NEWCASTLE - 3

[Charlie Roy]

as of today the ryanair site is saying that winter flights are available for booking...does this confirm the demise of the newcastle / bergamo route?

No, the Milan based aircraft involved remains unscheduled for its daily afternoon rotations.

The aircraft is currently used in the afternoons/evenings to fly to Charleroi (1234567), Liverpool (1-3-5-7) and Newcastle (-2-4-6-). A Charleroi based aircraft will now take over the evening Charleroi to Milan flight.

Leaving the Milan based aircraft free to introduce a couple of new routes and then probably operate new/different schedules to Liverpool and Newcastle.

So while Ryanair are saying that the winter flights are available, in reality the schedules for Milan, Luton, Cork, Dublin and Shannon are only in semi-finalised state. Expect some minor to majour winter schedule changes for these bases in the next couple of weeks, with new route announcements still likely from Milan, Luton and Dublin.

As soon as Ryanair have sorted out the new routes it wants to launch this winter from Bergamo, then we will know for certain the furture of the Liverpool/Newcastle flights. Personally I guess that they will not be axed, and Liverpool may actualy see an increase...

[airhumberside]

Esperia Air's website shows they no longer plan to serve NCL but will use Durham instead

[fl dutchman]

New route from NCL starts 11 Dec 2x weekly rising to I think 3 or 4 times weekly late Dec to Jan,then back to 2x weekly until 15 April

[rmskynet]

For winter flights keep watching the above.
Heard rumours going around of a big route annoucement for this coming winter and next summer.

JET 2 April 07 new flight/flights, sorry can't divulge anymore info.......YET!:mad:

[crewboi83]

Sat CMF is a W pattern with the MAN based 737 by the looks of it

[transwede]

rmskynet, go on give us a clue!!!!!!!

Route/routes from NCL for 07??? Long haul, expansion of shorthaul ops???

[HH6702]

Jet2

It will be all short haul flights. Most of the routes will be new but some i think will take easyjet on.

Exciting times ahead.

[HH6702]

We all Chambery would be a flight for the winter

[transwede]

Someone needs to give easyjet a run for their money. Too many cancellations, tonights is another prime example, IBZ rescheduled by over 12 hours (a delay in other words) due to 'Operational@ reasons. If easy do not get this crewing crisis sorted pretty soon, passengers will loose confidence and look elsewhere, hence a market will open up for other loco operators.

Some ideas for Jet2....

Venice, Madrid, Milan, Valencia, Athens, Krakow, Warsaw.......

While I'm on please would some of the charter operators look at expanding frequency to the likes of Kefalonia and adding new destinations, Mykynos, Sicily, Sardinia, thassos etc or lets be daring Cancun??!!

[CentreFix25]

Airport have tried to persuade tour operators to do a Mexico, but it's not gonna happen (at least not before '08)

[3202b]

Anybody know why the Thursday Monarch SFB flight has been cancelled next year? :sad:

[nclbase]

I wasnt aware MON were not operating the Thursday SFB - who is taking it on?

[CentreFix25]

The tour operators selling on the Thursday this year (Thomson, Thomas Cook and Main Street USA) are only selling Saturday departures for next year, which i assume means its been pulled and not replaced.

If it is to only be one flight a week to Florida, that would make it (if my memory serves me right) the least number of seats per week to Florida in 20 years.

[nclbase]

TCD are planning a 767 operation on a Friday serving the regional bases from a hub at SFB. It will operate on a fortnightly basis from May through to Sept Ihave been led to believe. Heard this through a travel agent so not sure how true
Ever so surprised there is only one flight - I always thought FLorida was very popular with the North Eastern folk

[CentreFix25]

Can't understand it myself, pax figures for May were as good as if not better than the other regionals. Wonder if they have concerns over the price of fuel and plan fewer seats at a higher cost.

[transwede]

nclbase what airlines 767 a/c are TCD using to serve regional bases? Hopefully not XL a/c, as the last time these a/c were used out of NCL was, lets be honest a disastr! If TCD are starting SFB ops then maybe there is not the market for 2 A330 flights and TCD service, though years ago there used to be 5 SFB rotatations per week from NCL, so surely market potential is there!

Maybe an opportunity for GSM?? :ok:

Airlines/Tour Ops do need to start realising the potential of long haul holiday flights from regional airports. Look At FCA from BRS and TOM from Doncaster, it obviously is viable and these airports are similar in catchment areas to Newcastle.

Delays

Anyone know what is going on with AJY at NCL. Sat evening service heavily delayed and sunday morning flight didnt even operate. The airline seems to be dogged by technical problems and delays fairly often and surely they cannot sustain service levels such as 15+ hours delays in the long term. Charters will stop chartering them and passengers will not want to fly them. :ugh:

So, expansion here is gradually starting to increase again, abeilt at a steady pace, so whats next? What else can be offered at NCL?

[nclbase]

The TCD will be a TCD branded 767 - I hear these aircraft are much improved.

[fl dutchman]

Wouldnt get two excited about TCD to SFB. They cancelled this years programme from NCL before it started as well as a small programme in 2005.
What about the Dominican republic ( Monarch) on Fridays is that still operating.

If all this is true in either case there will be a shortage of seats from NCL to Orlando. Ideal opportunity for Globespan from NCL or even Durham!!!

[RobT100]

Dont know when the penny is going to drop with you lot.........if you want transatlantic then get yaselves to LHR/LHW, MAN, BHX or GLA/EDI.
NCL will never play with the big misters :)

[nclbase]

TCD have not operated in the past from NCL as they havent had the a/c suitable ie 280 or so seats. They now have a better plan utilising a 767 new to the TCD livery and operating every fortnight rotating daily through the regionals

[fl dutchman]

nclbase

Their 2006 brochure said they would have NCL flights but they were all cancelled. I think they proposed to use a 767 for these flights. In 2005 they advertised 747 flights, again did not op. Will be interesting to see if they go ahead this time

[CentreFix25]

Your right for once!! NCL will never be in the same league as LHR,MAN,GLA etc. Nor will they ever be in the same league as LBA! what with NCL shifting twice as many pax as LBA, and i can't really see the gap closing.

If the TCD happens (Not seen any evidence yet) it wont be flying for Thomson or Thomas Cook as they just seem to have cut capacity. Seems strange that both would reduce at the same time, but prehaps one went first and the other decided they couldnt/wouldnt fill the plane.

transwede, have to disagree with you on the expansion front. I think its ground to a halt: RYR BGY still not bookable past October, BA LGW down 4 to 3, LCY down 4 to 3. There are some gains (EIN to dublin) but overall i think its levelled out.

[RobT100]

Your right for once!! NCL will never be in the same league as LHR,MAN,GLA etc. Nor will they ever be in the same league as LBA! what with NCL shifting twice as many pax as LBA, and i can't really see the gap closing.

Oh dear CentreFix25, whoever mentioned LBA being in the same league or shifting as many pax as NCL ?

Ive told you before, put your binoculars away along with your spotters notebook and trot along to drink your cocoa ! Its bedtime little boy :8

[transwede]

Where will the 767 fleet from TCD come from? Another carrier or is excel gaining more 767's to operate for TCD?

I see XL are suffering again at NCL, Funchal flight indefinately delayed from 10am today to some time tomorrow due tech 737-400.

[HH6702]

GSM to SFB

rumours of the above to start May 2007 with 2 or 3 x a week


Also on the charters front the 2nd editions from the tour operators are out.
Has anybody spotted anything new yet?

[CentreFix25]

Touched a nerve there, knew that would get you going! You must read up on bandwidth, it'll keep the mods happy!

[nclairportfan]

Found this on another forum and thought you might all be interested!
EUROPEAN FLIGHTS - SCHEDULED
The latest CAA stats for June show:
BRU - down by 28% to 3831 pax but not surprising as SN have dropped one flight per day. Still better than other UK regional airports.
CPH - up by 23% to 2383. Where is our promised double daily?
NCE - up by 2% to 7119 pax. Can't believe EZY may drop this for winter.
CDG - up by 10% to 15855.
SXF - down by 5% to 6295.
DUS - up by 36% to 1573.
HAJ - down by 24% to 2337.
ORK - 2860 pax but new route so no comparison to last year.
DUB - up by 37% to 14487.
BGY - down by 49% to 3849 mainly due to FR cutting frequency.
PSA - 2507 pax but new route so no comparison to last year.
CIA - up by 9% to 7030.
AMS - up by 40% to 31059 mainly due to Jet2 starting on the route.
FAO - 5146 Scheduled pax carried. No comparison.
BCN - down 2% to 7415.
MAH - 1654 scheduled pax. No comparison.
BGO - 2440 scheduled pax. No comparison data.
TRF - 4499 scheduled pax. No comparison data.
GVA - down 26% to 4849. Reduced frequency.
PRG - up 1% to 7322.
BUD - down 34% to 4360. Reduced frequency on route.
DOMESTIC FLIGHTS - SCHEDULED
LGW - up by 11% to 20492.
LHR - down 11% to 39676.
LCY - 1594 pax. No comparison data.
STN - up 3% to 27185.
ABZ - up 47% to 2467.
BFS - up 16% to 19481.
BHX - static at 2245.
BRS - static at 20876.
CWL - down 20% to 1429.
EXT - up 27% to 4918.
INV - 200 pax. No comparison data.
IOM - down 17% to 693.
SOU - up 20% to 11319

[transwede]

HH6702 not realised anything new from tour operators, many still selling the same programme as this year, bar a few changes and the cancellation of thu Monarch SFB service. Maybe GSM are going for the pax instead. Some operators have not yet released S07 so there still maybe new things to come.

Excel

Poor old XLA, they really do seem to be going through a tough time at NCL. Firstly their 737 was delayed heavily on a FNC rotation, meaning todays JTR had to be subbed, at a substantial cost i would imagine and now the AY 757 is suffering with a hefty delay on this mornings PMI rotation, which leaves its second rotation of the day delayed, unless subbed again. its a shame really, as XL do offer a pretty good service, just their a/c seem to let them down.

With regards to GSM, I know its a touchy subject on this forum, but could they really find suitable destinations to operate a full long haul programme at NCL, or will a/c just pass through 2/3 times per week, should they ever begin operations. If what HH6702 has heard is true, NCL quite possibly could go from having very limited SFB seats to a massive increase, should MON, TCD and GSM be operating. MYT will also use 767 during April for a SFB flight.

[heslop2006]

GSM to SFB

rumours of the above to start May 2007 with 2 or 3 x a week


Also on the charters front the 2nd editions from the tour operators are out.
Has anybody spotted anything new yet?


In the back of the Sunset brochure the 2nd edition it still says Cancun - but outbound via London Gatwick.

[RobT100]

Touched a nerve there, knew that would get you going! You must read up on bandwidth, it'll keep the mods happy!
You should read up on 'flaming'

[HH6702]

Cancun lets hope so.

Dont think that it is bookable yet looking at the website

[Richard Taylor]

ABZ up 47%? Just think what could happen with COMPETITION on the route!

