An Emirates' A380 door "pops" in-flight

[crewmeal]

Not sure if this has been posted anywhere else but here goes:

My terror at 27,000ft: Jet door blew open and crew plugged gap with blankets, says Briton | Mail Online (http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-2279416/My-terror-27-000ft-Jet-door-blew-open-crew-plugged-gap-blankets-says-Briton.html)

I remember we used to plug the door seals on a BAC 1-11 with wet Kleenex when they started squealing. No terror though!no cowering behind a passenger seat, we just got on with it.

[fireflybob]

Not up to the usual DM's standard - no pilots "wrestling with controls" or "aircraft plummeting" or even "narrowly missed a school" etc

[Lyman]

Have we finished counting the orphans?

[mini]

My first ever trip in first class, from LAX to HON many moons ago was spoiled by the whistling of the adjacent door seal.

Should have sold my story... :bored:

[zz9]

No mention of how this will affect my house price, or how immigrants were to blame! Come on Daily Mail! I need to know!

[ExSp33db1rd]

Know of a similar story with a Britannia, circa. late '50's, door seal plugged with blankets, then water thrown over them which froze and successfully plugged the gap.

This does seem to be a bit more then simply a leaking seal tho'. 1 1/2 inches gap, if the Daily Wail are to be believed - and we do believe them, don't we ? !!

[Trackmaster]

What's going on here?

A passenger says an exit door opened in flight, and provides a photo of pillows and blankets being used as stuffing in the gap.

Emirates says there was a "whistling" noise on the flight?


Emergency Exit door opens in explosion on Emirates Airbus A380 | News.com.au (http://www.news.com.au/travel/news/emergency-exit-door-opened-in-explosion-on-emirates-airbus-a380/story-e6frfq80-1226579347708)

[gcal]

It was the same on the DC10 (and no not THAT door) blankets were stuffed under the whistling door which would sometimes seal itself with one hell of thump when the pressurisation kicked in.

[jucylucy]

"Mr Reid, who has a private pilot's licence,"

Read more: Emergency Exit door opens in explosion on Emirates Airbus A380 | News.com.au (http://www.news.com.au/travel/news/emergency-exit-door-opened-in-explosion-on-emirates-airbus-a380/story-e6frfq80-1226579347708#ixzz2L22nSwzJ)

More worrying is that Mr Reid has a pilots licence but forgets his basic physics, in his world low pressure outside can overcome the high pressure inside to "rush into the cabin"!!!
He should be sent back to school as a danger to flight! He might have an opposite reaction in an emergency!!:uhoh:

[SloppyJoe]

The picture on the first link shows green for locked not unlocked like stated. Red is unlocked, green locked.

[Eau de Boeing]

Here is what I posted in return on the site but for some reason it would not show on the page....

Ok speaking as an A380 pilot, I have to say this article is almost laughable in almost every part.

1) The picture showing the "door indicator" is actually the passenger call indicator indicating that someone was obviously so bothered by this that they wanted a Gin and Tonic.

2) If a door had "blown" as the article had suggested, do you think with an approximate pressure differential between inside and outside of 8.5 PSI that a blanket would stop everyone from being sucked out?

3) I would love to know how you can hide under an A380 jumpseat, there is barely enough room to keep a lifejacket there.

4) There is no curtain between Economy and Business class, they are separated by....... a floor.

This was nothing more than a leaky seal in a door and the blankets were for passenger comfort on a short (2.5 hour flight). I suggest Mr Reid needs a groundschool PPL refresher on basic physics and principles of flight and leaves operating these multi-million pound aircraft to the people who actually know what they are talking about.

Harsh but fair?

[triton140]

Ahh, you gotta laugh:

A sudden rush of ‘thin air’ from outside ... :ugh:

Reminds me of when I used to process my own B&W prints, and I had to cover the windows to stop the dark leaking out. :E

[kaikohe76]

Hi Crewmeal,
Ah those long gone happy days of flying the 1-11, full load to Tunis, Madrid Naples etc in high summer. Then there were WAT limits & water injection amongst other things to consider, we certainly got through a few Kleenex too didn't we? We used wet tissues as well, back when flying for HM the Q, on the rear pressure bulkhead of the RAF Andover, just in front of the opening rear doors.
Not the same these days is it?

