Enstrom Corner

[FSXPilot]

The aircraft is designed in such a way that failure of the boost pump will not impede fuel flow. The engine driven pump can deliver all the fuel you need. Is there any chance the stutter was caused by oiled plugs?

[lvflyer]

Well I'm not sure. I know when the boost pump was on I didn't have any hesitation. Also the mag check was fine. Next time I get a chance to fly I'll see if it runs on the engine driven pump only.

[CO280fx]

Dirk,
Question: Have you had any instruction in your machine from a pilot with Enstrom experience?

Regarding the boost pump- What do you mean when you say you did the runup without boost pump "as directed"? The engine driven fuel pump does not supply sufficient pressure at idle to keep the engine running smoothly in hotter temps. The fuel injected turbocharged engine is prone to vapor locking. Run the boost pump.

[lvflyer]

The warmup checklist says to do so with the boost off to verify the engine driven pump is working correctly and then the pre departure checklist says to turn boost on. Just following directions. So I take it when it is warmed up the engine driven pump will not produce enough fuel for a turboed engine? I do notice on cool down if I turn the boost off it will backfire more than normal.

[flylow]

Question: Have you had any instruction in your machine from a pilot with Enstrom experience?

I've been wondering the same thing!

[lvflyer]

The answer to that has to be No since the former owner of 7 years did not follow proper procedures and was unaware anything wasn't right. There are no experienced Entrom pilots or mechanics around here. I can't even get an instructor to give me dual in my own Enstrom if I travel to them a distance because I don't have insurance and I can't get reasonable insurance without getting dual. I'm not interested in renting another Enstrom to satisfy that need since the flying characteristics of my Enstrom is what I want to learn and practice on. On another note I checked out the engine driven pump today. Just taxied over for fuel and I did so on the engine driven pump only without any problems. After fueling with engine warm I noticed a lot of backfiring and hesitation with just the engine pump on at low RPM, but when increased to over 2000 RPM it was smooth. In addition I checked the fuel flow indication with and without the boost pump and there was no change. So my conclusion is when warm the engine requires more fuel than the engine driven pump puts out at idle, but the pump produces plenty at higher RPMs. I was just concerned that I didn't have any redundancy and had to rely on the boost pump or the engine pump was failing, but that is not the case. Also in reading the start up checklist it says to leave the boost pump off when running up for the first cold start of the day. So after a fuel stop I guess it is normal for the engine driven pump to not be sufficient for runup.

[lvflyer]

Update on my previous thread concerning the rotors turning without being engaged. In the middle of my first annual of this Enstrom I discovered the belt drive system was not rigged properly. It was so bad that any mechanic doing a proper annual would have seen problems had they removed the seat as required. For 7 years this helicopter was out of rigging on the collective as well as the belt drive engagement. As it was the belt could not be disengaged all the way because the clevis was actually hitting and cracking the shield around the engagement lever and, if you know anything about the rigging the top bracket was not parallel with the pylon as it should have been. The clearance between the threaded rod and the spacer was almost an inch when it should have been 1/16 to an 1/8. Obvious issues. Now we have to clean it all and test run it to see that in fact took care of the rotor continuing to turn at 100RPM at idle while disengaged.

I need some advice of some corrosion. Below are some pics of my rotor head. Other than just use some scotchbrite on the corrosion is there anything else I should do?

http://www.dahome.net/images/Enstrom/20140703_121931.jpg

More pictures are available at www.dahome.net/enstrom.htm (http://www.dahome.net/enstrom.htm)

[Deheli]

Sounds like you are having some problems. The Enstrom is a good machine. I will be in IL in august. I would be willing to stop by possibly if you would like. I have both mechanical and flight experience in the Enstrom. PM me if you would like to talk futher.

[Ascend Charlie]

I assume because the winds from the right were not allowing air flow from the engine fan through the oil cooler.

Errrrmmm.... If you are flying in balance, it doesn't matter a rat's patootie whether you have a crosswind, tailwind or headwind, the relative airflow will always be coming from dead ahead. Same with your door popping open, if you are in balance, that shouldn't happen - assuming the door is rigged correctly. Judging by your comments, the previous owner just didn't take proper care of it.

But maybe I am biased, I detest every hour I flew in Enstroms.:yuk:

[Gaseous]

IV,

The degree of corrosion on your grips is not a cause for concern and is not unusual. Just clean it off. The grip spindles appear to have been cadmium plated from the factory but most older aircraft seem to have lost it. Cracking around the clutch lever stop is not unusual either. Keep an eye on it. Incorrect rigging of everything is common. I feel that is the reason lots of pilots like AC above have had bad experiences. Lots ARE horrid to fly.:yuk:

Inaccurate rigging and incorrect main rotor blade chordwise centre of gravity appear to be the main culprits.

A well set up Enstrom is a joy to fly. Your attention to detail should get yours right eventually.:ok:

[lvflyer]

Regarding the cross wind. We were getting severe cross wind gusts in flight so the tail was swishing for sure. Every time we would get a big gust the wind came through the passenger door and applied pressure to the pilot door and pop wide open. Also the cross wind gusts were going right into the oil cooler outlet preventing the outward flow of air and the oil temp spiked. I had to crab out of the direction fo the gusts. It was a particularly lousy day.

I cleaned the rotor mast area and discovered the stain was actually cast off from the feathering nut and pin. I cleaned those up as much as I could and gave them a good coat of LPS2. I'll keep an eye on it from now on.

I think the rigging on the belt drive system is going to help a lot. The belt was not able to be disengaged fully, but there was still slack. Cleaning it up is going to help too now that I can get to it. I was told to spray it down with mineral spirits on everything in the engine compartment and drive belt area and let it dry. Any comments?

[Paul Cantrell]

Regarding the cross wind. We were getting severe cross wind gusts in flight so the tail was swishing for sure. Every time we would get a big gust the wind came through the passenger door and applied pressure to the pilot door and pop wide open. Also the cross wind gusts were going right into the oil cooler outlet preventing the outward flow of air and the oil temp spiked. I had to crab out of the direction fo the gusts. It was a particularly lousy day.

Like Ascend Charlie, I'm feeling a little puzzled about the whole gusty crosswind thing. If you were in cruise flight (even slow, like 60 MPH) a gusty crosswind isn't going to prevent the oil cooler from doing it's job. If the temperature was spiking, I think it's likely something else was going on. If you think about why the tail is twitching, it's because the natural weathercock stability the tail is providing (admittedly much less in an Enstrom than in other types) is trying to keep you in trim. When the wind gusts from the right, the tail is forcing the nose to the right to keep you in trim. When the gust subsides, the nose is being forced back in order to keep the aircraft in trim. In all of those cases, the airflow is still mostly from nose to tail and the oil cooler should be quite happy.

The door may be a different thing, but I suspect there's something else going on with the oil temperature. Especially given all the other things you've discovered rigged wrong with this aircraft...

I've been out in 45 knot gusts and never had an issue like you are describing... All my (Enstrom teaching) experience was in an F28A if it matters...