:D :ok:

[lukeylad]

nclbase

Their 2006 brochure said they would have NCL flights but they were all cancelled. I think they proposed to use a 767 for these flights. In 2005 they advertised 747 flights, again did not op. Will be interesting to see if they go ahead this time

if its a 747 its going to have to lift off light and refuel maybe some where else as ncls runway is too short for a fully loaded 747 to take off from.

[transwede]

Was under the impression that the TCX group had cancelled the charter to Cancun, maybe its just a brochure errata.

It seems that the moving of airlines between handling agents at NCL is continuing, with AF rumoured to be switching from Servisair to Swissport, on the cards really due to the closeness of AF and KL.

For summer 2007 does anyone know what the charter carriers have planned or is it the same as this year? 2 TCX 757, 1 MYT 320, 2 TOM 757, 1 TOM 733, 1 FJE 757 and 2 XLA units (is it the 734 and is AY returning?)?

[Kev 1]

This new venture will be based at Newcastle, operating ATR-42 aircraft. They plan to serve a UK destination 14 times per week and an Irish one 8 times a week, unable to confirm the actual destinations at this stage.

First flight 1st May 2007, they are currently recruiting for Cabin Crew at the moment.

Cheers


Kev

[Jamesair]

FLYSUNJET

more can be read about this NCL startup on the FLYSUNJET thread.

[nclbase]

TRANSWEDE

XLA are rumoured to have a 738 and the finnaor unit again. unless they get the 734 again

I will be amazed in Flysunjet gets off the ground - see the other thread. the domain is registered under a sole trader. I wish it all the best and would love it to prove me wrong....

[HH6702]

flysunjet

Lets play a game

Here's my guess

Newquay and Shannon

[rmskynet]

rmskynet, go on give us a clue!!!!!!!

Route/routes from NCL for 07??? Long haul, expansion of shorthaul ops???

Her Majestys Stationary! :mad:

[Maude Charlee]

if its a 747 its going to have to lift off light and refuel maybe some where else as ncls runway is too short for a fully loaded 747 to take off from.

No problems getting 310,000kgs of 742 out of NCL last summer to SFB, although it did require 07 as opposed to 25 due to obstacle clearance requirements.

[lukeylad]

Maude Charlee

cheers for that dude!!

[nclairportfan]

I feel there is still lots potential for an ATR operator at Newcastle - as long as the fares are reasonable. My suggestions for flysunjet:

Domestic
NCL - NQY - once daily should be sufficient in summer, reduced frequency in winter.
NCL - ABZ - would need to challenge T3 on price and frequency.
NCL - NWI - a new route for NCL. Likely to be popular if double daily.
NCL - JER - once daily perhaps summer only.
NCL - BHX - would need to challenge T3 on price and frequency.
NCL - LPL - A good domestic route, which at the right price and frequency is likely to work well.
NCL - MAN - A good domestic route, which at the right price and frequency is likely to work well.
NCL - CWL - worked well for Air Wales?

European

NCL - SNN - works from other regional airports.
Various french airports i.e. LIG, BOD and TLS.

[Pembo330]

Folks,

My brother was supposed to be on the Sunday morning Larnaca flight last weekend. When he turned up at the airport Helios (or should I say Alphajet) had cancelled the flight. Very rare for a charter flight to be cancelled, though they are often delayed.

He and 60 others were bussed to Birmigham for a flight out of there some 12 hours later where they ended up flying on a Lebonese airbus.

Anyone know what happened to the original flight?

Anyone know why only 60 passengers were bussed to Birmingham? What happened to the rest?

And who filled the rest of the Lebonese plane; surely it didn't just fly with 60 PAX?

Seems Helios continue to suffer terribly from only having two aircraft (why sub one to Excel??). Used to love this airline, but after events over the last 12 months, and their repeated lengthy delays, not sure I would chose to fly with them.

[nclbase]

Pembo330

The Ajet a/c was tech on sat night at NCL and the crew went out of hours. The flight which goes out on a sat night then operates back to take pax out on Sunday. The sat night flight operated at 1730 on Sunday after pax were put in hotels.

The Sunday flight which was supposed to go at 1100 was not technically cancelled as pax were coached to BHX and operated from there. The remainder of the pax were sent on other flights from other airports which were booked by the respective tour ops.

I feel so sorry for the poor passangers.:bored:

[Jamesair]

Jet 2 have announced NCL - Murcia timetable for the winter season...it varies from 3 to 4 flights weekly.

[heslop2006]

Anyone know why she was here ?

[HH6702]

The yearly loudes flight

[HH6702]

It's not with an ncl based aircraft

[lukeylad]

i think a MAN OR LBA bird is coming up to do it.

[airhumberside]

There is no mention of Djerba flights in the 2nd Edition Summer 2007 Airtours brochure

[transwede]

That Airtours route to Djerba has been started and stopped quite alot. It was originally mean't to operate last winter, then this summer but has never materialised. Its about time that NCL's tour operators started realising the potential of more unusual charter destinations, instead of the usual PMI, ALC and IBZ. Maybe something like Dubrovnik, Pula....

Remember when destinations like Kefalonia, Santorini, Naples etc were introduced, they went down a storm and are still operating now, more often than not at full capacity. With an airline like XLA and FJe, who are not heavily dependant on one sole charter company maybe some of the smaller operators can club together and come up with something.

As far as charter operations go, there is nothing new on the horizon, as yet but there is still many stuff not yet on sale for S07.

Have the rumours surrounding EZY dropping an aircraft been confirmed. Will be sad to see BUD, SXF and NCE go, all popular routes, maybe a chance for Jet2 to step in, particularly NCE.

NCL still needs more routes like MAD, VCE, Milan (proper), KRK etc on a loco basis and whatever happened to Athens?

[fl dutchman]

[QUOTE=transwede]
Have the rumours surrounding EZY dropping an aircraft been confirmed. Will be sad to see BUD, SXF and NCE go, all popular routes, maybe a chance for Jet2 to step in, particularly NCE.
----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
I understand they will still have 6 based aircraft this winter even if these routes are dropped. There are extra daily rotations to Stansted, Belfast, Bristol and Paris CDG, so 6 a/c will still be needed. There is the possibility that SFX may operate with a Berlin based aircraft.

Having said all that on some days right now due to the crew shortages in effect there only operating 5 aircraft. This will obviously have an impact on Pax numbers through the airport not to mention customer confidence. Does anyone know what they are doing to fix the situation?? and when will it be sorted??

[CentreFix25]

Ryanair thread has the RYR Bergamo as being pulled.

[Travel Agent]

That Airtours route to Djerba has been started and stopped quite alot. It was originally mean't to operate last winter, then this summer but has never materialised. Its about time that NCL's tour operators started realising the potential of more unusual charter destinations, instead of the usual PMI, ALC and IBZ. Maybe something like Dubrovnik, Pula....
Remember when destinations like Kefalonia, Santorini, Naples etc were introduced, they went down a storm and are still operating now, more often than not at full capacity. With an airline like XLA and FJe, who are not heavily dependant on one sole charter company maybe some of the smaller operators can club together and come up with something.
As far as charter operations go, there is nothing new on the horizon, as yet but there is still many stuff not yet on sale for S07.

If a route is not selling then a tour op will pull plug on route - pointless operating at a loss!

[RobT100]

Ryanair thread has the RYR Bergamo as being pulled.
I would pull it as well

[fl dutchman]

RobT100

Why? Average load 160 pax.

[CentreFix25]

Yes, why Rob? - you fountain of all knowledge. You dont know what the yield is, so what are you basing that comment on? Unless your being the usual pain in the backside.

[10 DME ARC]

Sorry RobT100 but the Bergamo will be on sale shortly for the winter!:)

[Charlie Roy]

Sorry RobT100 but the Bergamo will be on sale shortly for the winter!:)

A post on the Ryanair thread by cesare.caldi suggests otherwise :confused:
"SDR -2-4-6- replace BGY-NCL"

Unless a Dublin based aircraft will do a W on it or something... ?

[10 DME ARC]

Charlie
Rumors about new Ryanair route from BGY

Only rumours.......

[HH6702]

If ryanair have pulled the milan expect jet2 to pick it up and increase the number of flights

[transwede]

Was there not to be an announcement in the near future from JET2 regarding expansion?

[fl dutchman]

If ryanair have pulled the milan expect jet2 to pick it up and increase the number of flights
Jet 2 have announced Milan from Edinburgh for summer 07 4x weekly so its unlikley they will start NCL. They have also launched Edinburgh to Pisa with increased frequency for summer 2007. Does this mean NCL will loose Pisa next summer as many of the pax travelled from Scotland to use the NCL service?.

[crewboi83]

Blackpool and Manchester are in close proximity and they have routes served from both bases such as PMI. Also Manchester and Leeds is less than an hour away door to door and they service the same destinations bar the odd one of 2 destinations. So i dont think think that NCL will loose the PSA, and I wouldnt be suprised to see NCE, BUD and BGY annouced.

[transwede]

Easyjet have definately proven that there is a market from NCL to NCE and BUD, as have FR to BGY, so it may not be an unlikely surprise to see Jet2 add these routes, maybe at a reduced frequency, similar to their PSA and MAH rotations, but will it need a 3rd based a/c to serve them?

I see Jet2 as NCL's new biggest budget carrier!:D

[GrahamK]

Jet2 are launching Newcastle to Krakow flights this winter, operating 2 x weekly on Mondays and Fridays :ok:

[transwede]

Atlast, something a bit different for NCL. Maybe this is the start of Jet2 branching out into eastern europe? Hopefully we might see BUD re-instated or the possiblity of WAW etc..........

[HH6702]

great news from jet2 and still alot more to come.
Here is the timetable from oct till end of dec so far

Aircraft 1

LS551/2 123456 . AMSTERDAM 07:40 10:50
LS579/80 . . . . . . 7 CHAMBERY 07:20 12:45
LS535/6 . . . . 5 .7 CORK 13:35 16:35
LS553/4 12345 . 7 AMSTERDAM 18:40 21:50

aircraft 2

LS595/6 1…5 . . KRAKOW 10:55 16:35
LS523/4 . . . . .6 . MURCIA 11:05 17:55
LS523/4 . . 4. . . MURCIA 12:00 18:40
LS523/4 . . . . . . 7 MURCIA 15:40 22:30

[Charlie Roy]

Lots of gaps to be filled there so, in the schedule of those two Newcastle based Jet2 aircraft :ok:

You must be in your element HH6702 ;)

[HH6702]

it's been updated.

Shows bergan with WF until march 2007

[fl dutchman]

HH6702

Is this correct it does not show extra Easyjet flights to Belfast, Bristol, Stansted,Paris, or any of the new Jet 2 flights, it is still showing Budapest, Nice, Berlin and Milan? WF flights shown to Bergen not bookable after Oct.

[fl dutchman]

Having had a better look I think the only thing that has been updated is the DATE !!

[crewboi83]

if u look at the NCL timetable for Feb onwards the Murcia is done by a murcia based unit. and there is lots of rumours flying around about night stops down in Murcia. so that could free up some room for rotations, and also the sat CMF is a W pattern with a MAN based 737

[Jamesair]

I'm a bit worried about SAS to Copenhagen....does anyone know why there are no flights shown after 2nd September either on the Airport timetable or on the SAS website timetable. I understood the flights were doing well with over 2,000 pax per month. Surely they aren't pulling of the route.