[stilton]

Personally. I don't consider an Aviation article worth reading unless the word 'plunge' is used liberally within :eek:

[Payscale]

You gotta love it ! Weeping, plunge, crying, "we are going down".... now chest infection...later...compensation!!! Nice try

[SOPS]

I agree Payscale, as soon as I read the article I thought, someone is after some money to pay for their "trip of a lifetime".

[Krystal n chips]

Apart from the ever consistent Daily Mail "reporting" of this event, it's nice to see that, even with the advancement in technology, the basics of engineering are still deemed relevant....

" Mr Reid, who has a private pilot's licence, said that after several moments of confusion, the cabin crew started grabbing blankets and pillows which they stuck together with duct tape to fill the gap."

[500N]

".... now chest infection...later...compensation!!! Nice try"

Yes, I read that, was wondering how you get a chest infection
from what MAY have been something !

Another passenger / media beat up.

[fincastle84]

You cynical bunch, you've probably ruined this poor guy's chances of suing Emirates for millions of dinar. You should all be ashamed of yourselves.:=:=

[crewmeal]

Ah yes fincastle but I guess the 'no win no fee' brigade will be bombarding and terrorising him for business.

[Dysonsphere]

stuck together with duct tape

LOL have you ever tried gaffa tape (duct tape) on blankets it dosn`t work. But lets not stop the newspapers fun. :D

[SOPS]

And come to think of it, where did the duct tape come from? But let's keep the rubbish rolling along.

[A A Gruntpuddock]

"This was nothing more than a leaky seal in a door"

Sudden decompression must be frightening, especially when you don't know if the situation is going to get worse!

[ODY757]

One of the more nonsensical stories even by the Daily Mail's pathetic standards : I hope Emirates, if they do hear from this (paid?) correspondent or his (no win-no fee?) lawyers, tell him to take a flying leap.

[J-Class]

I think a lot of the posts above are slightly unfair on the passengers who experienced and presumably reported this. I've sat with Mrs J-Class next to a very noisily leaking seal on an A320 window exit and the combination of weird sound effects - which gave the impression that something was wrong with the engine - and freezing air was causing anxiety to everyone sitting nearby. The captain came down to reassure us everything was OK, which was the right way to handle this kind of thing.

On a newish model such as the A380, with a recent history of near-disaster, I'm not at all surprised at the reaction.

[Clare Prop]

If there was an explosive decompression, did they then tuck all the oxygen masks back in while the pax were still disembarking? I noticed they forgot the line about the oxygen masks not working.....:ugh:



The Lazy Journalists Plane Story Generator (http://www.radans.net/jens/planestory.html)

[KAG]

On a newish model such as the A380, with a recent history of near-disaster, I'm not at all surprised at the reaction. The B747 has killed 2852 persons. At least 49 B747 were completely destroyed, crashed.
The B747 (around 1500 built) alone has killed more than all the fly by wire airbuses (around 5000 built) ever built together (A319/320/321/330/340/380).
So please don't participate to this witch hunt that we regularly see with the A380, or with the Airbuses in general.

[Eau de Boeing]

"This was nothing more than a leaky seal in a door

Sudden decompression must be frightening, especially when you don't know if the situation is going to get worse!"

Sorry A Grunt but that's all it really was. There is a history of a bit of noise from the UR/L 2 doors on a couple of the frames, however the blankets mitigate that quite well and they have been thoroughly tested.

This is pure crash for cash and nothing more and I am appalled that this even made it to the press.

Interesting that if he had such a weak pulmonary system he was going to Honkers at chinese new year!!

[stuckgear]

KAG wrote:

The B747 has killed 2852 persons. At least 49 B747 were completely destroyed, crashed.
The B747 (around 1500 built) alone has killed more than all the fly by wire airbuses (around 5000 built) ever built together (A319/320/321/330/340/380).
So please don't participate to this witch hunt that we regularly see with the A380, or with the Airbuses in general.

jesus wept ! what an unmitigated load of claptrap, from someone professing to be a profesional pilot too.

the Daily Fail would be proud.

