KLM to cooperate with Easyjet instead of competing?
 

Hi all,

Two weeks ago, following newsmessage was published in the papers:
KLM gaat prijsvechten - Binnenland | Het laatste nieuws uit Nederland leest u op Telegraaf.nl [binnenland]

In short:
KLM is going to fight the LCC's flights from AMS to major European tourist destinations such as Madrid, Barcelona and Milan by agressively lowering fares.

My question, isn't it better for KLM to cooperate with the Low Cost Carriers (i.e. Easyjet) on their common routes? Perhaps some kind of code sharing agreement where Easyjet is acting as a feeder?

Looking forward to your opinions!

Jeroen

Utterly different business models I'm afraid. easyJet are point to point LCC with no explicit ability to make coonnections, KLM serve a hub and spoke at Schipol using their narrow bodies to feed the long haul at the hub as well as offering a (arguably) quality product on inter European routes.

Not sure what easyJet would add to KLM as they don't offer through ticketing.

It's comparing apples and pears !

The problem with the concept of connecting from KLM to easyJet is the fact it'd be a highly dis-pleasurable experience come down in my opinion.

I don't have (that) much against easyJet, but I'd want to fly KLM on all legs of my connections.. wouldn't want to touch easyJet if I'd paid hundreds on flights to the States, for example.

Doesn't exactly do wanders for the KLM brand either.

and whats wrong with the Transavia brand?

Regarding the added value:

To my understanding, several routes are flown by both KLM and Easyjet in which the blue bird is following the orange bird (as in load factors). Therefore, I think that by, for example, buying seat blocks KLM can operate more efficient by using the resulting capacity on more profitable routes.

Regarding the service differences:

The service issue is a valid point you bring up.. Aren't most of these flights related to feeding passengers into the hub? In which people go for the service of the intercontinental flight?

Regarding Transavia:

I think that for KLM it is indeed better to "use" their daughter Transavia to compete with Easyjet. Before that a lot of work needs to be done regarding their business model?!

Tim

A BBC report suggest that KLM will add three more AMS routes from the UK in 2013, in addition to Manston already announced.

BBC News - Could airport hub capacity see UK lose out to rivals?

Any idea what those could be?

Largest markets (airport size-wise) not served by KLM are (thus not including secondary airport at cities already served):

Liverpool
Nottingham East Midlands
Belfast
Southampton
Doncaster
Exeter
Bournemouth
Southend
Inverness
Derry
Blackpool
Newquay

Of those, only Doncaster, Bournemouth, Derry, Blackpool and Newquay have no AMS link at this point, while the others are served either by Easyjet (LPL, BFS, SEN) or Flybe (EMA, SOU, EXT, INV).

Not sure if we can rule out LPL and SOU given that KLM axed an existing link not too long ago.

They technically operate out of SOU, via a codeshare on Flybe's 3 daily flights. They also had their own service on Saab 340's at one point but that ended ages ago!!

As for the new airports I'm going to guess would be they BOH or EXT, EMA and BFS/BHD.

Liverpool did gave KLM but they left. Probabky due to other airlines at the same airport offering the same route.

How about Gatwick, Stansted or even Luton?

How about Cambridge?

Don't they already operate to INV ?

KLM are losing UK market to the Gulf carriers. Many of those long haul pax from the UK regions that used to hub through Amsterdam to the east and south, are now using gulf carriers as an alternative to connecting through any European Hub whether Amsterdam, Heathrow or elswhere.

The logical response from KLM is to serve more regional airports in UK, to offer a closer link to the world than presently available from BA, Emirates, QAtar and Etihad.

It will be interesting to see where KLM end up in UK and how Emirates in particular responds.

For example a code share between Emirates and Loganair could see all of Scotland's long haul market east and south Connecting through Glasgow.

Interesting times as ever!

FF

I would put my money on EMA, BHD and BOH.

The article says cities, not airports, so I don't think any other London airport is on the cards. Besides that, does not make much sense as the new routes are about connections through AMS which are no longer available for UK residents through LHR.

That's Flybe with a single daily flight. Not sure if it is codeshared, but in its current form it is of little use in a hub and spoke operation.

I have thought about some more exotic destinations as well, given that KLM chose Manston over all the other, more estalbished and bigger airports I mentioned above.

Interesting to see KLM publicly stating that they plan to compete with LOCOs aggressively. KLM charge insane prices for one way flights, trying to encourage the passenger to do a return and hence not cherry pick between them and others, and commonly LOCOs.

KLM did do some sort of trial on some AMS UK routes with low one way fares. Does anybody know what the findings of this trial were? Have KLM extended this or is this the basis of the new aggressive approach?

I recall the routes included Leeds/Bradford and Liverpool (I realise now confined to the KLM history book!)

