Informal heli nights UK (including arrangements)

[helimutt]

If anyone is up for coming to some evenings arranged around the uk (obviously depends on numbers of people and locations etc) maybe you cold put your name below and where you are based/where you are prepared to travel to. Hope VeeAny will step in to help out here possibly too.
Anyone else interested?

Plan is heli pilots of all experience ie FI's/PPL/CPL/ATPL/people thinking about it etc etc. No pressure. Few beers. Discussions on all aspects including safety and experiences.


Helimutt-N.Lincs/Yorkshire/Newcastle

[Whirlybird]

Sounds good to me. :ok:

Whirlybird - Derbyshire/Notts/Staffs/Leics/South Yorks

[Flashover999]

Yep im up for that!

Essex, Kent, Herts.

Flash

[KNIEVEL77]

Yep, count me in please............Newcastle, Yorkshire, Southern Scotland.

Helimutt, Newcastle Aero Club Bar or Wings as it now is, sounds the perfect venue........but then I would say that as I only live 5 minutes away!

[herman the crab]

East Yorkshire for me...

[Lord Mount]

Very interested

Lord Mount- London, Essex, Herts, Kent.

[Whirlygig]

Excellent idea! When I went to Phil Croucher's CRM course, everyone gained something by just chatting to another pilot with different experiences!

Whirls - Norfolk/Suffolk/Cambridgeshire/South Lincs/Beds (at a push!!)

Cheers

Whirls

[Monkeyseemonkeyfly]

Sounds great... Count me in.

Monkey,

Devon

[griffothefog]

Love to, but it may take some time.......:{

[O27PMR]

Hi Guys & Gals

I'd definitely be interested in getting together (depending on location)

I am located around Buckinghamshire but will travel within reason.

PR

[muffin]

Yes, and me.

Derbyshire/Staffs/Notts/S Yorks/Leics

[Bertie Thruster]

Lincs/Notts :)

[007helicopter]

Very good idea

Kent, Surrey, London, Essex

Duncan

[Sgtfrog]

Did someone mention beer:ok:!!!

Kent/Sussex/London/Essex

SF

[ManOnTheSticks]

Sounds good to me, I'll be up for that!:ok:

MOTS

South west

[paco]

Absolutely - Wycombe, Gatwick or Prestwick!

phil

[Mark Nine]

The problem will be finding a venue that will be able to handle all the ego's :p

[Whirlygig]

Don't worry love, if I'm around I'll deflate some egos so they can all get in! :}

Cheers

Whirls

[nigelh]

i would suggest no caa ....by the time they have made you fill in the entry forms in triplicate and insisted on a bi annual beer mug test...and made sure all participants are current in the art of mopping any spillage and got a licence for the carriage of alcohol signed off ...we will all have gone home.
Then of course you will have to worry about your duty hours if this is "work" ..not to mention getting the bar licenced for more than 6 sit downs in the day . As you can see i do not believed that increased beaurocracy equals increased safety. What we need is experienced pilots offering advice and not a bunch of desk jockeys. North Yorks.

[helimutt]

as I already said. totally informal nights. The only thing making it an official safety night would do was scare people off. Lets keep it in a bar or similar. over beers or similar. :p only heli pilots or people with a direct interest ie student pilots (not press!!)
Hopefully all types of different experience levels.
Looks like we might be able to arrange a few meets so far. :ok:

[KNIEVEL77]

Helimut,

Don't want to step on anyones toes but would you like me to check out if Wings are happy to accommodate us or are you happy to look into it yourself?

K77.

[Whirlygig]

Sounds like there would need to be a few regional Social Secretaries to organise such get-togethers so I am happy to co-ordinate any from East Anglia.

Cheers

Whirls

[mr blue]

Count me in

Herts Essex Beds Southeast, East Anglia

Mr blue

[helimutt]

k77, thanks for the offer. I think just a call to them to see if certain places are open for a few people to turn up.I think even if only 5 people turn up it would be worthwhile. As I said, no need to make these official. lets wait and see if more people are interested then Whirlygig has a good idea. I'm happy to turn up pretty much at shortish notice.

[opschief]

Excellent idea!

Count me in +2, London, South East, Home Counties.:)

[Bertie Thruster]

....not a nerd "noggin and natter" but a PPRUNE "pint and prattle" :}

[Whirlygig]

Maybe a good ol' Norfolk mardle eh Bertram? :ok:

Cheers

Whirls

[KNIEVEL77]

Helimutt.

Good idea.

I think Wings is actually owned by Northumbria Helicopters now, was planning to speak to them anyway as the North East Lotus Exige Owners are planning to meet there once a month.

[KeithO]

Sounds great idea!

(Currently nr Heathrow, shortly East Mids)

[EESDL]

Positioned at A1M/M1 link split - Garforth
Will confirm with the boss but would like to provisionally offer up the use of our premises for informal cag.
We could use the boardroom - which happens to house a bar and snooker table - and overstuffed Chesterfields...............plus the fact that, unlike a flying club, you know who is listening in!!
ideal surroundings - relaxed atmosphere.
Just thought it would be handy for M62/M1/A1 corridor ppruners.
Company H only available to company chopper but probably a good night not to be flying!
Handy transport links etc etc
And if you're interested in motorsport could throw in a tour of the factory blah

EESDL

[helimutt]

EESDL, great idea for the first meet then, thanks. Lets work on that one first if you like, then K77 can look into the Newcastle one. Lets see who can make it for EESDL's suggestion. I'll probably be available for both as long as their not on the same night and I don't have an early start the next morning.!:E

[VeeAny]

Helimutt

Thanks for the invite.

I will happily be involved, spoken to a few people today who are interested in lending experience to the evenings, and I have a few ideas of things that could be organised but not necessarily how to pull them off.

I would try and get to as many of them as possible.

My mention of the CAA on the other thread was primarily to do with material as they didn't really have anyone in safety promotion who knew anything about helicopters.

If you wish PM me a way to contact you as I have some ideas which need discussing with someone to see if they would work.

I also believe that we should promote these evenings through whatever means possible on other Forums, and at flying schools etc. Yes the initial idea started here, but as a potential huge bonus to flight safety we should try and get the message across to as many pilots as possible.

No idea where but would suggest Exeter or somewhere nearby as a good venue for the South West, drivable from Cornwall, Dunkeswell and Bristol all within an hour or so.


Cheers


Gary

[Whirlybird]

Is there anywhere near/at East Midlands Airport? Because that's almost on the M1, and would be good for the East Mids etc contingent? South Yorks (Sheffield?) also sounds like it would work for quite a few people. I can't think of anywhere specifically at the moment.

[jumpseater]

only heli pilots or people with a direct interest ie student pilots (not press!!)

But there are others too who surely could learn from these meetings. Those working in ATC, or airfield operations for example. I'm certain that I'd learn things that I'm not aware of, and there's a possibility of those being able to contribute too as well as listen. I appreciate the original idea is primarily for aircrew, and I wouldn't want that diluted, but there are others with direct interests that may not fly, and could find them useful.
I'd like to attend one, if work patterns allow, and if it thought appropriate.
js in ATC
N.Notts

[Kopterman]

Always up for few beers!!

London or N Essex

[Up & Away]

The more events the better
Lincoln .............From Humberside to Sheffield

[rotorcraig]

Sounds good, would be interested.

Craig

Northants, London.

[Brilliant Stuff]

If Whirlygig and Paco are going it must be a good gig so count me in. :ok:

Based around Luton.

[KNIEVEL77]

EESDL,

Sounds good............and I run a Lotus Exige Series 1 so i'd also be interested in the Motorsport offer too.

Will checkout 'Wings' for us more north eastern chaps too!