:ugh::ugh:

[blue up]

Sadly, I have lost the newspaper cutting from the front of the Telegraph thast reported the engine surge after departure that I was flying many years ago. "Jet fire survivors given Valium jabs" was the tag-line.

IF ONLY journalists had to display the same high degree of accuracy that they would demand of us........:rolleyes:

[Right Engine]

Ask yourself if the veracity of all journalism in mainstream news media is applied in equal measures across all stories. This story is the rule not the exception.

Hidden agenda's destroyed the purity of journalistic integrity many years ago. (Kick backs from Boeing perhaps)

Get yourself on T w i tt e r and follow stories that are based on facts and truth.

The Daily Mail has no reason for existing other than to fuel the ire of a nation of halfwitted teeth-grinders. Angry Middle Englanders lacking the wisdom to question anything that might ruffle their simple blame free existences.

Sadly the journalists who write these stories read these forums. They know they've been made to look stupid but rather than a moment of reflection, they react with sociopathic zeal, making their next story even more outrageous and patronising. You're dealing with :mad:. Plain and simple.

[Agaricus bisporus]

A bacterial infection due to a broken doorseal? That's a new one to medical science!

I sincerely hope that this imbecile Mr Reid has his PPL pulled (if indeed he does have one) and is made to resit his exams as he clearly doesn't possess the knowledge required to be a safe passenger, let alone to fly an aeroplane.
If anyone knows this cretin I hope they'll direct him here so he can read what real pilots think of him.

[Nialler]

As a member of the flock of SLF who contribute to your lot's wages (and well-deserved they are too) I have to admit that my first port-of-call when I read a story such as this is to come along here and see what the real story is.

It's always cautionary to read the professionals in the field (any field - including mine) before reaching any conclusions.

I guess the point i that this time I came here purely out of habit. This story was of a standard that in retrospect seems inevitable, yet I didn't ever think that even the DM could get so many "facts" wrong.

I can just see the thin air rush in - laden with microbes - while the passengers scream and queue up to punch a hysterical passenger.

I can only guess that the DM had no Ryanair story this week and that they panicked.

Anyway, keep up the good work.

One minor question arises in my mind regarding this story, though: I can see how blankets would provide a pretty convenient sound baffle on a door which was whistling a bit; but do they pose any type of minor risk in the event of an emergency egress? Any chance that they could foul up the mechanism if someone tried to remove them in a panic in a dark scenario?

Genuine question.

[barit1]

fincastle84:ruined this poor guy's chances of suing Emirates for millions of dinar.

Ummm - Emirates - wouldn't that be Durhams not Dinars?

[barit1]

jucylucy:Mr Reid has a pilots licence but forgets his basic physics, in his world low pressure outside can overcome the high pressure inside to "rush into the cabin"!!!

Remarkably like this question from tech log: What happens to the bleed air that is used to turn the pneumatic starter on a typical turbofan? Is it returned to the pneumatic manifold, or is it exhausted overboard?

I'd like to take these geniuses to go snipe hunting at a nearby river which flows uphill. :ugh:

[Good Business Sense]

Hi Nailler, FYI ref. but do they pose any type of minor risk in the event of an emergency egress? - not at 35,000 feet. They would be removed well before the approach and landing.

Once had a passenger threatening cabin crew and frightening everyone else by creating merry hell about his exit being blocked with a drinks trolley .... over Mongolia at 39,000 feet !

As an aside in the DM article, our expert Mr Reid, said they were two hours into the flight...as I remember it BKK-HKG is about 2 hours and 45 minutes over the South China Sea so HKG was probably the closest airport give or take.

[GHOTI]

@ Clare Prop
Thank you for the belly-larf this mornng!

[Nialler]

@Good Businss Sense,

Thanks for the reply. Clearly at 35000 feet they're not providing threat of ay type; I was wondering if in the event off an issue at lower altitude...

