Barling Magna

I know what you mean..the white circle is to big and is out of scale for the map..like you say - A small point.

GATWICK - Heathrow - Stansted - L City - Luton....All London airports, aren't they?.

...and Sorrento, the 'Heart of Italy' is actually on its shin, if you follow the years' old analogy used by geography teachers with leather elbow-pads.

...even worst is "Rome & the 7 cities of Italy" .....7 cities?
(Seven hills of Rome - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia)

and the amusing thing is that
- "Rome & the Heart of Italy" would have been perfect!
- "Sorrento & the 7 towns of the Amalfi Coast" nearly :p

EL wrote:

Quote:
In other words, SEN is an inbound destination whereas BLK is not.
I wonder how that can be so TSR2 - London is well served by 4 airports...Heathrow - Luton - Stansted and London City.

The Olympics are a one off -Also I wonder why SEN would be the airport of choice with so much competition from the big four.


I just thought I'd add Gatwick to your earlier list of four London airports. Perhaps we should also add Oxford and now Cambridge in addition to Southend. Eight airports. London's getting bigger and bigger and bigger... London Blackpool is probably a few decades away though, unless the website mapmaker gets involved!

I know that just quoting one example doesn't prove a point, but yesterday I flew AMS-SEN. The aircraft was airborne AMS at 1640Z and I was on the train to Liverpool Street at 1732Z. OK, I was fortunate that the train arrived as I stepped onto the platform, but I very much doubt that something similar can be done through STN, LTN or LGW in just 52 minutes. As an inbound London terminus SEN would seem to be well up there with the other 'main' London airports.

It's true that people in Preston can reach say Malaga more easily from BLK - Many prefer the large airport experience like MAN..That and the fact some folks don't know BLK exists is a problem...I guess this to an extent will be the case at SEN also.

By this I mean you enjoyed the experience Expressflight - Many may still prefer the larger more cumbersome airports..I say this because I have mentioned BLK many times to friends and relatives - With the odd exception, most say they would rather fly from a proper airport - with loads of shops.

Both have similar sizes runways - BLK slightly larger, both able to handle up to 757s and the medium jets like A320.

Both Stobart and BB have two airports - London Southend and Carlisle - And Blackpool and Exeter respectively.

Both BB and Stobart acquire land, albeit for different reasons..

At the moment both BLK and SEN have roughly the same amount of routes, and both have Aer Lingus with another major carrier.

SEN are open 24 hours - with ATC - BLK don't. I am just doing a rough comparison, but I suspect SEN can house more than the 4 - 737's BLK can accommodate.
Regional airports needs a lot of marketing and a lot of risk capital, if they desires to do more than just marl time.
I am not posting this as fact - just an impression I have acquired over the years..Also the ADF is a red herring as to why BLK have not developed further IMO..

Blackpool Airport warmly welcomes Manx2.com


mmm..:D

Sandgrown
I don't think it will catch on...Jet2 with free baggage and free change of flight. and no credit card fees..I think not.

Comparing Southend with Blackpool. Southend has a railway station but most people will arrive by car. Any passenger who catches an early flight or arrives late will not even have a choice to use the station as there are no trains available for these passengers.

So looking at the road network Blackpool has a motorway in spitting distance which links with the M6 and the national road network. It can’t get much better than this. On the other hand Southend is around 20 miles from the nearest motorway and even then any passenger heading for London won’t have the option to use this motorway to get into London.

Both Blackpool and Southend are costal airports but Blackpool juts out with Morecombe Bay to the north and the Riddle estuary to the south while Southend basically has water on 2 sides. The nearest river crossing that crosses the Thames is 30 miles away so anyone heading to Southend from Kent would think twice before heading there.

Despite basically only having land access on 2 sides there is no doubt that Southend should do well serving London. Time will tell whether passengers who use Southend once will be keen to go back for a second time when they discover that Southend lacks anything to do once inside the terminal and that the motorway network is 20 miles away.

Blackpool’s problem is a lack of population in its catchment area. Zoom out using Google maps satellite imagery will reveal that northeast of Blackpool is barren of any towns. That just leaves a narrow corridor of towns to the east of Preston with most of the population living south of Preston who would look to Manchester or Liverpool to fly from. Can’t see how Blackpool will ever overcome this problem.

It's the RIBBLE estuary actually.

Don't worry LTNman often talks in riddles.

Quote: "I know that just quoting one example doesn't prove a point, but yesterday I flew AMS-SEN. The aircraft was airborne AMS at 1640Z and I was on the train to Liverpool Street at 1732Z. OK, I was fortunate that the train arrived as I stepped onto the platform, but I very much doubt that something similar can be done through STN, LTN or LGW in just 52 minutes. As an inbound London terminus SEN would seem to be well up there with the other 'main' London airports. "

Exactly, Expressflight, that is SEN's unique selling point. For those within a particular geographical area, it is very convenient. All things being equal, it would be very silly for such travellers to go to STN, LTN, LHR, LGW, etc., for a destination available from SEN.

NHT, if developed, has similar potential for those on the other side of London.


Quote: "Both Stobart and BB have two airports - London Southend and Carlisle - And Blackpool and Exeter respectively."

AH CAX, now that would be a difficult airport to develop (very small catchment area but near the Lake District and Cumberland), but would love to see it!

It would give the citizens of Barrow a choice: BLK or CAX, ha ha.


Quote: "Both Blackpool and Southend are costal airports but Blackpool juts out with Morecombe Bay to the north and the Riddle estuary to the south while Southend basically has water on 2 sides. The nearest river crossing that crosses the Thames is 30 miles away so anyone heading to Southend from Kent would think twice before heading there."