[jellycopter]

I too am up for this. It's a great idea. West Midlands is best for me.

A couple of words of caution however, based upon my own relatively brief (20+ years) in aviation:

1. Broadly speaking, the sort of person that is going to make space in their diary to attend and hopefully benefit from such a 'safety' gathering is also, in my opinion, likely to partake in other safety-related practices. Be that bed-time reading of AAIB bulletins or stumping up a few hundred quid to fly with an instructor for refresher/advanced training on a regular basis. To some degree therefore, I believe these evenings would be 'preaching to the converted'.

2. All the 'war stories' in the world won't stop the same mistakes being repeated time and time again. There is no substitute for experience, and as a PPL(H), one can only truly, and safely, broaden ones' personal flight envelope by flying with someone with significantly more experience and the ability to impart their knowledge effectively. Just flying with your instructor does not necessarily cut it; he may have a few thousand hours but if they are all spent in the circuit or local flying area in an R22/H269 it doesn't count for a great deal. There are numerous highly-experienced instructors in the UK that fit the bill but they tend to be a little more costly than your average flying school FI - but it's usually money very well spent.

3. The best training and best equipment still count for nothing when a pilot makes a conscious (or sub-conscious) decision to fly/continue to fly when all the evidence is pointing to it being a bad idea.

I'll see some of you soon at one the venues I hope.

John Jackson

[Whirlygig]

JJ Jelly,

you are absolutely right but I think that, given the amount of nattering that went on during (yes, during) paco's CRM course, there is obviously a need for the social element. We're a very lonely and isolated breed and need to ocassionally seek solace in the company of others of our ....ilk!

Cheers

Whirls

[VeeAny]

I am pleased to report that every experienced pilot I have asked to participate in this has agreed.

Some have posted on here already.

Jellycopter is of course correct, the kind of people who want to go to these kind of events already have the kind of mentality which mean they are less likely to be involved in unsafe practice to start with.

I am working on some stuff discussed by myself and Helimutt earlier this evening.

However these meetings take place, I hope they can only serve to keep at least one of us alive who might not have been by the end of the year.

GS

[nigelh]

I totally agree with the experience part. loads of hours flying circuits or a to b in good weather is not going to help you say doing a precautionary or emergency landing in a gale in a confined area or coping with severe turbulence in the hills etc etc When it comes say to handling for instance, a few hours of crop spraying or sling load will benefit you more than thousands of hrs S & Level. These guys are out there, jellycopter being one of them, and i for one will be doing more brushing up on my autos, tail into wind slope landings, hyd failures etc etc at the end of the day they are ALL dirt cheap @ £4 -500 a day. ( you pay more for a dealer mechanic to service your car per hr !!) I think the annual check rides should be much more testing with some really testing moments thrown in for the F E to see the reaction because we can all fly ok when in our comfort zone , so who is ever going to fail their test ??

[helimutt]

NigelH, watch what you're saying. Some people might just take you up on that offer then i'd be out of a job! :oh: Spoke to VeeAny tonight and seems we will go on with this and maybe push it further. Watch this space for details and more. :ok: Jumpseater, I think you have a valid point. ATC often give heli's instructions which some of us do wonder about. We don't like overhead joins when we can come in low level and adjust speed to suit etc:E
I don't see why those interested can't come along. The more the merrier. I'll bring what little experience I have.:O
Anyway, planning has commenced. A web address will be supplied soon, to those interested, but obviously without upsetting the pprune hierarchy and management.;)

[jellycopter]

Nigel

You wrote "I think the annual check rides should be much more testing with some really testing moments thrown in for the F E to see the reaction".

I apologise for giving you such an easy time of it in the past and promise to make you sweat a bit more than last time on your next LPC!!!!!:rolleyes:

JJ

(edited for poor grammar)

[nigelh]

Woops ...me and my big mouth :rolleyes:
ps i also have an faa cpl i ,so i can avoid you !!!

[HeliCraig]

Absolutely count me in.

Based Coventry, but anywhere in Midlands is good.

The East Mids idea was ideal for me!

[Spacer]

Gents, I would definately be up for it. I'm in the north east, but will be away for the next 6 weeks.

[Flingingwings]

Go on then HM, count me in also :ok:

You know where I am :E

[manfromuncle]

Don't be so dismissive of 'standard' FIs flying skills. Yes, I spend a lot of time in the circuit teching basic manouvres, but I can also teach so called 'advanced' manouvers mentioned above. It's all part of the JAA syllabus. You don't need to be a crusty old ex-army/north sea FI to teach this stuff. More respect please.

[g0lfer]

I live the Nort East also and would be interested. How about joining Yorkshire and NE together and meeting at Northern Aviation at Durham Tees Valley? I can arrange if need be.

[nehp]

Based near newcastle,prepared to travel,if it works then next time we meet maybe it could be nearer here as there seems to be a good few Geordies crawling out the woodwork.

Could twist Neils arm from Northumbria to hold a future event in the 'toon' ,I could also contact some ringers who are both commercial and private helo pilots to come along who are not pruners

[KNIEVEL77]

NEHP,

I think Neil owns 'Wings' now, was going to ask him if we could use it for a 'meet' one night.

[Pandalet]

I'm keen! Herts and surrounding areas.

[Heliblob]

Room for 1 more in the South East!:D

[VeeAny]

I've spoken to some influential people today and they have all pledged support for these evenings.

Just a matter of sorting what gets done and where.

Helimutt and I will be in constant touch over the next week or so to try and sort this out.

I don't think we rush in and do it all straight away [like this week or next week], we need a couple of weeks maybe a month to get the message out to as many people as possible.

Cheers

Gary

[bladegrabber]

Count me in please.

Norfolk, suffolk,East midlands wherever!:ok:

[firebird_uk]

Wilco. Home counties.

[helimutt]

I think there will be enough people in Newcastle area to have one fairly soon but as VeeAny says, we're now working on some stuff to be included.
I'll go to the Newcastle one but need at least 1 months notice to adjust roster.

[Martin Barclay]

Based in Scotland but could make Newcastle. Sounds like a really useful event and a chance for some 'Newcastle Brown'.

[helimutt]

A few bottles of 'Dog' and i'll have to make it a full weekend. !!:D

[Pandalet]

Could I request that we aim for a Friday or Saturday evening? That way, those of us with silly weekday jobs don't have to bail early, and could possibly stay overnight to avoid weaving on the motorways...

(knowing how all helicopter pilots are teetotal 'n all)

[helimutt]

don't see why not. Just need to raise awareness for the first one which will probably kick off in Newcastle upon Tyne in the next month or so. If anyone has any objections for it being a fri/sat night let us know.

(off to check the work roster and beer token cupboard :eek:)

[Bertie Thruster]

'fraid only 12 weekends (Sat/Sun) free /year on present roster!

[helimutt]

glad I dont work for that company...jeez!! weekends off? what's that all about? How about a tuesday then?:hmm:
;)

[Whirlybird]

For some of us part time instructors, Saturday is the longest and busiest day!!! I'd prefer a weekday.

[Head Bolt]

Count me in for Newcastle, Wings bar would be a good venue as it has plenty of room........and beer.

K77, just for your info Neil does not own the Wings bar.

[TRC]

This is a great idea, and I wish the various organisers the best of luck in pulling the meetings together.

Will the final dates/venues be published in a thread here on Pprune, or will it be by invitation to those who register an interest and intent to attend?

I would be keen to attend in the S.W./Home Counties.

[VeeAny]

Dates will be here, and in other places around the web. I am also trying to contact most of the flying schools to see if they will promote stuff in their local area.

