace following the violation of its international boundary and airspace by Indian fighter jets. In March, it partially opened (https://www.dawn.com/news/1467600) its airspace but kept it banned for the Indian flights. India had also banned its airspace for flights to Pakistan.

Earlier, Aviation Secretary Shahrukh Nusrat said (https://www.dawn.com/news/1493570): "The Indian government had asked us to open the airspace. We conveyed our concerns that first India must withdraw its fighter planes placed forward. We are ready to open our airspace if India de-escalates."

Pakistan lies in the middle of a vital aviation corridor and the airspace restrictions affected hundreds of commercial and cargo flights each day, adding to flight time for passengers and fuel costs for airlines.

The announcement came hours after United Airlines Holdings Inc said it was extending the suspension of its flights from the United States to Delhi and Mumbai in India until October 26, citing continued restrictions of Pakistani airspace.