[lvflyer]

All I know is when I crabbed more into the wind the oil temp came down and the door didn't blow open. I have found the latches on the pilot door were not engaging properly. I don't know how, but the door latch on the frame was actually missing the whole about 1/8 inch to the top of it. I've adjusted the plate and filed the top a bit and now it latches if I pull up on the door as I pull it shut. I tried to let the heat in the hangar remold the doors so they close flush, but I have discovered there is no way for them to close flush due to the infrastructure on the inside of the door won't clear the door frame at the bottom. I've tried to adjust the hinge to get the door higher, but it still sticks out on the bottom. I'll just install some more weatherstrip in the areas where I can see light at the bottom. I'm curious if other's doors do not close flush at the bottom.

[Paul Cantrell]

All I know is when I crabbed more into the wind the oil temp came down I don't doubt what you observed. I'm saying you don't need to fly an Enstrom out of trim in order to prevent high oil temperatures. I think you have a problem with the oil cooler that needs to be looked into.

BTW, Ascend Charlie: I loved flying the F28A. I think easier to touch-down than even the B206 (because of high inertia AND the oleos). Just not a very happy helicopter when sliding, but with that much inertia there's really not much reason to ever have to slide, even on a calm wind day.

The F28A was really underpowered (no hover on a hot summer calm day @ higher gross weights) but basically the best pickup truck I've ever hovered. (i.e. built like a tank, and weighs like one too!).

[CO280fx]

lvlflyer,
The 280 door design is not very good, the 28's latching mechanism is much better. You are dealing with 37 year old fiberglass and plastic which has warped over the years and no longer seats properly in the doorframe. The fiberglass holding the latching plates on the door has probably also weakened and is not firmly holding the latches in place. This is a common problem with the older 280s. I have flown two older 280s (1978 and 1980) whose doors never closed properly and would sometime pop open at high speeds, especially on hot days. Pops open like a gunshot and with the turbo exhaust screaming right behind you, it really drops your heart. No fun at all and the expectation is very stressful when it happens intermittently! You will probably have to rebuild the door and strengthen the inner frame and latching mechanism to eliminate the problem. A bandaid fix we've used is to rivet some strong fabric velcro to the doorframe and adhere the sticky hard piece to the inner side panel of the cabin. It is a crude but effective solution. Quirky machines they are but a real pleasure to fly when dialed in.

*edit* Also agree with others that crosswinds should have no effect on your oil temp. Keep digging...

[lvflyer]

Maybe I'm really anal about my aircraft maintenance, but I think this shows 7 years of neglect more than 7 years of care by "the best helicopter mechanic around here". What do you think? Found the transmission bolts loose and lots of RTV to cover it all up instead of just torque to SIL 0166 recommendations. Under cockpit floor and in engine bay and all skins show major neglect. Took hours to clean and will have to reapply zinc chromate to most panels and to many support tubes. Collective and belt drive not rigged properly. Main rotors never maintained and had bare aluminum exposure for the entire time, thus exfoliation. This is a mess, but won't be when I'm done. Here is link to what I discovered so far. www.dahome.net/enstrom.htm

[lvflyer]

500e I can't respond to your email. Answer no JL

[500e]

Thanks IVF answers question Thanks :ok:

[Dennis Kenyon]

As a few PPs will know, I'm an avid supporter of the Enstrom and even after 40 years associated with the type I still enjoy her handling.

The infamous 'fishtailing' really came about when the new sleeker shape was introduced in 1975. Greg Focella was the industrial designer who produced the sleeker 'nose job' which enhanced the types good looks. Greg was also responsible for the new nose on the MD500E. I expect you know a few years back the USA 'Fortune' magazine voted her the best designed product of the year.

I believe the longer nose when associated with the Dorsal & Ventral 'Shark' fin results in the airframe being over directionally stable about the normal axis. It is possible to fly out the random yawing, but over the years, I've just accepted the feature unless I'm flying passengers.

It says something for the type that the Shark is coming up for forty years and the one I'm flying now is still handling well and rotor vibration less than point one ips on the Vibrex.

And as a side note, and in 6,000 type hours I'd not experienced a power failure although my log book indicates around 5000 practice full stop autos. That was until a few weeks back when one cylinder let go on an airfield approach. The passenger wasn't even aware we'd made a 'no-engine' landing. That just one of the reasons I like the old girl. Regards to all. DRK

[lvflyer]

Dennis I think I speak for us all, thanks for all your contributions. I started writing prolifically about my experience so others can benefit. I'm not trying to voice opinions, just the facts. When I am done with this annual I hope to have it in better shape then when I started. I am still finding it real difficult to find zinc chromate to touch up the support tubes and inside panels. I'm tempted to just go with the Dupli-color self etching primer I can get at local Advance auto parts, which is zinc phosphate. I would like your input and others as well.

[cockney steve]

A specialistpaint distributor *should* be able to supply the correct primer....you could always look for Automotive paint and bodyshop suppliers on the Net, from there, find the manufacturers, such as Dupont, Sikkens Etc and email their tech.dept direct...they should have tech. sheets to cover prep and application.

Marine applications also come to mind.
Have you been looking at retail outlets for Professional "trade" paints?
You are obviously a capable person, determined to understand your machine and learn the disciplines needed to maintain it. Professional engineering suppliers are the way forward. I think you'll find Zinc Chromate primer available in 1/2 litrepacks upwards..generally, 2-pack paints are streets ahead of solvent, or water-based stuff Avery thin, translucent coat is all that's normally needed....again, a paint-manufacturer will give full details of systems , prep, different coats and overcoating etc. hth.

[lvflyer]

Finding it isn't the problem, it's the time it takes to get it sent here. This has already been apart going on a month and the primer is holding me up now. I think I am just going to use Rustoleum self etching primer found at local auto parts store and WalMart. Gray is good color for inner panels anyway and the reviews on long term corrosion protection are good on this. Besides I think for other than large commercial shops zinc chromate has been replaced with zinc phosphate, which this primer is. Either way it is better than how it is. The existing coating is coming off on the inner panels and the primer on the support tubes didn't do much to stop corrosion there. I might use Dupli-color self etch green on the tubes. Not aluminum anyway. Always interested in experience and opinions though. As to my rotors I will wait for the good stuff. Plan is for PTI acid wash primer followed by PTI Epoxy primer then topped with PTI Polyurethane. Semi gloss Dakota black on leading edge and underneath and Gloss Madrid Red on tips. Suppose to be a super hard and tough coating.

[rick1128]

Have you tried Aircraft Spruce? At Pilot Supplies and Aircraft Parts from Aircraft Spruce (http://www.aircraftspruce.com). They do have it. However, it is becoming more and more difficult to get as it is a environmentally unfriendly material. In my dealing with Aircraft Spruce, I have found that they are good folks to deal with, fair and will quickly ship the product.

Good luck.

[lvflyer]

Yes Aircraft Spruce has to get it from PTI and they wait for enough orders to make it worthwhile to send a truck to pick it up due to hazardous fees. Could take upwards of 30 to 45 days sometimes. I'm working with PTI rep and AS rep directly to try to get some drop shipped. I can't wait to put this back together so I decided on Rustoleum self etching primer from walmart with a topcoat of Rustoleum rust control gloss gray enamel for the inner panels and the self etching might be OK for the support tubes since it has a dark green shade to it. If not I may just get the Dupli-color self etching lighter green. The Rustoleum has zinc phosphate, but the Dupli-color does not. I think it is the Titanium in the Duplicolor that controls rust, but I'm not sure. Others have reported great results years after application on both so I don't think I'm going to have any issues. Will keep a close watch on it though.