[Bronx]

Yes the initial idea started here

So why not have Rotorheads evenings to which anyone is welcome?
Just like the PPRuNe 'Gatbash' evenings held in various places around the world? :confused:

Seems a shame a good idea that started in this forum is now being hijacked.

[paco]

It's more of an informal effort at safety meetings, although they may or may not be in licensed premises! I can certainly host at Wycombe in the very near future.

Phil

[Sgtfrog]

Helimutt/Veeany

Happy to help organise South East branch - let me know.

Bronx -

I think the concept of this - as has been said before - :ugh: is an informal get together, I don't want to upset the Pprune moderators/purists but this is not so much a rumour thing as a safety thing. Plus...the guys organising this had the original idea so it has not been hi-jacked.:ok:

SF

[Hedski]

Bronx,
I sincerely suggest you read the entire thread again. Helimutt began the thread for exactly this purpose, hence no hijack.
This is not to organise bashes, rather informal constructive evenings for the single pilot onshore helicopter community with a focus on the less confident/experienced.

Your quote comes from the individual invited to partake in the original post.....!!!
:ugh:

PS: I'm in for anything involving alcohol but several of you knew that already.:E

[helimutt]

The idea is that it's a Rotorheads evening. :)Yes we will put the dates on here and venue so if anyone wants to come along they can, but my initial plan was more helicopter biased if possible. That would include any plank drivers with an interest in rotary and also atc'ers would be most welcome. Sometimes I feel ATC would have a great deal to say, and ask, about rotary too.

I am working on a provisional date for Newcastle, most likely at Newcastle Airport (Wings Bar, beside Flying Club)and see how it goes. Whether it's to be a regular event every couple of months or so, I don't know yet, but I guess that'll be up to those who wish to attend.
Suppose I just need to get people to PM me their names/pprune handles, and let me know if they're available for a Newcastle based rotorheads/interested parties meeting and depending on what night is best, we'll work to it. Looking at week 16th-24th Feb at minute?
Any points/ideas/safety issues/accidents etc you'd like to discuss, let me know and myself and VeeAny's plan is to have some sort of text which can be open to discussion if the Unstable Introverts that we all are, fail to talk to one another. As if!!! Again, all to be very laid back and more of a night out than a serious discussion.

I would also like to ask if anyone would like to take charge of a meeting in their area and co-ordinate that. (Whirlygig??;)) I think myself and VeeAny are going to try and get to as many as possible. Any excuse for a few beers away from home! Let me know.

Posted before I saw Paco had made his offer. How about Paco thinking of somewhere near Wycombe etc (the bar at airfield at Booker?) and people could poss PM him their name/dates free, etc?? Cheers Phil

[helimutt]

So, Paco Wycombe area?
SgtFrog South East area?
VeeAny South West?
Helimutt North East?
Whirlygig East coast posse?

unless of course we have other volunteers?

[Whirlygig]

A-hem?

Cheers

Whirls

[VeeAny]

SgtFrog

I think i may have mentioned to you earlier that we have a venue for free at Redhill if necessary.

Bronx

You seem to have quoted me and imply that I am hijacking the idea, far from it, I have the same passion as Helimutt. Helimutt and I know each other and did start to discuss this on another thread. My only concern is safety, sorry if the approach offends but WTF.

We are actively encouraging ATC chaps and interested parties to pop along. Some people think that this is such a good idea, they've offered to sponsor some of the venues with a bit of food and free accomodation.

I think I've got a venue for free (with a bar) for the South West, will confirm in the next few days.

Thanks to everyone who has volunteered help today, I for one appreciate it.

Gary

[Max Shutterspeed]

I am working on a provisional date for Newcastle, most likely at Newcastle Airport (Wings Bar, beside Flying Club)and see how it goes.

If it doesn't work out, how about Elvington? The air museum has a good room for that stuff. I went to a brilliant talk by the late Lee Attwood, P51 designer, a few years ago. Great atmosphere, I'm sure they have a bar.

Any room for a photog who spends time around helicopters, has a desire to learn and knows how to "strap in, don't touch nothin and shut the f*ck up"..?

MS

[helimutt]

What do you mean passion? I'm just in it for the beer and nights away from home!!!!!!! :E:ok:;)


MS, all welcome. If you have an interest in rotary, feel that safety could be discussed in a non too serious way and could bring something to the table from another perspective (ie photographers who take pics from heli's worrying about the flight. Yes seen that too) then yes, come along.

[Whirlygig]

A-hem? I did volunteer for the Eastern region.

Cheers

Whirls

[Flyin'ematlast]

Count me in just to listen & learn.

Flyin'ematlast Home Counties (Herts).

[Sgtfrog]

Vee -
You did but I just want my posts to match my age!!:E

SF

[Whirlygig]

You won't for long but!!! :}

Cheers

Whirls

[Sgtfrog]

:sad:sigh...so true!

SF

[helimutt]

flyin'ematlast, think of something which bothers you about helicopters. There will be something? Do you fly around wondering if the blades are gonna fly off? bring it up. I'm sure you'll talk to someone with thousands of hours, who knows someone wth thousands of hours, and they won't have heard of blades flying off. Well not many anyway. But you get my drift.
This is a chance to ask all those crazy questions going around in our heads. Did I mention licensed premises would be preferable?

[K48]

Great idea... Im in the South East.... Sgt Frog...? Anyone....:ok:

Chris

[Pandalet]

I'm happy to organise in the Herts area, assuming we don't just combine with Paco at Wycombe (which is only about 15 mins from Herts, if there's nobody watching the motorways).

As there seem to be a couple of people in Herts (slight hijack), if anyone's interested in some group flying or a fly-in to somewhere in the area, drop me a PM.

[SimonCFI]

sounds great!
Probably somewhere near a major airport. I am planning to go to the UK
this spring anyways (probably several times) so let me know when and I can see if I can make it!

[tonge]

Can I add my name to the South East list,

tonge

[Fly_For_Fun]

Would definitely be interested to listen and learn, and have a beer if necessary.

East of England

[ekardj]

I am also interested in joining in South East, as I am Herts based.
Could do weekends or week days

[ShyTorque]

I would be interested in a Midlands / slightly northern venue.

Subject to flying prog, that day and the following day, obviously.

I'm always willing to listen and learn; I'm hoping to get this helicoptering stuff right one day. :O

[KNIEVEL77]

Chaps, i'm going to check out a venue at Newcastle Airport this week for a northern meet but which day of the week would be most convenient?

I was thinking a Monday or Tuesday when it may be relatively quiet?

Any thoughts greatly appreciated!

K77.

[VeeAny]

K77

I think that helimutt might have that one in hand already. Suggest a PM to him to check.

We did discuss some dates for the Newcastle meet the other day, he will know them.

GS

[KNIEVEL77]

VeeAny.

Excellent, thanks.

K77.

[Spacer]

helimutt (http://www.pprune.org/forums/member.php?u=25131) /Knevil77: I am definately up for a meet near EGNT.... any day suits (subject to shift), but as I said earlier, I'm away on business until the middle of March (15th), but if you were to make it then, I'd be more than up for it :) PS: My comms are limited at the mo, so the best way to get in touch is a pm if you need any help

[helimutt]

Things now looking like more planning required so have removed first provisional date for Newcastle.
K77 check your pm's
:)

[KNIEVEL77]

Helimutt,

Feb 19th is good for me!

Have you a location in mind?

Still willing to speak to Wings if you want me to!

K77.

[Nobby 05]

Any news on a venue in the SouthWest?

Nobby

[Hughes500]

Nobby I think they are looking at Dunkeswell at the moment as there is a bar there !

[helimutt]

The story so far. Please check back.
http://www.helicoptersafety.org.uk/safetyevenings.asp

[KNIEVEL77]

Helimutt,

Nice website, i've sent you a PM!