[fl dutchman]

Jamesair

Not looking good for this route!. also WF to/from Bergen. The Copenhagen is I understand doing over 70% loads so makes no sense to stop it, unless someone else is to take it over?. WF to Bergen not so good loads though.

[HH6702]

I noticed cpn not on timetable from september i hope it does stay.
Maybe another one for jet2 to pick up!!

I have heard that jet2 will have more routes than easyjet out of ncl by next summer if it's true?

[transwede]

Any ideas what Jet2 could introduce? Bearing in mind, even though EZY are suffering from lots of cancellations at the moment, they seem to have the monopoly on many of the traditional loco routes at NCL, PMI, ALC, AGP etc.

They have given up BUD, NCE and possibly SXF which leaves scope for Jet2, but what else could sustain a loco carrier out of NCL. Many of Jet2's routes operate on a less frequent basis than daily which could reveal more opportunities. Maybe CPH is a possibility, but remember EZY gave up this route due to high fees at CPH airport. Jet2 do operate SZG, VLC, LGW, DUS and ACE from LBA, so these are also possible candidates.

Personally, I would like to see them start MAD, VCE, NCE, WAW, NAP, NQY, RIX, TLS or BOD.

On other things, LGW is a strong contender for a loco service, with BA dropping frequency. Route could be used for access to London or as connecting service for the wider variety of flights leaving here, both scheduled and charter.

NCL still needs a reliable scheduled leisure service to LCA and PFO. Many other major UK airports have this service, and while Helios used to operate it on a scheduled basis, is AJY continuing it?

[GrahamK]

TCX doing YYZ-NCL-YYZ next summer on behalf of Canadian Affair using a 757

[transwede]

Is that TCX YYZ flight in addition to the usual Globespan chartered flight,with whom it is rumoured to operated by either GSM or Zoom, as the company have ended their contract with Air Transat.

[HH6702]

I would say it's a new flight as Canadian Affair didn't have a flight this year out of NCL just globespan who used Air Transit

[HH6702]

Newcastle - Toronto

Day Start - End Depart Arrive Stop Aircraft Flight

Thu 3 May - 25 Oct 12:30 15:05 Non-Stop Boeing 757 TCX36K

Toronto - Newcastle

Day Start - End Depart Arrive Stop Aircraft Flight

Wed 2 May - 31 Oct 22:30 10:20 Non-Stop Boeing 757 TCX 46L

[nclairportfan]

I heard an odd rumour today about EZY having difficulty at NCL and that a number of routes are to be dropped. He indicated that it would be in addition to NCE, BUD and SXF. However, I don't know the source well, friend of a friend, he said he worked at the airport so it could be nonsense. Anyone heard anything similiar?

I hope it's not true though at the moment I am not booking EZY as they seem to be cancelling a lot of flights!

[jstars2]

I was in NCL last week and picked up a vague rumour of a start-up airline taking up from where American Airlines left off some months back, when they decided not to go ahead with new route, NCL – JFK.

I think the plan is for it to be a local based schedule carrier which offers a daily service to the Big Apple.

Any substance to this?

[transwede]

Flysunjet, using ATR42 to NYC from NCL, via PIK, REK and 10 other places??????

On a serious note, I cannot really see an airline starting up solely to operate a route to NYC. It just doesn't seem viable. NCL's only hope, logically is either a loco service or CO.

Has anyone heard that there is an announcement to some from Jet2? Is it more routes, or the fact they are fast becoming the new easyjet at NCL, with a slightly better performance record currently?

[HH6702]

I heard that JET2 plans to operate more aircraft and routes out of NCL than easyjet by summer 2007. hopefully this is correct but it seems to big too soon to be true.

Ive still got hopes for flyglobespan to do new york from NCL.
Ive heard that some managers were up last month having a look around.

About a year ago someone posted on here about ryanair doing stockholme and oslo, with the plane starting in stockholme.
We have oslo does anybody know if the slots are in still for the stockholme service. think the numbers were FR1701/2 ??

[HH6702]

Flyjet and Excel airways are doing paphos on wednesdays for summer 2007

Newcastle / Paphos Wed 27 Jun 2007 1355-2045 XLA448
Paphos / Newcastle Wed 04 Jul 2007 2145-0105 XLA449

Newcastle / Paphos Wed 27 Jun 2007 0805-1455 FJE606
Paphos / Newcastle Wed 04 Jul 2007 1555-1910 FJE607

[fl dutchman]

So it looks like the following routes are gone. Berlin, Nice, Budapest, Milan, Bergen and Copenhagen. I would have thought the appropriate airlines would have released seats by now. Only about 9 wks to go to start of winter schedules. Anyone heard if this is correct ?.

[transwede]

Are Jet2 not continuing on with Bergen? Wouldn't be surprised if Jet2 also pick up some of the other routes that are being dropped, particularly NCE and BGY.

XLA will operate to PFO, aswell as current FJE route, in place of their proposed SSH on wed which is now cancelled.

[fl dutchman]

Jet 2 to Bergen only bookable to end October. Same applies to Wilderoe to Bergen.

[GrahamK]

On the up side, NCL-AMS with KLM will see 3 out of 5 of the flights being operated by Boeing 737s.

SAS to CPH, perhaps rubbish yields.
Possible replacement could be Ryanair to MMX.

Jet2 to Bergen will probably be back next summer along with Pisa, Mahon and the others back to an increased frequency.

[682ft AMSL]

Are Jet2 not continuing on with Bergen? Wouldn't be surprised if Jet2 also pick up some of the other routes that are being dropped, particularly NCE and BGY..

Jet2 drop NCE, PMI and a whole host of other destinations for their winter programmes ex-LBA and MAN, so unlikely they would jump onto NCL-NCE.
Let's not forget that many marginal routes that might work when oil is $30 a barrel will not simply stack up at current prices. Flying 2hr+ sectors, with 60%/70% loads at £40 per head yields just won't stack up for anyone. Jet2 appear to have the luxury to simply not fly if the numbers don't stack up, so as it case at LBA and MAN, don't be surprised to see lots of downtime in the NCL fleet over winter.

682

[CentreFix25]

SAS to CPH ends 3rd September.

[transwede]

A shame that NCL have lost these routes. It seems that Scandinavian routes out of NCL do not seem viable, look at the history of CPH. Muk Air, Cimber, SAS, Easyjet, then SAS again have all tried it and all have suspended them.

NCE may well work on a seasonal basis, much like Jet2's routes to PSA and MAH. I was surprised to see EZY drop BUD and SXF, however is it for them not being profitable routes or is it to ease their situation with crewing problems?

[Jamesair]

scandinavian routes out of NCL do seem to have problems. CPN is certainly not closing for a lack of pax, it has been running with load factors in the 80's and 90% range. It must be a yield problem.

STV is the longest survivor

[HH6702]

Im sure that easyjet had better loads when they did cpn before they dropped to operate the berlin.

[HH6702]

SSH is still on xl under timetables for the wednesday flight

[HH6702]

Airport charter timetable 2006/7 has been updated.

cant find anything new as of yet


There's a few changes for 2007

KAJ has been dropped and flights are now with TCX on behalf of mytravel

[NCLRULES]

Sorry if already mentioned.

Experience scuba diving in Egypt this winter and fly to Sharm El Sheikh from Newcastle International.

Newcastle Airport Direct has some great offers to this stunning resort.

Or book now for Luxor in Egypt from Newcastle, new for summer '07 with Thomsons, and take a trip down the Nile.

from NIA Newsletter.

[fl dutchman]

Ryanair- Oslo
Reduced from daily to Mon, Wed, Fri, Sun, For winter 2006/2007.
So bearing in mind all the others ie Milan, Budapest, Berlin, Nice, Copenhagen, and Bergen,seeming lost, plus reductions in frequency by B A for LHR and LGW when compared to last winter its not a good outlook for the airport.

However on the plus side there should be extra daily flights to Belfast, Bristol, Stansted and Paris, (Easyjet), plus the daily Dublin with Aer Lingus. And the new Jet 2 services.
I think there may be an overall loss in flights though when compared to last winter.

[GrahamK]

It seems NCL is starting to reach it's saturation point. The lack of catchment area seems to be inhibiting the popularity of it's routes

[transwede]

While I don't think NCL is reaching saturation point, I do think there is a limit as to what routes at what frequency the airport can sustain. Many of the dropped routes are not proving that popular, particularly amongst business travellers, who generally have a higher yield - exactly the type of pax airlines to want to attract. However, I do suspect that some of EZY's changes are due to reasons other than low pax figures. For example, NCE has been consistently popular, but maybe not sustainable during the winter. Why does EZY not take note of Jet2's operation. Adjust route network to match the season. They have successfully operated PSA and MAH during the summer, but have changed to more winter orientated destinations.

There are still many potential routes for full service, loco and charter companies alike to start from NCL, however all at a risk as all the sure-fire winning routes are already operating.

LXR by Thomsons is a welcome addition to the charter programme, as is Agadir by Mytravel. I am still of the opinion that there are too many flights to the likes of PMI, ALC, AGP etc by charters and locos from NCL. More variety and with the likes of TOM now operating smaller a/c there is the potential to start some more interesting and varied routes.

[Currock Base]

FL Dutchman - as someone who has lurked on this site for years and works in the aviation industry in the North East, I'd like to offer this insight. Is it any wonder carriers such as BA et al are reducing service to NCL when the airport has some of the highest (if not highest) landing fees in the UK outside London. Let's face it, the place isn't LHR... So if NIA wants frequency of service and to attract other non loco carriers, perhaps it should look at it's fees.


CB

[fl dutchman]

CB. Is it not the case that airlines conduct negotiations with the airport re fees and charges etc to get the best overall package they can. If they dont get the deal they go elsewhere.The airport must be doing something right to attract all the airlines and routes it has done over recent years. I believe its fuel prices that are having a major effect on routes/frequencies, NCL is not the only airport to have some cutbacks just now.

[Currock Base]

FL - Yes they do negotiate, but the position for an established incumbant is very different from the package a new loco may be offered. In the event the loco was given a package "free" or close to "free" the airport would need to recover their costs from somewhere. That somewhere is going to be a mixture for increased retail sales, increased car parking revenue and increasing the fees from the established carriers. That gives established carriers 3 choices: negotiate and then pay up, withdraw some or all of their services, or explore loop holes in the charges by varying aircraft size or time of day (this only works at some airports).

Much of the flying for airlines out of NCL is marginal. The economics are bizzare - the public are now more willing to pay for long term car parking at the airport than for the air ticket itself. Yes there is an argument to fly to more lucrative places, but for carries such as KL, BA and AF that really isn't an option. Lets face it they won't move capacity to NCL-ALC even if that's where the money was to be found (and I'm not suggesting it is).