[lvflyer]

Well looks like another miss by the former mechanic. What are the chances that the overrunning clutch would be totally empty of oil since it is a required check on all annuals? Which was completed less than 25 hours ago. Not a drop in the clutch. Now I have to find a couple ounces of Mobil Jet Oil II before I can move on. Will it ever end? This guy should lose his license. I can't imagine how dangerous a locked up overrunning clutch would be. OH yes I can. DEAD

[Matari]

lvflyer:

You've got some very interesting things going on with your Enstrom. From what you've posted, I recall you've have collective binding problems, a leaking gearbox, panel and flight control tube corrosion, M/R leading edge erosion and delamination, untorqued transmission mount bolts, and now a dry clutch.

On top of all that, you've paid a mechanic for a recent annual inspection where these discrepancies should have been found and fixed.

It seems, just based on the incomplete evidence here, that your A&P (and AI?) may have dropped the ball -- to put it mildly. For that, you may want to have a word with the local FSDO.

However, and with respect, your remedies for the listed discrepancies seem equally worrisome. Rustoleum from Walmart in lieu of Zinc Chromate? Household paint on the M/R blade leading edge?

Who is applying the paint? Is it being done per OEM requirements? Is blade balance being considered? And is the blade erosion outside of tolerance? Who is doing the filing/blending on the leading edge? Who is balancing the blades afterwards? Will this work be signed off by an A&P? Are your torque wrenches certified accurate? Are your maintenance manuals (which I assume you are following) up to date, with latest revisions and bulletins?

My recommendation would be for you to stop where you are and assess the condition of the aircraft as an pilot/owner, and not as a mechanic (unless you are an A&P). You should find a competent, well qualified mechanic to inspect the aircraft NOW. Get an estimate to complete the repair work using OEM and FAA approved materials and consumables.

If you can't afford to do it right, you have some serious decisions to make. You can continue down your current path of what seems to be non-compliant standards, or you can cut your losses and sell the aircraft to someone with the budget to complete the work in an approved way. Enstroms are well regarded aircraft...it will sell even in pieces.

I've never worked on an Enstrom, but I've signed enough helicopter maintenance logbooks to know that before I put my name to paper, the work was done per spec and parts used were all genuine and authorized by the OEM and/or FAA. Your Enstrom deserves that. The FAA requires it.

And most importantly, your family and passengers trust that your aircraft has been maintained to the highest standards. Don't let them down.

[lvflyer]

Matari, Thanks for your interest and concern. Some minor corrections of your conclusions.

First this is my first annual. The former owner paid $5k plus every year for his annuals from the mechanic that I wish to expose. The ship should have been in the best condition possible at that rate. I am posting this so others may learn. I am under the capable hands of a licensed A&P with helicopter experience.

Collective was rigged wrong and now perfect thanks to my mechanic, Bayard, Dennis, and others on this forum.

Leaking gearbox was because of the loose bolts on the transmission case and not mounting bolts. This should have been taken care of along time ago.

I agree with you that somebody should give the other people around here a heads up about the A&P that dropped the ball repeatedly. Problem is the IA helped me a great deal and was very particular years ago. I don't know why he is turning a blind eye to this guys work. I told him about it and he said "no it couldn't be his fault, somebody else worked on it after him"... I told the former owner and he won't even acknowledge me at airshows and won't acknowledge receipt of emails I send him with pictures. I think he was a victim.

The corrosion on rotors is not out of tolerance and blade balance is not an issue since the paint is being replaced not added. I thought when I initially sanded the corrossion off and it was still hopping on take off that I did have a balance issue, but after discussion with Bayard I serviced the oleos and a lot of that went away. I found the oleos hadn't been serviced and some were empty of gas and one was frozen and hard to cycle. All great now. After I still had a little hop I thought I had to get the blades tracked until I bought the damper bleed tool from Enstrom and WOW difference between night and day. I've had to bleed several times now to get all the air out. There are no leaks so it must be trapped air from almost never being serviced, even after the lamiflex bearings were replaced just before it was delivered to me. Prior to me bleeding the dampers the right way it never flew so smooth. Not 7 years ago when I first flew it, the time I flew it before purchase, and the day of delivery after the lamiflex bearings were replaced and a claim made that it was balanced to .1. It wasn't. I still think I want to buy a PB3 and permanently mount it to have an ongoing analyzer of vibrations, but that is down the road. I may have to have the tabs adjusted a little also since there is a little bit of cyclic feedback.

I am not using the zinc phosphate based primer on the rotors just on surface areas where the existing primer, obviously not a good job, has flaked off. All the research I have conducted is that the zinc phosphate has replaced the zinc chromate. The aircraft paint shop on the airport, which is part of a very anal shop that works on high dollar corporate aircraft doesn't use zinc chromate, they use zinc phosphate based primer. The same stuff I am using is available from Aircraft Spruce, look it up. Rustoleum Self Etching Primer and Dupli-Color Self Etching Primer. Both used by the RV builders for years. The corrosion on the support tubes is not pitting I think it is more stain than anything else, but it needs to be touched up. I think the grease and grime that has never been cleaned off in 7 years just ate the primer away.

So with that information you can see that all is within spec and all is within legal and safe bounds..again thanks for your concern but with the help and guidance of all the folks on this forum, my A&P, Bayard at Enstrom, Roger Sharkey at Sharkeys I think I am at the best I can do since nobody around here knows Enstroms except the one that screwed it up for 7 years. I wish I had someone close. I know Olivers, who previously owned this helicopter is out of business, but I have spoken with the owner and the one after him and they are near Chicago. I am hoping to make my way up there this summer and let them look it over. At near 6800 total time on this helicopter I think I'm in the running for having the highest hours for a privately owned Enstrom. Maybe not, but the books sure show this one has been around.

[Matari]

lvflyer,

It sounds like you are in good hands. Best of luck, once you get her all spruced up post some new pics of the old girl and your adventures.

[lvflyer]

She is all back together and so far after runup and one flight no problems surfaced. As requested pictures have been posted, click here Entrom (http://www.dahome.net/enstrom.htm)

[lvflyer]

I think I have asked this before, but maybe not. I can't recall all the responses. What is the normal oil temperature for a 280C hovering in 80 degrees and 80% humidity? My GEM starts flashing at 230, but stock gauge isn't anywhere neer red. Does the GEM need to be adjusted so it isn't flashing at that low temp? Also has anyone had experience with the Airwolf Chiller, a set of cooling fins for the oil filter. I think a lot of the benefit depends on airflow so how can I get more airflow to the front of the engine? The other Airwolf option is to install the remote oil filter adapter and place the oil filter in a cooler location. Suppose to get 30 to 60 degrees of cooling and a lot more efficient than the auxiliary oil cooler from Enstrom.

