https://www.planespotters.net/airline/Aer-Lingus
Can someone confirm the A330 seating layouts? I was looking at the above and it lists a whole host of different configs
A330-300 as C30Y287 as well as C30Y283
A330-200 as C23Y243, C23Y248 and also C24Y236 for the ex QR example.

They can't have FIVE different A330 configs on a fleet of only 13 airframes surely?

Cityjet / Aer Lingus - fare costs on London City airport route

I am a frequent flyer, been a heavy user of Cityjet into Dublin. When Cityjet operated the LCY - DUB services, you could pre select seats free of charge, and automatically included 20 kg checked bag.

Since the ACMI service partnership between Cityjet and Aer Lingus, this has all changed. All checked bags are now charged dependent upon weight you select.

So the headline air fare initially gives you a perception of relatively cost effective but by the time you add in the extras the end price becomes something quite expensive, which is over and above the historical typical air fares on this LCY - DUB route.

Ripping off customers comes to mind. I've learned an expensive lesson in how Aer Lingus are trying to get passengers to purchase a Plus ticket. This will sadly be my last flight using this service, taking my business elsewhere. Buyer beware!

What you're describing (paid-for seat selection, charge for checked bag) sounds like the standard Aer Lingus short-haul business model (which makes sense given that Aer Lingus are now calling the commercial shots on this route and CityJet is just a contractor to Aer Lingus).

I note that BA Cityflier offers something similar (cheapest fare is hand baggage only, pay extra to choose a seat).

I'd absolutely agree with you that the CityJet offer (in terms of what was bundled in) was superior to this, but CityJet had (sadly) become an outlier in a headline-price-driven market.

I'm curious: when you say you are taking your business elsewhere, what other airline will give you a CityJet-type bundled fare between LON and DUB? Or are you proposing to take the train and ferry?:cool:

Quick fare comparison across Aer Lingus, BA, and Ryanair and looking far ahead to Sat 6 & Sun 7 April, selecting a Plus ticket or similar, reveals:

BA (LGW - DUB rtn) £217
EI (LCY - DUB rtn) £175
FR (SEN - DUB rtn) £104

Had Flybe (SEN - DUB) service been available, likely would have been priced around £135 for a Plus equivalency airfare.

With FR having options available to DUB from STN, SEN, LTN, LGW and Aer Lingus limited to LHR and LCY with premium airfares, relying on the hope of a more pretentious passenger, it will be interesting to see how long it will take for Aer Lingus to squeeze more costs out of their product delivery.

For what is a 1 hour short hop London to Dublin flight time, with hardly time to serve and consume in-flight refreshment services at a relaxing pace, ticket airfare is king. Aer Club members are more abundant now than ever before, with long lines of Aer Club members almost outnumbering non members. In many regards, quiet similar to the Priority boarding lines on all FR services. In-flight service costs are similar too. So I fail to see any Aer Lingus USP's on the London / Dublin routes. IMHO there's no discerning product distinctions between Aer Lingus and Ryanair at this point. As O'Leary describes it, it's a bus in the sky, I want on and off and reliable fast efficient service at lowest price. Consumer is king. BA ticket prices on this route are ridiculous compared to the competition. Room for another carrier on the route to keep the competition vibrant

Aer Lingus also serve LGW...

Average summer schedule:

LHR - 13 daily
LGW - 6 daily
LCY - 6 daily

The Aer Lingus offering continues to be very attractive in this market.

Irrespective, I can't see justification for higher air fares on the London services when compared to current competitors fares.

The usage of the South Gates at DUB by Aer Lingus, jumping on a bus at the 300's for a jolly to South Gates is not ideal for London service's. Can't understand why all EI London services don't run from T2 for a better passenger experience for the airfare being charged by Aer Lingus.

So basically, the passenger experience is on a par with Ryanair, yet you pay a much more expensive ticket price from Aer Lingus, with no added value or USP. Seems very much a rip-off for what is a very average service quality. I see no upside for the passenger, all I see is hassle, inconvenience, and more expensive travel costs compared to Ryanair, for example.

Even Flybe and Cityjet on all London services can park at the 200's and deliver a better passenger experience than the Willie Wonka bus ride layed on to shuttle pax to South Gates for the Aer Lingus flights to London.

EI short haul has for some time now been no better than FR. Anyone who claims otherwise is deluding themselves.