K77.

[Pandalet]

So no chance of a meet at Wycombe / somewhere near Herts, then? I'm (still) happy to organise if necessary :}.

[helimutt]

Pandalet, yes, there will probably be one near there. A few people have asked the same thing. It's all taking a bit more organising than I first imagined as there are other aspects we plan to look at instead of just all shooting the sh*t and drinking beer. :E
That will be a part of it hopefully. As mentioned, watch this space.

VeeAny and myself are hoping to sort out a few things tomorrow.:ok:


NB, not my website, all VeeAnys hard work.

[Whirlygig]

There haven't been many takers for an Eastern region gig, so I will join either a Wycombe based do and/or, depending on location, the midlands.

Cheers

Whirls

[helimutt]

Whirlygig, fear not, I think there will be a few more people from that area. I haven't been in touch with anyone down that way yet and not all possibles visit pprune. Failing that, it would be good if you could get to the other meets.
VeeAny and myself are planning to get to as many as poss.

[170']

Vee/Helimutt....
Are you guys planning to offer the 'weekend in Spain' option also...:cool:;):E
170'

[KNIEVEL77]

170',

You mean you've missed it!!!!! :D

K77.

[The Nr Fairy]

I'm in northern Wiltshire - Wycombe is good, as is Bournemouth / Soton way.

[Brilliant Stuff]

We could put 170' in highback on stage and have him tell us his tales form years gone by that alone would give us ample food for thought, we could even sell tickets for this and there fore pay for his plane ride.:}:}

[Whirlygig]

An Audience With 170' with celebrity guests from around the rotay world! Hey cool BS, you can be his agent and I'll be his manager; we should make a small fortune! Maybe even a couple of quid!!

Cheers

Whirls

[KNIEVEL77]

And we could film it and sell it to Channel 4!

[helimutt]

Hey, if anyone can come up with a cheap spanish option (ie easyjet, cheap accom for a night or two, somewhere to have a beer) i'll put my name down first on the list.:E

[Brilliant Stuff]

What like Moses going to the mountain and not the mountain coming to Moses?:}:}

Whirlygig those couple of quid should buy us a couple of teas though.:}

What do you think 170', ready to be treated like a star?

[DennisK]

I'd like to come. Kent, Surrey, Sussex.

Dennis Kenyon.

[paco]

I should be able to arrange something in Wycombe in the first week in March (3-7th). You will be very welcome Dennis!

Phil

[120torque]

As per the Silverstone '08 thread it appears that most pilots will be in Northants on 30th June why not find a biggish local pub to descend on after the brief - you've probably lost your days flying anyway!!

[Pandalet]

As Ian's court hearing is to be held in the first week of March (starting on the 3rd, possibly running to the 9th), could I suggest we push the Wycombe evening into the second week? How about Friday the 14th?

If nothing else, this'll allow us to debate the outcome!

[Flingingwings]

Only one problem with Friday 14th.............
Cheltenham :eek:

[Bravo73]

Only one problem with Friday 14th.............
Cheltenham :eek:

That sounds like an ideal venue for the South West then! There will certainly be plenty of pro pilots hanging around during the day... ;)

But I guess that there won't be much chatting 'over a beer or two.' :(

[Pandalet]

Good point...Cheltenham runs 11th - 14th, I believe, so I guess most people are going to be tied up all week.

Anything happening the following week? Or does the evening of the 10th work for anyone?

[VeeAny]

Helimutt and I are sat in a motorway service station near humberside putting together some material and venues.

Watch this space !!

We would like to have done about 6 of these by end of April.

Check the wbsite helimutt posted above for more details.

We've got support from the CAA, HCGB, BHAB and GASCo up to now.

The material I've been sent up to now is very good, and I am sifting through it daily and slowly.

We have a venue in the southwest at Dunkeswell, but theres nothing to stop a Cheltenham meet too.

We are trying to get pilots form all the flying schools across the country, as we are looking to grt the message out to people outside the PPrune world (few as they are). I've visited a few already and we have some interest from them aswel.

GS

[heli_ben]

Yes please...

Berkshire!

HB

[Brilliant Stuff]

March 4th would suit me like a treat I will be down south anyway and on the 3rd on London to support Ian therefore the 4th in Wycombe could be good.

170' that went all a tad over my head.

[SmokinHole]

Can you add a mailing list to that site so we can sign up for email updates? I know it might not be that trivial, but it would be good for all.

Anywhere in the South West for me, or anywhere in the South really. I'm keen to take part. But I'm abroad until April, then doing my IR at Bond. So Cheltenham would be good in April/May! :)

Ta

[JFDI]

Yes please - thanks to all those dedicating time to organise.
My preferred area = Wilts/Avon/Glos/Hants/Berks etc
Rgrds
JFDI

[helimutt]

http://www.helicoptersafety.org.uk/about.asp

Please check out the site.

I'm hoping the mods will let this stand as this is all being done on a free basis, with briefing rooms (hopefully) being provided free for the meetings, beer paid for out of your own pocket and all done on a voluntary basis.:ok:

[Foxy Loxy]

If ATCOs are welcome, I'll try to make it to a do in East Anglia. I still have a lot to learn from you rotary peeps!

Foxy

[Baldegret]

The site is a great idea; I'm sure it will develop into an excellent asset for all of us. My thanks to all those involved. I would like to cast a vote for a meeting somewhere in the north-west. Maybe Blackpool is the obvious location for this?

[Foxy Loxy]

As an ATCO, I would like to attend one of these evenings if I can. I'm in E Anglia.

Foxy

[Ioan]

Big well done to you who've organised this. I'll be keeping an eye on the site and getting to what safety evenings I can

[helimutt]

Ok, first meeting pencilled in for 6th March at Newcastle (EGNT). Hour or so in the briefing room at Flying school (many thanks to Neil) and then to the Wheatsheaf pub nearby. Handy for Metro/Road links etc.
Anyone interested please let us know.
Thanks.

[leemind]

Can I put my name down for a South East meet -- ideally London but DennisK's Surrey/Sussex/Kent also works well.

Of course if VeeAny wants to give me a lift to the South West in his shiny machine then I think I'd have to take a day off from the day job :)

[rotorboater]

I would be interested in coming, put me on the mailing list.

[500e]

Me to for south west

[g0lfer]

I'm interested in the Newcastle event, please keep me updated.

[VeeAny]

Helimutt advises that the Newcastle evening will be Thursday 6th March 2008.
He would post this himself but I believe he will be unconscious until Sunday :uhoh:.

1900 at

Northumbria Flying School Ltd
Southside
Newcastle International Airport
Woolsington
Newcastle Upon Tyne
NE13 8BT

Seems we have Neil to thank for the use of the facility.

I'll probably be there work permitting, can we have a show of hands as to who will be coming along.

Next will probably be Redhill or Dunkeswell at some point in late March / early April.

GS

[speds]

wycombe airpark

[paco]

There will be one at Wycombe the week of the 10th - possibly Tues/Wed. Proposed meeting place the Pad

phil

[helimutt]

Not true!!! I am just waiting for the right moment for killing the noisy cockerel who lives over the back from me. Kept me up most of the night! Ok, How many going to Newcastle? 6 people so far that I know of.

[DennisK]

CAPT,

If Tues 11th or Weds 12th March goes firm for Wycombe Air Park, please log me in.

Guess 19.00 hrs ish is a start time.

Listening out.

Dennis Kenyon.

[Whirlygig]

Tues 11th March in High Wycombe would be grand for me; it's the day after my exams so could probably do with a nice cup of tea!

Cheers

Whirls

[Brilliant Stuff]

Can't do those dates am on dayshift, to far to travel afterwards thanks to all the congestion on the M25 and M1.