Then again, my guess (I emphasise that word) is that in the event of even the beginnings of an incident present themselves,the CC are trained to make sure all exits (including over-wing) are clear as a priority action.

I seem to recall reading somewhere about the "wheels-up" landing in Warsaw, where the CC even checked with the passengers over the wings that they were both calm and capable.

Sorry if my question came across as silly; I can understand the frustration of not just pilots but cabin crew when these type of stories hit the news-stands.

We SLF put our lives in your hands every time we fly, and the fact that I'm able to post shows that that relationship of trust is justified. Hell, the guys in the nose of the thing has every reason to get there safely too.

[Zag23]

After reading through the comments section of the DM "report", it seems the large majority of hysterical comments come from the females. Perhaps one time where "calm down dear" is most appropriate.

[BDiONU]

Ummm - Emirates - wouldn't that be Durhams not Dinars?No it would be Dirhams (Dhs) or AED.

[Johnmal]

Just had a hilarious conversation with my daughter who is an Emirates Cabin Crew. She is incandescent with rage about the DM story, ironically enough she has just had to pass her safety procedures re-certification tests this week and pointed out that using the blankets to muffle the sound is a standard procedure in the safety manual. I'd be surprised as everyone else here if one of the Cabin Crew was screaming over such a trivial incident, maybe the screaming the passenger was hearing was his own. It could account for his 'chest infection'

[Agaricus bisporus]

You couldn't make this up, not that it hinders the Daily Wail...

Holding in wind during flights is bad for your body claims scientists who suggest flatulence-absorbing solutions | Mail Online (http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-2279678/Holding-wind-flights-bad-body-claims-scientists-suggest-flatulence-absorbing-solutions.html)

If you apply the DM's theory of gas pressure equalisation to this scenario it could get really nasty...
No - I'll leave it to your imagination!

[Sunnyjohn]

I love it - this is the most fun thread I've read in ages (with due respect to the serious posts). Please don't give up, Ppruners.
But this took the biscuit:
The B747 has killed 2852 persons. At least 49 B747 were completely destroyed, crashed.
The B747 has been flying for forty (40 - that's 40) years. And the A380 has been flying for - um - let me see now . . .

[ironbutt57]

Plunges are for buses, air pockets on the other hand still seem to be alive and well in India...:}

[travelbug2011]

Most hilarious article! Cannot believe it was published without confirming the facts first! Don't go circling things in RED if you have no clue what they mean!
I had a good laugh about this with all of my fellow A380 colleagues!
Curtains separating classes?
Doors opening inwards?
Fitting under a jump seat?
AIP is the new DSIP!!!???
We need this article as an SEP training excercise...'spot the difference!?'

[Speed of Sound]

On a serious note, an article which claims that a door was 'wide open' while showing a picture of a closed door with a few blankets around the bottom shows exactly how stupid the DM thinks its readers are. :-(

[parvatti]

Travelbug ~ the image with the mysterious panel circled in red is the replacement image. The same article used to look like this:

http://katoributa.com/itap/itsacallbell.jpg

Somebody must have told them the AIP has always been green and only green, so they had to grasp further to make this scene look "terrifying."

[ttodd]

A380 out of LHR to DXB EK006 11th Feb. RHS door at the back of business.

Lots of whooshing noise deadened by blankets and passengers moved away because of noise. No panic, no screaming but it sounds like a possible generic problem?

[KAG]

SunnyjohnThe B747 has been flying for forty (40 - that's 40) years. And the A380 has been flying for - um - let me see now . . .
I have never compared the A380 to the B747. I have compared the whole fleet of FBW Airbuses (319/320/330/340/380, more than 5000 built) to the B747 alone (less than 1500 built). Result: the B747 has killed more people than the whole FBW Airbus fleet ever built. 49 B747 have crashed, completely destroyed (more than 2800 people killed), last time not so long time ago, but I don't hear you saying "history of near desaster" let alone "history of disaster" each time a B747 is mentioned.

No need to speak about "recent history of near disaster" (and I was answering to this sentence initially) here with the A380 without looking like a stupid witch hunt.