Maybe EI/BA can "get away with it" because the bus takes people to where they want to go when they want to go?

Have some people just woken up in the year 2003?!

Surely it's no surprise to anyone that the Aer Lingus and Ryanair offerings are very similar on short haul while average fares are distinctly different, it's been that way for the best part of 20 years! Despite this sudden revelation, Aer Lingus continues to do quite nicely for themselves so the argument feels somewhat dated.

Bit defensive there, Shamrock. Complacency and no USP are obvious factors here.

I do rate EI better than FR. I generally find the experience more relaxing and I'd rate the EIR service even higher than mainline. Always much prefer the 2 a breast seating!

I have to say in the past, when cancellations have occured EI have always looked after me very well. Hotels, meals, forward transport, the lot. Meanwhile those on similar flights with FR have been sleeping on the airport floor.

Yes, but I'm specifically highlighting here the London - Dublin service. As a frequent flyer, I'm in and out of Dublin weekly for the past 6 months for business reasons. I've used a variety of different airlines, ranging from Aer Lingus, BA, Ryanair and even Flybe. With the exception of Flybe, I have never had any major delays or flight cancellation on the route. The services on this route generally run like clock work from all of these carriers, except for Flybe.

My point being, the need for added comfort and peace of mind that Are Lingus will put you up in a hotel if they cancel a flight is such a rare need on such a smoothly running route, I fail to see how accumulating significant airfare cost differences can be jusyified. The risk / reward ratio is just not justifying the price of the Aer Lingus fares on the London to Dublin services.

If my flight was unfortunately cancelled and it necessitated my need for hotel accommodation then I'd much rather take control off that expense for myself and be free to arrange my own overnight accommodation and taxi / chauffeur service myself and expense back to my company.

We can't justify spending significant flight costs on an annual basis on this London to Dublin route when the chance of a (rare) cancellation occurring is used as a business rationale argument to support buying Aer Lingus tickets versus others. (Flybe, by the way, have been consistently poor service providers on this route, that's been our direct experiences from several staff we've had to send to Dublin on weekly business over the past 6 months - needless to say we dumped Flybe as a direct result). We spend thousands of pounds on business travel London to Dublin each month but can no longer justify the cost differentiators of airfares, our 2019 plan spending means we've imposed rules on what my employees can book and what airlines). It's simply business, and I can't continue to support excessively high airfares on a 1 hour short hop London to Dublin service when there's such an availability of other services and time slots that work when you are running a business and need staff located on time for meetings. Harsh reality and our honest position.

£175 isn't excessively high. You are comparing flying from London City, which is premium business airport, in the heart of the city and on the transport for London network, to southend, which isn't.

You are also missing the point, that Aer Lingus is not competing with Ryanair, not really. They have different business models, and much of the traffic between London and Dublin will be connecting where as Ryanair is all point to point.

In terms of point to point, I expect another reason EI and BA are more expensive (apart from the fact they operate into major airports) is that they have less seats available for point to point ... like I said, different business models.

But, even with all this said, here's the bottom line. If you want to save £65 then book Ryanair and enjoy the service they offer, enjoy the lack of convenience of London City and hope nothing goes wrong. At the same time, as has been seen above, many others prefer to fly with Aer Lingus and BA and that is why both do very well on the route.

Reading your description of the activities of your staff, it seems you need to be making much more use of VC facilities. The cost in unproductive time of you and your staff traipsing to and from Dublin greatly outways the cost of the airfares (and getting to and from the airport).

Interesting report on the front page of the sunday independent today,

https://m.independent.ie/business/irish/aer-lingus-chief-says-staff-stealing-many-millions-of-euro-from-customers-and-colleagues-37585746.html

Obviously it's the Sindo so usual rules apply but not great press for EI. Surely it can't be that easy to just walk away with company or passenger property...and strange that this leaks to the media...I'm assuming it's a leak?

Not the OP, but as someone who manages a remote team VC doesn't replace actual face time. I try to see my people in person every two months or so.

I agree that some face time is necessary. I always made a point of actually attending the first meetings of any group, and there were others where it was worth my time. But I was a volunteer, so my time in was free

My reading of that is that there is an issue with company stock being pilfered. Aer Lingus want to install CCTV. Some staff are unhappy with that. The Unions are planning a hissy fit (seemingly over something else entirely, but they see this as a bargaining chip). Aer Lingus are carrying out a pre-emptive strike and using what is probably a small number of cases of customer property being lifted to gather public sympathy for their position.