[paco]

Tues 11th at Wycombe? 1900 in the Pad? I have a couple of guys in a course who will want to attend - they're a captive audience!

phil

[Hedski]

Depending on my own roster situation I might even put in an appearance at Wycombe on the 11th myself. Keep the beer cold Phil.......:E

[Flyin'ematlast]

Phil

Count me in for Tuesday 11th at Wycombe.

Ian.

[Need money]

Bugger - would have been interested in the High Wycombe one - but am in San Francisco all next week !

[johned0]

Me too, please, :ok:

JE

[Lord Mount]

Please put me down as a defnate maybe.
I may be on a course, but if not, I shall be at Wycombe.

LM

[HeliCraig]

I'll be down for the Wycombe one, management permitting (will ask her tonight!!).

[JFDI]

Thanks for organising this - Wycombe Air Park 11th March 19:00 - definite maybe (though more likely than not).
What/where's the Pad? :confused:
JFDI

[Bravo73]

What/where's the Pad? :confused:


It's a bar, between the HeliAir hangar and the Helicopter Services building.

[helimutt]

at least 14 people for the Newcastle one on Thurs night this week. Would have been nice if I could have made the Wycombe one too. Who decided the date?

[Flingingwings]

Work permitting I'm up for the Wycombe get together :ok:

[VeeAny]

There has been a tremendous response on here, elsewere and to the website.

Looks like different people want different things out of these evenings.

Just so there is no confusion not all of these nights will follow the suggested format on the www.helicoptersafety.org site.


The Newcastle one will almost certainly be quite informal, as Helimutt who is putting it together first suggested. I am going along to lend him some moral support and take the draft version of the safety powerpoint thingy I am working on if he wants to use it as

Phils @ Wycombe next week will probably be driven by what people want to talk about on the night (according to a 3 minute conversation we just had), I might get there, depends on work. It will be in the bar at the Pad.

I am definitely going to do two evenings, one at Redhill, one at Dunkeswell. These will start off with the powerpoint thingy but only as an aid to the general discussion and end up in the bar later. Almost certainly late March to Early April.

Not all of these evenings will be the same, some will have a few attendees, it looks likes some will have 30 odd.

If any CFIs want to hold a safety evening and need something to talk about, they are welcome to use my presentation (after its been tried and tweaked a few times).

Tell us what you want to talk about, what you want to see either on here or at [email protected] as my PM box keeps filling up.


GS

[Whirlybird]

Any plans yet for one in the Midlands?

[VeeAny]

Whirlybird

I've been looking for a good midlands location sort of Coventry / Halfpenny Green.

Trying to stay away from helicopter flying school premises, so there is no political affiliation , an open to all kind of policy. However trying to be close to or equidistant from helicopter flying schools in an area.

You got any suggestions ?

Gary

[paco]

One suggestion has been going in and out of busy airspace. I know many people find this confusing when they don't do it a lot.

The date was decided by a flip of a coin in the end, aided by my own commitments.

Phil

[helimutt]

yes, that airspace thing is a b*tch! Hate every second. LMAO

[BobbyBolkow]

Looks like this idea is really taking off (pun un-intended!). Been looking through the thread and mentioned website, but being a bit of a muppet :eek: can't find a date for Dunkeswell - Doh!
Anyway, I'm up for a meeting there, duties and her indoors permitting!!




Does ANYBODY know how to fly this thing?:ugh:

[Spacer]

Gents, I have replied both by email and pm for the Newcastle one tomorrow night. Sorry for the short notice, but I've been out of the country. See you all there!

[tonge]

I'm going by train from London on Tuesday evening, does anyone want to share a cab from High Wycombe?

Tonge

[HeliCraig]

tonge,

I too am planning on getting a train (from Leamington) and can arrive at High Wycombe at 1830 or 1856... Return around 2243. Ddo these times suit?

Probably best to PM me to avoid thread drift.


Craig.

[AlanM]

I like the idea of these events - a great promotion of safety.

Can one of the organisers email me at [email protected] please...! :)

Cheers

[VeeAny]

Alan

Done

Gary

[VeeAny]

BobbyBolkow

You are not being a muppet, I haven't sorted it yet so no date.

I hope to confirm the Dunkeswell and Redhill dates this weekend.

Watch this space and the website.

GS

[Whirlybird]

VeeAny,

Can't think immediately of a Midlands venue. However, Halfpenny Green is a bit awkward to get to. Maybe better to be near the motorway system - East Midlands, Wellesbourne, or Coventry, if we want to be at an airfield.

Can anyone else in this neck of the woods think of anywhere suitable?

[johned0]

I went to a CAA safety evening at one of the flying schools at Coventry and they had all the necessary facilities - large room and bar (for those who aren't flying :) I did a web search but couldn't find any club at Cov with those kind of facilities. Maybe someone with more knowledge of Coventry aerodrome can advise.

JE

[HeliCraig]

I have used the lounge at Coventry Aeroplane Club (www.covaero.com) before for an non flying related meeting - it was ideal. Have PMd VeeAny.

[heliwes]

How about The Oak pub at the entrance to Cov Airport West. The GA side.

[Spacer]

Gents, nice work on Thur night :)

[helimutt]

Shame we didn't have two laptops, 2 overhead projectors 1 large room and also the fact twice as many people turned up than expected! (had to split into two groups) It overran more than expected and we didnt cover half of what was planned really. One point to note, if anyone is going to further meetings, please add to the conversation as these meetings are for everyone, they are not intended to be lectures, more a group discussion. Varied levels of experience attended.
Thanks to those who attended and to SD for his effort in getting all of the attendees. Also thanks to Neil for letting us use the flying school.:ok:

Also thanks to Carling for producing a nice cold lager and britvic for the blackcurrant! :ok::D

[KNIEVEL77]

Mike, Gary,

Thanks very much for a very informative 'chat', sorry I couldn't get for a pint but had an early job in Birmingham the next day!

Are these nights likely to become a regular event?

If there's one thing that sticks in my mind from Thursday night it is WIRE STRIKES!!!!!!

Thanks again and hope to meet everyone again soon.

K77.

[HeliCraig]

Good to hear such good feedback on Thursday - looking forward to tomorrow now!

[VeeAny]

K77

Hopefully the evenings will become fairly regular, with a few each year.

Some will be more prepared discussion like the one on Thurday, some will be like Phils tomorrow where there is no particular plan beforehand and they decide what they are doing when they get there.

I am talking to a couple of organisations at the moment who are willing to help and come and talk at the evenings about some very useful stuff related to helicopters.

Cheers

GS

[Jarvy]

Gary have you a date for the Redhill meeting.
Thanks
Ian

[VeeAny]

I've summarised the Newcastle evening here -> http://www.helicoptersafety.org/newcastle.asp

Jarvy,

I'll let you know shortly about Redhill, Mike and I are trying to get to as many as possible together and we need to compare his roster to my completely random timetable.

Cheers

GS

[Spacer]

Gary, I must say, I like the idea of an "advanced" PPL-H syllabus that we were discussing briefly on Thur night.

[K48]

Is a date for Redhill set yet.... ? Im away 26th March- early April... but would like to come along.

[tonge]

I just wanted to say how good last night was. Even though I had a nightmare getting home, managed to get on the slowest train back into London, then got on the wrong tube and went the wrong way. I'd missed my dinner and the tuna and mayo sandwich in The Pad wasn't quite filling, so I was forced to buy a McDonalds at 11.45pm! and I finally got in at 12.30am!

Paco, it was a pleasure to meet you again, you gave a very informative talk which turned into a good discussion. Inspired me to read your book for an hour on the train!!

DennisK, it was an honour to meet you Sir!

