trouble on the Eastern Front....
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trouble on the Eastern Front....
I have been hearing several stories recently about all not being well with Eastern Airways. Since they were forced to pull off the MAN-DND route last year after only a few months due poor loads, they are now experiencing difficulties with some of their new flights ex NCL which they took from BA late last year!
They are also apparantly suffering on the Aberdeen to Norwich route since bmi started operating this summer, with bmi already carrying more than 50% of the market. The route was previously Eastern's best performer!
They are also talking of removing the wet-lease jet they have on this route and reducing frequency to try and to rescue some money from it! Versus bmi's product and aircraft though there is a lot of speculation of them even pulling off!!!
It doesn't look like they are coping with things at the moment though and seems that they have bitten more than they can chew with expending too quickly.
Has anyone else heard anything about their difficulties or know where they could be putting their jet instead of ABZ-NWI?
They are also apparantly suffering on the Aberdeen to Norwich route since bmi started operating this summer, with bmi already carrying more than 50% of the market. The route was previously Eastern's best performer!
They are also talking of removing the wet-lease jet they have on this route and reducing frequency to try and to rescue some money from it! Versus bmi's product and aircraft though there is a lot of speculation of them even pulling off!!!
It doesn't look like they are coping with things at the moment though and seems that they have bitten more than they can chew with expending too quickly.
Has anyone else heard anything about their difficulties or know where they could be putting their jet instead of ABZ-NWI?
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I dont mean to sound rude to those people that work for Eastern Airways, but as a former cabin-crew member with bmi regional and still using them occassionally for flights, you only have to compare the service and the prices to realise which is better.
People feel more comortable on jets and bmi regional operate an all-jet fleet using ERJ-135 and ERJ-145s, which are equipped with all-leather seats and are reasonably comfortable and quiet.
Onboard passengers recieve free drinks and a free snacks, and on out of EMA we used to serve hot food on breakfast flights.
Also, bmi's new fares that are bringing them inline with low-cost airlines are extremely cheap compared to the very expensive starting prices Eastern are asking on some of the ex-BA routes.
I dont know about Eastern, but they are up against a great airline service wise.
People feel more comortable on jets and bmi regional operate an all-jet fleet using ERJ-135 and ERJ-145s, which are equipped with all-leather seats and are reasonably comfortable and quiet.
Onboard passengers recieve free drinks and a free snacks, and on out of EMA we used to serve hot food on breakfast flights.
Also, bmi's new fares that are bringing them inline with low-cost airlines are extremely cheap compared to the very expensive starting prices Eastern are asking on some of the ex-BA routes.
I dont know about Eastern, but they are up against a great airline service wise.
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"I dont know about Eastern, but they are up against a great airline service wise."
You make quite a statement without realising that Eastern only compete with bmi regional on one route! And your own admission of knowing nothing about Eastern!
You make quite a statement without realising that Eastern only compete with bmi regional on one route! And your own admission of knowing nothing about Eastern!
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stopping all operations - or just ABZNWI route? It will be good to see them stop it at the end of the months though!
If regional have had this impact on ABZNWI then maybe they should consider offering their services to other Eastern routes as obviously passengers donly travel with them if they are the only choice - not because they are the preferred airline...... especially at the fares they charge...
If regional have had this impact on ABZNWI then maybe they should consider offering their services to other Eastern routes as obviously passengers donly travel with them if they are the only choice - not because they are the preferred airline...... especially at the fares they charge...
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1500 list? Eastern only have a flight at 1600 ex ABZ and 1415 ex NWI and I've never seen a wait-list for either flights....... I don't think we even did before bmi came on the route.....
No, no, no
Your original post is a touch perplexing. You've heard "stories" about Eastern (all with a common theme), which you're keen to relay here. You appear (by previous posts) to be a Midland employee, so why are you so keen to run down the opposition?
Management maybe? Vested interest?
The reason for my interest is that I also hear stories. Eastern have been very busy recruiting, the loads are good (certainly much improved on the loads that BACX left them with), they make a profit, and they offer a stunning service. If what I hear is correct, then we should not be surprised if their fleet grows yet again in the near future, and this time by the addition of aircraft that will have other regionals very worried.
I have had the misfortune of positioning on several bmi routes, and I'm afraid to report that the product was shocking. Maybe you could tell me how long it takes to train a bmi c/a to be able to dump a "snack" in front of me whilst throwing a glum expression in the opposite direction? How much more do I have to pay to see just one smile? Do they speak?