CB

[Currock Base]

FL - Sorry I missed your point about fuel. Yes the current position is horrendous for the industry as a whole. One point to remember at NCL - there were 2 oil companies providing fuel at NCL (often sharing or pooling the work). Now NIA has built a new tank farm and established a monopoly it is charging a higher fee per gallon on top of the fuel market price. So again fuel from NCL is less attractive. Sure airlines can adopt tankering strategies but it is still more expensive and more hassle.

The outlook at NCL has changed since CPH airport got involved. Prior to this the local council owners had a nice source of revenue from something that they viewed as a strategic assest for the region. Now the goal is profit at all costs. At some point both full service and loco operations will reach saturation and the airlines will look to maximise their business by juggling capacity and frequecy with other routes. That's what you're seeing now with BA reducing LHR and LGW frequencies, especially as the LHR slots are valuable - it's not just the NCL end of a route which defines the economics of a route.

CB

[Jamesair]

Do we know for certain that EZY are dropping the routes still missing from the winter timetable? The website indicates that some winter schedules are still to be announced.

I remember that HLX said they were considering going head to head with EZY on Berlin maybe they would take it up if the route is dropped. At one stage germany was very well served from NCL now we're back to two destinations and possibly just one.

[Jamesair]

Today Eastern seems to have 2 flights to the Isle of Man, the usual 1605 and an additional flight at 1440 according to the departure board.

[HH6702]

Easyjet

Ive worked out the timetable and all six aircraft are fully booked.
our only hope if for berlin on a w?

[fl dutchman]

C B
Yes you make some very good points. But is it not now the prime objective of most airports to make money. NCL was as you say a nice little earner for the local authorities. I think they still get an income now with the arrangement with Copenhagen?.
The likes of BA, AF and KL must still see the routes they operate as important mainly to feed into their hubs, even if they dont make a big margin on them. But the timings on BA to LHR and LGW are in many cases less than convenient for internal business travellers and those wishing to connect with onward connections. The reduced frequency has and will make things worse so they will probably loose traffic.

[CentreFix25]

I was under the impression NCL have the cheapest landing fees for any airline in the UK (Quote from JP). You say they are the most expensive outside London, where do you get this information from?

Your understanding of the operation of the fuel farm is misunderstoodThe new facility will be operated by Swissport International, one of the world's leading airport ground handling groups, supplying fuel from Texaco, Conoco, BP and Q8Source. (http://icnewcastle.icnetwork.co.uk/0500business/industryreview/chemicalindustry/tm_objectid=15444895&method=full&siteid=50081&headline=airport-fuel-farm-has-really-taken-off-name_page.html#story_continue)

The airline choses their supplier (could be a national agreement with the price hedged) fuel has to be competitively priced or it will be uplifted at other airports, although the airport does get a bigger cut.

[Currock Base]

CentreFix - thanks for the clarification regarding fuel, you've also confirmed my point, NIA is getting a bigger cut which does translate into higher fuel fees for airlines. As to my source, it is someone very high up in my organisation who will know this area - trust me.

CB

[CentreFix25]

There wouldnt be additional based aircraft (TOM & LS) if they were paying the highest fees outside London, RYR would pull out completly, as they dont take any c#?p. So i got to disagree with you on that one (JP's quite high too!)

you've also confirmed my point, NIA is getting a bigger cut which does translate into higher fuel fees for airlines.This is also false, the airports bigger cut comes at the expense of the middle man (in this case Swissport).

[onion]

I think you ll find that airports negotiate with airlines individually. For instance airports a more likely to charge BA more than Ryanair because of higher ticket prices. Also airports charge in different ways. Some airlines pay a landing fee, others will pay a fee on passengers through the terminal and others will pay on both. Remember airports really make their money off retail and non aviation related businesses now. So if Ryanair can guareentee 500,000 pax a year the deal they get will be great and so the airport isn't concerend with landing fees so much, also charter and low cost pax a more likely to spend in the retail outlets as they generally have more time after check in and are more inclined to spend on little extras like food and things they have forgot to bring on holiday etc... Business pax like BA pax want to get to the airport pass through and get on the plane, maybe buy a paper and a cup of coffee. The longer a pax is waiting the more s/he is likely to spend. (Hence why Ryanair have suggeted that airports pay them for bring the customer to the shopping mall in the terminal) Maybe the landing fees at Newcastle are expensive but that is probably more aimed at one off flights and GA users, trying to price them out to free up space for more profitable charters, low cost and business pax.
Regarding the fuel situation again airlines will have individual deals with NIA and so value will vary across the board.

[JKP505]

How disappointing it is at NCL at the minute, it seems to be going back rather more than it is forward in terms of route development. However somebody made a very good point saying that routes like BUD had a shelf life. Being honest, BUD has little traffic other than city breakers. I think GVA and KRK will in time suffer also. Once people have been once, that's it really.

I do believe that routes such as BGY, OSL/TRF, CPH, NCE are different however. It seems that BE, FR and EZY are fast losing interest. To be honest I wouldn't be bothered if EZY just left. Much prefer the service on LS, and the fares of FR. I find their fares pretty shocking considering the standard of their service (ie CANX). I recently tried to book a one-way from PMI on EZY, £180!!! I think thats disgusting.

It is time for consolidation rather than expansion. Remember, NCL was the last out of the secondary airports to get the 'first wave' expansion. LPL / EMA / LTN / BRS all had expansion before NCL. Now they have all seen a 'second wave' of expansion.

It appears the airlines are out of touch with what would actually work from NCL. It really is about time some 'proper' routes were added, for example FRA, ZRH, OSL. As for SK, not enough connecting traffic, what the hell do they expect with a 1xdaily mid-morning service? The timing of the CPH flight hardly endears itself to connecting traffic does it?

Although it is time for a stock-take on routes, as I say, the right routes will work. NCL needs more links to big commecial business centres, not two-bit citybreak routes.

[akindofmagic]

I'm sorry if this is the wrong thread to ask this question in. When visiting the Aero Club the other week I saw a 737-200 parked up, just beyond the club itself. Out of interest, I was wondering if anyone could tell me what the aircraft is doing there, and who owns it.

Thanks for any replies.

[CentreFix25]

http://p.airliners.net/photos/small/8/7/1/0322178.jpg
Answer here (http://www.newcastleaviation.co.uk/)

[Jamesair]

I see that the "Flysunjet" website seems to have disappeared.

[akindofmagic]

Cheers for that.

[skyman771]

Although it is time for a stock-take on routes, as I say, the right routes will work. NCL needs more links to big commecial business centres, not two-bit citybreak routes.
Well said!!, the only bit of real sense (rather than day dreaming) posted on this site re. routes for sometime.:D :D
The only problem is that in the light of recent events, such developments are perhaps further away than ever .........

[skyman771]

Business pax like BA pax want to get to the airport pass through and get on the plane, .
Judging from recent experience this might actually be a misconception. Being a past frequent user on the LHR-NCL route I was surprised at the distict lack of 'Business Pax' on more recent trips.
On most BA LHR flights I've expeienced of late, one could not find a more diverse mix of ages, nationalities, religions,family groups, VFR's, students et al.

[onion]

Maybe BA were a bad example, how about Eastern's pax? I was just trying to make the point about pax types, you can't just quote a little bit of what I said it needs to be all taken into account.

[nclairportfan]

The latest CAA stats for July show:
EUROPEAN FLIGHTS - SCHEDULED
BRU - down by 19% to 4408 pax but not surprising as SN have dropped one flight per day. Still better than other UK regional airports.
CPH - down by 1% to 2889. I can't believe we're losing this route!!
NCE - down by 8% to 7114 pax.
CDG - up by 8% to 17623.
SXF - down by 22% to 6041.
DUS - up by 11% to 1630.
HAJ - down by 20% to 3076.
ORK - 3637 pax in July versus 2860 pax in June so good improvement.
DUB - up by 32% to 14136.
BGY - down by 51% to 4532 mainly due to FR cutting frequency.
PSA - 3181 pax in July vs 2507 pax in June so good improvement.
CIA - up by 1% to 7173.
AMS - up by 38% to 32052 mainly due to Jet2 starting on the route.
FAO - 5508 Scheduled pax carried. No comparison data.
BCN - up by 2% to 7884.
MAH - 2069 scheduled pax in July versus 1654 scheduled pax in June.
BGO - 3470 scheduled pax in July versus 2440 scheduled pax in June.
TRF - 5477 scheduled pax in July versus 4499 scheduled pax in June.
GVA - down 34% to 5381. Reduced frequency.
PRG - up 1% to 7899.
BUD - down 41% to 4490. Reduced frequency on route.
DOMESTIC FLIGHTS - SCHEDULED
LGW - up by 13% to 22596.
LHR - down 11% to 40340.
LCY - 1467 pax. No comparison data.
STN - down 7% to 25707.
ABZ - up 37% to 2200.
BFS - up 14% to 20786.
BHX - up 1% to 2192.
BRS - down 3% at 21211.
CWL - down 11% to 1568.
EXT - up 24% to 5435.
INV - 276 pax. No comparison data.
IOM - down 16% to 687.
SOU - up 16% to 11760

[transwede]

Judging by those figures, it doesn't really surprise me that certain routes are being cut, even though some of the drops are due to reduced frequency. Nice to see some vast improvement on certain routes, some of them showing that seasonal routes can actually work, as long as the airline adapts the route to the season. Interesting to see how routes perform over the winter, including the new Jet2 flights to KRK and CMF, as well as established routes.

What is happening with Thomsonfly and their ontime performance? They have suffered again over the past 48 hours, a big difference compared with their previous OTP performance - bring back the Britannia name! Would actually be interested to know how the charter carriers are performing in terms of OTP at NCL this summer, so far. I have a feeling it would be interesting reading.:O

[NCL-06]

sorry this is abit random but... if a service to JFK or EWR was to be announced from NCL for spring 2007, it would roughly be around this time or in a couple of months... so how likely is it that this route is going to be announced? and which airline is most likely to operate it?

[heslop2006]

I somehow think that NCL won't get a New York service anytime soon, however I think that it would most probably come from Globespan or Continental. I know which one I would prefer :ok:, however I have heard that GSM have lost interest in NCL, so who knows, anything could happen.

[skyman771]

I can see this saga running for some yet. I'm sure that CO & DL ? have done their homework as regards NCL as a new route, but unless they have spare 757's chasing new routes & are prepared to take a considerable risk in an environment that is hardly becoming less ' risk averse' then the time is not yet right.
For me there is also the over looked question, why when things were looking up some 18 months ago or thereabouts, with CO undoubtedly the more likely candidate to add further UK routes, did they allow AA to ostensibly move into NCL ?
Finally I must reluctantly, from the infra-structure side, now question as to wheter NCL has the spare capacity to support such an operation. Even access & parking are becoming ever more problematic, reflecting a combination of lack of land and investment that is necessary, on top of that currently being expended on the much mooted new control tower & proposed hotel development.
Oh......! & no one will ever convince me that NCL would not significantly benefit from further airbridges.
Anyway who actually wants to travel to NYC at this time ?

[nclbase]

A new airbridge is to be built at the end of the pier, on stand 9. 40ft long apparently and work is to commence soon

[Mark23]

some good news...ncl to bergamo IS now on sale for winter. Tue/ Thu/Sat so same frequency as summer.

