BA reveals post-11 Sept recovery figures

[RVR800]

Traffic on British Airways flights fell in November for the 10th consecutive month, but showed some improvement on the month before.
The number of passengers flying with BA was 17.8% lower last month than in November 2000.

In October, however, traffic fell by a steeper 24.7% compared with the same month in 2000.

At the same time, BA reported that it had cut capacity on the airline by 14.6% below November of last year.

In its statement, BA reported that "trading remains challenging", particularly for premium traffic - passengers travelling in business class.

The traffic improvement on October pushed BA's shares to close at 222.5p, up from their opening level of 207.5p.

Business travellers stay away

The reduction in traffic included a 24.8% drop for premium class and 16.3% decline for non-premium, or economy, class.

The passenger load factor, which measures the level of passenger take-up of seats, was, at 63.9%, down 2.4 points on November 2000.

BA said that the relative improvement in traffic, compared with October, was driven by ticket promotions.

"Non-premium traffic has been responsive to this type of price stimulation," said the BA statement.

"Premium traffic remains weak," it added.

Cheap tickets

The airlines also said that the promotions - which have put more than 100,000 discounted tickets on sale - were affecting yields.

Cargo carried on the BA aircraft fell by 18.8%.

Separately, the traffic and capacity statement from BA recorded that Concorde had returned to a commercial service between London and New York, and to Barbados.

The airline also said that it was expanding capacity to Tobago, Grenada, Antigua and St Lucia during the winter to cope with extra demand.

[dv8]

And yet see how that same information is headlined in wildly diferent ways

BA traffic remains on downward path... Guardian Unlimited


BA says traffic is levelling out... Electronic Telegraph

BA reveals hopes of traffic revival... BBC

BA passenger traffic continues to fall... itv.com

BA passenger figures cheer shares... Evening Standard

British Airways reports drop in passengers... Ananova



:confused: :confused: :confused:

[brabazon]

It's amazing what you can do with statistics...

How does it go again, there are lies, damned lies and statistics

[The Guvnor]

BA Still in Crisis as Passenger Numbers Tumble (http://www.thescotsman.co.uk/business.cfm?id=127385) - The Scotsman

[moggie]

Well, there can't be many other major airlines (other than the low cost boys) that can say that their figures are up on last month - so at least things are going the right way.

So what if some of these seats are only filled because of the sale - that has to be better than none.

My brother (BA B777 FO) tells me that although their Boston route is now twice daily rather than three times, they are full or near full every time. This is, of course, part of the capacity reduction programme that was underway before 11th sept, but still has to be good news.

[LGW Vulture]

Some of you guys should pardon your own ignorance sometimes.

Airlines recognise that their barometers are measured each month by the same month against the previous year. Remember this rule, ITS IMPORTANT.

You cannot measure one month against the last month, because some months are busier than others. You try a typical Feb Pax against a typical Sept pax.

[topman]

2nd Dec London to BCN
4th Dec BCN to London

BA £612.50 (from LGW) No deals available.
EasyJet £143 (from LTN)

Guess which one I bought?

says it all.

[overstress]

topman:

I guess you bought the full fare BA!

Guess not, you certainly wouldn't get on a BHX-BCN, they're pretty full.

[Cisco Kid]

So finally the market was suffering from a gross overcapacity Sept. 11 only helped the long overdue adjustment. C´mon chaps the whole thing was becoming unsustainable delays
overloaded airport infrastructure,frayed tempers et al.

When this settles down, the low cost carriers
although offering a good product will begin to face competition from the remaining "classic" airlines,with deep pockets, which will hit yields drastically.I predict mergers in this area which will consolidate market share and slow expansion,on the other hand I´ve been wrong many times before.

[topman]

Some more info:

11 Dec London to Madrid
12 Dec Madrid to london

BA (from LGW) £525 (no deals available)
EasyJet (from LTN) £130
BM (from LHR) £525 ish

Guess I'll make the same choice again, I like the M25.

When will they learn?

[euroboy]

topman

You are trying to compare two different products, BA is not a low cost carrier. Why don`t compare EasyJet to Go, ie like for like?
LTN is miles from you with hell of a drive in both time, miles and traveling on 2 of the worst motorways in the UK.