So Eastern are growing, profitable and popular. Your lot are currently managing the business by the "blind hatchet swinging" technique, so much loved by other successful regionals (BACX springs to mind). Now you are appearing on this forum to slag off your competitors.
Did you think this was a particularly perspicacious (if somewhat transparent) management move, or have I misunderstood? Maybe you're just a loyal employee hoping to avoid the above mentioned "list". When they come your way, just state your Pprune username!
edited for spelling
Your original post is a touch perplexing. You've heard "stories" about Eastern (all with a common theme), which you're keen to relay here. You appear (by previous posts) to be a Midland employee, so why are you so keen to run down the opposition?
Management maybe? Vested interest?
The reason for my interest is that I also hear stories. Eastern have been very busy recruiting, the loads are good (certainly much improved on the loads that BACX left them with), they make a profit, and they offer a stunning service. If what I hear is correct, then we should not be surprised if their fleet grows yet again in the near future, and this time by the addition of aircraft that will have other regionals very worried.
I have had the misfortune of positioning on several bmi routes, and I'm afraid to report that the product was shocking. Maybe you could tell me how long it takes to train a bmi c/a to be able to dump a "snack" in front of me whilst throwing a glum expression in the opposite direction? How much more do I have to pay to see just one smile? Do they speak?
So Eastern are growing, profitable and popular. Your lot are currently managing the business by the "blind hatchet swinging" technique, so much loved by other successful regionals (BACX springs to mind). Now you are appearing on this forum to slag off your competitors.
Did you think this was a particularly perspicacious (if somewhat transparent) management move, or have I misunderstood? Maybe you're just a loyal employee hoping to avoid the above mentioned "list". When they come your way, just state your Pprune username!
edited for spelling
Last edited by HundredPercentPlease; 19th Jun 2003 at 06:20.
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Sorry to disappoint you but I am not an employee of Midland, nor any other airline.... I like to earn decent wages so manage to stay clear of working for an airline...... 
I only repeated what I have been told to see if there was any truth in it...... I was not the only one to think this though as I saw on another thread that Eastern aren't doing that well on NCL routes (which has no impact on midland at all so where this has come from I'm not sure.....)
and it was highland man who mentioned Eastern pulling off the route BD compete on so maybe you want to ask him if he also works for Midland.......
very well composed post though hundredpercentplease - although one could suggest that you yourself could work for Eastern - if you do then I would be very interested to hear how you are actually doing....
I only repeated what I have been told to see if there was any truth in it...... I was not the only one to think this though as I saw on another thread that Eastern aren't doing that well on NCL routes (which has no impact on midland at all so where this has come from I'm not sure.....)
and it was highland man who mentioned Eastern pulling off the route BD compete on so maybe you want to ask him if he also works for Midland.......
very well composed post though hundredpercentplease - although one could suggest that you yourself could work for Eastern - if you do then I would be very interested to hear how you are actually doing....
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Bmi Baby
So I take it that operators who fly routes with no competition have to sell their tickets at Low cost prices to be sucessfull?
Reality check, as sole operator on a route, they are supplying a service and basically will charge what they want to ensure that the route is profitable.
As for the route Norwich to Aberdeen where Bmi operate in competition with Eatern, the ticket price reflects the market each airline is trying to attract to fill their seats.
As for Eastern struggling, with a route increase of 60%, a fleet of J41's to enter into service and personnel to employ to reflect the increase in their route network then maybe you would forgive Eastern for taking their eye of the ball, but i'm sure this wont be the case for long.
Good luck to Eastern & BMi
Reality check, as sole operator on a route, they are supplying a service and basically will charge what they want to ensure that the route is profitable.
As for the route Norwich to Aberdeen where Bmi operate in competition with Eatern, the ticket price reflects the market each airline is trying to attract to fill their seats.
As for Eastern struggling, with a route increase of 60%, a fleet of J41's to enter into service and personnel to employ to reflect the increase in their route network then maybe you would forgive Eastern for taking their eye of the ball, but i'm sure this wont be the case for long.
Good luck to Eastern & BMi
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Well said Chillwinston.
Eastern saw these problems on the NWI-ABZ route brewing a long time ago with BMI (The airline that can't decide what it wants to be).
All the best to everyone at Eastern !
Eastern saw these problems on the NWI-ABZ route brewing a long time ago with BMI (The airline that can't decide what it wants to be).
All the best to everyone at Eastern !
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Sorry to disappoint you but I am not an employee of Midland, nor any other airline.... I like to earn decent wages so manage to stay clear of working for an airline......
