Who is it, FC, MT, TC or Thomsons?
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alas I fear the moderation of these forums has certainly something to answer for here. If the MYT thread had to 'sweat it out' on the frontline forum then I see know reason why this one should be quietly sidelined. All a bit sad really.
Join Date: Aug 1998
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Danny:
I'm sorry, but my feeling, along with many others, is that you, or another moderator, were wrong to move this thread to Airlines, Airports & Routes.
As has been pointed out, the State of play at MyTravel/Kestrel thread (only very recently moved to this forum, btw), was allowed to continue on the Rumours and News forum for over 34,000 'hits', despite the tone and content of some contributors being more blatantly scandalous than any other posting I've ever seen here!
Yes, it was lightly moderated when necessary. But, when NACUD first posted on this subject, this post was moved here in a matter of hours. Most unfair.
Now, Danny, like it or not, any aviation/travel/business-related journalist worth their salt, WILL look on this Bulletin Board for information. You used to warn about that very fact. To think that what is written here does not affect what the press investigates/publish, is nievety personified. To say that "...This thread is NOT about a major UK tour operator" just beggars belief! If, God forbid, TUI were to cease trading, then so would Thomsons and Britannia. Is that what it would take to make you see that this thread IS about a major UK Tour Operator? I do think that NACUD's post was a wee bit gloating, but nowhere near some of those on the State of play... thread, and nowhere near as sanctimonious as your reply here. Yes, it is your toy, but like it or not, what is written by the press, using material gleaned from any source, can even affect the company that you work for, as they have operated third-party work for most of the major operators.
What is written here, and how it is moderated, has a direct effect on how people, from all walks of life, perceive what is going on in our industry. Be they industry professionals, SLF, journalists, etc. It also affects the morale of those employed by those companies, and their families. Ask my wife, who, thanks to the previous management team of our company, coupled with some of the absolute garbage that has been printed here and in the press, is now on medication for a stress-related complaint!
You and your team profess that they have a duty to be even-handed.
It's time for you to practise what you preach.
I'm sorry, but my feeling, along with many others, is that you, or another moderator, were wrong to move this thread to Airlines, Airports & Routes.
As has been pointed out, the State of play at MyTravel/Kestrel thread (only very recently moved to this forum, btw), was allowed to continue on the Rumours and News forum for over 34,000 'hits', despite the tone and content of some contributors being more blatantly scandalous than any other posting I've ever seen here!
Yes, it was lightly moderated when necessary. But, when NACUD first posted on this subject, this post was moved here in a matter of hours. Most unfair.
Now, Danny, like it or not, any aviation/travel/business-related journalist worth their salt, WILL look on this Bulletin Board for information. You used to warn about that very fact. To think that what is written here does not affect what the press investigates/publish, is nievety personified. To say that "...This thread is NOT about a major UK tour operator" just beggars belief! If, God forbid, TUI were to cease trading, then so would Thomsons and Britannia. Is that what it would take to make you see that this thread IS about a major UK Tour Operator? I do think that NACUD's post was a wee bit gloating, but nowhere near some of those on the State of play... thread, and nowhere near as sanctimonious as your reply here. Yes, it is your toy, but like it or not, what is written by the press, using material gleaned from any source, can even affect the company that you work for, as they have operated third-party work for most of the major operators.
What is written here, and how it is moderated, has a direct effect on how people, from all walks of life, perceive what is going on in our industry. Be they industry professionals, SLF, journalists, etc. It also affects the morale of those employed by those companies, and their families. Ask my wife, who, thanks to the previous management team of our company, coupled with some of the absolute garbage that has been printed here and in the press, is now on medication for a stress-related complaint!
You and your team profess that they have a duty to be even-handed.
It's time for you to practise what you preach.
aka Capt PPRuNe
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Pathetic. The threads move according to how many other threads have more recent replies to them.
As for which page they appear on, that is down to your own personal settings. You can change how many days worth of posts your see and how many per page. if you haven't figured that out yet (use the UserCP link at the top of nay PPRune page) and you are accusing me of somehow 'manipulating' a thread then you had better see the psychiatrist for your paranoia!