I managed to beat EasyJet`s fare from LTN-MAD-LTN departing from your local airport as well!

Air Europa offers a daily flight
DEPT LGW @ 1450 ARR MAD @ 1800

DEPT MAD @ 1240 ARR LGW @ 1350

v class booking for 11 Dec/rtn 12 Dec

Rtn fare £113.51
tax £ 12.99


Total £126.50

They have flights to BCN via MAD, and a frequent fliers programme.
www.air-europa.com (http://www.air-europa.com)

[ 07 December 2001: Message edited by: euroboy ]

[The Guvnor]

What's the point of a short haul 'full service' airline, especially if you're travelling in Y? The only differences between the likes of Go and BA are:

1) BA provides free onboard catering (value - approximately £1.50)
2) BA provides a free newspaper (value - approximately 40p)
3) BA provides a frequent flyer programe (value - sod all unless you're a frequent flyer)
4) ... er, thats it.

So, for £1.90 worth of benefits (£3.80 round trip) a 'full service' airline charges some £400 more? And that's worth it?!?!

I don't think so! :mad: :eek: :mad:

[topman]

Guv, all the prices in my previous posts were indeed Y class.

More and more people are waking up to the fact that "Full Service" means Rip off.
£400 for a meal, drink and newspaper is not good value.

euroboy, good point about air europa, I'll check it out next time. The fact is though that I WILL drive to LTN to save me or my customer, who is paying the fare, £400. Just think, my willingness to do so (and lower my prices) may be the difference to me getting the business against my competitor who prefers the (FREE) meal and convenience. Pleased to hear that Easyjet will start flying LGW to BCN in Feb 02, then I won't even have to drive to LTN.

BA's cost's are out of control, and unless they act who knows what future they will have. LGW's days must be numbered for BA.

[The Guvnor]

Topman - just get the Thameslink train - takes you straight up from Brighton and Gatwick through to Luton!

[topman]

Good point Guv, LTN's looking better every day.

[liftyryce]

You're not comparing like with like. I bet if you change your plans and don't want to go on the same day, easy will keep your money and tell you to p**s off ! By comparison, that BA fare you quoted, was almost certainly a full fare (fully flexible) economy (sorry - euro traveller!)fare. Also, if you're not so worried about exactly when you go, try staying away over a Saturday - you will probably find a BA fare to match Easy.

Cheap Easy versus pricey BA is not quite as simplistic or true as it may appear. ;)

[The Guvnor]

liftyryce - OK, so you want to travel midweek and you want to change your return ticket. Even if a single ticket were to cost the same as the original round trip in the EZY example used here - £130 - you're still saving £270 over BA's flexible fare! And of course if you don't have a flexible fare with the 'full service' carrier you're in the same position of having to buy another one or pay a change penalty of £100 per sector.

Nope, still can't come up with any justification for using a 'full service' airline ... try again! :D :rolleyes: :D

[The Guvnor]

From today's Scotsman. Says it all, really. :D :eek: :D

Passenger figures soar at no-frills airlines

IAIN DEY

NO-FRILLS airlines won a further round in the battle for the skies yesterday as both Go and easyJet reported huge increases in passenger numbers.

Go, formerly part of British Airways, carried almost 360,000 passengers in November - a massive 63 per cent rise on 2000.

Its larger rival easyJet posted a 39 per cent rise in passenger traffic on last year’s figures, carrying more than 690,000 passengers across its routes.

Earlier this week British Airways announced its tenth successive month of spiralling passenger numbers.

A spokesman for easyJet said: "We’re still looking to increase our market share further so BA had better start looking over its shoulder."

Go added: "We are always looking to expand our routes and will definitely see continued expansion."

Both easyJet and Go, along with Irish carrier Ryanair, have offered discounted fares since 11 September in order to keep people flying.

BA, which saw November traffic plunge 17.8 per cent against last year, has run several promotions but generally kept ticket prices around their usual value.

The budget carriers are now looking to capitalise on their current strength and swoop in for flight slots left vacant by Europe’s ailing traditional airlines.