To everyone else who attended, all I wanted to get out of the meeting was to meet up with other helicopter pilots. I don't get to see too many other helo pilots from where I fly from, so I feel like I miss out on that social interaction that perhaps the "plank" drivers seem to have.

Look forward to the next one, I might try and attend the Redhill one as well just to see if I get home in one piece!!

(Can someone now check my speeling!)

Tonge (Simon)

[ShyTorque]

Glad to hear it was a good evening; I'm disappointed that I couldn't attend.

Myself and Upland Goose did pass by Wycombe though, within 12 miles at about 20:00. We were "just having fun" flying home in the dark against a rather stiff breeze and the odd snow shower.

[HeliCraig]

Just like to second Simons comments - thank you Paco, DennisK and everyone else for a very informative evening.

My train journey home was much less eventful thankfully!

See you all next time.

[paco]

It was a pleasure - as mentioned, it is intended to hold something monthly, with a guest speaker or small project, or maybe a visit somewhere. Helicopter Services have generously offered the use of their sim (in small numbers!) for demos of what flying in cloud is really like. Otherwise, watch this space....

Phil

[helimutt]

Glad all went well Phil. As for Heli services offering sim use, spent enough time in that bloody box! Oh, and I know what going into cloud is like and it isn't always fun. I plan to come to some of the next meetings but only if can be worked into my roster. How many attended?

[paco]

It was all a haze... but I think it was 14 or 15, with a couple being stranded due to weather. We managed to persuade the bar to stay open by promising to purchase more beer!

A lot of the discussion was on the pros and cons of leaving "instrument appreciation" in the PPL syllabus, hence the mention of the sim.

STOP PRESS: IF he comes over in April, Shawn Coyle has agreed to give a presentation.

phil

[Pandalet]

I'm up for a sim evening!

And it was great to meet Dennis, too. But who was that wierd white-haired guy who kept going on and on? :ok:

[paco]

That was me! :)

Phil

[Flyin'ematlast]

Thanks Phil for your very informative discussion. I had intended to stay quiet and listen but I found the night very useful.

I doubt that I would attend 12 per year but I will definately be back for many of them.

We discussed the idea of a PPL(H) equivalent of the IAM advanced driving test. If this was set up by those interested outside of the regulation regime in this country but with decent structure and standards imposed do you not think that the insurance industry would still support it to some degree as being better than nothing? At least if we kept it's management outside "the system" then we could avoid the innapropriate syllabus structure of the regulated tests as we discussed on Tuesday night.

Again, Many thanks,

Ian.

[Brilliant Stuff]

What date have you in mind for Shawn's visit?

[Rotormaniac]

Lincs, Notts weekdays, Herefordshire, Shropshire weekends, count me in...

[paco]

Shawn estimates being in UK mid-April ish - the trip is not confirmed yet.

Phil

[VeeAny]

Redhill Date Now Confirmed Monday 14th April 2008 in the Terminal Building at Redhill Aerodrome.

1845 for a 1915 kick off.

If you plan on coming please let us know either here, or to [email protected] . The airfield are putting on some snacks for us and we need to let them know numbers.

Cars need to be through the barrier by 1910 or they may not get in.

More details will appear shortly at http://www.helicoptersafety.org.uk/redhill.asp

GS.

[DennisK]

Gary,

Just to confirm my attendance at Redhill Terminal please.

Can we change the coffees to a bud perhaps!

See you all there,

Dennis K

[Sgtfrog]

Capt S - count me in.:}
SF

[Flashover999]

I will be there!

Looking forward to it.

Flash.

[tonge]

I've sent you an email, but I'd like to attend,

Regards

Tonge

[DBChopper]

Hi Folks,

I'm a bit late to this thread but if you can squeeze me in then I'm keen to come along to the Redhill evening.

Regards,

DBChopper
:ok:

[paco]

That's just up the road for me - see you there!

Phil

[firebird_uk]

Hoping to make it as well.

[paco]

The next one for Wycombe will be in the latter part of April and will involve theuse of the sim at Heli Services. Because this is a limited resource, this will be for PPL(H)s only and will involve being put into bad weather situations and the recovery therefrom.

Will keep you posted on the actual date.

Phil

[HeliCraig]

I, for one, shall look forward to that paco. Thanks for all your (and VeeAny / HeliMutt) hard work!:ok:

[Need money]

Hi Paco,

Will this be available for those mid way through their PPL(H). Probably about 25 hours ?? I understand if spaces are tight and better utilised elsewhere !

Thanks.

[paco]

The lower time the better!

Phil

[helimutt]

A huge thanks to Heli services for the use of their procedural trainer. Some people are going to find out just how long you'll survive when flying into cloud without full training and certification. Phil, maybe you could set up a scenario, bad viz, rain increasing, low cloud, high ground then some fog perhaps? Have a competition to see who can survive longest. Can't see anyone actually surviving and landing safely. :E

Can't remember actually seeing much of the visual cues when I was in that thing for 40 hours!!!

Can you let me know a date to see if I can make it, thanks.

[K48]

Hi Phil,

I would love a test on that sim...is it strictly only PPL(H)s...? Please let me know if numbers might let me on..

I did some self testing on MS2004 in the R22 in zero viz... rain mist et al... I now manage to land a few times... hovering requires monitoring of heading, Alt and speed at a fast rate as well as the usual intsrmnts...VSI too slow.. But hovering is not practical anyway but bit of fun:}... one trick to landing was using a VOR site as they always have clearance around them for an approach and slow run on... 15-20 knot approach allowed for emergency braking/ turning due objects.:ugh:
<No implication that this would work in real life implied:=>

[Sliding Doors]

K48,

I did some self testing on MS2004 in the R22 in zero viz... rain mist et al... I now manage to land a few times... hovering requires monitoring of heading, Alt and speed at a fast rate as well as the usual intsrmnts...VSI too slow.. But hovering is not practical anyway... one trick to landing was using a VOR site as they always have clearance around them for an approach and slow run on... 15-20 knot approach allowed for emergency braking/ turning due objects

Think you'll find that the whole idea behind these safety evenings is to stop advice like that :ugh:

Mimimum IMC speeds would negate the hovering in absolutely zero viz. As would minimums during an IMC approach. There are no 'tricks' to IFR flying :=

Fairly sure that the Sim offer is to show a brief taste to non IR holders the differences between VMC and IMC flying, and to try and provide some knowledgeable guidance on how to think and act before actually going IMC. It's all a bit too late by the time the windows have all gone a dull grey colour :uhoh:

Just reassure me that you don't seriously think MSFS as a sole training aid will help you get out of a situation you shouldn't be in anyway :uhoh:

[Ken Wells]

I don't live that far away and would also love to try the sim

PPL(H) 22 & 44

Cheers

[helimutt]

A bit tough there sliding doors as the sim is actually the Microsoft FS 2002 software!! ;)
Good advice as for not trying it out for real after a few practice PC sessions though!
Having now done an IR, I can't believe some of the weather people still continue to launch off in without an IR themselves or an IFR aircraft.

Hopefully this will be an eye opener.

[paco]

I suspect there will be just such a discussion at Redhill ;)

phil

[helimutt]

As would minimums during an IMC approach. There are no 'tricks' to IFR flying



Well actually there are. One being, if the weather is really pants and on minima, get the other more experienced guy to be handling pilot! ;)

Wish I could have made the Redhill meet.

[Flingingwings]

Always knew you Geordies were light weights :E

[VeeAny]

The last few days have been quite productive.

A few vague details to protect the guilty.

We've got another two aviation related agencies involved this week.

We have another (in addition to Helicopter Services offer to Phil) IR Sim operator who will let use their sim for an evening put on a presentation at their facility or somewhere nearby on the airfield.