[slowto280]

Can't you just open it all the way and then slam it shut? :confused:

[AviatorTB]

The fact that KAG couldn't remeber Tenerife or KAL 007 (just to begin a short list) before posting speaks volumes. Next thing we'll be hearing from him is that US construction and zoning are at fault for 3 of the four 9/11/01 incidents. Oh wait, all four of those were Boeing's fault too, I guess...

Puhleez...

[toffeez]

Indeed, LongLander.

Since you mention cement, we now have proof that the A380 is built like a brick sh!thouse.

No-one can simulate the results of such an incident on another plane, but the A380 engines are much smaller and the wing structure much thicker than on a 777, for example.

[QF22]

A mate at MAS tells me they have changed 3 upperdeck doors on their A380s recently.
One door had a 5 inch cracked in it, which was easily visible from the inside with daylight shining through !
Fairly reliable bloke, I have no reason to doubt him.
Cheers !

[vctenderness]

Can't you just open it all the way and then slam it shut? http://images.ibsrv.net/ibsrv/res/src:www.pprune.org/get/images/smilies/confused.gif

Good idea well give you the job!

[Landflap]

Daily Mail. Bless. Hope Emirates will not order an invetigation into the crew's response. Reminds me that the same paper, over a quarter of a century ago, reported, in the same headline grabbing manner, a B757 incident outa TFS together with a cartoon contribution too. Stuff like "Hero passenger stops airliner take-off". Twerps in Commercial ordered a full internal inquiry. Clowns in 'Management' believed the Daily Mail & my mate nearly lost his career. Better for Emirates to legally pursue the DM for grossly inaccurate reporting.

[KAG]

To a few enthousiasts posters here: you missed the point.

Somebody mentionned the "near disaster history" with the Airbus 380. To what I reply that's bullcr@p, as Boeing has its share of disaster too but nobody jump on it like that, Boeing had planes that fell down from the sky too, but when it comes to Airbus this is all about disaster scary bed stories only. I spoke about the B747 alone (more than 2800 persons died in B747 disasters, more than the whole FBW entire Airbus fleet), but if you take Boeing in its whole, that's thousands, thousands, thousands of people who died (including in recent times), the disaster history actually do exist with Boeing, no need to play the witch hunt with Airbus: Boeing is not better (in fact worse) in accident rate, death, and hull loss. However everybody seems to think the opposite, that is called brainwhashing.

[griffin one]

787 has proven to be a bigger failure, if it ain't Boeing I ain't going. Too bad the A380 a better wide body product

[J-Class]

I am the poor soul who mentioned the A380's history. I didn't intend to set off an A-versus-B flame-fest.

In my original post, I was merely pointing out:
(a) that leaky seals can be much more disturbing to passengers than some posters here seem to appreciate; and
(b) Some passengers are wary about flying on new types which they view as being 'beta-tested in service'. The Qantas A380 incident and the 787 problems arguably provide justification for this prejudice.

A combination of (a) + (b) leads to a non-event an an Emirates A380 being blown up out of all proportion. All I'm saying is, one shouldn't be entirely surprised by this.

[Sunnyjohn]

I have never compared the A380 to the B747. I have compared the whole fleet of FBW Airbuses (319/320/330/340/380, more than 5000 built) to the B747 alone (less than 1500 built).
You did, KAG, and I apologise for misconstruing your post, although I still feel that the comparisons are a little mischievous. It just shows how the Daily Fail can get under one's skin :)

[fireflybob]

How valid are comparisons of accident stats between B747 and A380?

Correct me if I am wrong but when the B747 was introduced to service there were no other airliners flying around which could carry 300 + passengers and this remained the case for many years.

The A380 has been flying for a much shorter and it remains to be seen how "safe" it is statistically speaking.

Another factor is that items such as EGPWS and TCAS are now standard fit whereas in the early days of the B747 they were not fitted at all and when GPWS was fitted it was much cruder device.

If we are going to make comparisons then let's please compare apples with apples.