The easyJet spokesman said: "There are so many good opportunities in the market at the moment. Brussels is the political capital of Europe, but since Sabena collapsed, the airport has been virtually empty. Somebody has to fly there."

He refused to rule out further expansion on its Scottish routes, suggesting a service to Brussels could be particularly successful. He added that easyJet was keen to take on slots left vacant by Swiss flag carrier Swiss Air, particularly at Zurich.

[Human Factor]

Guv,

If you shop around, you can get some pretty reasonble deals with BA. Also, chances are if your BA flight goes tech, there'll be another flight/aeroplane available in reasonably short order. That's one reason why they charge a 'bit' more for full fare.

[Egg Mayo]

Got to agree with Human Factor; if your BA aircraft catches a cold at LHR, a bit of switching occurs but its a bit tricky down the line.

My personal take on this is Easyjet is for punters who want to slum it and BA is for the City boyz and other business guys and girls who want the quickest and nearest airport out of London and the surrounding counties to Europe and the USA etc. BA wins hands down with its route network and frequency. Of course, theres punters like me who aren't going to drive all the way from sunny south London, Surrey border to Luton or Stansted for the sake of a few quid; I ain't that tight or hard-up!

[euroboy]

I don`t know what the cost of putting meals on board now days are. However, back in 1990 when I was on my No1 course with BD the trays cost £20 per tray.
Airline catering is a strange affair. The items are charged for then charged to be put on the tray, whether its a dog dish, or a choc or bread roll.
The other interesting fact is all the dry stores loaded on board ie coffee, tea, sugar, plastic glasses etc. is charged for, 1. the product, 2. to load the item, 3. to remove the item (decater) and next flight or day to have the same items loaded costs again.

[yaffel1]

The huge difference in price on a midweek ticket has absolutely nothing to do with the difference in onboard service and everything to do with the way the pricing is set, Guvnor you are being ridiculous in making the comparison on that basis. All of BA's cheap fares are set with a Saturday night minimum stay whereas all the low cost boys use sector rates. Fares become comparable when you select a traditional "leisure" itinerary. In fact, the difference in the way the pricing and fare rules are structured means that for peak leisure events, BA are invariably cheaper - not very impressive Pricing/Yield Management!

BA insist on the Saturday night rule because they are paranoid about business passengers using cheap excursion fares on peak services. Unfortunately for BA they do it anyway, making use of back to back itineraries or throwing a coupon away. BA cannot get it through their minds that getting rid of the Saturday night rule need not be dilutionary if you get the revenue management right, the low cost carriers have proved that. As it is, they just provide an open goal for FR, U2, GO etc when they make price comparisons.

[moggie]

Easy to find bad BA prices but how about seville-Gatwick- Seville £120 return. That was the price quoted on line via e-bookers.com.

Cheaper than Buzz Jerez-Stansted-Jerez.

[gordonroxburgh]

At certain times by picking the correct flight times BA can be better value than the no frills lot.

Last week I had to fly from London to Glasgow at short notice.

Booking 5 days in advance for an Off Peak flight (Afternoon out , morning return) on Wednesdays

Ryanair return (STN-PIK) £120
BA return (LHR-GLA) £95
BMI return (LHR-GLA) £85

[topman]

AS a "business passenger" I can achieve the BA Saturday night fares all of the time. Also with Easy and Ryanair (don't know about Go) I can change the ticket, but have to pay a nominal sum to do so). The point is that you don't need to be "hard up" to make the choice, just commercially sensible. The more orange aircraft that i see arrive at LGW the better. Why pay BA £400 extra.
I don't want or need to pay BA's "Full Service Fare" for a Deli bag with a dried up sandwich and a chocolate bar.

The more orange aircraft I see at LGW the better.

[mainfrog2]

So many people slag off one company at the expense of another. What is this talk of the more easy jets at LGW the better. Just shop around. The real common sense business sense would be to go for the cheapest available rather than be blinkered into believing that Easy or Ryanair are always the cheapest. If your requirements mean that BA are cheaper (which can happen) fly with them. It's not hard to shop around these days.