We now have a venue close to Bristol.

We've also got some aviation press coverage coming soon.

I managed to catch up with Paco at his office this afternoon, and he has given me some more of the videos he uses in his CRM courses. I am just collecting as many accident reports related to them now as I can, so we know what really happened.

The reason I am being vague about people and organisations is just because I tend to get home to a load of emails at the end of a flying week, and I can't tell the people concerned that I am taliking about them in public and I would prefer they knew beforehand.

Form the emails I have received through the heli safety site and PMs on PPrune i expect 30+ guys on the 14th.

To give you an idea of interest in the project the site has had 1100 individual visitors in the last month.

Cheers

GS

[Flyin'ematlast]

Gary (& Phil & others)

Thanks for all your hard (unpaid) work on this. It's obviously an idea whose time has come and, you never know, it just might start happening abroad as well! :cool:

I note in at least 2 of Phils' books that he bemoans the lack of opportunity for heli pilots to just get together and "chew the fat" compared to the plank boys and just maybe you've hit on the solution.

Thanks again

Ian.

[Pandalet]

I'm up for Wycombe (as always)...

[500e]

Bristol North or South?
Dunkerswell
Coming soon ?

Thanks for reply garystemp await with interest:ok:

[garystemp]

There will be a Dunkeswell or Bristol South hopefully within the next month.

Also possibly Gloucester not too long after.

Looking at Doncaster 1st or 2nd of May as a possibility also.

Gary
(From my can't remember the VeeAny password account).

[Whirlybird]

Excellent. :ok: I should be able to make Doncaster. 1st May is better for me than 2nd.

[ShyTorque]

I also might be able to make Doncaster, subject to being at the correct end of the UK! :)

[helimutt]

I can make Doncaster.
:ooh:

[AndyJB32]

Not seen my work rota yet, but if i'm able to , i'd like to get to the Doncaster meeting.
Andy

[McBad]

Hi Veeany, I would be keen to attend an evening in the Gloucester area... Should also be able to round up a few others.

Cheers,

M

[Evalu8ter]

Bristol or Dunkeswell Please!

[helimutt]

Anyone interested in putting their name down for something VeeAny and myself are looking at adding to the website? Basically, we would be looking for people to be available, at no cost, to fly with less experienced people, ppl's, low timers of all kinds, without them having to worry about the extra expense of paying an instructor.
I'm not trying to take money from instructors but going more along the lines of people getting some tips and hints from maybe slightly more experienced commercial pilots who they probably normally wouldn't get the chance to fly with.
This is not supposed to be a 'free instruction thread creep'!!

I am willing to go flying with people if they want an extra set of eyes in the cockpit or just for the re-assurance on worse weather days etc in the Humberside/Sandtoft area and slightly further afield on my days off work.

I know of another couple of very experienced people in the North Lincolnshire area willing to go on the list. Plan would be to have people around the country willing to fly on days off, weekends, whenever really. Hopefully the safety evenings can include this to be discussed and people get to know others and not be afraid of asking. :ooh:

Just an idea. Thoughts??

ps, might even consider renewing a couple of type ratings.
R22, R44, B206, AS355, S76, Raleigh /strika/grifter/chopper but a bit rusty on them:ok:

[Flingingwings]

Was waiting for this to be suggested :p

Go on then count me in :ok:
Of course subject to the day job :eek:
West Sussex, East Hants, Surrey and Essex - not that I get about much :E

[[email protected]]

Me also - subject to the shift plot - SW generally.

[Overdrive]

It says a lot about pro' helicopter pilots that three of you (so far) are so enthusiastic to offer your free time like this, unpaid... good on you :D

[Flashover999]

Count me in for Essex , Herts and North Kent.

My charges are very reasonable.......Tea, white with 1 sugar! (A bourbon Biscuit is considered a tip).;)

Flash

R44,B206,H269 and R22 if you are light.:ok:

[DennisK]

Sounds a nice idea and I'd be delighted to offer some dual time, and will do that. The difficulty is of course ... what what do I say to my regulars who pay quite a steep rate for the same thing, but I guess I can steer round that.

My offer would be open to an attendee at one of VeeAny's/Capts safety evenings, and perhaps we should restrict it to newly qualified PPLs. Needs to be close to London to avoid too high travel costs.

Can we discuss the idea at the Redhill evening on Monday?

Take care out there,

Dennis Kenyon.

[Brilliant Stuff]

Excellent idea.

I can do Herts and Beds. I need three sugars though please.:}

[KNIEVEL77]

Mike,

I've got a brand new, yes brand new Grifter, Tomahawk and Chopper if you fancy rekindling your childhood..........oh yes and a Commando, Burner, Sinclair C5 and a Dodgem car.........AND i'm open to sensible offers.....!:p

[morris1]

Any idea of a date / venue for doncaster yet please..?

[helimutt]

morris, we're looking at possibly 1st May for Doncaster. Just need to sort rosters, number of people interested. Hope to have details in next few days. :-)


Overdrive, I just like to fly. Don't care what in.
:ok:

I just hope newly minted ppl(h) holders take us up on our offers and we can give something back. I don't profess to be an expert by any means, I learn every day, but know a lot more than I did 15 years ago. :hmm:

[Whirlygig]

Helimutt, has there been any further response for an evening in East Anglia; I'm feeling a wee bit stuck out in the middle of nowhere! Oh yeah, I am!!

Cheers

Whirls

[helimutt]

Remnd me where East Angrier is again? LOL

Actually, i'm trying to sort it soon as I know a few people interested. Have you any idea of numbers of people who might come that you know of? Places for the meeting etc?

VeeAny and myself just been a bit busy so apologies, not leaving you out in the cold.

[Whirlygig]

I know of three or four who may be interested. Norwich is obviously best for us few but Cambridge may be more central for others.

Cheers

Whirls

[Brilliant Stuff]

Please pretty please make it Cambridge.

[Jarvy]

Can't make it to Redhill on monday due to work.
I can offer my time to fly with low hours PPL,s work permitting, in Kent.
Jarvy

[Need money]

Gents,

While not yet a PPL holder - I hope to be in the summer (aiming for an August completion), and I for one would be extremely grateful for the offers of someone flying with me in the early days for some confidence / comfort factor.

Amongst other things I intend to do - I will be looking at taking my girlfriend to a hotel / restaurant for dinner (as you do !) - and it would be great to fly it at least once with an experienced pilot - to talk me through, lend their experience to approaches, hazards, what to look out, things that may catch me out etc etc.

So hopefully I will be able to take advantage of your generous offers :D

Hope to meet some of you at the next Wycombe meet.

:ok:

[Whirlybird]

My first thought about this free flying bit was that as a career instructor I wouldn't do it. After all, I really need the money - possibly more than a lot of PPLs! I spent all mine getting qualified.

But on second thought....

a) I don't do enough flying other than basic instructing, and I'd rather enjoy it.
b) It could really help someone, and a lot of people have helped me in the past and it's time I passed it on.
c) Please, pretty please, may I log some of it if I'm actually teaching you something? You see, I'm coming up to my last year before instructor revalidation, and though I have zillions of instructing hours (well, around 350 anyway) from when I did it full time, now I'm part time and doing not much more than 20 or 30 minute trial lessons...I may have trouble getting my 30 instructing hours in the third year!!!!

So on that basis, any PPL who's not too far from TNT is welcome to contact me!

[helimutt]

Hope all goes well for Redhill. Lot of work gone into it by VeeAny and others. Look forward to the update on the evening.

I just hope everyone who attends gets something positive out of it all.:D

[KNIEVEL77]

Hi Mike,

Is there anything else planned for 'up north' because as you will remember due to the massive turn out in Newcastle we only got through half of your and Gary's prepared safety brief?