I wonder why there was such a delay in releasing it?

[Brian H]

I have just been on the SN Brussels airline site to book a flight to Brussels from Newcastle in May, and found that they have upped the number of flights from 2 to 3. Departures from Newcastle are 06.35, 08.15 and 16.30.

[cesare.caldi]

some good news...ncl to bergamo IS now on sale for winter. Tue/ Thu/Sat so same frequency as summer.

I wonder why there was such a delay in releasing it?

BGY-NCL together with the BGY-LPL were routes that Ryanair had decided to close and to replace with other from BGY base, but to the last minute had a change of mind and were both confirmed.

[HH6702]

looking at pax figures this yr to last. if you work out the same days last year to this year are the figures not close if not better for milan?
12 flights was it during the month.

[HH6702]

Have heard that the above airline has received slots for ncl for the start of summer 2007. Has anybody else heard this.

[transwede]

HH6702 how and where have you heard this? Could it just be a slot replacing the currently operated Air Transat weekly YYZ service?

From Airports Of The World magazine:

Discussions are ongoing with a number of airlines regarding short-haul network expansion and new routes for Summer 2007 will be announced towards the end of this year.

Also says that the airport have been approached by a number of new operators, who could they be and what new routes? Possibly something else from Jet2? What other markets are left for NCL?

Also:

Dubai remains a big target for the airport

Another is the popular Mexican resort of Cancun....a "big wish" for the airport

Maybe the supposed slots from GSM are YYZ, SFB, CUN....however the possibilities are endless. Dubai, I think is a long long way off for NCL.

The magazine article also says that the airport are trying to attract big freight operations. Could NCL see the arrival of DHL, FedEx, UPS etc with large freight a/c. This attraction is due to expansion on number of stands, apron space with 3 new stands being operational early next year.

Maybe expansion at NCL is about to start quickly again.:D

[skyman771]

:sad: HH6702 how and where have you heard this? Could it just be a slot replacing the currently operated Air Transat weekly YYZ service?
Maybe the supposed slots from GSM are YYZ..
Surely you can recall the recent posting on this thread that indicated that the summer YYZ for 2007 was to be operated by TCX ?:bored:
HH6702Could NCL see the arrival of DHL, FedEx, UPS etc with large freight a/c. This attraction is due to expansion on number of stands, apron space with 3 new stands being operational early next year.

I'm sure that I'm not the only reader of this forum who feels that it should not be used as a medium of irrational fantasising!:sad:

[HH6702]

TCX to YYZ is a new flight nothing to do with globespan

canadian affairs is one of many new operators to ncl for summer 2007.

GSM will being some flights but not sure where yet.
globespan may use Zoom to replace TS

[transwede]

skyman771 if the airport are serious in trying to attract freight operators then it may not be "irrational fantasisng". However looking back on that post maybe NCL could never sustain the likes of DHL, UPS etc but smaller freight operators with smaller aircraft could well be attracted.

And yes, the TCX YYZ service is a brand new flight with a brand new charter operator for NCL, Canadian Affair using Canadian based 757 aircraft, in 187 config (?). The Globespan chartered flight will still run, but with whom is anyones guess. NCL could sustain a regular, not daily though, YYZ service. Its been done before. TS years ago used to operate 2 x weekly and the defunct Canada 3000 also had a weekly charter. Maybe operators could consider a number of other Canadian destinations - sorry is that irrational fantasising again??!!!:}

However if the airport are in discussions regarding new shorthaul routes with short haul operators, what could they be, lets throw that question open to everyone.................?

[HH6702]

Banjul
Cancun
Goa
Dubai
Taba
Hurghada
Stockholme
Frankfurt
Hamburg
munich
Cologne
spilt
dubrovnik
tallinn

The list could go on and on and on.
So what abut airlines

Wizz
germanywings
Air Berlin
sky europe

That list could go on ans on also

Any new routes and airlines would be good

[CentreFix25]

Stick my neck out here, in my opinion you won't see any of those airlines flying into NCL within the next 2 years. As for the destinations prehaps 2. I posted a while back that the airport were trying desperately to get a Cancun, but nobody would do it.

[transwede]

Most likely out of that list is probably a charter to Hurghada. Having said that, charter companies seem to be reluctant to introduce 'different' charter destinations out of NCL. Maybe if they took a risk, it could work, same for the likes of DBV, SPU etc.

Hopefully the discussions the airport are having are serious and far advanced and NCL could be in for another bumper year of pax numbers, though with expansion at a little steadier pace.

Nice to see another airbridge being added, though I'm sure it has been discussed here already but airlines don't seem too keen to use them at NCL. Indeed with the exception of BA and TOM, it is used very little for other airlines. Are only Swissport despacthers trained on its use? Easy/ryan/Jet2 certainly wouldn't be interested as it lengthens loco turnarounds!

What would be nice to see in say 10 years is a truely international airport with two piers, fully equipped with jettys with charter, full service and loco carriers parked, flying to a full range of destinations both business and leisure. A thought or reality...............

[Jamesair]

Maybe the second air-bridge is for use by a company we don't know about yet. Any new long haul operator to New York/ Dubai etc would certainly need this equipment for their passengers.

Other threads on pprune are suggesting that Delta might be interested in a JFK - NCL route as part of their transatlantic expansion plans (which are to be announced in November).

[HH6702]

Last year Delta said it was hoping to start flights out of NCL to the USA within the next two years so hopefully this is true unless somebody else gets in first.


Hopefully the airport may attract tour operator (holiday opitons) for services to DBV, SPU.
They could work if they charter an airline with say a 100 seater (ARJ)

[skyman771]

Last year Delta said it was hoping to start flights out of NCL to the USA within the next two years
Must have missed this, who & in what publication did Delta state this?
Did they state any other UK destinations at that time ?
IF !!! a NCL - NYC route by a US carrier does eventually materialise, then my money remains on CO:)

[skyman771]

However looking back on that post maybe NCL could never sustain the likes of DHL, UPS etc
Glad to see that you are back down to earth! ;)

Maybe operators could consider a number of other Canadian destinations - sorry is that irrational fantasising again??!!!:}

I did not suggest that this part was, I am more than familiar of all the attempts at YYZ services over the years, incidentally you missed out the early major players who actually put a lot more capacity & effort into the route i.e. Wardair & CP Air with a product that at times offered connections to YVR & beyond.
Personally I would be very suprised if more than one carrier eventually operates a YYZ service in 2007, & astonished if two could make a success of the route.

[HH6702]

YYZ year round service would be great

[transwede]

All depends on wether a year round service is sustainable. How many other regional airports have this service?

Anyone know how many pax NCL is predicted to handle this year and where it stands in terms of UK airport pax?

[Jamesair]

Should be an interesting year stats-wise.....will the latest terror episode have much effect?, maybe London will feel more effect than regionals.

As far as NCL is concerned, I will be interested to see the August figures. I'm not sure how Easyjet count their passengers, with all those cancelled flights. I suppose as long as they have paid, they count as pax on a flight, I'm not sure what happens if a refund has to be given. There were also a lot of BA cancellations for NCL - LHR/GTW.

Looking forward to the year I think NCL will have a good year but some routes have been lost this Autumn/Winter.

[MerchantVenturer]

http://www.caa.co.uk/docs/80/airport_data_prov/200607/July_2006_Provisional_Airport_Statistics.pdf

transwede

The above .pdf link will find CAA airport terminal pax provisional stats for July.

In the rolling 12-month period ending 31 July 2006 NCL is in 10th place in the UK airports 'league', with 5,338,000 pax, just behind BRS (5,572,000) and just ahead of BFS (4,949,000).

[skyman771]

In the rolling 12-month period ending 31 July 2006 NCL is in 10th place in the UK airports 'league',
Important for airport profile that NCL maintains a spot in the 'Top Ten'. Prospecive new airlines must look to some form of benchmarking.
Lets face it we are the only airport in the 'top eleven' without a NYC service (excepting LTN) & there are obvious reasons re LTN's 'non participation'.:ugh:

[transwede]

NCL surely has to be the next UK airport to gain a transatlantic service, surely!!!!

Lets hope we do stay in the top ten, would be bad news if we didn't precisely for the reason that it would deter airlines from expanding or starting new services.

[GrahamK]

Disappointing that NCL has slipped behind BRS.
Although RobT100 will b pleased no doubt...:ugh:

[MerchantVenturer]

Graham

NCL has been behind BRS for nearly a year now.

BRS tends to carry more pax each month than NCL in the winter and NCL more than BRS in the summer.

For instance in July CAA prov stats show NCL had 603,000 terminal pax and BRS 572,000.

BRS, like NCL, is to lose several scheduled routes this winter and, again like NCL, has also been affected by the numerous easyJet cancellations throughout the summer and these are continuing.

I know to my cost because there seem to be twenty-four fights cancelled on the NCL-BRS-NCL route this month, including the one I was intending to use on 25 Sept (the morning rotation), and this is just one route.

[fl dutchman]

I reckon the August figures from NCL will be more affected than BRS. Not only was there the Easyjet cancellations, there was a large number of BA flights to LHR and LGW cancelled due to the terror threat. Flights to Stansted were also cancelled, probably over and above the planned Easyjet cancellations.
So overall the August passenger numbers from NCL will not make good reading.
Of course any airport with flights to London especially with BA will have a large drop in passenger numbers

The local paper last night was claiming about 20 overall cancellations from Easyjet during September ??
Easyjet are doing themselves a great deal of harm with all of these cancellations and will have a long term effect on bookings. I wonder if all the extra flights to Bristol, Stansted, Paris and Belfast will go ahead when the new shedule starts at the end of October.

[transwede]

NCL and BRS do seem like extremely similar airports in terms of markets etc, not to mention services offered, though BRS does have the edge on NCL with a wider variety of scheduled and charter flights. Maybe NCL has a bit of catching up to do if they want to take over BRS and get into 9th place.

For summer 2007, nothing much seems to have changed in terms of the charter provisional programme, with the exception of extra YYZ and a few minor changes to XLA and TOM programmes.

[fl dutchman]

For summer 2007, nothing much seems to have changed in terms of the charter provisional programme, with the exception of extra YYZ and a few minor changes to XLA and TOM programmes.

Orlando down to one weekly flight. Suspect we may see more to Jersey as there has been a desperate shortage of seats this year. On the scheduled side more from Jet2, possibly even a couple of new routes from Easyjet to replace lost routes but still with 6 aircraft?.
I cant understand why there are no flights from NCL to Split, Dubrovnik, Pula etc, there was always strong demand in the past before the unrest, and I am sure much of that demand is still out there now

[Jamesair]

I have had similar throughts....Yugotours used to do very well out of NCL and I would have thought the time is now right for an expansion of the couple of flights per season that NCL has had lately to this area.

