Belfast City Airport-2

[DUB19]

Anyone have/know how to view BHD slot report for S20?

[Alteagod]

A postage stamp possibly. I don't think it will be a pleasant read

[DUB19]

A postage stamp possibly. I don't think it will be a pleasant read

Why is that?

[EI-BUD]

I believe that KLM will have extra capacity by way of more flights by the large variant of Embraer

While Aer Lingus drop their 2 sun routes, they will reinstate their 4th LHR rotation most days of the week. Ironically, on some days of the week BA have less seats on LHR than Aer Lingus... BA schedule looks like 4 or 5 daily.

It sounds like Flybe will have the greater frequency on LCY or large plane I should say, though not 100% sure how long that arrangement lasts until. Didn't they put extra capacity onto BHX at some point.

I should thing that 2020 will be more or less the same as 2019...

​​​​​
​​​​​

[DUB19]

All Domestic routes down. Cardiff down 40%. Carlisle performing well working out at 73% LF

Amsterdam up 4% on last year working out at an 83% LF

[mart901]

All Domestic routes down. Cardiff down 40%. Carlisle performing well working out at 73% LF

Amsterdam up 4% on last year working out at an 83% LF

LHR + LCY both up, and BHX, EXT, LBA, MAN and EDI were barely down in fact EDI was only down 61 pax which is like 2 a day.
Not really altogether doom and gloom, the LON market is the most critical really. When you consider how much additional capacity EZY have ploughed into domestic routes from BFS its not so bad all in all.

[DUB19]

LHR + LCY both up, and BHX, EXT, LBA, MAN and EDI were barely down in fact EDI was only down 61 pax which is like 2 a day.
Not really altogether doom and gloom, the LON market is the most critical really. When you consider how much additional capacity EZY have ploughed into domestic routes from BFS its not so bad all in all.


I forgot to look at the LON numbers! My apologies

[mart901]

I forgot to look at the LON numbers! My apologies
They're separate on caa. No need to apologise 👌

[mart901]

https://www.eveningtelegraph.co.uk/fp/loganair-to-launch-flight-from-dundee-to-belfast-city-airport-in-april-2020/

[goldeneye]

Dundee service also confirmed by Loganair.

https://www.loganair.co.uk/our-story/latest-news/2019/new-services-from-dundee-airport

[OneBellEnd]

Good news to see reinstatement of Dundee flights from Belfast, especially for students.

Hope the route proves to be a success for Loganair on this occasion.

[DUB19]

Anyone know the aircraft operating the route? I see London is being operated by an ATR so I’m guessing BHD will be as well?

[goldeneye]

Anyone know the aircraft operating the route? I see London is being operated by an ATR so I’m guessing BHD will be as well?

it’s an ATR42 as well.

[mart901]

it’s an ATR42 as well.
And it'll be a new one at that correct me if I'm wrong... 🤔

[goldeneye]

And it'll be a new one at that correct me if I'm wrong... 🤔

new to LM but I think they are a similar age to some of the Saab 340’s LM already have.

[toledoashley]

Are the 42's not coming from Air France/HOP?

[mullac30]

Are the 42's not coming from Air France/HOP?

Yes, they are around 24 years old, so 5 years younger than the average 340, but about the same age as the Saab 2000s.

[mart901]

Yes, they are around 24 years old, so 5 years younger than the average 340, but about the same age as the Saab 2000s.
I thought they'd put an order in for new 42's?

[Fly757X]

I thought they'd put an order in for new 42's?

Doesn’t sound like they plan to now. In their press releases about their fleet, they’ve mentioned an “ultimate fleet of ATR42-500s” The first 3 have already been acquired from HOP! with the first one (G-LMRA) already painted. They are to get 2 ATR72-600s leaded from BE, however these will be operated elsewhere (GLA/EDI/ABD). Maybe a few years down the line they will, but in the next year or so it doesn’t sound like there is any plans at present for a new order.

[Alteagod]

Would not be surprised if DND becomes an extension of the CAX service operating via BHD

[SWBKCB]

Good news to see reinstatement of Dundee flights from Belfast, especially for students.

Is this a realistic target market for a thin domestic route?

Would not be surprised if DND becomes an extension of the CAX service operating via BHD

Why? Doesn't fit into the schedue of the CAX a/c, but does fit in between LCY for a DND based a/c. Would need quite some re-jigging.

[PDXCWL45]

BHD could be a way of rotating aircraft and crew to and from Dundee meaning they won't have to open a base at Dundee. Eastern do a similar thing with Newcastle for the Anglesey route.

[goldeneye]

BHD could be a way of rotating aircraft and crew to and from Dundee meaning they won't have to open a base at Dundee. Eastern do a similar thing with Newcastle for the Anglesey route.

Dundee has a based aircraft and crew and has done for quite a long time. There is currently a Saab 340 based there for the current twice daily STN. They also have a maintenance hangar at DND as well.

[GAZMO]

Looks like stormy weather causing diversions to BFS
EMA, MAN, EXE, LHR and AMS arrivals diverted at moment

[Alteagod]

Am I wrong but have several airlines in the past not said that APD was hindering them from launching routes from BHD and BFS. Well it will be extremely interesting to see if APD goes if anyone launches anything new regardless of Flybes temporarily financially embarrassing difficult trading position.

[DUB19]

Anyone got an idea on why KLM have sent in a few E190s in the past few weeks? Are these just random a/c changes?

[EI-BUD]

Anyone got an idea on why KLM have sent in a few E190s in the past few weeks? Are these just random a/c changes?
What is odd about KLM sending 190s?
They've often used the larger Embraer on the route..
Either there is demand or they need to use it when smaller ones are getting Winter maintenance...

[DUB19]

What is odd about KLM sending 190s?
They've often used the larger Embraer on the route..
Either there is demand or they need to use it when smaller ones are getting Winter maintenance...

Im sorry if I poorly worded my question, I just meant that the week leading up to a flight it would be showing that it’s operated by an E175 and then the night before it changes to an E190.
Anyway, you answered my question in your reply so thank you

[True Blue]

So I had my daughter booked on the 19.45 Lcy - Bhd last night. She was waiting in the departure lounge at 7.00pm when the departure board is suddenly changed to flight cancelled. No warning emails or text. She was of the opinion that the load was very good. She believes that about 20 were transferred to the EI flight to Dublin, but that travel expenses from Dublin to Belfast would not be covered. Remaining pax to be put up in hotels. We were still at the hotel, close to Lcy, so she decided to return to our hotel. She has been told the hotel cost will be covered. Before leaving the airport, she was re-booked onto the 8.55am flight this morning and issued with a boarding pass. It was only later that I thought of the fact that the pax on the Bhd-Lcy last night were also left in Belfast or else were re-routed at cost to Flybe.

The first flight this morning left Bhd about 35 minutes late, arriving a few minutes late into Lcy. Departure board is changed to flight delayed, info at 9.30am. She heard ground staff on the phone and it seems the Stobart aircraft developed an engine problem. Now they are discussing transferring pax again that were from the cancelled flight to the 10.20 departure. I think by this stage ground staff were taking a lot of flak. So pax from last night's flight were called forward for re-booking. Now staff were dealing with the pax cancelled from last night, pax from the delayed 8.55 from this morning and pax on the 10.20. She was transferred onto the 10.20, but it left about 50 minutes late.

I have no idea of the exact number cancelled from last night, but this one example will cost Flybe a fortune, probably is a good example of why they are in the position they are in.

[Startledgrapefruit]

BHD -LCY diverted in to SEN last night and positioned back to BHD empty

[cuthere]

This happens to all airlines TB.

I had a similar experience with EZY a while back, as well as BE from LCY-EXT last summer. Guess which one coughed up compensation the quickest?

[Alteagod]

Cityflyer may be regretting there decision not to operate LCY BHD when they came so close to launching when BE had there last touch of financial embarrassment.

[BFS101]

New route announcement - Eastern Airway to Teeside, starting March 2020
Source Belfast City Airport Instagram

[mart901]

https://www.belfastcityairport.com/News/EASTERN-AIRWAYS-BELFAST-CITY-AIRPORT-TEESSIDE

[Alteagod]

Always good to see new business

[Startledgrapefruit]

Quite a bit of surveying going on with the old theodolite going on round the cargo area.

[BHD2BFS]

Plans for a new hotel to help accommodate all those passengers left stranded by Flybe

[Startledgrapefruit]

Plans for a new hotel to help accommodate all those passengers left stranded by Flybe
Oh you should pop down to the empire some night and do stand up
Its actually a new aircraft hanger.

[BHD2BFS]

Ah to store all the Dash?

[Startledgrapefruit]

Ah to store all the Dash?
Oh you are killing me
You are funnier than those adverts James Nesbit did for BT

[escaped.atco]

Rumour I have heard is that the surveying is to do with the building of a massive new structure.