Note that engaged with unions does not mean agreed with unions.

The last four paragraphs are key as they have nothing to do with what is being reported, but give all the background context needed.

That's fair enough. If you and your colleagues are relatively seasoned travellers (which clearly you are) and you are able to look after yourselves in case of disruption, then Ryanair can provide a good value service.

I used to have a concept called the "ABR [Anyone But Ryanair] Premium." Given two flights with equivalently convenient timings (including surface travel time/cost), how much extra would I pay not to fly with Ryanair? That number was higher for me in the days before Ryanair's "Always Getting Better" campaign - since then, they've become (generally) less obnoxious, and to be honest Aer Lingus has become somewhat less "premium" (300 gates in DUB being a case in point), so my own personal ABR Premium is far lower now (and hence I end up flying with Ryanair more often).

Where are you off to? It's clear you are not keen on Stobart, so you probably won't be so pleased to learn that they now operate a fair number of BA flights DUB-LCY. Aer Lingus, BA or Ryanair don't include baggage or seat selection either. If you want those things, you have to pay for a Plus fare. That's what Ryanair's competition has done to the Irish (and wider European) market. As you have demonstrated, customers may have a preference to check-in luggage and select their seats in advance, but the majority won't pay for it.

Asl
 

When this week is the new brand being rolled out? Is it a drastic change?

EI-CVA currently in SNN getting her new coat for launch on 17th.

From what I heard it won't be a million miles off the dreadful new Lufthansa livery but in green!

Fingers crossed for EI to pull out a scheme that will make them stand out - the current green top scheme is instantly recognisable among the sea of eurowhite liveries.

Agree that current livery is outdated but they really should have stuck with something along the same lines. KLM were in a similar situation and the subtle changes made a big difference. When they added the new livery to the F70s it knocked 20 years off them!

Ok, it may save the bean counters a few tins of green paint but if that leaked version be true, it would be a massive own goal. Horrid.

I employ my Marketing Director and team to market my business to look unique and stand out from the rest. If I'm walking around ORD or CDG or any airport and I see that green lid, I know it's EI - it is subliminal marketing. I can walk past countless eurowhite liveries on a pier and regardless of the colour of the taiI, I really wouldn't be able to recount which airline they were.

I really hope that the leak is fake and that EI will be bold with a livery that will make a statement - not just blend in with the rest.

From what I have seen, and the leaked photo that seems to substantiate the drawings, it´s horrendous! The briefly lived dot com livery would have been better, and it was awful.

This is going to be one of worst airline logos out there.

Look at the font! Is this a toy plane from a gift shop!?

Indeed Dublin at present is The Greentops, Ryanair and Miscellaneous White Others. This change hands visual dominance to Ryanair's utilitarian-but-bold colours. Why would any CEO sign-off on that?

Mr O'Leary must be laughing, not only did his airline take over yellow to the extent that Lufthansa dropped it as 'not premium' but now, and again for free, he'll become the Signature Colours of Dublin.

I think this is a tiny part of the thinking, having worked with a few agencies in my time, the level of group-think is endemic.
It's not (usually!) management that's coming up with this, it's the "creative" teams at the third party agencies.
The new Iberia looks amazing on the heavies lined up in the Madrid sun, however it vanishes into the background outside that setting IMHO.

the images I've seen online look like the type of faux livery used in many "Airline Simulation" games from about 15 years ago.

IMHO, the main issue is that the Shamrock looks "weak" with the stem curving back, the current "italic shamrock" or a slightly revised version, on the proposed design would look stronger.

I like the font, the current type face looked dated when it was adopted.

Overall, it could have been a lot worse.

JAS

but it is a weak airline, dont know why anyone would think different??

@Refullerman,

EI's arguably a small airline, but weak? that's hardly accurate.

https://www.independent.ie/business/...-36635488.html

https://www.irishtimes.com/business/...-4-1-1.3345269

JAS

I think Refueller man is just a bitter Northerner... would probably say the same thing about Ryanair. :rolleyes:

Ah now... We're not all that bad ;)

EI is part of IAG and is enjoying the efficiencies of being part of that.

On its own it was struggling to survive and we did that to death on here. In addition there would be costs IAG pick up in relation to people that previously would have sat with EI if it was a stand alone operation.