[500N]

J-Class

"A combination of (a) + (b) leads to a non-event an an Emirates A380 being blown up out of all proportion. All I'm saying is, one shouldn't be entirely surprised by this."

Understand that, especially A but you need a third factor in the equation
for the "blown up out of all proportion" to occur.

That is a passenger going to the media after the event and the media doing what they do, making a mountain out of a molehill.


If the passenger hadn't gone to the media, would it have become a story ????

[J-Class]

If the passenger hadn't gone to the media, would it have become a story ????

Perhaps not, but we don't know the exact circumstances on board. We don't know if there was panic among passengers. We don't know if an inexperienced stewardess freaked out, leading to panic amongst passengers. If any of this took place, that's would be a story in itself, even if the underlying cause (a leaky seal) was a non-event in safety terms.

As to how the story got to the press: most likely a passenger was either a journalist himself or knew someone who was, and decided to sell the story and picture for a few quid.

The story would have been through in-house lawyers at the Mail prior to publication. The Mail would appreciate that Emirates is a big newspaper advertiser and has deep pockets to defend itself against libellous damage to its reputation. So for that matter does does Airbus. For both these reasons, while the tone of the story may be complete :mad:, the story itself probably has enough truth to it that the Mail cannot be attacked for publishing it.

[stuckgear]

before there is more delving into any jingoistic wankfests about boeing or airbus, lets get one thing straight.. all aircraft from all manufacturers undergo certain revisions after entering service, due to the operational wear and tear and in service life cycles on an aircraft as a structure.

both aircraft types are certified under each others aviation administrations as are many other aircraft from different manufacturers around the world.

now if anyone wants to discuss control systems go ahead but be clear about what is a control system and what is a structure.

[500N]

J Class

"We don't know if there was panic among passengers. We don't know if an inexperienced stewardess freaked out, leading to panic amongst passengers. If any of this took place, that's would be a story in itself, even if the underlying cause (a leaky seal) was a non-event in safety terms."

We are in a sorry state of a society if as you described above
"would be a story in itself", even with media beat up.

What has the world come to.

[lomapaseo]

given the number of people involved it is no surprise that all of the above happened. In the end it was handled professionaly, No big deal, so why beat our keyboards over it?

[barit1]

BDiONU:Originally Posted by barit1

Ummm - Emirates - wouldn't that be Durhams not Dinars?

No it would be Dirhams (Dhs) or AED.

Yeah, I guess so; although it would be properly spelled in the Arabic language, and any translation to a Roman alphabet would be a phonetic one. :}

[KAG]

Fireflyboy: How valid are comparisons of accident stats between B747 and A380?I don't recall of anybody doing such a comparison, never heard about it. May I ask you to what comparison/study you refer to?
If you refer to a post in this thread, may I ask you to quote it as I have not seen such a comparison here?

[Taildragger67]

Astonishingly, according to Mr Reid, instead of making an emergency landing,

Sorry but two hours into a sector from VHHH to VTBS, wouldn't the nearest suitable (if not nearest available for an A380) be VTBS?

On what basis did the pair have to cut short their $6,800 trip?

Maybe I'm making some assumptions here here but I would assume that if there was an emergency that the belt-up signs would be illuminated. So how did Mr Reid manage to get the photo, if not by disobeying a reasonable direction from the crew?

So glad Mr Reid's 18 year old son has such a sense of civic duty that he reported the incident to the AAIB. We can also sleep more safely now. Phew. :ok:

[SOPS]

I'm also interested in exactly which "curtains" between business class and economy class were "closed". As far as I know what separates Y and J on a EK A380 is a whole floor! Mr Ried is full of ........:mad:

[Dg800]

On what basis did the pair have to cut short their $6,800 trip

He had to cut short the trip because of the chest infection, the one he got from the bacteria that rushed in together with the "thin air". :mad:

:ugh:

[cockney steve]

If the leaky door-seal problem is so endemic, one would question the maintenance-regime that doesn't ensure a firm seal (adjustment!)