Stands 5 to 10 will be turned into a trophy cabinet for the awards that the management team keep winning. As flights and passengers continue to decrease under current management, this can be spun as the airport being more environmentally friendly. This will enable further awards to be won and further management bonuses paid, everyone is a winner! :ouch:

[Alteagod]

It's for a multi story car park and eventual low rise hotel

[GAZMO]

Looks like the end of Flybe going by cancellations and also news on Flybe thread

[EI-BUD]

So without Flybe there would be 9 flights from BHD tomorrow. Would leave only
London LHR
Amsterdam
Carlisle

oops, not good. I'm struggling to see what BHD can do in this instance.
​​​​​

[SealinkBF]

So without Flybe there would be 9 flights from BHD tomorrow. Would leave only
London LHR
Amsterdam
Carlisle

oops, not good. I'm struggling to see what BHD can do in this instance.
​​​​​

Get Loganair in. Wonder if Eastern and Blue Islands would become Loganair franchises?

[True Blue]

I recommend you have a close at the ability of Eastern or Loganair to do much here? How many aircraft has Eastern in service? Lot of wishful thinking going on.

[Skipness One Foxtrot]

Loganair are maxed out dealing with growing pains of digesting bmi regional and re-fleeting with ATRs. I am not sure jumping into too many of these ex flybe markets would be wise, best to cherry pick a few. Of course it was Loganair who opened GLA/EDI-SOU in the first place before the non Scottish routes were given to Manx and it’s successors.

[rhutch28]

I recommend you have a close at the ability of Eastern or Loganair to do much here? How many aircraft has Eastern in service? Lot of wishful thinking going on.

Eastern have 2 x ART 72, 6 x Jetstream 41, 1 x Embraer 170, 2 x Embraer 145 & 4 x Saab 2000
15 in total

[True Blue]

all in service?

[SealinkBF]

I recommend you have a close at the ability of Eastern or Loganair to do much here? How many aircraft has Eastern in service? Lot of wishful thinking going on.

Not wishful thinking in that sense, just a desire that the essential routes are saved and maybe have a new force in domestic travel that will be sustainable. Flybe planes and crew will be available but of course have no idea about leases etc. So that is definitely wishful thinking !

[EI-BUD]

Right now Corona Virus is taking a huge toll on airlines, so airlines like Loganair, Eastern etc will NOT be in any way interested in launching any new routes, they will be preserving cash at all costs. This is a very serious situation.

I'm not convinced easyJet well even augment their BFS flying at this time, instead they'll enjoy fuller aircraft on low capacity for the market at high prices. Once the CV issue goes away or 'normalises' well see easyJet doing more impacting the case for new operators ex BHD.

[SealinkBF]

Right now Corona Virus is taking a huge toll on airlines, so airlines like Loganair, Eastern etc will NOT be in any way interested in launching any new routes, they will be preserving cash at all costs. This is a very serious situation.

I'm not convinced easyJet well even augment their BFS flying at this time, instead they'll enjoy fuller aircraft on low capacity for the market at high prices. Once the CV issue goes away or 'normalises' well see easyJet doing more impacting the case for new operators ex BHD.

Loganair taking on 16 Flybe routes according to press.

[840]

There's no guarantee that the Flybe aircraft will remain in Europe, never mind this corner of Europe.

The best hope may be that Stobart now have 5 aircraft spare and BHD may be an attractive option for them, if they can get Aer Lingus agreement to operate as Aer Lingus Regional. However, there are a few problems in terms of getting Stobart in. Other airports in the UK and Ireland will also be eyeing them and in particular, Knock can offer them the opportunity to operate with the known EI Regional brand and freed-up routes to Manchester and Birmingham that are cash cows with no nearby competition. Also, Aer Lingus mainline will want a replacement operator on DUB-SOU and DUB-CWL for the 100K+ connecting passengers and getting Stobart is the easiest immediate solution.

And, of course, as EI-BUD said, it may be for the next few months that operators will lose less by leaving aircraft on the ground.

Most other potential operators are already at BFS and will have no desire to take the extra cost of operating at both airports.

[bean]

With what aircraft, which routes
I'm not trying to be rude; just curious

[GAZMO]

Loganair to take over INV and ABZ

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-northern-ireland-51749152

[EI-BUD]

There was an 0715 Flybe flight to AMS on the departures board at BHD, which surprised me, assuming that had been a mistake? Not that it actually matters now.

[db7]

Aspire Lounge is closed equipment moved to BA Lounge. BA lounge taking Priority Pass passengers

[Alteagod]

I understand this was all pre planned last year between BA and the GHA at BHD.

[Startledgrapefruit]

PR shots for Eastern on BHD faceybook

[SWBKCB]

PR shots for Eastern on BHD faceybook

First Teesside flight today

[elle may clampit]

The Aspire lounge closing has indeed been planned for sometime and while I haven't been in BHD recently I hear the main Food Village, Georges Market, and Starbucks have closed also due to the lack of passengers. Is this true?

[virginblue]

The arrivals/depatures website is a depressing sight - less than 10 flights spread over the whole day... (well, it could be worse, for a real shocker, head over to the EXT website...)

[GAZMO]

Anyone know the numbers on the first flight to/from Teeside today

[panpanpanpan]

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-northern-ireland-51809048

This doesn't look good! The fallout continues and I suspect will have a wider impact for some considerable time.:sad:

[Tinwald]

The arrivals/depatures website is a depressing sight - less than 10 flights spread over the whole day... (well, it could be worse, for a real shocker, head over to the EXT website...)
Try the Rock's as well!

[SealinkBF]

I'm still surprised that BHD still has no takers for Flybe's GLA, EDI, MAN, LC,Y SOU, EXT and BHX routes. Where they actually profitable?

[Startledgrapefruit]

I'm still surprised that BHD still has no takers for Flybe's GLA, EDI, MAN, LC,Y SOU, EXT and BHX routes. Where they actually profitable?
Heard announcement Thursday
But then again was told it's easyJet !

[Letsflycwl]

I'm still surprised that BHD still has no takers for Flybe's GLA, EDI, MAN, LC,Y SOU, EXT and BHX routes. Where they actually profitable?

Don’t forget CWL too

[lbalad]

Leeds/Bradford too.Think they were due to go 5 x daily on the Belfast City route.Certainly every flight I have been on over the last 3 years appeared full,doesn't mean it was making money though.No clue as to who may take on this route.

[virginblue]

Well, the problem is that there are simply not many airlines around that could offer flights. Who is left? Loganair, Eastern Airways. That's it. They are small operators with mostly 30-50 seat equipment. Maybe Jet2 for LBA as they served the route in the past (although domestic flying is not really part of their business) and BACF for LCY.

easyjet serves GLA, EDI, NCL, BHX, BRS, IOM, LPL, STN, LGW, LTN, MAN from BFS. Short of moving their base to BHD, why should they offer those destinations from BHD instead of ramping up frequencies at BFS? The fact that Loganair has taken up INV and ABZ from BE, but not their core markets GLA and EDI shows that there is little point for them to serve destinations offered by a LCC from BFS.

[Startledgrapefruit]

Cafe Nero will be taking over from Costa.

[Sharklet_321]

Is it sustainable in the long term to have two airports in Belfast? I mean the likes of Manchester, Edinburgh etc etc with only one...

[Startledgrapefruit]

There only is one airport in Belfast..... The other is outside...!

[GAZMO]

Sharlet
Its a debate which we have had for a long time...…...don't need to start it again. Three airports in NI for population of 1.8millon!!!

[Alteagod]

Can we just role back from idle chit chat and negativity for a little bit longer. Hundreds of staff are now jobless or laid off at the minute and having to take onboard the immense challenge that is a head for us all at BHD. Please can we try and be a little less snowflake and "it's all about me" kind of attitude and look at the bigger picture when posting our thoughts and muses about the future of the City Airport. Aviation is always described as a family, let's show some support to our fellow family.

[Startledgrapefruit]

Can we just role back from idle chit chat and negativity for a little bit longer. Hundreds of staff are now jobless or laid off at the minute and having to take onboard the immense challenge that is a head for us all at BHD. Please can we try and be a little less snowflake and "it's all about me" kind of attitude and look at the bigger picture when posting our thoughts and muses about the future of the City Airport. Aviation is always described as a family, let's show some support to our fellow family.
OK understood !

[panpanpanpan]

https://www.itv.com/news/utv/2020-03-09/staff-at-airport-face-temporary-lay-off-following-flybe-collapse/

Think this backs up Alteagod's post. The cynic in me would say this has played into Swissport's hands to a certain degree - get rid of all the workers on decent contracts and replace them with zero hours staff when the airport picks up again.

Unfortunately there are a number of posters on here who seem to take delight in the demise of an airline or route at one or other of the local airports, maybe they forget there is a human element attached or maybe they don't care.