Because I decided to move this thread to this forum is not supression. It is editorial control. The original MYT thread was actually a merge of several similar threads that appeared over a few days. I left it in the R & N forum because it was a quiet news week and the thread was very popular. Eventually it got a bit too repetitive with the same few people hand wringing about the discussion but at the same time keeping the thread at the forefront.
I decided to move the thread to this forum as it was moving away from pilot issues and descending more into company issues. Next thing we see this thread posted by NACUD in the belief that it somehow would deflect attention from the financial troubles at MYT. I saw it as a blatant attempt to create news and also it was not relevant as far as I was concerned directly to pilots but more to company issues and so I also moved it to this forum.
Obviously NACUD was not happy about my editorial decision and his subsequent attempts to undermine my decision which involved him emailing my moderators and others only served to prove to me that he has a personal agenda and I would not be dictated to on my own bulletin board which has managed without his feeble input until now. He obviously wants to pick a fight and if he believes that he is going to coerce me into puttinghis posts where he wants them when there is no merit then he has another thing coming.
As for supression... get a life!
This thread has been read over 1100 times in the two days it has been up. If that's supression then keep pressing the point and I will show you what supression is.
Never have I see such naivety from a very small group of pilots who are so quick to throw their toys out of their pram that they fail to see that if they just shut up and let the 'uninformed, unwashed masses' have their say the whole thing would have been old news within 24 hours of it being reported. Instead, they just keep on harping on about other companies being in trouble too as though that is going to make their own bad news go away.
Now this thread is also remaining at the top of the list because as long as someone posts a reply it jumps back up. No doubt I'll be accused of somehow manipulating this too. In fact, why don't I give NACUD his own forum where we can focus on his attemt to get the Sunday Times Insight team to do an in depth investigation as to why no one is writing about TUI's financial problems but picking on MYT instead.
In fact, I have just gone back and had a look at the original thread and until the forst post by Kinsman where he states "Sounds like one of our competitors has slipped the papers a story to add a bit more pressure to our situation." it was just discussion about a press report that was circulating several newspapers but after that it became a delusionally paranoid thread with a small group pleading for the thread to be closed so that it would all go away!
Anyway, it's in here now and no one can accuse me of supressing anything!
As for which page they appear on, that is down to your own personal settings. You can change how many days worth of posts your see and how many per page. if you haven't figured that out yet (use the UserCP link at the top of nay PPRune page) and you are accusing me of somehow 'manipulating' a thread then you had better see the psychiatrist for your paranoia!
Because I decided to move this thread to this forum is not supression. It is editorial control. The original MYT thread was actually a merge of several similar threads that appeared over a few days. I left it in the R & N forum because it was a quiet news week and the thread was very popular. Eventually it got a bit too repetitive with the same few people hand wringing about the discussion but at the same time keeping the thread at the forefront.
I decided to move the thread to this forum as it was moving away from pilot issues and descending more into company issues. Next thing we see this thread posted by NACUD in the belief that it somehow would deflect attention from the financial troubles at MYT. I saw it as a blatant attempt to create news and also it was not relevant as far as I was concerned directly to pilots but more to company issues and so I also moved it to this forum.
Obviously NACUD was not happy about my editorial decision and his subsequent attempts to undermine my decision which involved him emailing my moderators and others only served to prove to me that he has a personal agenda and I would not be dictated to on my own bulletin board which has managed without his feeble input until now. He obviously wants to pick a fight and if he believes that he is going to coerce me into puttinghis posts where he wants them when there is no merit then he has another thing coming.
As for supression... get a life!
This thread has been read over 1100 times in the two days it has been up. If that's supression then keep pressing the point and I will show you what supression is.Never have I see such naivety from a very small group of pilots who are so quick to throw their toys out of their pram that they fail to see that if they just shut up and let the 'uninformed, unwashed masses' have their say the whole thing would have been old news within 24 hours of it being reported. Instead, they just keep on harping on about other companies being in trouble too as though that is going to make their own bad news go away.