[lvflyer]

CO280FX Regarding your previous post about Enstrom doors. Can you describe the Velcro Bandaid a little more? I can't get the latch lined up and I've had the opportunity to experience the door flying open more than once, even once in a practice autorotation. Very unnerving. Also with your experience can you or anyone else give me some guidelines on oil temperatures that are normal for 77 280C. I just finished my first annual switching to Phillips 20WX50W and with 80+ degree and high humidity around here I'm still getting a warning on my JPL EDM 700 when climbing out with left quartering wind that flashes starting at 230 and goes up to 235 before starting to come back down when I level out. Do I need to adjust the alarm limit on the EDM? Is that a normally expected operating temperature with these conditions? I don't think it is so drastic around here to warrant the auxilary oil cooler, but what about using the Airwolf Chiller Airwolf Filter :: Oil Filter Chiller (http://www.airwolf.com/products/oil-filter-chiller/) after relocating the oil filter or redirecting more air to the filter?

[cockney steve]

Due respect to you! Interesting photos, especially the "professional" application of gobbets of red silicone,trying to hide the leaks.

Console yourself, If he was the best, just how bad were the others? :eek:

You seem to be on the ball and researching the best methodology and an understanding of materials and technologies before jumping in.
I had a friend with a full professional auto paint and body-shop who repainted his Cessna 172 after a bare-metal strip and engineers' inspection.
The prop got several coats of 2-pack black, which was stoved in a low-bake oven......It was amazing how quickly the paint eroded back to bare metal on the leading edges of the blades. IIRC he used blade-tape after another repaint and resolved the problem.
Your MR blades certainly look neglected. the previous owner was obviously a "Cheque-book flyer" otherwise, instead of just tossing money at it, he would have found some of the horrors you have uncovered....... keep at it, you should wind up with a really,really good machine....you deserve it :ok:

[lvflyer]

Thanks for the encouragement cockney steve. It's been a tough road, but I think I have most the kinks out. I still haven't gotten my order from the paint shop yet. Sean just decided not to reply to me anymore and I can't get what I need from Aircraft Spruce. I just really cringe at the idea of blade tape at this time. I read too many horror stories and with the weight of the blades as they are with lifting tape it is a handfull to say the least in flight. Urethane is suppose to be a really tough coating for the leading edge. It is two part and suppose to be really resilient. We'll see.

[500e]

No paint stands it :{

http://www.arl.army.mil/www/pages/374/AHS_68th.pdf

http://rain-sand-erosion.com/PDF/enhanced_erosion_protection_for_rotor_blades_V22_AHS_paper.p df

[lvflyer]

Good info for desert dwellers, but all I have to deal with is bugs here in corn country.

[lvflyer]

I still haven't gotten a response to my high oil temperature issue. What is the normal operating temperatures I should see on a 280C in high 80 degree and high 80 humidity at 1450 TIT? Should I adjust my JPL oil temperature warning more like 240 than 230? Oh I changed to Phillips XC 20W50.

[Gaseous]

240 is on the high side for normal running but ok for a warning level. Check everything is OK - oil coolers not blocked with grass etc. Check your mixture settings too.

I dont like repeated 'false' warnings from an engine monitor - they get switched off and ignored. If your engine wont run below 230 (some wont!) even though everything is right set the limit to 240 then if something does go wrong you'll get a warning you take note of.

If you're serious about understanding your engine - and I guess you are- google John Deakin's Pelicans Perch articles on AVweb. There are a lot of irrelevant articles but the engine management ones are gold! They approach engine management from a fixed wing perspective but the knowledge can equally be applied with care to helicopter engines too.

[500e]

IVf, look at Robo blade paint problem,not talking about dis-bonds but paint erosion. Not just desert dwellers.
Not found any paint that lasts on leading edge, re painting numerous times just tends to screw T&B

[FSXPilot]

Use the new 3M blade tape that is glued on. It is very good. Look at service letter 172.

[lvflyer]

I found a new auxiliary oil cooler in surplus stock for $500. Can someone send me some pictures of the auxiliary oil cooler installation, especially pictures of the oil lines and where the cooler mounts on a 280C. Enstrom wants $1400 for an oil line. I may have a qualified oil line manufacturer around here for a lot less. It would be great to get the temperatures 20 to 30 degrees lower.

[500e]

It's all most as if manufacturers don't want customers, some of the prices are just robbery
And quality is not that special either

[Aussiecop]

500, it's helicopters... If I find something that's under $5k I think it's like Christmas morning lol.

[lvflyer]

yep supposedly new in box although the box is opened. Problem is the illustrated parts document has a rough drawing of the auxiliary oil cooler system and no clear pictures of where it mounts or exactly what the hoses look like. Enstrom engineer told me on Facebook that some of this model didn't run cooler than 230 and 240 was a good warning point. Seems really high to me.

[rotorboater]

Has anyone heard of a storage box mounted on the skids or underneath? I have seen them for R44's & rotorways but not come across one for a 28F

[lvflyer]

One more thing. My pilot door blew open on a flight and I lost my fuel dipstick. Can one of you measure your marks and let me know so I can make one. It's still a mystery why my 1977 280C doesn't have sight glass in the tanks.

[FLY 7]

This looks very nice


First Enstrom 480B-G goes to New Hampshire pilot | Vertical Magazine - The Pulse of the Helicopter Industry (http://www.verticalmag.com/news/article/29016) :cool:

[Gaseous]

I need a new LPC. Is there anyone in the north west of England can do one? Just type ENF28.

Thanks.

[rotorboater]

Ray Jones is your best bet, actually he might be the only bet! There is a lack of current Enstrom examiners in the North UK at the moment since Bill Bailey retired and Norman Bailey has stopped as well. If you need Ray's details send me a PM.

[timprice]

One of the few schools still doing type ratings in the UK is Shoreham Helicopters Ltd we can complete type conversions and Skills tests, plus Proficiency checks.
Regards
Tim:D

[helicopter-redeye]

Bill and Norm had a third pilot working with them (Collier?) - was he an examiner on the ENF or instructor only?

Looking like the end of an era for Enstrom in the UK. Such a fun aircraft to fly.

[chriswhi]

Howard Collier was an instructor for the Manchester Helicopter Centre not an examiner, not sure he is still instructing since Bill & Norman closed. Very sad for Enstrom

[TOT]

HI Gaseous.
LPC ( now Proficiency Check) no problem, have sent you PM, I come up north fairly often, or happy to meet you somewhere.
Have sent you PM with my contact details , or contact me at Gloucester EGBJ
As Tim has said only a few schools in UK now Providing TYPE Conversions on ENSTROM 280 SERIES.( OR ENSTROM 480 SERIES)
As far as I am aware
ENSTROM 280 series, its only TWO, Shoreham Helicopters and Staffordfordshire Helis at Burton on Trent.
ENSTROM 480 series, its only TWO, Shoreham Helicopters and Heliflight Gloucester.

I provide AB INITIO TRAINING at Gloucester, Swansea and Pembrey but happy to accommodate PC or Skills Tests at most locations.

As far as Enstrom 280 Examiners, I only know of, myself, Tim Price, Al Gwilt and Leon Smith, - but there could be others

regards Ray

ray

[bvgs]

Tim did mine on G-SHRK at Shoreham. Great guy!

[Dennis Kenyon]

My apologies for IVFLYER for not being able to respond sooner ...I've been away working ... actually flying an Enstrom 480B at the South African, AAD air show at AF base Waterkloof, then on a USA holiday. The massively de-rated C20W engine easily coped with the 5000 feet airfield elevation plus a 90 degree daytime temperature. Three displays a day for the period of the show and as good a week's flying as I've ever enjoyed. If interested there's a couple of cockpit mounted videos and a 'ground to air' of the Enstrom and the MD530F display sequences posted on You Tube and possibly FB.

I also flew the Safomar Enstrom FX crop sprayer and it was good to see the old girl neatly decked out in working clothes. Unhappily we experienced an incorrect mixture engine failure 800 feet over Pretoria, but as we all know ... something of a non-event in the type.

Many of the 28C/280C versions I've flown seem to suffer high engine oil temperatures after a prolonged period of high power and low air flow as in a climb or hover. Like the Schweizer 300, the factory have available a second cooler which is fitted in series as per the service instruction. It is normally mounted right side in a 5 o clock position to the air filter. Fitment drops the temperature by around 20-30 degrees and I've always taken the view that two coolers are essential for training or when the ambient is circa 80 degrees plus. But in constant hover mode, it is important that the number one unit is routinely checked for matrix blocking. Some airframes had coolers fitted with manually removable 'butterfly' flaps for hand removal of debris. (eg grass) It's a simple retro fit.

Talking to the new Enstrom CEO at Waterkloof, it seems with the new Chonquing ownership, the Menominee factory are heading for greater manufacturing capability and sales. The forthcoming 180 trainer being the first new model to appear, so no need to start forecasting a factory demise. Rather the opposite I feel.

Just to confirm dear Ray Jones at Monmouth is always prepared to be the wandering minstrel for Enstrom type checks plus of course my good mate, Tim Price down south. You won't find two nicer or more type knowledgeable guys. Leon Smith at WAP is type approved too. I'm always happy to help or fly with existing or new Enstrom owners with some pre-LPC familiarisation flying or specialist auto handling. (to date I'm up to 5,500 'skids-on' practice autos - just two for real!) PM me or look me up on the internet.

So retirement or not, I still rate the Enstrom marques highly ... good looking, reasonably low operating costs, quiet, great handling, even greater autorotation capability, ultra safe, wide roomy cabin, dedicated 100lb capacity luggage locker, 85lbs fuel burn per hour giving 100 mph in the cruise and as we all know, the type can be trimmed to fly 'hands & feet off' ... I often wonder why people buy anything else !!! Hard hat firmly on.

Best wishes from an Enstrom COF. Dennis K.

[Dennis Kenyon]

Oh and I forgot .... the original two 40 USG capacity fuel tanks always had the transparent 'boiler' guage for external fuel contents readings. Usually marked 60, 120, 180 and 240 lbs. The problem was that in service the transparent strip became opaque over time so many simply got painted over. Contact the Steve Payne Roberts Enstrom support engineer. He'll send you a standard wood 'dip stick' on request. Or make one yourself using your own graduations! Safe flying. Dennis K.

[whiskeyflyer]

For a video with internal and external shots of Dennis Kenyon flying the Enstrom 480B in his usual spectacular way, at AAD 2014 in South Africa, click on the following Youtube links

Well done Dennis, hope I can fly like that in my 80s

Short version, with music
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1Im_kN2r5-s

Long version, with just heli sounds
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_grWBb20TNg

[timprice]

Nice display Dennis and the weather looked perfect.:ok:

[Dennis Kenyon]

Thanks Tim & Others. Yes the wx was superb for the AAD air show. Quite a few novelties though. The crowds were queuing at the gates for entry to the show at 06.30 hrs. My first display was for 08.45 hrs. And the air force ground crew were a tad wary of the opening 'Pirouette' manoeuvre thinking I might scrape a hole in their new tarmac, so the fire guys flooded the lift off position with foam!

And a big AND ... Waterkloof is a whisker under 5000 feet ... mid day temperatures circa 90 degrees, so shades of my Salt Lake City faux pas! Hopefully none of us make the same mistake twice but since the display machines were the MD530F, 630 SHP C30 to be followed by Enstrom's highly manoeuverable 480B, the resultant DA was well within the types handling.

Air Shows are big in South Africa. I'm told the daily attendance was circa 35,000 with a show total of 130,000! I'd have to say one of the ... if not THE most enjoyable flying week of my career. Best wishes to all pps. Dennis K.

[wirlybird]

Hello Dennis, I have been following this thread for some time,I think the guys who follow forum this are extremely lucky to have your knowledge at their finger tips. The point of writing is I can kick my rear that I.missed your demonstration flights at the air show , your flying ability is amazing that machines becomes part of you.

[seneca2e]

Dennis,
Can you elaborate on your engine failures in the piston Enstroms. I think from reading your posts here and elsewhere you've had two. You reference a mixture issue but what exactly did it turn out to be that time(and the other for that matter). Can you tell us also the resolution of the failure and where you put it down at?

I recently bought an Enstrom 280C and am going over it now bringing her up to excellent condition so am looking to learn all I can about them. I did own one nearly 30 years ago but didn't really get into the mechanical part of it so much back then. I do remember the oil temp running near redline and it being very hard to start when hot(had the impulse coupling mag). Also had a lot of issues with T&B but this time around I'm hoping to have a different outcome by knowing more!

Thanks!

[Dennis Kenyon]

My apologies to Seneca for being unable to respond to his 'engine mixture' request. I'm miles from home just now, but will post the requested info very shortly. DRK.

[seneca2e]

Thanks for your response! Looking forward to it I assure you! I have two beautiful helicopters sitting side by side in my hangar. Both of which you have tremendous experience with and I have tried to read every word you've posted on them over the years. A Brantly B2B and Enstrom F280C. Both are great aircraft years ahead of their time!

[EN48]

I recently took delivery of a new Enstrom 480B-G equipped with Garmin G1000H avionics. Enstrom and Sharkey's Helicopters (Enstrom dealer) both went many extra miles to assure that the purchase experience was outstanding. Fit and finish, and attention to detail are world class, with nothing that even an accomplished nit picker like myself can complain about. IMHO, this helicopter is an exceptional value in the light turbine market. :ok:


http://i306.photobucket.com/albums/nn264/sharkattack2347/n208rjsml_zps78ee7dc8.jpg (http://s306.photobucket.com/user/sharkattack2347/media/n208rjsml_zps78ee7dc8.jpg.html)

http://i306.photobucket.com/albums/nn264/sharkattack2347/n208rjpnlsml_zps52bfc196.jpg (http://s306.photobucket.com/user/sharkattack2347/media/n208rjpnlsml_zps52bfc196.jpg.html)

[timprice]

Love the swept blades in the photo! are they for special ops, or stealth mode?:cool:

[lvflyer]

Congrats. Gotta say though a little envy creeping in. Hey can you post more pictures. I can't seem to find pictures of the power plant in the turbines. Just curious how they can get so much seating arranged in one.

[CO280fx]

:ok: Looking sharp! :D

[EN48]

I can't seem to find pictures of the power plant in the turbines. Just curious how they can get so much seating arranged in one.

Engine: Allison Model 250 - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Allison_Model_250)

Seating: http://rototexheli.com/productos/480B-R44_Comparison.pdf

[Dennis Kenyon]

I'm just back from my final flying stint away for 2014 and having posted on the Enstrom 480 type further on, I'm sorry to see my earlier reply to Seneca doesn't seem to have been posted. If you care to PM me with any items where I have experience and can provide personal information, please let me know. Take care all ppruners. Dennis K.