[skyman771]

Orlando down to one weekly flight.
Well this just sums up the popularity of US flights, and we want a NCL- NYC service !!:ugh:
Yes true they are potentially looking at different markets, but will still require a strong tourist overlap to support any NYC venture.
So why down to one weekly ?, what was the peak volume in earlier years 3 weekly flights ? I used to use these flights regularly in the 90's in Jly / Aug & were very popular & always full. I suspect that they priced themselves out of the market as the costs became comparable or even more than a LHR-MIA flight.
There are probably lessons here in that even with the ludicrously high prices now charged for 'cattle class' ie sub 'Y' in peak season, I have it on good authority that late booking in the shoulder periods can result SFB round trip costs sub £300:(

[fl dutchman]

Dont think the Orlando is being reduced to 1 per week due to lack of passengers. The demand is quite strong and I understand they are always full, and have been since they started from NCL.
To cut capacity by over 300 seats per week seems crazy. Could it not be something to do with aircraft availability or the tour operators wanting to concentrate elsewhere.

The New York flights are a completley different market but I dont think that even with an airline with available onward connections it would stand more than 3/4 flights per week.

I sometimes wonder what the advantage would be to say fly to LAX via a direct NCL-JFK link over NCL-AMS then onto LAX. Same number of stops! probably at a lower price??. I think the number of pax flying NCL-JFK only is limited!.

[nclairportfan]

I may be wrong but I seem to think some analysis was done and it was estimated around 100,000 pax per year fly to New York via Paris, London, Brussels or Amsterdam so if the price was right a service could work.

[Jamesair]

Its only September.....there is still time for another Orlando flight to be announced for the high season, especially with such a cut in capacity as things stand.

[GrahamK]

I'd expect a TCX A330 flight.

[transwede]

I seem to remember a summer season when SFB was served upto 4 times per week from NCL, using the likes of Britannia, Airtours International and Air 2000(all long gone!). Florida will always remain the number one long haul destination, due to its family orientated attractions and I am at a loss as to why NCL is to be left with only one flight per week. I tend to agree with fl dutchman that the loss is down to aircraft availability with MON. I am not convinced TCX will return with their A330 a/c, as the dropped the route as it was proving too costly to position the aircraft to/from NCL. Travelcity Direct were rumoured to be interested in starting a route, using smaller capacity aircraft than their jumbos, maybe a return of XL 767 a/c in the red colour scheme is on the cards. Whatever way, NCL seriously needs an up in capacity to one of its only 3 long haul destinations, otherwise it does deter future long haul expansion. On the same subject why is that SFB flights always leave NCL late? Is it down to the positioning of a/c or the facilities at NCL, i.e groundstaff?

I think its more or less definite that Jet2 will announce further routes for Summer 07, though the likelihood of EZY doing the same is quite slim, judging by their performance this summer. Infact all the cancellations/delays must surely have cost them some passenger confidence.

I think it has been said before, but the likes of Pula, DBV, SPU could maybe sustain a smaller regional jet charter service, it works at BRS with a similar catchment area and market. Or maybe the geordies are just stuck in their habits and like the usual PMI, ALC and AGP.

[HH6702]

There will be more than one flight per week.

GSM are looking to launch this route out of newcastle so maybe some of the tour operators will buy seats on these flights

[kthompson]

Does anyone know if NCL - NCE winter on EZY has definitely been cancelled, or have they just not issued the new winter schedule yet.

[skyman771]

I seem to remember a summer season when SFB was served upto 4 times per week from NCL, using the likes of Britannia, Airtours International and Air 2000(all long gone!). I am not convinced TCX will return with their A330 a/c, as the dropped the route as it was proving too costly to position the aircraft to/from NCL. ... maybe a return of XL 767 a/c in the red colour scheme is on the cards. .
Ah the nostalgia !
Pity they still don't come from over the pond, as with the ATA Tristar’s in the 90's. :{ even though they always had a tech stop in both directions, even added to the interest not knowing if it was to be Bangor, Goose, or where ever. Note that this service did not allow itself to deteriorate to that of it's contemporaries in terms of comfort, sevice & time keeping. How anyone could wish for the return of Excel (whether red, pink or whatever colour) with their pathetic levels of comfort & timekeeping is beyond me.

[10 DME ARC]

See Jet2 just released BGO for the winter twice weekly Thur & Sun.
:)

[Jamesair]

Wideroe also seem to be doing Bergen for the winter with flights on Thursdays and Saturdays. Stavanger will be operated 4 x weekly with flights on M/Th/Fr and Su.

[Jamesair]

GSM to operate Toronto (Hamilton) - NCL summer 07 with 757/200 wkly on Saturdays

Flybe.....the 2nd daily flight to BHD from 30th Oct now cancelled

[transwede]

Does this mean GSM are replacing TS YYZ service or is this a new addition to programme and is it possible that someone else will still operate the Globespan chartered flight on Thursdays in addition to TCX flight? GSM may still be big at NCL, fingers crossed anyway!!!!:rolleyes:

skyman771, ahhh ATA tristars, they were NCL's glory days in terms of long haul and I don't think many pax would relish the return of XLA longhaul, but if its NCL's only chance...........Afterall TCD are one in the same.

[transwede]

Advert Link Removed Newcastle-Hamilton (Toronto)

Deps NCL sundays at 1340, arriving sundays 0815.

A/C is Hamilton based 757.

Looks like so far, for summer 07 NCL will have 2 x weekly toronto services.

[HH6702]

FAB news lets see what else they give us!!

Looks like we may have a tuesday flight also got no flight details yet but the date is now shown on a website for a flight on may 1st 2007 (tuesday)

[airhumberside]

Advert Link Removed Newcastle-Hamilton (Toronto)
Deps NCL sundays at 1340, arriving sundays 0815.
A/C is Hamilton based 757.
Looks like so far, for summer 07 NCL will have 2 x weekly toronto services.
The flight will operate STN-NCL-YHM with the aircraft STN based (I guess to avoid setting up a YHM base)

[daz211]

so the a/c opp via NCL do you know if the other daily
flights from STN will opp via the other uk airports talked
about in the flyglobespan forums:confused:

[diesel36]

looks like all the ones that go once a week will start in stn then go via

dsa one day ncl another etc,etc

[skyman771]

Could it only be 'NCL longhaul' where the basic laws of supply & demand are challenged?
Seems to me large demand, low capacity on SFB, low demand large capacity on YYZ, or for the Loco's? 'Hamilton' , or could this be another RYR type ploy for GLA...:confused: :confused: ................ didn't they one have a football team 'Accademicals' or something like that;)
Where is Hamilton ? in the times I've been to Toronto never came across or near it, may have seen a freeway sign, must get out the Rand Mcnally;)

[BombardierCR7]

Hamilton is on the western side of Lake Ontario and is at least 60 miles or so from downtown Toronto. It is however much closer to Niagra falls than Toronto.
Its a few years since I've been but I remember it was a very sleepy airport with a daily movement count similar to somewhere like DSA or CVT. I think Westjet have a base there.

[airhumberside]

Hamilton has only two scheduled airlines; Westjet and AIr Canada (I think flights may be operated by Jazz). Westjet is by far the largest airline and has flights to most major Canadian Cities, plus Orlando. There are also some charters to the Carribean. For more info on routes, the airport website has some useful interactive maps

[HH6702]

transwede

Where did you get the flight times for the flyglobespan canada service

[transwede]

from the canadian side of the Globespan website. Strange that flights are not on sale on the UK side of things. Does anyone know the routing of the a/c, e.g is it going to be STN based 757 doing STN-YHM-NCL-STN?

Have also heard to expect a few more minor route announcements in time for next summer, though nothing major like a US service. I'm thinking the odd new charter and of course, according to TV adverts - from Newcastles low cost airline - Jet2.com!!! Where could they venture to next? (is KRK just a winter route?)

[mmeteesside]

It'll be either STN-NCL-YHM-NCL-STN or STN-YHM-NCL-YHM-STN and probably the first one

[Jamesair]

I think KRK could work as a summer destination....I understand it is a very beautiful city and could sustain weekend break traffic.

I hope there could be more from HLX if Easy drop Berlin in summer as well, that was supposed to be a route they were considering operating head to head with EZY. Someone is needed to replace SAS on CPN as well.

[nclairportfan]

LS seem to be making NCL work really well for themselves at the moment. I hope it continues!

KRK seems to be working out quite well for LS - just looking on their low fare finder indicates that some flights are full and there seems to be strong bookings throughout the winter period. I think this will go year round and we may even see a slight capacity increase on this route for summer - perhaps a 3rd weekly flight?

I'd like to see LS possibly pick up other new routes.

RIX would probably also work with two flights per week, similiar to KRK to appeal to the weekend market but it is a little far.

LGW is prime for a loco, BA are reducing frequency, much to the annoyance of friends of myne who use the service a lot. I have a vague recollection of some deal between NCL and BA to not allow competitors on this route. Does anyone have anymore info on this?

I'd love LS to replace SAS on CPH but not sure if they would because of landing fees - the market is definitely there though!

[skyman771]

It'll be either STN-NCL-YHM-NCL-STN or STN-YHM-NCL-YHM-STN and probably the first one
How do you make this pay ?, are these positioning flights or with 'a proportion' of fare paying pax on the NCL-STN & back? Either way it does not make too much sense for 'loco ops.' & then you have the issue of a greater probability of inherrent delays due to the nature of such a service:ugh:
An earlier posting on this forum suggested a second carrier may operate to YYZ ?, very little can be more efficient, reliable & cost effective than say a YYZ based operation, but then again Air Transat were comfortable with one weekly service.
Either way I see this service as becoming a nightmare to operate for GSM:(

[10 DME ARC]

From GSM Canada web site the flight operates;

YHM ETD 2015 Saturday
NCL ETA 0815 Sunday
ETD 0910ish (don't publish these times)
STN ETA 1000
ETD 1200
NCL ETA 1250ish
ETD 1340
YHM ETA 1640
:)

[skyman771]

Well at least that makes sense - a YHM 'based' operation. But what is this service really ... another STN service with a drop off at NCL in an attempt to maintain a max load factor over the pond, or is it a more formal split load effort? The question has to be asked... what 'Southerner' in their right mind would fly to Toronto via YHM & NCL unless offered a seriously highly discounted fare as oposed to BA, AC direct services & others?.
It is all very well offering low fares, but when the operation is outside the traditional 8 week holiday period, one can find serious discounts on scheduled flights in any event.:confused:

[son of a .....]

Seen loads of new Easy adverts on bus stops around the area for Newcastle - Berlin!
Bit of a waste of money since it seems to be dropped this winter!
:\

[HH6702]

How much capacity are we loosing for Toronto next summer are we gaining?

How many seats are on the A310 ?

So far next year we have

GSM with 189 seats (split with STN)
TCX with 233 seats ?

[HH6702]

Just to let you know that Flybe are planning to use there new E195 on the last southampton from 1st Jan 2007

[CentreFix25]

First EMB-195 just departed NCL on a crew training sortie.

[RobT100]

LS seem to be making NCL work really well for themselves at the moment. I hope it continues!
KRK seems to be working out quite well for LS - just looking on their low fare finder indicates that some flights are full and there seems to be strong bookings throughout the winter period. I think this will go year round and we may even see a slight capacity increase on this route for summer - perhaps a 3rd weekly flight?
I'd like to see LS possibly pick up other new routes.
RIX would probably also work with two flights per week, similiar to KRK to appeal to the weekend market but it is a little far.
LGW is prime for a loco, BA are reducing frequency, much to the annoyance of friends of myne who use the service a lot. I have a vague recollection of some deal between NCL and BA to not allow competitors on this route. Does anyone have anymore info on this?
I'd love LS to replace SAS on CPH but not sure if they would because of landing fees - the market is definitely there though!

