View Full Version : Airprox Swiss-KLM above Reims

19th Feb 2004, 03:20
Incident in French airspace
A KLM aircraft and a SWISS aircraft came close together early this morning in French airspace near Reims. Thanks to the swift response of both crews and the onboard warning systems, the incident passed without consequence. SWISS has reported the incident to the relevant authorities.
At approximately 07.45 this morning, as SWISS flight LX 17 en route from _New York JFK to Zurich was flying over the city of Reims, the onboard warning system (TCAS, traffic alert and collision avoidance system) indicated the proximity of another aircraft. The SWISS crew followed the systemís instructions and put distance between the two aircraft. _
The French authorities are investigating how it was possible for the two aircraft to come close to one another. As required by regulations, SWISS has reported the incident to the relevant authorities in Switzerland.
The flight landed on schedule in Zurich.

Anything to do with the ATC strike in France or I'm mixing up different issues? :eek:

A note just for fun: Swiss President Bouw is a former KLM guy and he is Dutch. You would bet he was on board of one of the two planes but would never dare to say on which one...;):

19th Feb 2004, 04:00
Nasty if this was the case... thank god things unfolded otherwise.
The French ATC action was actually yesterday, 17th Feb.

ATC Watcher
19th Feb 2004, 17:53
Media sensation again .. If everytime an aircrfat is following a TCAS RA in the world it came in the news you will get bored to death..

Jut a warning before jumping to conclusions :
For info it is not because you have TCAS RAs that it implies a loss of separation. In fact most RAs are unecessary from an ATC point of view.( But in some cases they really help. )
Also a loss of legal separation minimum occurs as a consequence of RAs is also possible.

Last info ; the strike in France were limited to Orly and Paris ACC.
Reims was not involved.

20th Feb 2004, 04:56
The SWISS crew followed the systemís instructions and put distance between the two aircraft. A (dutch) paper has a different story. Both a/c (KL 737 and Swiss A330) approached up to 300 mt (1000 ft). Instructions of the (French) ATC did not matched with the on-board computers of both a/c.

The KLM pilot, after spotting the Swiss a/c visually, decided to make a sharp left turn to avoid the a/c.

It was not clear whether the 300 mt was vertically or horizontally.

20th Feb 2004, 05:31
Is that sensationalist?

Looks like a straightforward factual report. In fact mentions many things such as TCAS that sensationalism will ignore.

Insignifant perhaps (depends on what you know about really happened) but is otherwise an innocuous 'yesterday it was very rainy' story pumped into the newswires.

normally left blank
20th Feb 2004, 06:45
I don't understand "the left turn" - story. Isn't TCAS only working with climb or descents?

20th Feb 2004, 07:10
ATC Watcher wrote:
Media sensation again ..

Sorry, I did not mention that the original quote came from SWISS, not from the medias, who were obviously not aware of the incident, at least not in Switzerland.