View Full Version : Recleared?
Killroy
31st Jul 2005, 22:05
Howdy!
Question for ATCO's:
When I'm climbing to a certain FL and during this climb the controller clears me to climb to another level, what is my response supposed to be?
I have been told by an instructor that answering with "123, re cleared FL something" is not correct as it is a phrase only to be used by ATCO's in a particular sitation (can't remember exactly which one) while others say you can answer like that.
Who knows what to say (or not)?
Tnx,
K.
niknak
31st Jul 2005, 22:11
Its a crap piece of phraseology which in my opinion, shouldn't be used at all, but often is when ATCO's tell a/c to climb or descend.
You are either cleared to climb or your are not, to use any other phraseology can lead to confusion, which at the very least wastes everyone's time, and at the worst can be downright dangerous.
jEtGuiDeR
31st Jul 2005, 23:08
Personally, if I re-clear an aircraft to climb/descend, I just say "Climb/Descend FL***" I've noticed some of the older/bolder :D controllers say "recleared FL***" and this is still in JSP552 (Mil regs) as recognised phraseology
Chilli Monster
1st Aug 2005, 09:54
Your instructor is right - from both sides of the fence:
1) as a controller I don't use re-cleared. It doesn't appear in the books so a simple "Climb FL***" suffices
2) as a pilot if I ever get "recleared FL***" (VERY rare) then I just respond with "Climb FL***, (callsign)".
It's a bit like saying "turn further right heading blah blah"
Re-Cleared is just a piece of lazy phraseology that people drop in from time to time......
tori chelli
1st Aug 2005, 12:01
AlanM
although the 'book' does allow "continue turn heading..." which I've always thought superfluous & unnecessary. :confused:
Tori
spekesoftly
1st Aug 2005, 14:27
CAP 493 (applicable to civil ATCOs in the UK), clearly states:-
"The expression 're-cleared' is not to be used."
5milesbaby
1st Aug 2005, 22:50
abc123, amendment to your routing (if I think the pilot needs a heads up that I'm about to splurge some extra crap from what I normally pump out) , route......
abc 123 STOP climb/descent FL*** (If lower/higher than previous clearance)
otherwise use normal RTF.
I admit that once or twice I have used 're-cleared' to correct myself immediately after a transmission by saying, 'correction, recleared....' but I then had to run away in embarrasement!
Talkdownman
2nd Aug 2005, 04:34
"The expression 're-cleared' is not to be used."
Why do you think some people find that sentence difficult to understand?
catocontrol
2nd Aug 2005, 04:57
Why does everybody in here forget the small and simple word to
e.g Climb TO 2000 feet. Climb TO FL130. The right way to do it!
Recleared can be used to change details in a clearance:
"SAS1234 recleared direct PIKOX"
It doesn't say anything about not using it with altitudes.
5milesbaby
2nd Aug 2005, 09:43
catocontrol, we are permitted to only climb TO altitudes, you DO NOT climb TO FL***.
Whats wrong with route or route direct?
catocontrol
2nd Aug 2005, 14:10
I guess different countries has got different rules.
Norway= "Climb to FL.."
Proceed direct or cleared direct is the most common phrases used here.
The problem with climb/descend TO altitudes has to do with the confusion between "to"and "two". Remember that 747 freighter a few years back that slammed into Mt. Kinabalu in Asia because there was confusion with the descent clearance - controller said "descend TWO TWO HUNDRED (2200) feet", the pilots heard "descend TO two hundred feet", or something like that. Don't remember the details too much, but the possibility for mis-hearing an instruction does exist. Best not to use "to" at all, I think.
catocontrol
2nd Aug 2005, 21:05
I cannot say that I agree with you on that one! Decend 1000ft, could also mean decend by one thousand feet!
Pilots, aswell as ATC should know their phraseology. 2200 feet shall be pronounced "twothousandtwohundred feet." Not "two-twohundred feet"
5milesbaby
2nd Aug 2005, 22:09
and the word altitude should be added before the numbers so:
descend to altitude two thousand two hundred feet.
Ronaldsway Radar
3rd Aug 2005, 16:34
My instructor always told me to NEVER say "to" as in "Climbing to two thousand five hundred" as it can easily be mistaken as "climbing 22500" although why a PA28 would climb to FL225 is out of my knowledge :D lol!
But best be on the safe side, if you don't use / forgot the correct R/T, just spend 30mins or so re-freshing your memory on CAP413!! Surely thats not too difficult for you? Not to be mistaken for, surely thats not 2 difficult for you :}
Regards as always.
Martyn