I'll be honest NCL fan I can't see any of those destinations coming off. What I have been informed however is if the Chambery goes okay this winter then come next we will see saltzburg, which has to be good news.

[Jamesair]

I hesitate to make comment on the unfortunate developments at DVT but the loss of the NEWQUAY route, which seemed to be doing ok should open the way for AirSouthwest to either NCL or DVT.

[HH6702]

Bad news about baby pulling out of mme.
This may also affect NCL next year.

If jet2 open a base at mme it will mean that ncl will suffer and keep to an 2 aircraft base for next summer, instead of 3 or 4 aircraft.

[HH6702]

It's in tonights paper that newcastle airport mangers and MME managers together with one north east are out in dubai talking to world airlines about starting services to the north east.

Lets hope we get something out of this

[CentreFix25]

Jet2 wont open a base at MME in my opinion due to its proximity to the two other bases. 'W' flights into MME with aircraft based at LBA and NCL to the popular Spanish destinations would be prudent.

[airhumberside]

It's in tonights paper that newcastle airport mangers and MME managers together with one north east are out in dubai talking to world airlines about starting services to the north east.
Lets hope we get something out of this
Sounds like the annual Routes confrence

[mbcxharm]

HH6702

Thomas Cook 757s to Canada are set up with a 187 seat config. I don't think you'd actually be able to get a 235-seater airbourne at NCL with fuel to get to Toronto...

[skyman771]

HH6702
I don't think you'd actually be able to get a 235-seater airbourne at NCL with fuel to get to Toronto...
I don't think too many of 235 would actually survive such conditions on a trip to Toronto;)

[skyman771]

It's in tonights paper that newcastle airport mangers and MME managers together with one north east are out in dubai talking to world airlines about starting services to the north east.
Lets hope we get something out of this
The delegates will certainly get something out of this...;)
Many ways of looking at this other than the obvious 'corporate beano'. It has seemed fairly obvious to me for some time that there will in all likelihood be a service from the N.E. to the Gulf within a few years.
The variable as I see it is simply whether it be on an IT basis to service the demand for new holiday destintions for the punters, or whether it be as part of a larger marketing strategy of Emirates, Gulf Air or whoever.
Presumably it would have been politically incorrect with One NE representing the region as a whole including 'Durham' to have ignored the region's second airport. However from recent events I would have assumed that the only stregnth that MME currently have to offer is plenty of spare apron space.:(

[Richard Taylor]

Any signs/suggestions/rumours of possible competition on NCL-ABZ or does T3 have the route all sewn up.

Could competition grow the route, or have T3 captured the market.

You could always fly up to ABZ to fly the CPH route!! ;) ;) ;)

[transwede]

Always thought BE would have stepped in on NCL-ABZ market!

Anyone know why AJY has been diverted? Seems that AJets flights are dogged by problems and delays!!

[fredtheanorak]

Sounds like the annual Routes confrence
Spot on. Every freeloadin,sunlovin,hard drinkin, expense account wieldin man from the industry who can justify a week out of the office is at Routes in Dubai :8 :8 :8 I'm sure its 100\% all business and no fun at all:{ You couldn't get a first/club class seat out there for love nor money as they've all been taken by in house freebies!:mad:

[fredtheanorak]

Anyone heard what Eastern are planning out of Newcastle this winter? Heard they were reorganisinga couple of routes Will th be needin more crews there?:confused:

[fl dutchman]

Saw a press ad the other day in the Newcastle Chronicle re Easyjet flights from NCL. On the bottom of the page it said something like " Easyjet now running a full shedule".
So does that mean the staffing issues are now sorted?. On the other hand I think they cancelled todays to/from Rome!!! was that for another reason?.

[daz211]

I cant speak for NCL but BFS, EDI and NCE canx tonight and tomorrow
info from STN BAA website.

[SWBKCB]

fl dutchman

From todays (18-09-06) NIA arrivals board...
EZY568 09:35 BRISTOL FLIGHT CANCELLED
EZY515 12:20 LONDON STANSTED FLIGHT CANCELLED

:=

[fl dutchman]

Well that just shows you shouldnt believe everything you read in the papers. It also means the Easyjet adverts are incorrect!.

Berlin is also cancelled today!

[HH6702]

Wounder if eastern will start NCL-CPN then?

[crewboi83]

Well they money eastern charge for a one way ticket they should have enough money behind them to afford the over the top landing fee's at CPH!!

[transwede]

Logically eastern are probably the most likely to step into the NCL-CPH route, however it seems unlikely at the moment.

There is still time for new routes to be announced in time for the summer programme next year, so we shall have to wait and see. It has been so nice to see NCL's apron so full of aircraft this summer, just one complaint is that the airport need to use more than 2 buses for pax on remote stands. Pax and airlines are getting increasingly annoyed at having to wait for buses to return after one load.

[HH6702]

did anybody read the journal this morning. 2 pages full about both NCL and MME.

It states easyjet have no plans to pull out of ncl, infact we are looking into new routes to start soon.

Newcastle airport states that if easyjet contiune to increase pax numbes by 15% a year then hopefully the plan of 10 aircraft by the end of 2009 will be met. (great if this happens) Easyjet would not comment on that report.

However the management of MME are hoping in add some of the routes dropped by Bmibaby within the next fortnight. (somebody must be going to get in quick!)

Anybody got anything to add

[HH6702]

Is this route going to stay. Looking on the cardiff thread it states that T3 are pulling out of the airport.

Heard Delta are to put summer 2007 on sale from JFK lets hope NCL in on the list

[BAforever]

Yes this is the CWL-BRU service based at CWL not those going to CWl

I think its likley it will stay as there is a possibility of ABZ from CWL:ok:

[HH6702]

See they have added berlin and warsaw today

wounder if they will take up NCL - SXF and WAW and maybe NCE?

[skyman771]

Globespans Sunday NCL-YHM operations wef S07......
I'm surprised that not more comments received on this rather curious operation. To clarify we are one of seven different stop off's on the daily STN to YHM route which stops at a different UK regional airport enroute depending upon as to what day of the week it is!:\ It does seem to me that for a new operator this is taking on too much, i.e. EXT one day EDI, LPL or wherever the next, I hope the crew don't get confused, certainly a novelty for any STN-YHM frequent flyers:sad:
This does lead on to an interesting point as to whether there is actually the demand (at least from NCL) for a weekly service. If one reviews the current availability of the 2006 Air Transat/fly Globespan NCL-YYZ route, for Sept & Oct 06 departures, seats remain available for £49 one way, clearly a give away, and hardly suggesting that there will be an uplift in demand for a 2007 GSM Toronto service (non YYZ !) outside the traditional holiday period where one way GSM 'cattle' (below 'y') seats are currently on sale at well over £200 one way.
Anyhow is this service likely to attract any 'non tourist, punters? YHM is hardly a major hub for anward connections.
Then do I recall an earlier posting on this thread suggesting that there is to be a second operator to YYZ from NCL ? I really can not see this working.
GSM would have done much better had they been able to opertate a STN - DXB via 7 UK regional airports..............;)

[kthompson]

Has NCL - NCE winter schedule been cancelled?

[HH6702]

Just looked dublin is on sale still 2x daily same times

[HH6702]

NCL-YHM

I think that it will work but we need another flight along side the TCX to YYZ to meet the pax numbers i think.

kthompson - NCE isn't on sale and all 6 aircraft are fully booked now!

Easyjet are advertising berlin, nice on bus stops which to me seems a waste of money! wounder if these routes are going to be summer routes only and we will see them again in summer 2007 from easyjet

[transwede]

Easyjet

According to the plan, NCE will return for the summer and remain a summer only flight, obviously no demand in winter months, though possibly less than daily frequency could work. Maybe Jet2 will step in, there was the rumour that LS want to expand alot at NCL so we shall have to wait and see.

Canadian Flights

TCX will operate on Thursdays to YYZ on behalf of charter company Canadian Affair. It will be a charter service, though seat only deals can be booked.

GSM's service is at the moment a loco service. Presently Air Transat run a charter-sched service. Seat only can be bought, however touring holidays of Canada etc are also available through various tour operators.

The demand for YYZ is strong at NCL, with the TS A310 a/c departing virtually full every week. However, it remains a strong charter flight so it will be interesting to see if GSM's service to YHM works, especially shared with STN. NCL has always has regular services to YYZ, mainly on a charter basis. Airlines such as Wardair, Canada 3000, Transat among others have operated it. If demand was not there, then surely the route would have stopped long ago??

I do think we will see some more routes from Jet2, for Summer 07. What they are and when they are announced is anyones guess!!!!

[10 DME ARC]

GSM
Don't forget GSM YHM will be providing seats for GSM's parent company Globspan Holidays, who use Air Transat at the moment.
As for cheap seats being available with Air Transat now, well Air Transat make money from tour operators buying in bulk, the remaining seats have always been sold off at a reasonable rate!

[_ShIfTy_]

Always thought BE would have stepped in on NCL-ABZ market!

Anyone know why AJY has been diverted? Seems that AJets flights are dogged by problems and delays!!


The alpha jet was diverted due to weather at newcastle. I belive they did two go arounds then diverted to manchester.

[skyman771]

Easyjet
The demand for YYZ is strong at NCL, with the TS A310 a/c departing virtually full every week. Well it would be at £49 one way any date you wish Sept / Oct 06 !:rolleyes:
As for references re excuses /justification 'tour ops block bookings' I don't dispute the fact, just the conclusions that you make are far too simplistic & largely irrelevant.
It is, it has been & it will be the same, you want a flight to Toronto you go to a travel agent,or you book direct, you may be sold a seat out of a Tour brochure backed up by a block booking, you don't have to purchase any accommodation or extras. Next year you will do the same or you MAY also consider GSM ! None of your reasoning whatsoever suggests that there will be any extra demand outside the school holidays when one can sell virtually anything. Historically as you note there is sufficient demand to support a weekly operation, again not disputed, but twice weekly ??:confused:

[HH6702]

(GSM187) NEWCASTLE - TORONTO (Hamilton Intl) 13:40 / 16:40

(GSM188) TORONTO (Hamilton Intl) - NEWCASTLE 20:15 / 08:15

Sundays

[10 DME ARC]

Same number of seats any way, one and a half 757's = One A310!:bored:

[HH6702]

Im still hoping for zoom to start a weekly service too.

Whats the chances of GSM starting SFB intime for s07?

[skyman771]

Same number of seats any way, one and a half 757's = One A310!:bored:
:sad: How do you operate one & a half 757's, I thought we there were to be two, with two flight crews, two handing charges, twice as much to go wrong:E

[10 DME ARC]

Two flights but one is shared with STN!!