EI-BUD

I know that NQY recently sent out an online survey and specifically mentioned AMS in a would you use it type question.


cs

Well, whatever KLM does with its UK market it's going to have to sharpen up its customer service, if my recent experience is anything to go by. Flight times changed without telling pax, 'booked' on alternative flights that they knew were full and already overbooked, clunky, inaccurate and unhelpful website, transit desk at Schiphol with long queues and virtually no-one on duty. It's a shadow of its former reliable self.
NS

Looks like Bhd no Dsa

losing out? Lots of ex UK routes are showing month on month AMS increases. INV must be a codeshare as bookable on KLM.

Inverness is BE's flight with a KL codeshare.

How about DND getting a flight to AMS on a CB operated DO328 :ugh:

CAA stats
 

CAA stats for last ten years show Netherlands has not fared well from UK, especially when compared to flows to Middle East and Turkey. Total pax today is not much more than in 2001 for UK - Netherlands.

http://www.caa.co.uk/docs/80/airport..._2001_2011.pdf

There is no doubt that KLM are suffering from EK competition, both in UK and at home. KLM is not alone, but at least they can fight back by serving their hub in Amsterdam from more regional airports in Europe than the Gulf carriers can offer.

3 years ago there was no EK service from AMS to DXB, now its a daily A380 with Etihad shortly starting AMS - AUH.

Ultimately all this competition will be good for UK regional airports and bad for legacy carriers in Europe and Asia.

FF

It is interesting that KLM expands to all those small UK regional markets whereas in Germany AirFranceKLM has retreated from a lot of those markets. They used to link AMS/CDG with places like FMO, DTM, PAD, BRE, LEJ, but all those flights have disappeared over the past few years. All of them have at least a link to Lufthansa's Munich hub, so the strategy of being the single hub feeding airline from small UK airports that BA no longer serves and that will never be served by the likes of Emirates or Etihad may be a good idea. The question really is if those places can sustain feed even into a single hub like AMS. It will be very interesting to see how MSE works out.

@virginblue - minor correction: BRE is still served up to 4 daily by both KL (F70) and AF (E145). For other mentioned airports you are absolutely right.

Could be quite a coup and a positive achievement if MAG have managed to nab KLM for STN, EMA and BOH, though I believe BHD is to be one of the new routes.

You are absolutely correct - BRE indeed is one of the longest-served routes in the KLM network. I meant DRS (which was served in the 1990s) - although there are rumours that the route may be resurrected in 2013.

Don't suppose there's any chance of them coming back to LPL then? :E

Actually yes :ok::ok: but dose it need them i think not:}

Why doesn't LPL need them?

KLM to extend codeshare with BE
 

In light of EXT, IOM etc now showing on the KLM website airport drop down menu, is this an indication of Flybe extending their codeshare agreement with KLM similar to what is in place with AF?

I'd be happy to be proven wrong, but if you try to book a flight on klm.com from (for example) EXT to a KLM destination, I think you'll find you're offered a connection through CDG with an AF code. The presence of EXT, IOM etc in the airport drop-down seems to be simply a way to sell AF-coded connections too.

The Dutch pilots union agreement with KLM limits to 2 the number of codeshares KLM is allowed with any non-Group/non-alliance airline. This has been a sticking point for quite some time.

Could the presence of GCI and JER on the KLM drop down list show there may be a potential for KLM to codeshare on the new Blue Islands service to AMS

Klms booking engine shows liverpool yet you cant book ait half the other newer ones are via fracne. The rest eg bhd shows errors . Si dont thk klm are bringing any new routs. Keast of all dsa. Though odly huy is no longer bookable it says contact air France

Say again all after "Klms" :ugh:

Haha, Onyx you didn't fly for Balkan in the 70s did you? :}

Sorry that was written. Half asleep on the mobile app last night. Autocorrect seems to have hit as I went to send. It.
What I. Meant was Half the new routes listed say contact airfrance. Liverpool is there but shows errors along with bhd.
As for my last post this galaxy phone is infuriating with its autocorrrct. Even simple words seem to change after they are typed
Apologies for the odd spelling

How about Dundee? The folks at HIAL were making noises a couple of years back that they were lobbying for a route to AMS. Could DND handle a Fokker 70?

Perhaps Dundee could show that routes like Belfast and Birmingham are sustainable before the Govt starts subsidising the airport for flights outside the UK...

Well, places like Manston, Humberside oder Durham Tees Valley do not have domestic routes to Belfast, Birmingham, Glasgow, Manchester or Belfast, but nevertheless a serivce to AMS, so I don't think that domestic services are an indicator whether or not a KLM service would make sense or not.

Durham TV and Humberside both have chemical and oil-related industries nearby which have links to their Dutch equivalents. Manston is an interesting experiment.

Manston has a growing offshore renewable industry in the area, with Ramsgate fast becoming a major port for offshore servicing. I wonder if that had any bearing on KLM's choice?

Which do you think makes the more sense, BA serving Rotterdam or KL serving Manston?

It may actually be quicker if you live in Thanet or East Kent to travel to many destinations via AMS than via LHR, but is the East Kent market large enough to fill the aircraft?