[Cozy F]

I’ve heard smartest money on any backfill is Ryanair re-build on Stansted, Manchester plus new East Midlands and left-field Exeter or Bournemouth! Also new EZY op on Belfast Leeds. All in planning but deferred pending eye of COVID-19 storm..

[virginblue]

I’ve heard smartest money on any backfill is Ryanair re-build on Stansted, Manchester plus new East Midlands and left-field Exeter or Bournemouth! Also new EZY op on Belfast Leeds. All in planning but deferred pending eye of COVID-19 storm..

From where - BFS or BHD? easyJet certainly from BFS - Ryanair from BHD?

[Cozy F]

Not sure TBH. In context I’d say likely all BFS. :confused:

[Cozy F]

Indeed - ultimately time will tell. Speculation is inherently just that until something is formally announced. Simply offered this info on this forum as the ‘smartest’ speculation/rumour because it seemed more credible in theory and source than some of the other stories doing the rounds - like a rumoured imminent announcement from a turboprop airline seemingly about to launch a host of new regional routes in the wake of Flybe’s failure, despite the current economic environment and the fact that the same airline has only just issued a public warning that they urgently need to cut staff and slash costs purely to survive.

[Startledgrapefruit]

Best time to do it
New routes
Airport deals
New passengers
And nothing wrong with props

[GAZMO]

From BBC website
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-northern-ireland-51826307

[OneBellEnd]

The story inside is BA due to shortly retire.

[BHD2BFS]

Now I know I’ll get shot down for saying this and I hope it doesn’t happen as I enjoy travelling through BHD but is this now the time for BFS to offer BA what it wants and make amends with EI to return BFS?
invest heavily with a possible new domestic pier and a better business lounge and make Belfast have one airport?

after brexit is final will EI even be able to fly internally in the UK also

[DUB19]

Now I know I’ll get shot down for saying this and I hope it doesn’t happen as I enjoy travelling through BHD but is this now the time for BFS to offer BA what it wants and make amends with EI to return BFS?
invest heavily with a possible new domestic pier and a better business lounge and make Belfast have one airport?

after brexit is final will EI even be able to fly internally in the UK also

EI considering ORK-US, BFS will need to get on EI’s good side in order to achieve flights like this. I think the logical option is, as you said, for Belfast to have one, good, airport.

[allan1987]

From Belfast LiveFlybe support motion passed at Belfast City Hallhttps://www.belfastlive.co.uk/news/belfast-news/flybe-support-motion-passed-belfast-17901170

[EI-BUD]

Pprune is full of "armchair CEOs". I'll admit I read that on another thread but it is quite apt!

People who see things from their own point of view and in their opinion that is the only logical option. People who have heard from a friend of a friend and now it is suddenly 100% accurate and what is definitely going to happen.

If those routes were successful from Harbour, it doesn't necessarily translate to a success from Aldergrove. A London City route for example would be competing against Gatwick and Stansted whereas from Harbour it was primarily aimed at business passengers looking city to city connections. Time will tell on all developments I suppose, I will be amazed if there's much movement until this virus has burnt itself out. Its been a double whammy for Harbour, not an easy comeback. Having said that, do any of the oldies here remember when Capital went bust a long time ago, that was the vast majority of Harbour business at that time - early 90s I think? Out of the ashes came the forerunner to FlyBe, well managed in the early days and then a few wrong decisions and the rest is history.

Nice airline memory panpanpanpan. Capital collapsed in early 1990s from memory. They were very much a pace setter with lead in fares of £29 on way to LTN and LBA, possibly flexible pricing and £19 BHD-DUB which never actually took off due to the collapse. I recall their 2 146s were G-OSUN and G-OSKI. The pilots and cc referred to them as Gosun and Goski rather than as a reg!

​​​​​I think the main likely outcomes will land somewhere like this for Belfast in the wake of Flybe's collapse;

Stobart will emerge with an operation on those routes that were most attractive. I'm guessing BHX, MAN, LCY and potentially LBA. The only vehicle available to them in terms of brand now would be Aer Lingus Regional.
easyJet make a bold decision to consolidate and solidify there Belfast operations and open up BHD, with a single unit based and most routes to/from GB operated from bases over there. This would mitigate the impact of curfew and ops. While at the face of it BHD hadn't been attractive to easyJet, the prospect of wrapping up the market for themselves has to be of considerable interest.
Eitherway, I suggest easyJet will pick up something in this debacle from BFS (or BHD) LBA and SOU make perfect sense.
Aer Lingus and BA imho will step up capacity on LHR at the right juncture
I don't see any FR upside here

Remember their are industry data sources showing yield and volume that airline buy into. So airlines don't go blindly into this. Flybe did have considerable corporate business.

On easyJet their dilemma competing with a high frequency prop operation is can we mount a frequent enough schedule viable operation to appeal to the business traveller, this is often a barrier to entry, but now they have the opportunity to overcome that.
​​​​
Nothing will commence I'd suggest until late April or start of May. Current flying is a blood bath with aircraft flying around empty, this has been well publicised in the various media, so right now is not a good time to launch. However, if BHD is as attractive as has been suggested (by BHD and other sources in the media) I suspect an announcement will come within weeks. I've no exacting info but the above is my assessment of the potential outcomes. Call me an armchair CEO, but I do have experience in the industry so I'm considering all likely outcomes. I'll be watching with interest. Best of luck to all those ex-Flybe staff or indeed ground staff who have lost their jobs.

[Expressflight]

EI-BUD

I'd go along with your appraisal of the situation, particularly the likely start date of any planned BHD operations. It would be crazy to commence flights in the near future with so much uncertainty of where this will go and a little patience may pay dividends.

[Startledgrapefruit]

Hopefully !!
Ah. Capital airlines. There boss , I think it was Adrian Thompson came in one day on his Brown Air Gulfstream.
We were all excited to get on board to see the luxury jet
Then we heard Dart engines !

[Sharklet_321]

EI-BUD, so for example SOU was operated at between 3 and 4 flights per day by Flybe. What frequency do you think easyJet would work on for SOU if they were to ever do it?

[EI-BUD]

Sharklet321, imho I think easyJet if they flew SOU would be daily perhaps with a second some days. I can't see them doing more than that. I'm guessing SOU will be giving serious incentives and they already have easyJet on the ski route. SOU is huge for cruise connections which now is a disaster and then business travel. Daily by easyJet would be better than nothing.

The likes of Eastern would be skeleton schedule at huge prices, if history serves as a guide elsewhere....
​​​

[The Nutts Mutts]

Is an announcement still expected tomorrow as alluded to a few days ago? The poster who reported it seemed to think it was an easyJet announcement, so I guess that may mean it's not necessarily going to be for BHD.

[SWBKCB]

The likes of Eastern would be skeleton schedule at huge prices, if history serves as a guide elsewhere....

The recent launched routes do suggest the leopard might have changed it's spots...

[OneBellEnd]

They might have to re-discover their spots - one paying punter on Monday's BHD-MME inaugural!

[mart901]

They might have to re-discover their spots - one paying punter on Monday's BHD-MME inaugural!

£154 is the cheapest return on the route.

[Wanted Deal or Ailve]

I'm sure the £154 will appeal greatly....to the regular stag/hen parties travelling between Belfast & north east of England …:bored:

[SealinkBF]

Surely this is a chance for Loganair to get back to GLA, EDI and MAN! Aircraft pending of course

[DUB19]

Eastern Airways launching BHD-SOU

[LBIA]

Eastern Airways launching BHD-SOU

Southampton to Belfast City route to operate 6x weekly (Mon, Tue, Wed, Thu, Fri & Sun) flights commencing from March 23rd using either the Southampton based Embaer 145 or 170.

EZE7840 = SOU 10:30 - BHD 12:15
EZE7841 = BHD 12:50 - SOU 14:35

[Sharklet_321]

Hopefully it will be the 170 to allow for slightly lower fares

[allan1987]

checked flights on easten website BHD to SOU will be on ATR 72-600 im guessing G-IACY or G-IACZ

[True Blue]

As these, what are small airlines, announce all these new routes, money will be flying out the door. The biggest issue facing almost all businesses is cash flow. It is what brings most businesses down, lack of it. Money flying out the door before money starts coming in. And then, is that money coming in profitable? These two airlines are expanding at a serious rate, I hope they know what they are doing. And before you have a go at me, plenty of businesses far bigger than these two have failed due to cash flow. Don't assume those at the top know what they are doing, evidenced by plenty of other businesses that have gone.

