Training Captain Pay versus ATCO OJTI

[GM WAN TO BE]

Does anyone one know approximately how much extra training captains get paid in relation to a standard captain(no offence meant)? With the continued pressure to train ATCO's during higher and higher traffic levels, i was wondering if our renumeration was on a similiar scale?

Just found some easyjet stats

Training Captains\' Pay
Line Training Captains £75,305 (12.5% on basic salary)
Type Rating Instructors £76,979 (15% on basic salary)
Type Rating Examiners £78,652 (17.5% on basic salary)
Airborne Base Instructors £80,326 (20% on basic salary)

[tobzalp]

In Oz ATC get 6% to train and only when actually plugged in doing it or debriefing.

[5milesbaby]

In NATS (UK) we get an extra spine point on the pay scale (approx 3%) and then if we meet the required targets for training unit based over 3 months we then get a bonus of something like 1% basic (average after tax £250).

Basically it doesn't compare to pilot training pay at all.

[Barnaby the Bear]

Outside of NATS, you are lucky to get a luncheon voucher! :}

[Friio4]

Mine doesnt compare at all with pilots. About 1.2% above basic. I'm afraid having an OJTI ticket is all but useless when it comes to renumeration. The responsibilty that is attached to it appears to be lost on the bean counters, in my opinion.

[Lock n' Load]

AAAARRRRRGGGGGHHHHHH!!!!

People, please. The word is reMuNeration.
Class dismissed.

[VectorLine]

AAARRRGGGH!

LOCK N' LOAD f :mad: :mad: k off! The grammar/spelling police are not welcome here. Go back to your "Eats, shoots and leaves"

[30W]

Basically guys, stop training and when they ask why tell them it's not financially worth the hassle.

Only when they aren't able to train will they be forced to address why and do something about it..........

For what it's worth, my company pays Type rated Examiners 20% above basic, Line Training Capt's 10% above basic.

30W

[Lock n' Load]

Vector Line; using the correct word is nothing to do with grammer. It has a lot to do with precision and this is a precision job.
I corrected the use of the wrong word in good humour, and your epithet-laden response is far more unwelcome.
In the words of Billy Connely, YOU F*** OFF!

[rodan]

Billy Connely
I believe the great man spells his name 'Connolly'.

[Del Prado]

....and it's grammar.

[Legs11]

pedants unite:rolleyes:

[Loki]

Once you`ve got an OJTI ticket, it can prove a tricky business getting rid of it, or not making use of it when required.

The attitude of one major UK employer historically is that training is part of the atco`s normal task.

[GM WAN TO BE]

An ATCO top of the scale gets an extra 3% for being an OJTI. Perhaps things will improve with the new structure we've been promised, otherwise there could be a lack of OJTI's in the future!!

[Jerricho]

Nav Canada pay a flat rate of $8.50 per hour, no matter what level of the pay scale you're on.

After tax, it equates to about a happy meal at McDonalds.

[cossack]

After tax, it equates to about a happy meal at McDonalds
Every hour!!!
:yuk: :yuk: :yuk:

[Jerricho]

Hows about 2 double-doubles and a box of Tim-bits ;)

[Scott Voigt]

In the US FAA controllers get 10% extra while plugged in and getting shots at your ticket made by trainee <G>....

regards

Scott

[DirtyPierre]

Tobzalp,

Don't we get 8.5% above salary increment now for OJTI? And as Scott says all the shots your trainee can take at your licence.

[Tower Ranger]

Yes, there is a total lack of understanding from management that you are putting your licence on the line and there have been many days when it just ain`t worth the risk, about £1 a day after tax in my case, but..............

If you`re just training someone to get a few extra pennies you`re in the wrong place. I see training as one of the more important parts of the job. It gives us the chance to pass on our experience to the people who within a couple of months will be making all the decisions for themselves.

If you can`t get satisfaction watching a trainee going from a zero hours newbie to a validated controller and on the way picking up something it took you years to learn then don`t bother.

How many of the people complaining about not getting enough cash for training were trained by people getting paid nothing for the pleasure of watching them stumble out of the starting blocks. Always remember where you came from you may be going back some day!

[Behindblooeyes]

Doesn't that rather make the assumption that we're all out there doing the job just for the love of it? I work because I need the money, and as we are forever being told that air traffic is now a commercial business like any other, I would like to think that specialist skills and work over and above the basics should be rewarded accordingly.

If I employ a plumber to fix my bolier I would expect him to charge me X, if I then ask him to sort my cistern out at the same time I would then expect to pay X + a lot! Is there a difference?

[DFC]

If I employ a plumber to fix my bolier I would expect him to charge me X, if I then ask him to sort my cistern out at the same time I would then expect to pay X + a lot! Is there a difference?

The plumber will not for ever whinge about having to train an apprentice or expect to be paid lots mor for doing it.

The plumber will not for ever whinge about what would happen to his job if the apprentice mucks up on a boiler repair and people are killed in the explosion 10 days later.

The plumber can be paid more than an ATCO and TRE combined per hour!

There's 3 good ones. :)

Regards,

DFC

[Behindblooeyes]

Errrm, explain please? The plumber will not appear in court if his apprentice kills people through his ommisions, I might!

[Frunobulax]

@ Tower Ranger:

I couldn't agree more.

[VectorLine]

Behindblooeyes

as we are forever being told that air traffic is now a commercial business like any other, I would like to think that specialist skills and work over and above the basics should be rewarded accordingly

I absolutely agree. Taking it from a NATS perspective, as that's the only one I have;

The Red Barron has been banging on about his order book flying overhead everyday and, I paraphrase from a recent open meeting, "The only reason you run a business is to make money"

Air traffic controllers sell their skill to the company for the a salary (and a pretty decent one at that). However, we sell our skill (or lack of it?) as teachers to the company for very little extra. Also, in my opinion, the training we get in OJTI is woefully inadequate.

Maybe it's time to reduce the number of OJTIs. Make the course longer and more in depth. Highly specialised OJTIs, selected for their ability in this task and pay them more for it (ATCO1 at LACC?). It could be considered a 'skill' counting towards minimum unit requirement, so one could drop a sector or T/P.

However,
The plumber will not appear in court if his apprentice kills people through his ommisions, I might!

The plumber probably would. It's still negligence and people die.

[tori chelli]

Under the law of Tort (neat pun :O :D ) and vicarious liability, the plumber, as an expert in his field, would definitely be responsible for the (vicarious) actions of his apprentice (trainee).

Tori

[Number2]

Are controllers really experts in their field?!

[Frunobulax]

No, they're not.
A monkey could do it better ;)

[VectorLine]

Monkeys don't live in fields

[CosmosSchwartz]

Can you really compare an atco to a pilot...........


Crash helmet - check, emergency rations - check

Blue touch paper - lit! :E

[rodan]

Can you really compare an atco to a pilot...........
Good point, actually. How much more than pilots do you think we ought to be paid? ;)

[Captain Mayday]

So..... what if I'm an ATCO ..... and a pilot ... ? And an instructor on both ...... ? :E

PAN-MAYDAY-FLICK-SPIN-CRASH :\

[CosmosSchwartz]

:p :p

To be honest, as a pilot I find myself comparing pay to Train drivers, seeing as they earn more than me!:rolleyes:


I'm not kidding!:ouch:

Seriously!:sad: