Many influenza like viruses like can have long term complications. It is uncommon but not unheard of. Professor Francois Ballaux of UCL is worth seeking out. It seems for geneticists the sars Cov2 is a rather unremarkable virus.

unherd.com/thepost/covid-epidemiologist-climate-of-fear-on-covid-is-dangerous/

The BBC standpoint needs to be treated with caution.

If the Gov't considered air travel to be a major hotspot for covid they would probably have banned it. They probably looked at the way mask wearing has been enforced by the airlines and airport, which is far better than in pubs & bars. People do not tend to raise their voices on aircraft unlike pubs & bars and this is another well known spreader of the virus. Shouting across a crowded pub to your mates is a given in most city centre establishments on a Friday night. There is a world of difference between airports & pubs in this respect..

LTNman......having travelled through your beloved Luton Airport on 30th of last month to catch the early morning Ryanair to Tenerife let me tell you that it was not like 'the old' times, no queueing at security and with approx 30 pax there was no crowding to get on or off the plane. With those numbers social distancing throughout was totally acceptable. Disembarkment was orderly and civilised, no buses required at TFS, just a short walk to the terminal and onward to passport control where those with the required QR code were segregated from those needing to 'fill in the form'. After passport control a short orderly walk through temperature checking cameras ensued. Sorry that my experience does not fit into that which you believe is happening. Hence, I am happy to travel by air.

There will always be individual cases that can prove/disprove any theory. The problem is finding out whats fact, rumour or complete fabrication. Its sad ,but the whole future of aviation is at risk because of this. I personally would be happy travelling, but the vast majority arent and airlines cant survive on the few like myself

I can assure you that Luton Airport is not my beloved airport. If you like I can publish here queues at the gates and Border Force where social distancing doesn’t exist. Luton is still using remote stands and bussing passengers to the terminal in a single bus. As you have found out all flights will be different but don’t dismiss what is happening as not happening just because you sat on a flight with 30 passengers.

The airlines certainly can't survive on loadfactors of <20% and even those probably paying nominal fares.

I'd happily jump on a plane to Malaysia, Hong Kong or Japan tomorrow, except being British I am not allowed to go.
These Asian countries have Covid much more under control by more extreme tough measures taken at an early stage. Their track & trace has been pretty good from Day1- as a result their economies aren't tanking like our. Problem areas- a street or a specific apartment block can be isolated within 12 hours of a test result-without the need to lockdown a whole city or region.
My very recent domestic flight had 6 pax one way & 7 the other. There is no restriction on taking domestic flights but load factors like that can't be sustainable.

However, Wizz has the fortune and benefit of a network centred around Central and Eastern Europe where Covid was fairly negligible first time around which meant easier travel from and between them and more destinations being on green lists/corridors. It’s easy to say TUI or Easy were timid but there’s no point them flying if there’s no one to fly because people aren’t allowed or business travel isn’t happening.

So now there is pressure from Labour and Sage for a lockdown for 2 weeks over half term. Reminds me of the last lockdown that kept getting extended. Save lives and ignore the economy seems to be the call. When it gets lifted then what. Are we all going back on our travels around the world again for a brief few weeks? Will anything actually change? I am thinking not except more businesses will go to the wall and we will end up with even more eye watering support bills that will have to be paid off.

I was off to South Wales during half term to spend money in the country for a week until I was banned. That’s 7 restaurant meals lost plus 7 trips to 7 safe pubs gone from the Welsh economy. Plan B is to rebook and go to probably Norfolk. Now I dare not book anything with only 10 days to go.

If anyone was thinking of a last minute trip to Europe and a safe country, they won’t be now.

Now let’s look at Christmas, seems a good opportunity for another 2 week lockdown seeing that schools will already be closed. Anyone thinking about booking their Christmas break?

The benefit of the original lockdown with suppression of the virus was squandered by this Government during the Summer which should have installed sufficient mitigation in the form of adequate test & trace.

The PM has created an enormous void with his shambolic handling of the Pandemic & has effectively lost the Country & Parliament & the Tory Party.

So yes the grown ups will effect a second lockdown/circuit breaker now & further if required.

Politically it was a good move from Starmer as the evidence is clearly there and despite long posts on here and the #KBF crowd on social media objective polls show strong public support for a “circuit break” lockdown.

The problem is let’s say Johnson U-turns again and calls the circuit break (and I think he will)...what then? Unless they finally stop with the corruption on an enormous scale...and yes it is corruption...we’ll come out the other end in 2/3/4 weeks no better off and still without effective track and trace. The longer the current shambles goes on the worse it will be not just for aviation but just about every other sector.

I don't think it is a simple as you make out. Throughout Europe the virus is once again out of control with everyone seeming to blame their governments. I have no doubt that whichever party was in power we would be facing the same events as we are now. Would track and trace be any better when too many people refuse to cooperate? Would the Covid App not have lost the details of thousands of people seeing the same people would have worked on the project?

Come last summer, which now seems along time ago, Europe seemed to go back to some sort of semi normal life. Now the whole of Europe is paying the price, as most governments took their eyes off the ball but were they all trying to get their economies moving again when the cases were low?

There are no simple answers even through a few here seem to think so.

LTNman

Good post.

The same people would not have worked on the project. This more than anything else along with dodgy PPE should have seen the Government collapse and people marching in the streets. Billions handed out to “mates” for no/poor results. Search for it, the information is there. It won’t take you long.

France and Spain are having it tough and while cases are high(er) all across Europe it’s not fair to say everyone is in a bad position. There are record numbers in Czech and others but they never had it bad the first time around so it’s misleading. At some point the cheerleaders for our Government are going to have to accept they are backing a dud.

If you want my opinion I think we need a temporary coalition Government probably led by Jeremy Hunt as rep of the party with most MPs who came second place in last year’s leadership contest and has health experience. Starmer deputy, reps from SNP, Plaid, DUP all in the Cabinet. Rest of the Government made up of competent MPs from across Parliament.

It is always easy for those in opposition to have all the answers. Interesting to hear that PPE would have been abundant under a different government in the early months. I suppose they would have been getting their orders in last year before the outbreak.

Meanwhile while we are all hopefully doing out bit those in Liverpool decide it is party time again and shame the City. https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-englan...yside-54535481

LTNman....defend this - https://www.google.co.uk/amp/s/inews...cts-711916/amp

I keenly await your response.

I can see BJ making a U turn and insisting on the circuit breaker, but for how long?!

As for the Christmas holidays, everything is booked for 8 of us to Malaga. All paid for prior to March and as long as flights are operating I will do my best to ensure I go! No quarantine on arrival and when I return I will be homeworking for 2 weeks.

In the meantime, I need to get home to the UK first...

competent MPs. That would be a first!

Oh that that would happen!! However it won't because of the adversarial nature of our system.

It might however be worthwhile having a cross party committee, made up of all the main players you named to coordinate covid-19 response across the UK; but WITHOUT England (that is the British government) having a veto over decisions it didn't like. Again, sadly, because of our broken system, probably won't happen.

Here here, also just think of the NHS and emergency services who will have to work extra hard over Christmas because certain people have ignored the Covid rules.