[SealinkBF]

As these, what are small airlines, announce all these new routes, money will be flying out the door. The biggest issue facing almost all businesses is cash flow. It is what brings most businesses down, lack of it. Money flying out the door before money starts coming in. And then, is that money coming in profitable? These two airlines are expanding at a serious rate, I hope they know what they are doing. And before you have a go at me, plenty of businesses far bigger than these two have failed due to cash flow. Don't assume those at the top know what they are doing, evidenced by plenty of other businesses that have gone.

But I think Flybe were spectacularly badly run. I know I am like a broken record but that spat with Loganair was stupidity on a level I have never seen before. Business acumen was not their strong point.

And I think Loganair and Eastern are managed better, hence why we haven't seen a wholesale takeover of Flybe routes

[SWBKCB]

As these, what are small airlines, announce all these new routes, money will be flying out the door. The biggest issue facing almost all businesses is cash flow. It is what brings most businesses down, lack of it. Money flying out the door before money starts coming in. And then, is that money coming in profitable? These two airlines are expanding at a serious rate, I hope they know what they are doing. And before you have a go at me, plenty of businesses far bigger than these two have failed due to cash flow. Don't assume those at the top know what they are doing, evidenced by plenty of other businesses that have gone.

Let's look at what LM and Eastern are actually doing - as reported by Saabdriver on the Loganair thread

A shedload of under-performing routes have been taken out in the last two months - NWI/MAN, EMA/BRU, GLA/SEN, ABZ/SEN, NCL/BRU - frees up five E135/145s in all.

So they've merely moved resource from poorly performing routes. The new routes launched are mostly (if not all) from existing bases. Hardly profligate.

For Eastern, they've re-instated the leases of two a/c which have been parked up for months - so probably not expensive - and are making better use of the the two under-utilised EMB-145's. A new booking engine, yes.

[Alteagod]

Too raw for many at the minute with the monumental jobs at risk to raise this at this stage.

[mart901]

Southampton to Belfast City route to operate 6x weekly (Mon, Tue, Wed, Thu, Fri & Sun) flights commencing from March 23rd using either the Southampton based Embaer 145 or 170.

EZE7840 = SOU 10:30 - BHD 12:15
EZE7841 = BHD 12:50 - SOU 14:35

Saturday flights now on sale from 11th April.

[True Blue]

Who owns BHD now?

[mart901]

Who owns BHD now?

3i own it I believe

[True Blue]

This is not a good position for Bhd at all. Government now saying they don't expect this virus to peak until maybe May/June.
3i invest for capital gains and profits. It will be a long time before Bhd ever recovers to near current levels, if at all. 3i will be considering this and if they can't see a reasonably quick possibility of a return to near normal, they will be considering their position. Currently, Bhd probably doesn't carry a value anywhere near what they paid for it. Economic reality is flowing over us like a major storm and it is not easily stopped. It is all very well bold statements about re-placement services from Bhd, but who is going to take that chance now? Many airlines are now in a battle to survive, talk of expansion just stupid.

Capitalism has given most of us a very good life over many years now, but it doesn't always behave well. Now is one of those times and at the end of this, there will be many casualties. A process of renewal, but not nice. It is something I give warnings about every day.

[West Brit]

3i sell off BHD with agreement from Harhour Commissioners to redevelop as 'urban village'. All Belfast aviation is then concentrated at one site. An un-restricted site. Infrastructure is put in place to serve BFS and significant redevelopment takes place.
5 years down the road BHD is forgotten about, and we have one big airport that makes life easier for most.
Alternative is 2 airports with one major operator each no significant developments taking place, and both operators walking on thin ice hoping that their major operator doesn't go under.

[Sharklet_321]

3i sell off BHD with agreement from Harhour Commissioners to redevelop as 'urban village'. All Belfast aviation is then concentrated at one site. An un-restricted site. Infrastructure is put in place to serve BFS and significant redevelopment takes place.
5 years down the road BHD is forgotten about, and we have one big airport that makes life easier for most.
Alternative is 2 airports with one major operator each no significant developments taking place, and both operators walking on thin ice hoping that their major operator doesn't go under.

Inclined to agree with the spirit of this. Far better to have a thriving strong airport with a whole range of different offerings rather than two spread very thinly with limited investment because of the strain.

[True Blue]

Maybe I'm just a realist. You are entitled to your opinion, so am I. I would be interested to hear how you see Bhd recovering from here to close to where it was before Flybe went under. What would your plan be?

[mart901]

Tell you what. Let's think about it another way. What would happen to BFS if EZY went bust. Now I can't see it happening, but just think about the coverage of BA this last 24hrs.

[True Blue]

Why not answer the first question first?

[True Blue]

Thank you for an honest answer. 3i will be thinking the same. Problem is they might not have the patience to wait for that recovery. Therein lies the problem.

[Alteagod]

I see the Stobart Embraer has positioned into BHD this evening

[DUB19]

I see the Stobart Embraer has positioned into BHD this evening
I’m guessing it’s something to do with their administration.

[Alteagod]

How would that work?

[allan1987]

Im not sure why EI-GHK has move back to belfast as Connect Airways Group have been in administration since 10th March,
Stobart Air and the Aer Lingus Regional routes have not affected, unless they are looking at new franchise partner since collapse of Flybe,either Eastern Airways or Loganair.
Also could be that Stobart Air might need the room in Dublin, there is 1 ATR 42-600 getting painted white at the Moment and 2 ATR 42-600 Maintenance in Denmark and Sweden

[Wanted Deal or Ailve]

Some balloon on Twitter has suggested the following - "What about Aer Lingus Regional coming into BHD to operate Manchester, Birmingham, Leeds, East Midlands, Glasgow, Edinburgh and possibly a London route. Obviously when things settle down of course" - It never ceases to amaze me how naïve people are with regards to aviation.

[Alteagod]

The sentiment is sincere and in different times probably a sound suggestion but just at the moment what crazy mind altering mad s h one tea drugs are they on in fact what planet are they on? Dont they know we are all going to die as Mother Nature resets the plant Earth with Covid 19

[CaptJ]

Is the Q400 economical though? perhaps compared to a jet, but not compared to an ATR.

[allan1987]

Eastern Airways holds off planned new route announcementsEastern Airways has today confirmed Southampton Airport to Dublin Airport among 7 new routes planned for announcement across its Southampton and Belfast City airport networks,
but has held off while the Covid-19 restrictions peak.


https://www.easternairways.com/news/72/eastern-airways-holds-off-planned-new-route-announcements

[Sharklet_321]

easyJet will be operating 5 flights a day from W20/21 between BFS and NCL. Will this affect BHD-MME demand?

[Jamesair]

There is only one day a week that has 5 flights daily BFS/NCL The schedule is:-
Mon....4x daily
Tues...2x daily
Wed...2x daily
Thur...3x daily
Fri.....4xdaily
Sat. ..1x daily
Sun...5x daily

[highwideandugly]

NI..UK. essential link!

[Startledgrapefruit]

Think there is another RE EMB190 in today .

[Alteagod]

Loganair have canned the CAX from 27th Mar u.f.n.

[buzz_hornet]

BA pulling out permanently according to BBC

[globetrotter79]

BA pulling out permanently according to BBC

do you have an actual bbc webpage link for this?

[cessnarocket]

do you have an actual bbc webpage link for this?
I've just been through the entire BBC website and cannot find any info

[Startledgrapefruit]

I've just been through the entire BBC website and cannot find any info
On the daily updates
Says EI doing and accomodating BA pax

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/live/uk-northern-ireland-52158868

I know the BA lounge merged with the Aspire lounge as this all started to kick off so we will have to wait and see

[cessnarocket]

On the daily updates
Says EI doing and accomodating BA pax

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/live/uk-northern-ireland-52158868

I know the BA lounge merged with the Aspire lounge as this all started to kick off so we will have to wait and see
You are correct just found it sad times. Some businesses will recover from this some won't unfortunately.

[Startledgrapefruit]

You are correct just found it sad times. Some businesses will recover from this some won't unfortunately.
Might only be until things get back to normal !

[cessnarocket]

Might only be until things get back to normal !
The BBC is reporting it within the article as permanent

[OneBellEnd]

Afraid there’s every chance it might simply be history repeating itself.

BA operated a Heathrow Shuttle service from Aldergrove forever, and overnight summarily executed it under the cover of 9/11. Good day to bury bad news and all that..

When BA made a return to Belfast and Dublin a number of years back, after they bought British Midland, they started up with virtually the same schedule and capacity on both BFS and DUB into Heathrow. Now the UK air tax has directed so many travellers south from NI to DUB that the BA op out of Dublin is easily twice the size of the one out of Belfast!

No doubt BA will be looking at their whole network - like every airline - in these unprecedented circumstances. If a route is already shrinking for them like Belfast Heathrow, and they can’t get any direct Government support to help keep it operating because of other airlines serving Belfast London, it may indeed suit them to up sticks and go. After all there hasn’t been as politically ready made and watertight an excuse to abandon anything, well since they last left NI eighteen and a half years ago! 😳

Sorry state of affairs indeed.