[rotorboater]

Nice machine EN48:)

[CO280fx]

In response to the tragic and very disturbing recent accident in Colorado:

http://rgl.faa.gov/Regulatory_and_Guidance_Library/rgAD.nsf/0/342fb061c33bc7a786257dea00750308/$FILE/2015-04-51_Emergency.pdf
(http://rgl.faa.gov/Regulatory_and_Guidance_Library/rgAD.nsf/0/342fb061c33bc7a786257dea00750308/$FILE/2015-04-51_Emergency.pdf)

SDB from Enstrom:
http://www.enstromhelicopter.com/wp-content/uploads/2012/03/SDB01191.pdf
(http://www.enstromhelicopter.com/wp-content/uploads/2012/03/SDB01191.pdf)http://www.enstromhelicopter.com/wp-content/uploads/2012/03/Spindle-MPI-SDB-0119-T-050.pdf
(http://www.enstromhelicopter.com/wp-content/uploads/2012/03/Spindle-MPI-SDB-0119-T-050.pdf)

[John R81]

CAA have issued an EAD.


No flight for affected machines until inspected.


pdf of the EAD available here


[PDF]EMERGENCY AIRWORTHINESS DIRECTIVE - EASA ... (http://ad.easa.europa.eu/blob/20150451_Emergency.pdf/EAD_US-2015-04-51_1)
ad.easa.europa.eu/blob/20150451_Emergency.../EAD_US-2015-04-51

[FSXPilot]

I don't know of any Enstroms in the UK that have 5,000 hours.

[griffothefog]

EN48, as much as I like the look of the 480B with G1000 fit, is there really any point without a autopilot?
All the colored graphics in the world is only as good as the hand that flies it and the autopilot does it so much better than us mortals...
Surely that fit is was intended for IFR flight, otherwise what's the point :{

[EN48]

the 480B with G1000 fit, is there really any point without a autopilot?
Surely that fit is was intended for IFR flight, otherwise what's the point

The aviation world (at least in the U.S.) is going this way. Three light turbine helos (none with IFR certification) are currently certified with G1000H avionics: Bell 407GX, Agusta 119 Kx, and Enstrom 480B-G. The forthcoming Bell 505 will come standard with the G1000H package. I am told that the B407 is now available to civilian purchasers with the G1000H package only (no steam gauge option). An autopilot would add useful capability, however, none of these aircraft would be certifiable for IFR under current FAA standards even with the addition of an autopilot which meets FAA requirements for SPIFR, and such an autopilot would boost the cost of the E480 by as much as 50%. To meet current FAA requirements for IFR requires systems capabilities beyond the AP which are, so far, found only in the Bell 429/Agusta 109/EC135 class of helicopters (and higher), with price tags something like 5X or more that of the E480. It seems likely that, as avionics capability increases and costs come down, the FAA will adopt certification standards which permit IFR in light single engine helicopters.

It can be argued that for a helicopter certified for VFR-only operation (virtually all civilian single engine helicopters in the U.S. with the exception of a handful B206’s and B407’s which were approved some years ago on a few-off basis) there is little point in any avionics beyond the surprisingly little instrumentation required by the certification standards, plus a com radio and (perhaps) a portable GPS. However, technology is approaching a breakeven point where the incremental cost of the advanced avionics is not a major cost once one decides that an AI and DG might be useful, along with a backup com radio, a certified GPS navigator like the Garmin 530, and a transponder (which might as well be ADS-B capable given the FAA 2020 NextGen mandate).

Finally, an integrated avionics suite such as the G1000H makes possible useful features (some safety oriented) not practical with a steam gauge panel, offers potential reliability advantages over mechanical/ electromechanical instrumentation, and the promise of upgrades and fixes via software changes. The G1000H is a variant of the G1000 originally developed for fixed wing aircraft and does include some capabilities that will rarely, if ever, be used in a VFR-only helicopter (except, perhaps, for training), such as dual VOR/LOC/GS receivers. However, it is apparently less costly to standardize on a single basic hardware configuration than to delete these capabilities. It is easy to see why this is the case when one carefully examines the internal architecture of the G1000. In the 50 years since my first solo in a Cessna 150 with a single, primitive, vacuum tube nav/com, I have experienced the evolution of avionics technology first hand; I have no desire to go back to the good old days, not even a few steps back.

BTW, Enstrom developed the G1000H version of the 480 partly to meet the requirements of foreign military customers who train dual rated pilots in G1000 equipped Cessna 172’s and Enstrom 480’s, and want a common avionics suite in both aircraft. The G1000 has been available in the C172 since 2005.

Most important point of all is the distinction between needs and wants. Many recently manufactured owner flown light helicopters can be said to be “over-equipped,” possibly for this reason. :E

[lvflyer]

Update on AD. Now 1500 hours TIS. Also SD says the test has to be repeated every 300 hours.

[flylow]

... for spindles with over 3500 hours.

[lvflyer]

Yes 3500 on recurring every 300 hours. This is not in the EAD, but is in the SDB from Enstrom. The FAA EAD does say initial inspection before further flight and before 1500 TIS or any that TIS cannot be determined or over 1500 TIS. The SDB allows 5 hours of flight before inspection, but the EAD does not. For those that do not know, Enstrom, last I heard, was doing the testing for free and will disassemble/reassemble the retention system for a fee.

[flylow]

I would like to upgrade the 9-hole panel with a 12-hole wide panel in my 280C. However, the factory drawings only show approval for the wide panel in the F models. I'm trying to find anyone who has done this or would have or know about prior approvals, such as 337's, field approvals, etc. that could be used to do this upgrade.

[lvflyer]

I would be interested in any suggestions for upgrading the 280C's interior and equipment. I have a 1977 that could use some upgrading. I think the next thing is getting the doors to close tighter or securing with a Velcro strap. Frustrating to have the doors blow open in gusts or when the window vents are turned just so, pressurizing the cabin.

[tom28a]

HI guys any one out there flying the Enstroms is Dennis k still flying

[FLY 7]

Yes, lots. Excellent helicopters.

And, Dennis here: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=n5XT_XdVAeA

[tom28a]

Dennis K is the best pilot I have ever seen.......

[Hot and Hi]

offers potential reliability advantages over mechanical/ electromechanical instrumentation, and the promise of upgrades and fixes via software changes. Yes, promises. I wouldn't be too sure about either.
Reliability to be proven. But if the glass goes down, everything goes down. With traditional steam gauges, there can't be one single fault that kills all instruments at the same time.

See here (http://www.avweb.com/news/features/The-Dangers-of-Jump-Starting-225794-1.html) for an updated re-print of a 2014 article from Light Plane Maintenance magazine. While the article mostly speaks about the risk of flying an a/c with a dead battery, further down by way of example, the author spells out the unexpected (or to be expected) effects of an electrical problem on 'modern' avionics. The article concludes with a section called "Is This Progress?".

And promises of upgrades and software fixes? In my experience, these proprietary GPS systems come with high map upgrade costs. I reckon, leaving it (not doing map or required software updates) will render your a/c un-airworthy. So you are trapped.