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eastern & bmi are doing about 50/50 on nwi-abz route due the fact that bmi operate the erj135 base from abz & eastern operate their erj135 base from nwi. People are using either eastern or bmi on time that sute them !
the time table are different which make the two airlines about egal. But now eastern is strongly decided to battle for their route, where we have seen bmi doing some route for 6 months and try else where. Only time will tell !!!!!
that the best win the battle
mosantu
the time table are different which make the two airlines about egal. But now eastern is strongly decided to battle for their route, where we have seen bmi doing some route for 6 months and try else where. Only time will tell !!!!!
that the best win the battle
mosantu
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From the figures I have seen floating around in the last couple of weeks, it now looks like bmi are carrying between 60-65% of the market - and all this considering that the NWI end is suposed to be stronger.......
I do worry for Eastern though, if this was their most profitable route, which now surely must be making losses due to the loss of pax and less yield - plus the wet-leased jet they fly on....
How long could such a small airline cope with these losses - especially if ABZNWI previously supported their whole network!
It would be good to hear from someone at Eastern to see if they are actually coping!!!
It would also be good to know if bmi have grown the route much or just stole pax from Eastern.....
I do worry for Eastern though, if this was their most profitable route, which now surely must be making losses due to the loss of pax and less yield - plus the wet-leased jet they fly on....
How long could such a small airline cope with these losses - especially if ABZNWI previously supported their whole network!
It would be good to hear from someone at Eastern to see if they are actually coping!!!
It would also be good to know if bmi have grown the route much or just stole pax from Eastern.....
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Hope that both companies do well overall, although there will always be continuous appraisals of routes.
Must say though that from a very sucessful period in the 80s and 90s, BMI seemed to have lost the plot. I do hope that their late entry into the LoCo sector does well.
Must say though that from a very sucessful period in the 80s and 90s, BMI seemed to have lost the plot. I do hope that their late entry into the LoCo sector does well.
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bmi baby.com
i dont know when you were cabin crew for bmi regional cos ive been flying the 145,s since we first got them and none have got, or ever have, had leather interiors that is except for the rental one we are leasing at the moment.
i dont know when you were cabin crew for bmi regional cos ive been flying the 145,s since we first got them and none have got, or ever have, had leather interiors that is except for the rental one we are leasing at the moment.
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The Aberdeen route is the only problem that Eastern have.
It's an established fact that Eastern are doing very well on the vast majority of their scheduled services, and also seem to be doing an increasing number of charter flights as well.
However, 8 flights a day to/from NWI/ABZ is not sustainable, and it's "simply a matter of time before one operator caves in and reduces their commitment on the route" - the words of the Norwich Airport authority, not mine.
Four return flights a day is easily achievable, be it two by Eastern and 2 by BMI or some other arrangement.
I would be sorry to see BMI pull out altogether because the competition has been good for Norwich if no one else, but something has got to give somewhere, and I hope that when it does, none of the staff from either side lose out.
It's an established fact that Eastern are doing very well on the vast majority of their scheduled services, and also seem to be doing an increasing number of charter flights as well.
However, 8 flights a day to/from NWI/ABZ is not sustainable, and it's "simply a matter of time before one operator caves in and reduces their commitment on the route" - the words of the Norwich Airport authority, not mine.
Four return flights a day is easily achievable, be it two by Eastern and 2 by BMI or some other arrangement.
I would be sorry to see BMI pull out altogether because the competition has been good for Norwich if no one else, but something has got to give somewhere, and I hope that when it does, none of the staff from either side lose out.
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bmi regional announced today that they will be taking over the East Mids-Brussels route from bmibaby this Winter. Further to this have heard from a source that regional are also consdering re-launching their East-Midlands to Aberdeen route which they operated several years ago linking this new BRU service with their Aberdeen base.
As it happens the EMAABZ route also happens to be one of Easterns!!! Surely that route won't be big enough for 2 carriers!!
As it happens the EMAABZ route also happens to be one of Easterns!!! Surely that route won't be big enough for 2 carriers!!
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Eastern & BMi
I may of missed the plot somewhere along the line, but hasn't Eastern signed an interline agreement with Bmi on the services to Inverness from Manchester. Believe there was a news item about it on Eastern's web site and now it seems any Eastern route is fair game for Bmi regional, seems an odd relationship!
Anyone know any different.
I thought Bmi regional would of been better suited operating from regional airports to the continent with the a/c type they operate or would that be in competition with Bmi baby.
Anyone know any different.
I thought Bmi regional would of been better suited operating from regional airports to the continent with the a/c type they operate or would that be in competition with Bmi baby.