[BCALBOY]

There has been no announcement from BA ,as yet , indicating they will scrap the route permanently.
they have already suspended domestic routes from Heathrow to Newcastle , Leeds, Inverness and there has been no suggestion they wouldn't return at some stage.Belfast has been taken off sale from 13-30Apr but seats are still on sale from 01May.This would suggest it's a temporary measure and the BBC NI reporter has misinterpreted the situation.

On the other hand , there are political sensitivities regarding the "National Carrier" ditching the link between N.I. and the UK capital. The last time BA pulled off Aldergrove to Heathrow was in the aftermath of the horrific events of 9/11. If BA did want to get off the route , the current situation with Corona would be an opportunity to do so with minimum political flack

we will have to await either official confirmation from BA or Belfast City Airport , or for the thoughts of an insider from either of these.

[CCR]

There has been no announcement from BA ,as yet , indicating they will scrap the route permanently.
they have already suspended domestic routes from Heathrow to Newcastle , Leeds, Inverness and there has been no suggestion they wouldn't return at some stage.Belfast has been taken off sale from 13-30Apr but seats are still on sale from 01May.This would suggest it's a temporary measure and the BBC NI reporter has misinterpreted the situation.

On the other hand , there are political sensitivities regarding the "National Carrier" ditching the link between N.I. and the UK capital. The last time BA pulled off Aldergrove to Heathrow was in the aftermath of the horrific events of 9/11. If BA did want to get off the route , the current situation with Corona would be an opportunity to do so with minimum political flack

we will have to await either official confirmation from BA or Belfast City Airport , or for the thoughts of an insider from either of these.

Well, the other half of NI view Aer Lingus as our "National Carrier".
You really know who your friends are when times are tough...Thank you Aer Lingus for maintaining the route to LHR and for keeping Belfast City Airport from closing.

[SWBKCB]

Bricks being built out of straw again... :suspect:

[SealinkBF]

A little thing, BA used to sell the EI flights on its website, this appears to have stopped...

[stewyb]

Where does it say this is a permanent withdrawal of the route? At the bottom of the report it states that its the busiest route in the airport but has seen a dramatic fall because of restrictions associated with the coronavirus. Would the implication not be thats it pulled until such time as life gets back to normal?:confused:

Of course it’s the busiest route as it was served by two carriers on multiple shuttles a day. Maybe this is no longer sustainable under current circumstances!

[stewyb]

It probably isn't sustainable under the present circumstances, not much in aviation at the minute! It is also the exact reason that there are ZERO commercial flights from Aldergrove, however it is interesting to note the usual suspects almost gloating that this will force Harbour to close.

Once this virus blows over, and it will, all airports will in effect be starting again from scratch. It will be interesting to see if those airlines with smaller aircraft and lower break even figures fare any better than those much larger carriers trying to fill an Airbus or equivalent with its associated bigger break even figure. I've read a few reports saying the domestic market will recover first followed by leisure traffic to Europe etc. Time will tell. Perhaps Harbour might be in a relatively strong position to take advantage. Who knows!

I tend to agree with you that domestic connectivity, ie predominantly business travel will probably recover the quickest and this will most likely be to Harbours advantage. Eastern Airways has already confirmed route expansion from the airport post Covid and will be a good start to backfill lost BE routes.

[passportstamp]

I tend to agree with you that domestic connectivity, ie predominantly business travel will probably recover the quickest and this will most likely be to Harbours advantage. Eastern Airways has already confirmed route expansion from the airport post Covid and will be a good start to backfill lost BE routes.

Another thing that might work in its favour, most people I know visiting NI much prefer the shorter BHD bus route into town than the long bus from BFS.

[SWBKCB]

Given the recently announced range of domestic flights announced by EZY from BFS, I would have thought any operator planning to fly from BHD will now be thinking twice.

EZY will have price, frequency and familiarity over any new starter.

[SealinkBF]

Govt to fund LDY LON and BHD LHR and ferries...

https://www.gov.uk/government/news/government-to-safeguard-vital-great-britain-northern-ireland-air-links?utm_source=e16ed786-7fe0-4967-934e-d36e6229b23a&utm_medium=email&utm_campaign=govuk-notifications&utm_content=immediate,

[Alteagod]

Great news

[virginblue]

How long will 5.7m GBP last to support two airports and two opertaors?

[passportstamp]

How long will 5.7m GBP last to support two airports and two opertaors?

Yeah seems like a drop in the ocean. Ferries got £17m last week for five routes, maybe it's being doing based on # routes. Would love to see a cost breakdown.

[kildress]

Presumably there is still some demand, albeit much-reduced, for BHD/LHR travel.
What are the criteria for being able to travel on a domestic route like this at this time?
Presumably there might be some essential scientific/medical travellers, but my understanding is that although one can travel to non-essential work (if you can't work from home), you must comply with social distancing. Is such distancing being achieved in terminals and on board?

[planedrive]

UK government giving money to an Irish airline to operate BHD LHR? Why is our government spending our taxes on a foreign airline when there are at least 2 British Airlines flying from Belfast to London?

[GrahamK]

At a guess, BA are dropping BHD

My bad, it had aready been announced.

[kildress]

UK government giving money to an Irish airline to operate BHD LHR? Why is our government spending our taxes on a foreign airline when there are at least 2 British Airlines flying from Belfast to London?

Who are the two "British" airlines flying Belfast to London?
Although EI are seen as Irish, register their planes in Ireland and operate under an Irish Certificate, they are owned by IAG (as are BA), a Spanish entity with ultimate ownership spread across various countries.
It's difficult to ascribe a national identity to many enterprises in the modern age.

[EI-BUD]

UK government giving money to an Irish airline to operate BHD LHR? Why is our government spending our taxes on a foreign airline when there are at least 2 British Airlines flying from Belfast to London?
oh dear, you have to love this! Why to me as Irish person does this feel oppressive. My parentage is Northern 'Irish' and your comments feel just the same as the oppressive anti Irish commentary that I often hear in the NI media.
Most people in the North avoid this kind of commentary for obvious reasons. We now look forward as part of a shared society recognising that while NI certainly is in the UK, it also is part of the Island of Ireland, the two parts which are inextricably linked and share many things, like electricity grid, gas, infrastructure, tourism etc etc.

There actually are few Irish or British airlines left.
I'd agree with the subsequent poster who commented about BA not returning, I think sadly that this is a distinct possibility. We may need to rely on that Irish airline for our linkage to LHR from the province and indeed a London link to BHD ...

[camperdown9]

At a guess, BA are dropping BHD

My bad, it had aready been announced.

Has this actually been announced? They are still showing flights in November, not that, that means anything at the moment.
I hope they don't drop the route the current EI schedule means that a day return from Heathrow to Belfast isn't really possible.

Alex

[Jet Set Willie]

Has this actually been announced? They are still showing flights in November, not that, that means anything at the moment.
I hope they don't drop the route the current EI schedule means that a day return from Heathrow to Belfast isn't really possible.

Alex

Actually hoping that BA CityFlyer pick up the route to LCY. Loads were good on FlyBe and the Embraer would perhaps be a better fit for the near future as well with loads vs profit?

[cuthere]

I have no words for the following. Where are these people going to/from (and apparently it really is from this morning).

https://mobile.twitter.com/kellybonner/status/1257323982400831491?s=21

[kildress]

I have already asked this but got no response.
Who would be a legitimate passenger on such a flight?

[The96er]

[QUOTE=cuthere;10772339]I have no words for the following. Where are these people going to/from (and apparently it really is from this morning).

I wouldn't lose sleep over it, it's called living a normal life. Although, it was to be expected that people would turn to social media to portray their false sense of outrage. If the person on Twitter was so aghast, why the hell were they travelling. The sooner all of the doom merchants return to their cave and stay there, the sooner it will return to normal for the rest of us who are not taken in by the Government sponsered and media led paranioa.

[inOban]

Given the cost of housing in London, quite a few people commute for a week while keeping their home elsewhere. Nurses for example.

[Wycombe]

The sooner all of the doom merchants return to their cave and stay there, the sooner it will return to normal for the rest of us who are not taken in by the Government sponsered and media led paranioa.

Fine of course to "live a normal life" if you don't know anyone who's been affected, or don't give a sh!t about the people who have died (a number that is probably still low-balled in the UK and elsewhere), or who have to deal with it every day in the NHS and other parts of the healthcare industry, military etc.

The kind of selfish attitude that is the one that will probably elongate the lockdown rather than get us all to where we want to be.

