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hugh flung_dung
16th Oct 2007, 20:31
I need to ferry an aircraft to a new owner but seem to recall that the log books are not allowed to be carried in the aircraft - can someone point me at where this is specified? (I've looked through the ANO without success.)
I'm interested in whether it would be acceptable to have them in a fire-proof box, or if there's another way to have them on board.

HFD

_FL600_
16th Oct 2007, 21:02
Are you asking about your own pilot logbooks? Or, the airplane's?

pilot logbook: haven't seen any regulation preventing them from being on board. however, i wouldn't personally carry them along in my flights just in case,,

airplane logbook: it should be on board all the time.

mono
16th Oct 2007, 21:31
Err,

Not true. The a/c technical log should always fly with the aeroplane. However the airframe, engine, propeller logs should not.

Contacttower
16th Oct 2007, 23:21
Is there an exemption for FTOs? Certainly whenever I go flying all the docs are left in the clubhouse.

ATC Watcher
16th Oct 2007, 23:39
I'm interested in whether it would be acceptable to have them in a fire-proof box,

I do not think that if the aircraft crash and catch fire that the books would be any good to anyone . I would send maintenance records and books by DHL and carry Aircraft logbook (and Airworthiness's. and insurance certificate ) with me in case of check at destination or during transit.

ATC Watcher
16th Oct 2007, 23:42
Certainly whenever I go flying all the docs are left in the clubhouse.
The aircraft log should not if you leave your based airfield for another one, even within the same country.

hugh flung_dung
17th Oct 2007, 10:01
Thanks folks, it's the aircraft logs (airframe, engine, propellor) that I'm interested in. Can someone point me at where it's stated that they can't be on board?

Ref other docs: there's a bit of misinformation in the replies. The ANO states: "If the flight is intended to begin and end at the same aerodrome and does not include passage over the territory of any country other than the United Kingdom, the documents may be kept at that aerodrome instead of being carried in the aircraft." See para 86 for more info.

HFD

themoonsaballoon
17th Oct 2007, 10:52
I dont know the reference but by the laws of best practice and common sense send them Fedex or DHL and get a good night sleep with one less thing to worry about,
TMAB

chainsaw
17th Oct 2007, 22:20
hugh fd

Aircraft logs are maintenance records that MUST be kept - see Annex 6 Part I subsection 8.4. See also ICAO Doc 9760 AN/967 Airworthiness Manual Volume I regarding record-keeping (which includes maintenance records referred to in Annex 6).

6.8.4 Record-keeping

6.8.4.5 Maintenance records should be kept in such a way that they are protected from hazards such as fire, flood, theft or alteration.

I'm not an engineer, but I'd think that carrying the maintenance records onboard the aircraft to which they belong is (probably) going to expose them to hazards.

Any other 'takes' on hugh's problem?

PantLoad
17th Oct 2007, 22:36
I don't know of any reg that either requires or prohibits the carrying of the maintenance logs (I'm not talking about the aircraft Tech Log.) on board the aircraft when the aircraft is going to fly. I may be ignorant. However, I've always considered it 'not a good idea' to carrry these legal documents on the aircraft during flight.

In the past, what I've done, is to FedEx (I'm not doing an ad for FedEx here in PPrune.) the maintenance logs to my destination. Maybe send them the day before my flight...so they arrive close to the time of my arrival. That way, these legal documents are protected from the crash of said aircraft. It's expensive to do this, but a good idea.

The main problem is the loss of these important records in the event of a crash. The investigating authorities will not have available important histories for accident investigation.

Sorry I cannot quote any regulation pro or con.

PantLoad