[nclairportfan]

Found this on another forum and thought you might all be interested!
EUROPEAN FLIGHTS - SCHEDULED
The latest CAA stats for August show:
BRU - down by 16% to 3500 pax but not surprising as SN have dropped one flight per day. Still better than other UK regional airports.
CPH - up by 13% to 2750.
NCE - down by 6% to 7483 pax. Can't believe EZY may drop this for winter.
CDG - down by 9% to 15516.
SXF - down by 34% to 4994.
DUS - up by 8% to 1481.
HAJ - up by 2% to 3919.
ORK - 3918 pax but new route so no comparison to last year.
DUB - up by 20% to 13852.
BGY - down by 54% to 4668 mainly due to FR cutting frequency.
PSA - 3193 pax but new route so no comparison to last year.
CIA - down by 13% to 6604.
AMS - up by 44% to 33216 mainly due to Jet2 starting on the route.
FAO - 5686 Scheduled pax carried. No comparison.
BCN - up 1% to 7703.
MAH - 2269 scheduled pax. No comparison.
BGO - 2901 scheduled pax. No comparison data.
TRF - 4441 scheduled pax. No comparison data.
GVA - down 20% to 6434. Reduced frequency.
PRG - down 19% to 6635.
BUD - down 64% to 2487. Reduced frequency on route.
DOMESTIC FLIGHTS - SCHEDULED
LGW - down 10% to 17379.
LHR - down 13% to 33665.
LCY - 884 pax. No comparison data but a big drop!
STN - down 20% to 22131.
ABZ - up 63% to 2399.
BFS - up 26% to 19349.
BHX - up 4& to 1670.
BRS - down by 14% 19034.
EXT - up 24% to 5814.
INV - 263 scheduled pax. No comparison data.
IOM - down 15% to 676.
SOU - up 13% to 10196

[fl dutchman]

The terror alert in August will have a marked effect on the pax nos, especially the London routes with numerous cancellations. Easyjet cancellations were at there height in August and they will also be reflected in the figures. So its not in all cases a true like for like comparrison.

I understand the total passenger numbers for August through NCL were up by 6%. Not bad considering the circumstances.


By the way the Easyjet press ad stating they are operating a full service is in tonights Evening Chronicle again!!! so it must be true.

[Jamesair]

Considering the cancellations during August, the figures are not too bad. The interesting ones for me are the huge increase in the market to AMS which nearly beats LHR for the first time and the 18% increase in the "now gone" CPN route.....a route to be taken up again by some airline surely.

[JKP505]

The sham performance that EZY have put on this season, and the heavy press attention they are starting to recieve from it suggests to me that the best thing they could do is move out of the airport. I honestly believe that Flybe, Jet2, Ryanair and Thomsonfly could more than fill the void on their routes. An interesting statistic out of the CAA stats? The only international airline that has suffered a drop in travelling passengers, besides FR and SN on the reduced frequency BGY and BRU routes, is easyJet. BFS aside every single route that they fly has been subject to a drop in pax numbers. (The PMI figures aren't listed btw.)

EZY are the single reason the airport's expansion has stalled. Airlines are cautious to dip their toes into an airport that has an established airline flying all the typical routes. Notice that Jet2 don't fly any of the 'typical' routes such as ALC, AGP, BCN, NCE, PRG. They are just filling the gaps around EZY.
If they did take these routes on, with substantial marketing / promotions, I think they would finish EZY off hands down, especially with the 'frequent fliers' to the Costas whose flights have probably been affected.

The best expansion NCL can hope for is Jet2 over the next few years taking on ALC (1p/d); LEI (2p/w); SXF (1p/d); BUD (4p/w); ACE (2p/w); LGW (2p/d); AGP (1p/d); NCE (1p/d); PMI (1p/d) VLC (4p/w); VCE (3p/w) in addition to AMS, BGO, ORK, KRK, MAH, MJV, PSA, TFS. Although it doesn't look likely that FR will open up a base, connecting NCL to their current bases could be a real winner for them maybe to BRE 4p/w for HAM) CRL (1p/d for BRU); HHN (1 or 2p/d for FRA); GRO (1p/d for BCN); LTN (2p/d); MRS (3p/w); SNN (1p/d); NYO (1p/d for ARN). Alongside DUB, BGY and TRF, these routes could work for FR, especially considering their fares are normally good to excellent.

Past that, its probably Eastern and South Eastern European destinations, (ATH, WAW?) and the elusive JFK/EWR service, maybe DXB.

Thomsonfly haven't finished releasing their scheduled for next year, can anyone see anything new from NCL coming off? Nothing new on the charter front, would all charters have been confirmed by now.

[transwede]

JKP505

Totally agree with your posting. Jet2 seem to be building a decent reputation at NCL, and their TV advertising is alerting more potential NE pax to their services. I'm guessing that next summer will bring more routes, possibly becoming a 4 aircraft base. Easyjet brought low cost to NCL and stimulated people into travelling more on new routes, but their performance recently, particularly at NCL has tarnished their reputation. They have created a void, which can easily be filled by Jet2. I can see LS operating some of the routes you've mentioned, i.e LEI, SXF, VCE, ACE and VLC but I don't think that they would go head to head with Easy at the moment.

As for Ryanair, they have always said they would expand their NCL operation, but nothing has ever materialised. Their hubs would be perfect routes for NCL, indeed NCL has always been crying out for links into Germany, so I'm sure HHN would work. Another place NCL has always lacked in flights is France, Ryanair have a heavy presence there. Alternatively BE have expressed interest in international services from NCL. Is the possibility of TLS, MRS or other smaller French destinations on the horizon, now that we only have CDG flights?

A sched to ATH is probably a long way off, given the distance. WAW a possibility now Jet2 have started flying there.

There was rumour around that the new airbridge being built at NCL on Stand 9 was earmarked for an undisclosed international carrier? Is is possible to be EK with A330s to DXB?

Not even going to mention NYC service!!!:ugh:

10 DME ARC

You are totally right. The 2 flights to YYZ will equal the number of seats this year.

1 TCX 757 - 189 seats.
1 GSM 757 - approx 200 seats, shared with STN.

Both roughly equal the TS A310.

P.S It is not necessarily too late for charters to add new routes, some of the smaller tour ops put their summer stuff on sale quite late. However, without the addition of a 4th based aircraft from TOM, don't expect anything new apart from SKG and LXR as their aircraft programmes are now fully scheduled (i.e no space left in flying schedule for new flights/destinations to be added.).

[POL1W]

Just announced Palma, Malaga, Almeria and Valencia. Some head to head with EasyJet I see.

[daz211]

This JET2 announcement is just wat EZY need as a kick up the :mad: ,
they need to pull their finger out and sort out a service they can fully run.

[dwlpl]

It could be that they take the prompt and move out some aircraft from NCL.

[Jamesair]

More detail of Jet 2 summer programme for 2007

KRAKOW will continue at 2 x wkly 26/3 - 28/10

MAHON builds to 2 x wkly in period 21/5 - 2/9

PISA builds to 4 x wkly in period 21/5 - 28/10

MURCIA operates at 5 x wkly 26/3 -21/10

NEW ROUTES

ALMERIA builds to 2 x wkly max. in period 21/5 - 28/10

MALAGA builds to 4 x wkly max. in period 26/3 - 21/10

PALMA builds to DAILY frequency in period 21/5 - 2/9

VALENCIA operates at 3 x wkly 14/5 - 28/10

[daz211]

What jet2 need to do is stick a BFS and a STN into NCL:E .

[crewboi83]

and a LGW rotation wouldnt go amiss!
The next aircraft to be based in NCL is rumoured to be a 757
Think its doing the AGP and the PMIs and prob a few others

[JKP505]

Can't imagine EZY will like this one very much. I am surprised, albeit pleasantly that LS decided to go for jugular and take EZY on on 'their' territory, as well as the high frequency TOM services to PMI and AGP. In reality though, if an airline was going to go head to head, these are the routes that would be expected, rather than BCN, PRG which have smaller markets.
I can't see EZY being too threatened by this however, although I do think that LS will do well. LS has a good reputation in the North now, whilst EZY is just digging it's own grave. I would expect LS to go daily on AGP, MJV, ORK,and possibly VLC by summer 08. I can't see EZY expanding to any destinations at all in the next few seasons, although I do think it'll take a lot more to drive them out.
Wonder if WW's decision down the road had anything to do with this expansion?

[nclairportfan]

So does this mean a 3rd aircraft for NCL bearing in mind AMS is likely to stay and I would hope Bergen?

[HH6702]

NCL & JET2 will employ an extra 200 staff to operate 4 aircraft from the start of summer 2007.

i belive a 757 will be based but this will operate TFS,ACE and maybe a few more new routes. Heard maybe cyprus also. These routes will be on sale within the next few weeks.

Great news today. Looks like that jet2 will continue to base at NCL and not start routes out of mme

[daz211]

Do you think jet2 will take on any domestic routes?
looks to me like they are trying to hit EZY when they are down.

[HH6702]

dates :26/3 -28/10 2007

LS523 Newcastle 18:05 Murcia 22:00
LS523 Newcastle 18:25 Murcia 22:10

LS524 Murcia 07:30 Newcastle 09:25
LS524 Murcia 08:30 Newcastle 10:20

[crewboi83]

yeah HH dunno whats going on there, Murcia nightstops have been rumoured for ages now, since before the TFS nightstops which start newt week. It starts in about Feb i think for the murcia ones

[transwede]

Seems a bit strange for a loco carrier to operate nightstopping schedules? Quite rare in the likes of LS, EZY etc. Normally associated with business scheduled carriers like BA.

Nice to see Jet2 expand, better to see an airline with a more reliable service. Im guessing PFO, LCA, ACE could be next.

My only worry is how will Swissport deal with another 2 aircraft, in addition to every other airline they handle. I understand they have been pushed to their limits this year.

[HH6702]

think the plane may come in from murica then out to palma then back out again to murica?

there are loads of gaps still even if you slot bergan, amsterdam and cork into the timetable. more to come. (lets get nice and berlin with jet2)

[Wellington Bomber]

I reckon that they are night stopping away from NCL due to the problems that the airport has in the number of a/c that have night stopped and the problems with regards to getting passengers from the terminal to remote stands due to lack of buses, dispatchers etc etc

[10 DME ARC]

WB
I don't know why J2 are night stopping in Murcia but its not due to remote parking, all of J2 early morning departures are towed to a terminal stand before loading etc!

[Wellington Bomber]

10 DME ARC

I know what you are saying with regards to towing aircraft to the terminal, but if there is no gates available at that time of the day what do they do? the times of arrival into Newcastle means that there will be space at the terminal, due to the early morning departures already gone. Now do you get my drift

[postcard]

Quite right 10DME..and at least 3 more stands to be made available over this winter.
New airbridge for Stand 9 also comences build work late October.

Out of interest counted 26 overnighters on main apron last night.

[SWBKCB]

Where will the new stands be?

[10 DME ARC]

Opposite side of the alpha taxiway to stands 19/20/21, next to stand 18. The stands will be for turbo props like JS41. By the way stands 18 and 19 have been up graded to take a/c up to B738, rather than the Bae146 ish size they were!
:)