[Alteagod]

Construction workers going back to work in London probably accounts for a high number of the punters. Key point as well is this was the Monday flight. Not sure the rest of the week would be as busy

[mariofly12]

I have no words for the following. Where are these people going to/from (and apparently it really is from this morning).

https://mobile.twitter.com/kellybonner/status/1257323982400831491?s=21
What social distancing is she talking about? The empty middle-seat thing? We all know it s nonsense, it doesn't work ..It would require at least two empty rows in case a fellow passenger sneezes or coughs , to have some sort of safe distance from droplets and i am not sure even for that, having seen the vid that shows how it spreads around in the cabin..What is left then? Masks and gloves , sanitizers...Nothing else can be done on board

[AirportPlanner1]

I’ve fixed the newspaper headline:

‘Person Travelling on Belfast-London Flight Upset Other People Travelling on Belfast-London Flight’

[cuthere]

My sister-in-law works as a staff nurse in a hospital in Birmingham. I’d love some of you armchair pundits to join her for a shift.

As an aside. I certainly think the route is essential. I have a few points which may have already been made:

• EI and the airport will have known the flight was nearly full.
• Neither (apparently) implemented any procedures which would reflect advice from the WHO (any epidemiologists on here want to argue with them?).
• both are being subsidised to operate the route.

Perhaps EI need to look at their scheduling and booking procedures, and a few posters on here need to look at themselves.

[Alteagod]

Hard with flight deck based in Dublin, cabin crew based in BHD, hotels closed so not sure how they could increase the schedule but i see the BA now showing a flight to from LHR in June so this might take pressure off a little

[MCDU2]

My sister-in-law works as a staff nurse in a hospital in Birmingham. I’d love some of you armchair pundits to join her for a shift.

As an aside. I certainly think the route is essential. I have a few points which may have already been made:

• EI and the airport will have known the flight was nearly full.
• Neither (apparently) implemented any procedures which would reflect advice from the WHO (any epidemiologists on here want to argue with them?).
• both are being subsidised to operate the route.

Perhaps EI need to look at their scheduling and booking procedures, and a few posters on here need to look at themselves.

Every flight is "theoretically full" as its the summer season. Generally less than 10 turn up. The issue is not with the booking engine.

[The96er]

Every flight is "theoretically full" as its the summer season. Generally less than 10 turn up. The issue is not with the booking engine.

When dealing with EI flights from my local airport before being furloughed, the booked loads were anywhere between 700-900 for an A320 due to combining multiple daily flights. The flights rearly departed with double figures. I expect the same happened here, however, more than EI expected actually turned up.

[DUB19]

When dealing with EI flights from my local airport before being furloughed, the booked loads were anywhere between 700-900 for an A320 due to combining multiple daily flights. The flights rearly departed with double figures. I expect the same happened here, however, more than EI expected actually turned up.

Would it make sense for EI to send an A321 up to operate LHR? It would reduce the risk of this happening again.

[gilesdavies]

No wonder the Aer Lingus, Belfast-Heathrow flights are full, easyJet and BA flights are not currently operating between Belfast and London, and you also have the loss of FlyBE exacerbating the situation.

It was inevitable this would happen, and I don’t quite understand the shock or press coverage.

There are 1.8 million people in Northern Ireland and those who need to travel to/from London are fighting to get one of around 450 seats on the route per day is each direction, when usually there would probably be 8-10 times more seats available! Looking on their website, they are currently already sold out on numerous days.

Even if the middle seats are left free that only separates you by around 60-75cm from the other person, and why are Aer Lingus going to want to leave the middle seat free to economy passengers when people in business class paying 2-3 time more get this as the about the only perk.

If you want to fly at the moment, you need to face up to the fact social distancing onboard an aircraft is impossible!

[kildress]

"those who need to travel to/from London are fighting to get one of around 450 seats"
I have asked a couple of times who those people might be.
I have been given suggestions rather than factual answers. These included commuting Nurses and Construction workers.
Is it legitimate for these groups to commute by air (without social distancing)? Presumably they have London accommodation and could simply stay there, but there might be considerable hardship not getting home.
Please don't attack me, I realise that these are very strange and difficult times and I have a genuine reason for my question. I have a daughter stuck in London working from her accommodation there, she could not come home to NI earlier as she had to finish a Covid related Government project (working remotely from her London accommodation but required to be close to office, just in case). She could now continue to work from home in NI but can't find out if she's permitted to travel LHR/BHD.

[West Brit]

Use an A330, 'w' pattern from Dublin. Would probably have to land at BFS.

[EI-BUD]

There are 4 320s @ BHD at the moment (Aer Lingus), so plenty of machines about. A crew will need to be sent up.
Flights on selected days at 0845 and 0945.

[DUB19]

There are 4 320s @ BHD at the moment (Aer Lingus), so plenty of machines about. A crew will need to be sent up.
Flights on selected days at 0845 and 0945.

EI-DVE just positioned up to BHD from DUB.

[passportstamp]

They're going to have to halve the passenger capacity and leave middle seats free - it's the only way to enforce social distancing on the flight. I don't know why this wasn't already decided long before this packed Monday flight. It's going to have to be health over money, with large subsidies for the foreseeable future.

[MCDU2]

What does the law say they should do?

[Alteagod]

How do you social distance on a Saam 340 or other small regional aircraft? With difficulty or keep a door or windo ajar during the flight??

[All names taken]

People need to get a grip.
As FD Roosevelt said... there's nothing to fear but fear itself.
There is a whole media fuelled 'industry' of indignant, self-righteous cocks pointing fingers at people like they are Nazi collaborators or something. But then again people literally have nothing better to do.
(Anti) social distancing in aviation or any other form of public transport is fantasy and pointless in any case.
By the way the WHOs recommended distancing in enclosed spaces is 1metre not the wacky 2metres that the genius's advising Boris cooked up - literally invented without any scientific evidence to back it up.
1m is just verging on the bounds of possibility for air transport - 2m forget it.
Life is full of risks; we take calculated risks every waking hour. Thousands die in car crashes every year why don't we ban all cars?
The whole thing is starting to become more about politics - just listen to that useless dip****e over in Holyrood waffling on today.

[The96er]

Nonsense, to achieve 2 m social distancing on a 320 series aircraft you will only be able to fit 2 people per row and leave 2 completely empty rows which will equate to 20 passengers on a 180 seat aircraft or a load factor of 11%. It ain’t going to work.

A certain green airline airline this morning gave a memo to handling agents as regards to the boarding of said green airlne, stating "to board in small groups" and "board from the centre rows outwards" (When boarding via steps). At all times, passengers to be seperated in this process by 2m !!, obviously a reaction to the percieved bad press they got the other day, but still fails to take into account that Social distancing is impossible once onboard the aircraft.

I guess, all airlines/airport and other transport mediums will by trying to give the perception 'Look what we're doing' to try and avoid the enivitable false outrage on social media as was witnessed the other day and associated bad press that comes with it weather it is justified or not in the intial days of scaling up operations. I fully expect all of this nonesence will soon die down when people realise that there's no such thing as 'the new normal' !! A phrase I'm tired of hearing already.

[cuthere]

Thousands die in car crashes every year why don't we ban all cars?

I take it you don’t wear a seatbelt, regularly break the speed limit, and drive like a maniac? Or do you do all you can to mitigate the risks inherent in travelling by car?

Geniuses much wiser than you and I are dealing with, researching and doing their best to understand and mitigate the risks of SARS-CoV-2. I’m as frustrated as the next person with lockdown, its economic and social impacts and wish nothing but full recovery for aviation - when it is safe to do so.

[True Blue]

Isn't it wonderful the people who do things, then regret it and have to tell the world how wronged they were. Any person who believes in any way that social spacing can be achieved on a plane/in an airport is an idiot. Why don't these people stay at home, regardless of what they want to do?

[BHD2BFS]

Has Loganair or eastern hinted a date they expect to fly from bhd again ?

[allan1987]

Has Loganair or eastern hinted a date they expect to fly from bhd again ?

Eastern Airways start flying on the 15th June to SOU and MME from BHD

Loganair start flying on the 6th July to ABZ, INV and DND from BHD
CAX is suspended to further notice

[Alteagod]

Did Eastern not mention they might expand a few extra routes from BHD or am I imagining things

[allan1987]

Did Eastern not mention they might expand a few extra routes from BHD or am I imagining things
im quite sure that Eastern said 6 routes are going to added from BHD

[BHD2BFS]

looks like from the 6th July there is some form of normally flying again from BHD

06:50 BA1427 -LHR

08:45 EI930 -LHR

09:20 BA1423 -LHR

11:25 LOGANAIR -INV

12:30 LOGANAIR -ABZ

12:30 EASTERN -SOU

13:15 EI932 -LHR

14:55 BA1417 -LHR

15:00 LOGANAIR -DND

15:45 EASTERN -MME

17:20 EI936 -LHR

19:00 BA1419 -LHR

20:10 BA1421 -LHR

[Fly757X]

That’ll be good to see. A return to normal schedules at all airports would be fantastic but I think it’ll be some time before that happens. I’m not sure if there were any holiday flights scheduled from Harbour this year, can’t imagine those happening for a while!