Secondly, stuffing blankets in the gap is hardly a "professional" fix
to the punter it looks as it is...a CC trying to hide a gap with a blanket....presumably said blanket isn't Certified draught-proofing,-so, why not an extra-long "snake" as used in dwellings oop here in 't north,when t' draught under t' door starts shuffling the furniture.

Said soft textile snake could be covered in corporate colours and look as though it was a proper OE fitment/accessory. Pax then wouldn't give it a second thought.

Kleenex/towels/blankets are a BODGE however nonchalantly they're applied.

Don't say they're not effective, but IMO, shouldn't be needed in the first place.

Daily wail is just an entertainment rag aimed at "Angry of Tunbridge Wells"....why get worked up about it?

[Dushan]

The B747 has killed 2852 persons. At least 49 B747 were completely destroyed, crashed.
The B747 (around 1500 built) alone has killed more than all the fly by wire airbuses (around 5000 built) ever built together (A319/320/321/330/340/380).
So please don't participate to this witch hunt that we regularly see with the A380, or with the Airbuses in general.

583 (Tenerife) had nothing to do with aircraft type. Others (Pan Am flight 103, Air India flight 182) account for hundreds more. The type has also been in service for 45 years FFS. And if you're going to compare the total number of airframes built then use the same criteria on both sides.

[Perrin]

As I used to tell cabin staff don't worry when the whistling goes on, worry when it doesn't and then kiss your a** goodby. :eek:

[panda-k-bear]

Dear KAG,

How many of those Airbus hull losses were at Air France?

[The SSK]

'Aeroplane A has designed into its structure the cultural values and virtues of the country it was made in'

'I come from country A'-

[Taildragger67]

Thanks dg800, yes all those nasty bugs up there at FL270...

[skytramp2800]

C'mon, ladies and gents, a simple wiki search "all boeing 747 losses/crashes"
will reveal that most of these tragedies are the result of other than outright mechanical/build shortcomings.
Pilot error, improper repairs, terrorist actions are by far the biggest killers on the type.

[error_401]

Couldn't pass by without saying someting about dropping figures without proper analysis.

Comparing data to come up with a statistic is easy. Compare data to come up with a meaningful statistic very very hard work.

The risk of an accident is mainly on take-off and on landing. This leads to: The risk associated with accidents of aircraft is related to flights and not the mere number of airframes.

This rises some questions:

If it comes to this I'd like to see the figures about B vs. A on produced airframes.
Could it be that said 747 has a couple more flights than other models?

How does time span (40 years) count in this analysis? How long does A vs. B build airframes?

How do we account for the 60's and 70's where A had hardly any airframes built but some very nasty accidents happened? (The probability that it would be a B was indeed very high at that time - surely higher than being an A - and maybe about the same for an M) See link below and the ref #18 at page 13. (Huh - up to about 2000 B had about 2/3 of western built airframes worldwide?)

Interesting the analysis here:
Competition between Airbus and Boeing - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Competition_between_Airbus_and_Boeing) especially ref #18.

No wonder they get hit more if they fly more...

So get the figures right before misusing them statistically.

I stand corrected.

[BRE]

Well, the Bernoulli principle would allow air at low static pressure to enter into a hole that is a higher static pressure. However, quantitative analysis would probably show that this was not possible here.

[Gauges and Dials]

Error_401 is exactly right.

Occupant fatalities divided by occupant-takeoff-landing-cycles is a reasonable measure. Occupant fatalities divided by occupant-miles is a semi-reasonable measure. Occupant fatalities divided by the number of airframes built is a silly measure.

[expatflyer]

I remember the days when you could find all the door seal leaks on a 1-11 by looking for the nicotine streaks down the sides of the frame....

[Thaihawk]

And to think the "high drama" when the Emirates A380. I was in from BKK to DXB in October 2011 was diverted to HYD didn't even make the Mail.

Faulty generator on this IIRC.

No SLF panicking or anything on that.The nearest to that was when one of the younger CC donned a high viz jacket.She soon removed it.

Maybe the chance to engage m'learned friends for a bit of compo missed!?.

Ant to think(at the last time I was there) the Daily Wail is circulated in Dubai and is available in the Emirates lounges there,at least on occasions.