Kent is not intended (at present) to be in SEN's catchment area, SEN will survive without it. East Kent has MSE if the demand for a SEN-type "experience" is desired. Adequate demand doesn't appear to be there and, regretably, MSE suffers as a result.

Although dwarfed by Manchester - Blackpool has a large enough catchment area to keep a regional airport busy, that is properly managed and in a decent economic climate.

I know Google maps are handy - but hardly intended to forecast the future of an airport.

Small population?. Preston and North and Central Lancashire of course including Blackpool and the Fylde.
The Lake district and East Lancashre are in the Blackpool catchment area - Possible people in Blackburn. Nelson, Rossendale et al may need persuading that Blackpool offers that something Manchester does not. Ease of use for example.

When this recession ends - Airports like BLK and SEN will manage and even flourish - Come downturns, they are the first to feel the pinch.

Off hand BLK seem to have little competition as a regional airport - I have not done a count - But I am sure there are quite a few regional airports along the South coast..

Quote: "Small population?. Preston and North and Central Lancashire of course including Blackpool and the Fylde.
The Lake district and East Lancashre are in the Blackpool catchment area - Possible people in Blackburn. Nelson, Rossendale et al may need persuading that Blackpool offers that something Manchester does not. Ease of use for example."

Exactly right, Ernest Lanc's, same as SEN, it's the convenience factor of small regional airports that are their unique selling points, although the range of destinations are limited.

Quote:
"When this recession ends - Airports like BLK and SEN will manage and even flourish - Come downturns, they are the first to feel the pinch."

Always the way it happens.

Quote: "Off hand BLK seem to have little competition as a regional airport - I have not done a count - But I am sure there are quite a few regional airports along the South coast.. "

On the south coast there are SOU and BOH. SOU is busier than BOH, but both co-exist despite the proximity (about 30 mi. or so). LHR is about as far from these as MAN is from BLK, with similar motorway links.

Further west is EXT, which was near PLH (about 45 mi.) but, regretably, PLH did not survive.

Again, these have smallish catchment areas, but enough to sustain a small regional airport (just like BLK).

Small regional airports can work well, but they do need selling, both to potential carriers and to potential pax.

Fairdealfrank

I agree with the tone and expectations of regional airports in your post.

BLK will never be a threat to MAN..to be honest as the North Wests premier airport - I wish Manchester to prosper.

But choice is a great thing in any business - I like to travel from BLK because the ease of use suites me...If I can't travel from BLK because they don't fly my route, then I happily use Manchester of Liverpool..(The latter it seems are suffering at the moment with FR pulling/or cutting frequency on certain routes).

Yes a shame about PLH - Shows maybe to much regional airport competition in that neck of the woods.

Small airports like BLK are niche airports to a degree - Many uses of BLK own second homes on the Costas, Jet2 holidays in the future may alter the balance.
Probably the most important point - While jet2 have sold their airline and holidays, there has been a deafening silence from BLK..Rather than selling the point that Jet2, Aer Lingus and Manx2 are here and well at Blackpool.

The future of BLK and airports like SEN are safe, subject to the goodwill of their owners in wanting them to survive as airports.

Quote: "BLK will never be a threat to MAN..to be honest as the North Wests premier airport - I wish Manchester to prosper.

But choice is a great thing in any business - I like to travel from BLK because the ease of use suites me...If I can't travel from BLK because they don't fly my route, then I happily use Manchester of Liverpool..(The latter it seems are suffering at the moment with FR pulling/or cutting frequency on certain routes)."

Agree Ernest Lanc's, let's have as many regional airports as is sustainable, Let's have as much convenience as possible for as many air pax as possible. Choice and convenience are the watch-words.

Regional airports also have a part to play in addressing lack of transport capacity in the UK such as the congested highway and mainline networks, and are as expansion at the larger airports, especially LHR. It's not a case of "either/or" but "both".

Quote: "The future of BLK and airports like SEN are safe, subject to the goodwill of their owners in wanting them to survive as airports."

The goodwill of the owners is critical, it may be a lack of this that did for PLH. MME could be in similar danger.

You have to wonder what BB's intentions are for Blackpool. How much input do they have to the airport, or do they just leave it to run itself?

I have a copy of the Annual report for the year ended 31 December 2010. The airport made a huge loss on only £7.1M sales. The loss was £3.6M (pre tax). That is ridiculous.

in the accounts:

In other words Balfour Betty have them by the balls. The airport simply doesn't bring in enough money to pay for itself, so the losses will continue until massive changes are made. If Balfour Betty get bored and decide they want to build on the land, all they need to do is liquidate the company.

This bit is daft, staff costs were £3.6M. That is a huge 50% wages to sales ratio. That cannot continue. 157 staff in total. I know these figures are from 2010, but how much has really changed?

The next set of reports will be interesting. The future looks bland.

Mrs IB returned from Blackpool last night. On the positive side, the ladies loos have been refurbished and a new carpet has been laid in the departure lounge. However, the requirement to show passports is over the top, as are the settings on the security scan arches. Seems it could be an exercise to discourage passengers from using the airport. Passports had to be shown at bag drop, entry to the security area, at the departure gate and on boarding the aircraft. The security machines are activated by hairgrips, earings and bracelets.

Also there are rumours circulating that when the present agreement between the airport and Jet2 expires, the airport will not enter into a new agreement unless the reduced hours of operation, which they sought to impose on Jet2 and lost in court, are part of any new agreement.

When does the agreement expire and what hours does Blackpool want Jet2 to agree to?

I bet transit times through the terminal were times that Manchester could only dream of