Nope, no holidays scheduled this year, I doubt there will be many opportunities for them in the coming years either which is a pity.

[West Brit]

3 airports ain't going to survive for 1.8 million people. Nobody I know has committed to flying for leisure purposes the rest of this year. Anybody flying for business has scaled back to absolute minimum. Several normal high business frequent fliers, are now seeing the advantages of technology. Basically they have been forced to use it and are raving about the money and time saved vs flying.
The owners at BCA will be looking at other options for the place, if they have their heads screwed on. Urban village would work well. What a waste of land for an airport. Between port authorities, and planning I am sure they could come with a viable option coining everybody in.

[Alteagod]

Maybe some of us just want to get back to work at the City Airport and are getting a bit pissed as all these armchair analysts!!!!

[West Brit]

It won't be the management team down there. It will be many, many levels above. They will be oblivious to any such talk.

[Startledgrapefruit]

It won't be the management team down there. It will be many, many levels above. They will be oblivious to any such talk.
Just to stop you before you feel you are right
3i don't own the land so they can't have urban village.
But do feel free to carry on

[West Brit]

Just to stop you before you feel you are right
3i don't own the land so they can't have urban village.
But do feel free to carry on
Belfast Harbour Commissioners own the land. There use to be one of the world's largest shipyards on it's land, still exists but on much smaller patch H&W. As it shrank, they have changed the land use. BHC have been building office blocks, leasing land for office blocks and various other uses. Real estate is putting loads of money into the pot.
Do you think that BHC would not see the potential for this land to change use and make ££££££££££s instead of a bit of tarmac earning £. I am sure they could make a deal with the owners of BHD;)

[West Brit]

Think west Brit is just having some fun. Obviously an expert in land lease deals and designations as well as being an astute business case advocate.
The airport is part of the reason the rest of the BHC land portfolio is doing well. Connectivity is key and that small area caters for road, rail, air and sea connections.
Despite your well thought out forensic insights, I suspect BHD will be around for some time yet.
My goodness you actually do believe that the success of BHD is key to the future of the Port of Belfast.

[Startledgrapefruit]

As a side note
The aircraft factory has just gone up in flames
On BBC can't get visual as trees in way
Not the Airbus wings section
It looks like down near main building.

[SealinkBF]

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-northern-ireland-52795113


https://cimg2.ibsrv.net/gimg/pprune.org-vbulletin/660x371/676ea1cd_024f_4f25_85f3_62d568f0fa55_76860cb2f23c9326ec0e6e0 ecdbd87d4dfb42afb.jpeg

[SealinkBF]

BA to resume twice daily flights from 1st July, while LM to Dundee resumes in September.

[Alteagod]

From acorns oak trees are grown.

[Startledgrapefruit]

https://www.belfastlive.co.uk/news/belfast-news/belfast-city-airport-oils-goose-18403705

So after yesterdays " International airport open for business" on every social media platform we get this one dug up again.
As usual no follow up on how birds kept under control at the other council "nature reserves for poor endangered species"

[Alteagod]

Stobart thread indicates that they have applied for BHD-LGW slots.

[Startledgrapefruit]

Looks like another dash just left the city.

[Alteagod]

How many are left?

[mart901]

https://www.belfastcityairport.com/News/Loganair-announces-Glasgow-service-for-Belfast-Cit

[VickersVicount]

Loganair better start offering some decent prices as they ain't no BE/EZY on this route

[mmeteesside]

Loganair better start offering some decent prices as they ain't no BE/EZY on this route
Not being funny but look where Flybe ended up, and Easy have 150+ seats to spread the cost.

[Startledgrapefruit]

Not being funny but look where Flybe ended up, and Easy have 150+ seats to spread the cost.
Or 150+ seats to fill.

No football, no horse racing or 12th of July this summer

[mart901]

They're not offering anywhere near the capacity of BE. Slow and steady I think is the approach, if anything I could see them rising fares before capacity.

[Startledgrapefruit]

How many are left?
3..................

[Alteagod]

Cheers for that

[Alteagod]

Good to see Eastern Airways back at BHD today.

[DUB19]

BACF staring one daily LCY-BHD on September 1st increasing to 3 daily by late October.

[Alteagod]

Looks like its a nightstopper as first Dep ex BHD is at 0645. I wonder if Stobart will show there cards now re the LGW slots they applied for. BA to LCY also opens up some interesting onward connections all subject to COVID-19 and the market picking up.

[allan1987]

Looks like its a nightstopper as first Dep ex BHD is at 0645. I wonder if Stobart will show there cards now re the LGW slots they applied for. BA to LCY also opens up some interesting onward connections all subject to COVID-19 and the market picking up.BA has not announced this Belfast City to London City yet but only added on Sell, I sure we might hear something next with Stobart Air with LGW, BHX, MAN, EDI.
Not sure if this with franchise operator Aer Lingus or could be also new franchise with British Airways?

[theexpandingman]

BA has not announced this Belfast City to London City yet but only added on Sell, I sure we might hear something next with Stobart Air with LGW, BHX, MAN, EDI.
Not sure if this with franchise operator Aer Lingus or could be also new franchise with British Airways?
Its Aer Lingus. There was some kind of hurdle with the Irish pilot union IALPA which apparently has now been overcome in order to allow Aer Lingus Regional operated by Stobart Air to commence operations with ATR 72 only (no jets)

[EI-BUD]

Its Aer Lingus. There was some kind of hurdle with the Irish pilot union IALPA which apparently has now been overcome in order to allow Aer Lingus Regional operated by Stobart Air to commence operations with ATR 72 only (no jets)

BA booking engine has BACF flight number and Embraer as aircraft type ...

[Alteagod]

Who cares who is doing it just rejoice in the fact someone is with an aeroplane 3 times a day with first dep from BHD to help businesses recover. It will help hotel trade with crew rooms, taxi companies with crew transport and generally help us all in the aviation in game at BHD and wiser afield.

[Fly757X]

Brilliant news, Hope this is the start of another wave of good news for BHD. First GLA (with decent times.) and this. Increased frequencies (when demand increases again) on SOU wouldn’t go amiss either. All the best to those involved.

[GLCYZ]

LCY will be operated by BA CityFlyer using E190s.

[JobsaGoodun]

Also looks like it will be a LCY based aircraft operating ex London at 0700hrs MoTuWe and then afternoon ThFrSu - at least for the initial start up.
Will not be BHD based unless this changes with more freequency.

[GLCYZ]

Also looks like it will be a LCY based aircraft operating ex London at 0700hrs MoTuWe and then afternoon ThFrSu - at least for the initial start up.
Will not be BHD based unless this changes with more freequency.

From 25th October there will be a nightstopping aircraft, allowing a 0645 departure Saturday to Friday.

[Jet Set Willie]

The word on the internal comms is the increase to 3 a day will be subject to bookings. It's a simple case of use it or loose it for the future if there is little uptake. Hoping this will be a big success knowing FlyBe gave such a good service on the route.

[irishlad06]

Looks like some good news for Harbour at last, I really hope new routes revive this friendly little airport again.

Several points I suppose. FlyBe couldn't make the Embraer work, reading some of the other threads it appears the Embraer deals were one of the millstones round their neck, what's different that will make this route profitable on relatively short sectors. I read somewhere the Embraer has the cost footprint of an Airbus but with two thirds of the seats - not sure how true this is.

With the rumours of these new routes, is this finally the end of the FlyBe resurrection rumours? A new version would simply be competing on every profitable route they originally had.

Again with the rumours of new routes, will this in any form reduce the threat to all the ground handlers that are/were about to be made redundant? I truly hope so.

I know the London City route was always very busy with FlyBe, I really hope it works again for a new airline. The only worry is the current market but hopefully that will recover, I am sure all routes will be carefully monitored for profitability over the next while!

Flybe couldn’t make the E195’s work because of the leasing deal they had. The 175’s were a bit different - for the extra 10 seats over the Q400 it made operating at full capacity the same fixed costs as the q400 or as close to as possible. That was why they had to sign up to a Brazilian bank for the lease of them but they had to always be full.

flybe couldn’t fly any of these EMB’s into LCY as they weren’t rated. They flew the Eastern E170 for a season which was always full - and don’t forget towards the end flybe were 6 or 7 daily on the route. They had lots of corporate contracts on the route too.

With the aircraft being a night stopper this will potentially save some jobs but it’s only 1 aircraft - a step in the direction they need but will need more than 1 aircraft to help prevent the job losses proposed by SWISSPORT.

Hopefully the rumours about EI pilots being ok about EIR setting up BHD ops will come to fruition and this would help other aircraft be based at the airport. This will save jobs. Hopefully they start the proposed MAN BHX EDI and London routes that they have applied for slots for.