Julian.

[helimutt]

Yes, more to come. Watch this space.
:ok:

[Ioan]

Just wanted to say thanks to Gary and all the others involved for the huge amount of effort that must've gone into tonight... also especially to the poor CAA guy (I'm sorry I can't remember your name too!) for bravely facing up to us all :ok::ok:
Very interesting and useful evening, I'm sure others feel the same. For anyone who's not been to one before and is thinking about it, definitely get to one. I don't know how many thousands of hours worth of experience were in that room but it was well up there!
Cheers Gary! :ok:

[leemind]

I'll second that -- very useful and great to see so many friendly faces!

Well done Gary et al. :D

[DBChopper]

Huge thanks to Gary, Dennis, Phil and Dave (CAA) for your input, advice and opinions, but most especially to Gary who has obviously put hours and hours of work into preparing the presentation.

Ioan is right - if you haven't so far then get yourselves along to one of these evenings. A few of us were talking and agreed that is was like a condensed "safety course", of huge benefit, and we look forward to more ideas still to come.

It was also nice to put a few faces to PPRuNe names.

Thanks again guys,

DBChopper
:ok:

[DennisK]

Yes Gary ... a very worthwhile evening and thanks from all of us for the many hours of work it required.

Sorry I couldn't get to chat individually with more guys/gals. Future evenings will resolve that. Put me down for Exeter please Gary.

Some open questions for last night's pilots.

Was the format suitable? ie would you like to see more or less formal. How about sitting in the round, conference like ... where numbers allow. For Gary's next meeting, would you like a specific agenda where attendees nominate the subjects, and/or possibly a panel of two/three of the experienced guys for a 'Question Time' session?

I'm not sure how the bulk of pilots felt last night, but from my viewpoint I just want to impart anything I have learned over my fifty years flying, that can be helpful to our up and coming pilots. Just any format/discussion/even chit-chat that will help bring down the incident/accident rate.

I think the question session would prove a good platform for that. I'd like to see even more input from the newly qualified and training PPLs. I find it all too easy to sit in my box of isolation and the occasion such as last night's Redhill pilot gathering changes that.

Views please lads/ladesses. I'm always in touch with Gary Spender and Phil.

PS. Next time ... no pot shots at the CAA. There are better platforms for that. We are all about safe flying and safety awareness.

A great evening all, and thanks for the first beer at the 'Station' pub. Be with you on our next southern safety evening.

Safe flying all out there,

Dennis Kenyon.

[Flingingwings]

Cheers Gary (et al),

An enjoyable evening - the FREE beer and sarnies being a nice touch :ok:

Good to finally put a face to Dbchopper :p

Will try and attend more of them, albeit I got it in the neck for talking with you outside the pub for so long:ugh::ugh: Christ that was chilly.

For next time if you (Gary) could resist the urge to pollute the atmosphere :E

Good luck today at the Ivory Towers :ok:

FW

[DBChopper]

Likewise FW, and I'm not envious of your job at all.... :*

Dennis, in answer to the points you raised, yes I do think the format is appropriate for the inaugural round of these evenings. The meeting-round-a-table format is a nice idea but I think the sheer numbers and limitation of venues might make that problematic. I liked the fact that the "agenda" (for want of a better word) was a general overview of light helicopter safety and accidents and I suspect in the future it may be narrowed down to more specific subjects per evening. For now, it works and the fact that it overran just points to the enthusiasm and interest in the room.

A Question Time format for the future sounds like a great idea. PPRuNe might be the ideal forum for interested parties to post an idea of their questions to give those of you in the hot seat time to prepare (yeah, like you need it ;)).

As for pot-shots at the CAA, well I guess that was always going to happen and could be considered something of an occupational hazard by Dave and his colleagues (for some reason people always moan to me about GATSO cameras... :hmm:) I don't think it got too out of hand and, as we were reminded, he is on our side as his job is specifically safety.

DBChopper

[K48]

Firstly a sincere thanks to Gary for a great presentation and your much needed input to the industry, it's a great thing you are doing. Phil's point about heli pilots being 'on their own' is a real issue, which your gatherings help to address. I am sure attendance will grow even more.
And thanks to Dennis and Phil for your ongoing and invaluable input to the project and Dave's enlightenment of the CAA viewpoint.
Dennis, we had a bit of a chat about display flying and the developmental phase in the early days- very interesting, thankyou. It seemed it rather had parallels to the developmental phase of kitesurfing of which I was/am a part. Unfortunately in kitesurfing there are even now fatalities and serious injuries on an intolerable scale, largely due to poor equipment design and a lack of an accident reporting program.

The suggestion of a round table or perhaps a few round tables.. was a good idea Dennis, especially at the pub? It seems in one evening one cannot cover everything and perhaps an idea would be to have one feature /case study at each meet discussed in real depth, e.g, there was much discussion about avoiding inadvertant IMC but perhaps not enough conveying of the latter stages of control loss and what actually can happen - and why to prevent or deal with it. I don't know how this can be demonstrated in a presentation, perhaps video. On that point I have a recent experience with IMC in the alps, not flying, but snowboarding that people will find relevant and provokes a thought for training ideas:
Bearing in mind my background is one of a successful career as a kitesurfer and my balance/spatial awareness is fairly well trained, this embarrasing example demonstrates what a 'whiteout' (cloud) can do:
In a complete whiteout on skis, for example, you can spread your feet, use your sticks to feel the ground and stabilise yourself, however on a snowboard you have to balance on either your toes or your heels and have no other reference of touch/contact with the ground. It's all about balance.
I was doing a safe off piste run that I knew well, using some marks to find my way in very poor visibility of about 15m. The marks were about 15m apart.. To get to my favourite bit (which was in better viz lower down in trees) I had to go across a very flat powder field in cloud/ falling snow at slow speed. At one point the viz closed down to about 2m and I could only just see previous tracks 1m in front of my board. With arms out to balance I could not really tell how fast I was moving until I looked down.. I was going very slowly... backwards! The motion of the precipitation was not helping either. I stopped and hunted for the next mark (a stick) and tried to balance... searching out into the murk. I have two sayings that have kept me safe in life: Never move into a space you can't see, and time 'cures' conditions. So I waited, relaxed and patient....basically blind. While standing, waiting for it to clear, I felt a sudden rush of wind on my face... the ole semi circular canals picked up the movement about half way down... I was falling over! Normally one can just step forward but my feet were bound.. Luckily I realised just in time to bend my legs and put a hand out as I came into contact with the snow in Charlie Chaplin type fashion!! It was hilarious at the time but was extremely useful in terms of an excercise in IMC.
Although Sim training is a good idea, I think very useful might be a practical demonstration to pilots that reveals this shortfall in their human balance system; perhaps a white room, standing with feet tight together and mist pumped in.. and padding for when people hit the deck..:E:}

[Pandalet]

Actually, reading Dennis' post above, something I'd quite like to see, if at all possible, is something about helicopter aerobatics. I know almost nothing about aerobatics in general, and helicopter aerobatics in particular (beyond that they're not a good idea in an R22), so to hear from someone who actually does/did them would be fascinating.

Areas covered could include:

How does one get into rotary aerobatics
History
What permits / licenses / etc are required
Some moves and how they workIn the same way that instrument appreciation in the PPL doesn't in any way qualify one to fly IFR, I absolutely don't envisage this as being something that people attend, then go and have a go at on their own. It's just an area I think would be interesting, and it seems like something that would fit quite nicely into an evening's gathering.

I'd hoped to ask Dennis about aerobatics at the Wycombe meet, but sadly didn't get the chance. Hence the suggestion :)