Given that certified engine and drivetrain technology is in service for 25+ years (very slow rate of innovation), and that electronics show a very high rate of innovation, it seems advisable to reserve as much as possible of that "fast changing feature rich consumer electronics world" to handhelds. Handhelds (be it tablets or proprietary devices, like Garmins) you can change and dump as you feel fit, at much lower cost, and without affecting the airworthiness of your a/c

[evil7]

Regarding EN48´s last post (#571?)

The yanks make me laugh again.
You cannot certify all these "new" single turbine helicopters with all the gimmiks (AP, super new cockpit, etc) for IFR but you can gain your IFR ticket on a R22:mad::ugh::}

[Rhys Perraton]

Hello Denis, a blast from the past, met you some times at airshows in UK and at Shoreham. I'm looking to talk with someone knowledgeable about Enstroms, if you see this please e.mail me. Thanks
Rhys Perraton [email protected]

[FLY 7]

Spotted this on youtube - quite enjoyed it over my morning coffee

www.youtube.com/watch?v=1Mhzauk2iRM

[Gaseous]

Morning All,

Tom Kirk tells me he's stopped doing Enstrom maintenance.
I know of Steve PR in Northampton but he's a bit far away from where the aircraft usually is.
Anyone know of any other Enstrom engineers up north? There used to be a few but my list is well out of date.

Cheers.

G.

[Dennis Kenyon]

Just have to throw a note or two in here. OAP Kenyon has been happily & unhappily associated with the Enstrom marque now for forty-seven years, so I'd like to think I must have learned something. As some of you will know, I still love the type and spent a happy couple of hours just yesterday on serial number 1104 conducting some advanced training for an ex-Navy guy. The 280C Shark is forty-one years old but her handling still rivals anything on offer anywhere. BUT ... (there's always a but!) ... type support in the UK is abysmal. Now with the departure of Tom, we have just Rise at Gloucester and SPR in Northants. OOP NORTH ... nothing .... zilch I'm afraid! Will someone with rotary experience please, please join the party as there's a super window of opportunity as I write. There's a glimmer on the horizon though. Yesterday's client is an ex-Navy engineer with twelve years experience on heavies and may soon be offering a special service for Enstrom owners ... and how we need it. Those interested, PM for details.

PS. I'm still offering advanced dual handling .... dozens of full stop EOLs to the ground. (I won't practice anything else!) ... tail rotor failure - airborne study, plus the usual VR and any special handling you'd like to brush up. I guess 2017 has to be my last year but I'm hoping to bag a final couple of hundred hours to make the magic 20,000 mark.

And a cautious PS. The Enstrom is still THE ONLY helicopter of any type that has never suffered a fatality in the UK. Long may she keep it that way.

Safe flying to all. Dennis Kenyon.

[helicopter-redeye]

Sounds like the sort of challenge Aero Maintenance at Walton Wood would take on. Perhaps Gaseous and other northern Enstrom owners should fly over for a chat with Chris and Tony, along with an assessment of the market size in region. I'm sure they used to do Enstrom type work a few years ago.

[outofwhack]

I dont get it but then I'm only familiar with helicopter maintenance in Oz.

In Oz any mechanic that can work on a R22 can work on an Enstrom.
The same mechanic would need a hydraulic ticket to do a 47 or any piston heli with hydraulics.

Why would a UK helicopter mechanic turn away business in the form of an Enstrom?

I want an Enstrom in the UK ooop north one day.

OOW

[carlmeek]

I'm a new owner of a 280FX, and I love it. i watch this thread with interest. If anyone wants to make contact please do, owners need to share ideas.

Edited to add, I'm in Sussex UK

[cogboxer]

Anyone reviewed the new proposed AD on rotor spindles? You can see it here:
https://www.federalregister.gov/documents/2017/03/02/2017-03950/airworthiness-directives-the-enstrom-helicopter-corporation

They are proposing life limiting the spindles to 1500 hours, and are estimating a purchase and replacement cost of $18,690 per helicopter. In addition, an inspection would be conducted every 500 hours (so at 500 and 1000), with their cost estimate being $1,275/helicopter. So, if those costs are right this boosts the hourly operating costs by about $14USD.

I've been considering purchasing an older enstrom 280fx or f28f, but my current mechanic recommends waiting to see how this shakes out. What are your thoughts?

[Reely340]

In addition, an inspection would be conducted every 500 hours (so at 500 and 1000), with their cost estimate being $1,275/helicopter. So, if those costs are right this boosts the hourly operating costs by about $14USD. Hmm,:confused: assuming your spindles do not require replacing, I'd arrive at 1275/500 = 2,55 USD/h additional operating cost.
And yes, EASA AD 2016-0221 an MPI before exceeding 1500h service life and at least every 500f thereafter.

[Reely340]

Speaking of blade spindle thread breaking and mandatory MRI inspection every 500h, is changing to Airwolf TT-Straps a worthwhile invenstment?
They claim the same 5 years 1200h life limit as the lamiflex bearings
and lots of other andvantages: https://www.verticalmag.com/press-releases/airwolfttstrapssolutiontoemergencyad20150451forenstrompiston/

Has anyone already done that mod to an F28A?

What is the cost for changing the TT-straps (parts&labour) after 5 years?

I'd assume the 500h blade spindle disassembly and MRI inspection would be obsoleted.

[md 600 driver]

Why not just call the Enstrom distributor in the U.K. Eastern Atlantic ,SPR or call the factory in Wisconsin (I can't spell menonome )

And ask them

[Reely340]

interesting times for Enstrom owners.
If this https://www.federalregister.gov/documents/2017/03/02/2017-03950/airworthiness-directives-the-enstrom-helicopter-corporation becomes an AD,
and one has three spindles, MPI checked recently according to AD 2015-08-51, albeit each with say 4000h TIS, the spindles will become paperweights. :sad:

Any opinion if these retired spindles can be converted to TT-straps and will be airworthy again? :E

Considering that the tt-strap conversion "should cost less than $12,000" and
the replacement of three timed out spindles will cost in excess of $24.000, according to FFA's estimated cost of compliance,
I forsee golden times for Airwulf Aerosapce, or am I missing something here?:ok:

[Encyclo]

Are TT Straps really the way to go???

Not sure this poor guy would agree:

https://aviation-safety.net/wikibase/wiki.php?id=195300

Would these have been Airwolf Straps?

Fly Safe, Always :ok:

[Eddie Dean]

The STC for Airwolf TT straps now includes the F280 and like.
http://www.airwolfaerospace.com/awa/application/files/2814/4674/4551/Airwolf_Enstrom_TT_Strap__EASA_STC.pdf
I assume that fitment of these would be an alternative means of compliance for the FAA AD.
Would appreciate more information if any one can help.
Cheers

[Eddie Dean]

Second post:
Also looking for electronic copy of 280fx maintenance manual.