[Alteagod]

LCY was also reasonably popular with onward connections but as BE and BA cut there links it was a chancey option. BA will be able to tap into this market. It is probably not a massive number of passengers but still a fair few. I wonder if BA got the NHS contract as it accounted for a lot of the BE traffic to LCY.

[DUB19]

Bhd airport have just posted a video regarding the new LCY route.
The airport ceo also said “this is the first of a number of announcements over the next fortnight”

Could the airport be set to confirm EIR operations or perhaps other airlines/routes?

[brian_dromey]

Bhd airport have just posted a video regarding the new LCY route.
The airport ceo also said “this is the first of a number of announcements over the next fortnight”

Could the airport be set to confirm EIR operations or perhaps other airlines/routes?

As I have said elsewhere I would expect VFR traffic to be the first to recover and traffic between NI and GB to be at the front of that growth where road and rail aren't an option/competitive. BHD traditionally had a strong network to the rest of the UK, so I think it will be relatively better off than other airports. Still impacted between flyBe and COVID, of course, but possibly not as badly effected as airports with a high number of Sun flights - which will be decimated for summer 2020 compared to the planned capacity.

[stewyb]

Bhd airport have just posted a video regarding the new LCY route.
The airport ceo also said “this is the first of a number of announcements over the next fortnight”

Could the airport be set to confirm EIR operations or perhaps other airlines/routes?

Maybe these announcements are from Eastern as was intimated before lockdown!

[Alteagod]

Probably a mix of Eastern and EI. Lets be honest not a lot of choice left!! Blue Islands?? More Loganair. Very doubtful it would be any European carriers.

[BFS/BHD]

When are KLM due back?

[DUB19]

When are KLM due back?

August 3rd
Daily E175 / E190

[allan1987]

Probably a mix of Eastern and EI. Lets be honest not a lot of choice left!! Blue Islands?? More Loganair. Very doubtful it would be any European carriers.Birmingham, Edinburgh, Manchester and Gatwick are new slots that have been given to Stobart Air from slot-controlled airports. Hopefully there will be more than 4 routes, might be routes to Bristol, Isle of Man, Leeds/Bradford, Newcastle upon Tyne, and London Southend since these Stobart Air fly these routes from Dublin, Expect London Southend.

Eastern Airways might add routes from Belfast City to

Cardiff, Carlisle, and Humberside,

[True Blue]

Tell me more about the financial strength of these airlines to to set up a bunch of new routes and maintain them until they are profitable, in the current climate?

[Startledgrapefruit]

Tell me more about the financial strength of these airlines to to set up a bunch of new routes and maintain them until they are profitable, in the current climate?
I think they would have quite a bit of experience flying 45 seaters with 7 empty seats rather than 150 seaters with 110 empty seats for a start.

[Alteagod]

Yes I agree a spread of airlines is more helpful than one dominant calling the shots.

[ECR]

BA has not announced this Belfast City to London City yet but only added on Sell, I sure we might hear something next with Stobart Air with LGW, BHX, MAN, EDI.
Not sure if this with franchise operator Aer Lingus or could be also new franchise with British Airways?

The wikipedia page for Stobart Air says "it operates scheduled services under the brands Aer Lingus Regional, BA CityFlyer and KLM Cityhopper on behalf of their respective owners". It would be crazy to start an operation under their own Stobart Air name in the present climate, so I think they would be likely to operate under an existing well known brand.

Personally I would love it to be BA Cityflyer as I think BA is probably the widest known worldwide of those and would open up good opportunities for using avios. (I know you can collect and spend avios on Aer Lingus but they are generally very poor value for European flights, as indeed were Flybe when they used avios).

I think there is a very outside chance they could do a deal with Virgin to use their brand and booking platform as per the original intention when part of the Connect takeover of Flybe, but realistically I very much expect to see them using the Aer Lingus Regional brand.

[allan1987]

It is More likely to Aer Lingus Regional brand, but at same time I would like to see BA Cityflyer expanded with Stobart Air using ATR 72-600 or DHC-8-400 to do UK regional flying.

Bookings more likely to be on Aer Lingus website I Wonder will the flights be on the BA Website as well.

[ECR]

It is More likely to Aer Lingus Regional brand, but at same time I would like to see BA Cityflyer expanded with Stobart Air using ATR 72-600 or DHC-8-400 to do UK regional flying.

Bookings more likely to be on Aer Lingus website I Wonder will the flights be on the BA Website as well.
I would expect that they would be as current Aer Lingus Regional flights are normally also bookable as stand alone flights on the BA website under a BA code. Unfortunately though they normally seem to be priced so substantially higher as to not make them worthwhile booking on BA.

[FQTLSteve]

ECR (https://www.pprune.org/members/469853-ecr) From an earlier post I would suggest that KLM is as equally if not better well known global brand as BA.

[Alteagod]

Very tru but a once a day service impacts considerably on inbound and outbound connectivity

[SWBKCB]

I'm getting confused - I thought we were looking at BACF doing LCY, then expecting Stobart Air to operate LGW, BHX, MAN, EDI under the Aer Lingus Regional franchise, with maybe something additional to come from Eastern.

Don't think Stobart having done ACMI leases for KLM or BACF is relevant?

[Alteagod]

That was my understanding of a possible future for BHD

[tigertanaka]

ECR (https://www.pprune.org/members/469853-ecr) From an earlier post I would suggest that KLM is as equally if not better well known global brand as BA.

It certainly serves the whole of the UK better than BA do! However if Stobart run a service for KLM it will only be to AMS.

I'm struggling to see who would codeshare on a Stobart Air service to a domestic service ex-BHD. Aer Lingus only operate one other route out of Belfast and the existing relationship with Stobart is mainly about providing feed into DUB. BA are not really interested in anything unless it starts/ends in London or provides a tag on to a remote place.

[SWBKCB]

It certainly serves the whole of the UK better than BA do! However if Stobart run a service for KLM it will only be to AMS.

I'm struggling to see who would codeshare on a Stobart Air service to a domestic service ex-BHD. Aer Lingus only operate one other route out of Belfast and the existing relationship with Stobart is mainly about providing feed into DUB. BA are not really interested in anything unless it starts/ends in London or provides a tag on to a remote place.

See post #1041

[Startledgrapefruit]

I don't think Virgin will show up on any domestic shape or form. Little red were good but stopped too soon So in the public eye they were a failure
Virgin connect........
Anyhow
Once Simon the expert speaks his mind we will all know what the correct decision is.

[JSCL]

Let's not forget folk, that Flybe miraculously still own a hefty amount of slots at Heathrow.

[SWBKCB]

Let's not forget folk, that Flybe miraculously still own a hefty amount of slots at Heathrow.

Thought they were remedy slots that will have to be handed back?

[allan1987]

I don't think Virgin will show up on any domestic shape or form. Little red were good but stopped too soon So in the public eye they were a failure
Virgin connect........
Anyhow
Once Simon the expert speaks his mind we will all know what the correct decision is.

Virgin will not show up now

Im sure now its to do with Stobart and Cyrus capital and keeping Flybe’s existing OL and AOC then see what happens after that...

summer remedy slots was handed back to BA
but winter slots for flybe still there at LHR, MAN, LCY, BHX, and DUB

[tigertanaka]

See post #1041

I saw that but I don't get how the business case stacks up. Stobart operate for Aer Lingus on many routes from UK regional airports to DUB, these are primarily about providing LH feed as they can't compete with Ryanair on cost (and FR go head to head on virtually all these routes anyway).

As for O&D, business passengers may pay for the convenience of BHD over BFS but are there enough people like that, especially in the post covd world, to go toe-to-toe with the LCCs on Belfast-EDI (Easyjet 2-4 flights a day), Belfast-BHX (Easyjet 4-6 flights a day), Belfast-MAN (Easyjet 3-5 flights a day plus the odd Ryanair flight) and Belfast-LGW (Easyjet 6-7 flights a day)?

LGW could be an outlier (BA might want to codeshare on that one as well for some feed and could provide the slots) but do Aer Lingus really want to compete with BA on another Belfast-London route now that BA is about to launch BHD-LCY?

Or maybe there is a big pot of cash to subsidise routes out of BHD following the collapse of FlyBe?

[Flightrider]

Flybe does not hold any slots at LHR for Winter 2020. The remedy slots were returned to BA on 1 June.

[inOban]

There were enough to sustain both EZY and Flybe between Belfast and EDI for several years. Whether there still are, we'll see.

[Startledgrapefruit]

There were enough to sustain both EZY and Flybe between Belfast and EDI for several years. Whether there still are, we'll see.
Feel a Harry hill which is better moment coming on

[Startledgrapefruit]

KLM back 3rd August
On ​ facebake