[Gaseous]

AD for -11 and -13 main rotor spindles will come in force on 21st Feb. 1500 hour life.
looks like most older Enstroms will be affected.:(

[md 600 driver]

That’s going to cause Enstrom owners a lot of money

STEVE

[Helicodger Pilot]

Gaseous-Thanks for the "heads up".
The good news is that this issue is finally going to be officially resolved and we'll all know what the costs are. I talked with Eric at Airwolf a couple months ago and (IIRC) he said the cost of the TT strap STC conversion was $14,800 USD. That's a one-time outlay vs. an on-going expense for 500 hr inspections which an owner can use to decide which route to go.
I predict that 90% of Enstroms (including all new production henceforth) will have TT straps in the next couple years. Additional good news is that according to other owners I've talked to, the TT straps are operationally much superior to the Lamiflex bearings which frequently failed before their service life limit. Further, the spindle mod for the Airwolf STC removes the area where the cracking occurs, so the spindles don't have to be scrapped due to cracks if they're sent in to be converted.
It's a real shame to have this blot on the Enstrom's otherwise excellent safety record, and a tragedy for the souls that were lost in the precipitating accident, but I believe that in the long run it will be a positive outcome for the type, which I'm extremely fond of.

[Iainhp]

Am in the process of purchasing an older 28A in need of some TLC (which has been factored in) but based on new AD am looking at same spindle issue (or possible TT Straps) within next 12 Months, on that basis I am potentially looking to syndicate (at a sensible % cost/share) or sell Hrs - has anyone got any ideas/interest?

P.

[flylow]

I talked with Eric at Airwolf a couple months ago and (IIRC) he said the cost of the TT strap STC conversion was $14,800 USD. That's a one-time outlay vs. an on-going expense for 500 hr inspections which an owner can use to decide which route to go.


The cost of the TT straps was raised by Airwolf to $15,900 USD. They still have a 5 year calendar life, and require inspections at 1200 hours.

[Helicodger Pilot]

flylow-
Thanks for the update on the STC cost. I haven't been closely following the pricing since the ship I'm buying has already been converted.
True about the 5 year life and 1200 hr inspections, but the Lamiflex bearings also have a 5 year life and I've heard from other Enstrom owners that they seldom survive the full 5, so overall it sounds like an improvement to me. I've also heard (from owners) the TT straps give a smoother ride and don't get out of track, but I don't (yet) have any experience with that.

[timprice]

My experience is on 480 TT straps are no better than lamiflex, first 480 we had was on lamiflex no real issues, if set up correctly both equally as good it just comes down to cost.

[Helicodger Pilot]

The FAA has estimated costs for compliance with AD 2018-02-01 as follows:

Costs of Compliance

We estimate that this AD affects 323 helicopters of U.S. Registry. We estimate that operators may incur the following costs in order to comply with this AD. Labor costs are estimated at $85 per work-hour. Inspecting the spindles takes about 15 work-hours for an estimated cost of $1,275 per helicopter and $411,825 for the U.S. fleet per inspection cycle. Replacing a cracked spindle costs $8,164 for parts and no additional work-hours. Replacing a set of three spindles that have reached their life limit takes about 14 work-hours and parts will cost $17,500 for a total cost of $18,690 per helicopter.

IF those estimates are accurate, then there's no economic case for NOT doing the TT strap STC when 1500 hrs TIS is reached. Prior to 1500 hrs TIS there's potentially 2 inspection intervals when spindles could be returned to service after the MPI at an hourly DOC increase of $2.55 and then replaced after the 3rd 500 hrs, so at least there's some options.
I feel the pain of an almost $20K expense outlay but I'm trying to look on the bright side...:uhoh:

[Helicodger Pilot]

A few months ago while I was considering various options for a personal helicopter, I ran across this clip on youtube from Kenny Keller who really likes Enstroms:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Bjk5UDQlL5o

[Helicodger Pilot]

Another video from Kenny Keller comparing the Robinson R-44 to the Enstrom F-28/280. You may be surprised- :eek:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tInMe5Wt36w

[r22butters]

Another video from Kenny Keller comparing the Robinson R-44 to the Enstrom F-28/280. You may be surprised- :eek:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tInMe5Wt36w

Yeah, I've flown both too, and yeah the Enstrom is a really nice and well built helicopter, but I'm willing to bet that what makes people chose that R44 time and time again, is that back seat.

The Enstrom holds three like the R66 holds five,...and like my Trans Am's back seat holds anyone with well, legs!

As for myself, a guy recently tried to talk me into switching from an R22 to an Enstrom, and my answer is always the same,...price. The view from the cockpit is the same, so why pay more?

[FLY 7]

The view from the cockpit is the same, so why pay more?

Not quite. Look up and you'll see a fully articulated 3-blade rotorhead.

[r22butters]

Not quite. Look up and you'll see a fully articulated 3-blade rotorhead.

Big whoop:hmm:

[Helicopterdriverguy]

Big whoop:hmm:

R22butters. Totally agree a big whoop is the only way to go
3 bladed is definately the way to go

[flylow]

The Enstrom holds three like the R66 holds five,...and like my Trans Am's back seat holds anyone with well, legs!

I regularly fly 3 in my Enstrom doing event rides or longer tours. We fit just fine.

The view from the cockpit is the same, so why pay more?

I'll take the proven better safety and build of the Enstrom over an R22 any day.

[r22butters]

You guys are funny. :rolleyes:

[timprice]

Its the 12 year life that really gets me down with the Robinson, for a PPL owner that's a big cost.

[Gaseous]

Over the 18 years I've owned Enstroms the cost has been minimal compared with a Robinson - and that includes an engine rebuild and the TT strap conversion I'm about to have done. For me as a private owner it has been a cost effective, fun, safe and generally pleasurable experience.

Ps anyone want 3 Lamiflexes cheap with a year or so left on them?

[Helicodger Pilot]

Some highlights from the HAI expo with particular emphasis on the Enstrom booth:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=r5EVYc8q-HE

[CharlieS3]

Just a heads up for those of you who may be installing the TT straps for the first time in your Enstrom. Be sure to check out Service Information Letter 0187 when you install the system. There is potential for interference between the retention pin and the U-Block. I wish this had been mentioned in the STC installation paperwork. We ran into all sorts of problems balancing the blades after the STC until we found this out.

Charlie

[PhoenixHTKA]

Hi All!

We are trying to clean our airfield and find some F28 door pleaxiglass in hidden.
3 pcs R/H and 1 pc L/H.
If some of you are interested about it, contact me and trying to help.
Bests
PHX

[PhoenixHTKA]

Hi Guys!

Trying to clean our airport we found hidden some door pleaxiglass of F28

These are rounded version and brand new covered by foil.

3 pcs of R/H and 1 pc of L/H

If some of you are interested about it, just tell me and trying to help.

Bests

PHX

[Triple Nickel 8 Ball]

....that could let me have a go in an Enstrom? I’m a high hour pro jet jockey and lower hour rotor nut PPL that’s rated in Cabri and R44 that loves Enstrom......

[Mutley1013]

Shoreham Helicopters run them

[PRJ882]

I just bought an Enstrom 280fx here in the U.S. I hope to have some work finished on it soon so I can get her home!

[lvflyer]

It's been a long time and much water under the bridge, but since I originally started this thread and Dennis Kenyon was a valuable contributor I just wanted to say Rest in Peace Dennis. My shark is currently in pieces from the spindle AD fiasco, but finally getting in a place to put it back together after 2 years. Mysteries await on the control pressures and track and balance, but I'm sure I can tackle that as I have all the other gremlins mentioned in this thread. I'm currently in the market for a Tailbeacon also. I have had 3 sellers that were scammers on Facebook. I guess used avionics is the latest industry to rip people off from. Make them prove who they are and always use a pay service that guarantees anti fraud.