Now this thread is also remaining at the top of the list because as long as someone posts a reply it jumps back up. No doubt I'll be accused of somehow manipulating this too. In fact, why don't I give NACUD his own forum where we can focus on his attemt to get the Sunday Times Insight team to do an in depth investigation as to why no one is writing about TUI's financial problems but picking on MYT instead.
In fact, I have just gone back and had a look at the original thread and until the forst post by Kinsman where he states "Sounds like one of our competitors has slipped the papers a story to add a bit more pressure to our situation." it was just discussion about a press report that was circulating several newspapers but after that it became a delusionally paranoid thread with a small group pleading for the thread to be closed so that it would all go away!
Anyway, it's in here now and no one can accuse me of supressing anything!
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hiya,
This thread has been read over 1100 times in the two days it has been up. If that's supression then keep pressing the point and I will show you what supression is.
I think the reason this thread was viewed so much was that people knew a fight was brewing and wanted to see the outcome..
I agree with Pinni that this has been a laugh to monitor, but it's time to let it go... Arguments will get you nowhere NACUD because Danny is the top dog here on the board, you need to put your points to him simply and diplomatically (theres so much use of people saying use a dictionary here i figure i might as well say it to...
) - then im sure he will answer them all to the fullest extent he can. If Danny has managed to keep this forum running since 1995 i doubt he will loose any sleep over you being upset but i dont think he will want to be #1 on your hit list either...
Theres my two pence -
WhiteDevil
This thread has been read over 1100 times in the two days it has been up. If that's supression then keep pressing the point and I will show you what supression is.
I think the reason this thread was viewed so much was that people knew a fight was brewing and wanted to see the outcome..
I agree with Pinni that this has been a laugh to monitor, but it's time to let it go... Arguments will get you nowhere NACUD because Danny is the top dog here on the board, you need to put your points to him simply and diplomatically (theres so much use of people saying use a dictionary here i figure i might as well say it to...
) - then im sure he will answer them all to the fullest extent he can. If Danny has managed to keep this forum running since 1995 i doubt he will loose any sleep over you being upset but i dont think he will want to be #1 on your hit list either...Theres my two pence -
WhiteDevil
Ut Sementem Feeceris
Without getting silly, I do think the comment that it was moved because it was an Airline issue not involving a British Airline is a bit rich.
Over the past few months, there have been several threads in R&N about the state of American, United, Swiss, Aer Lingus etc. These are not British Airlines and they were not moved...............
Paranoid is a strong term to use, but after 7 months of bad press, constant sniping by sections of the media and the emotional roller coaster that the MYT staff have been through, it does just make you wonder if they are out to "get you". The almost immediate moving of the thread when others have remained does appear, on the face of it, to be a little "coincidental". I' m NOT paranoid....honest...
I (would like to) think that we are all mature enough to realise that deflection will not make MYT's problems dissappear. As I've said numerous times before I hope all companies come through, what can only be described as probably the worst spell in the industry's history, fitter leaner and wiser. If we could all just be left alone to get on with it, it would be a lot easier!
Safe flying,
A4
Over the past few months, there have been several threads in R&N about the state of American, United, Swiss, Aer Lingus etc. These are not British Airlines and they were not moved...............
Paranoid is a strong term to use, but after 7 months of bad press, constant sniping by sections of the media and the emotional roller coaster that the MYT staff have been through, it does just make you wonder if they are out to "get you". The almost immediate moving of the thread when others have remained does appear, on the face of it, to be a little "coincidental". I' m NOT paranoid....honest...
I (would like to) think that we are all mature enough to realise that deflection will not make MYT's problems dissappear. As I've said numerous times before I hope all companies come through, what can only be described as probably the worst spell in the industry's history, fitter leaner and wiser. If we could all just be left alone to get on with it, it would be a lot easier!
Safe flying,
A4
Danny, I’ve been a lurker and occasional contributor since the earliest days of Pprune and I have to say that your post on this thread is the first time you have ever disappointed me.
The treatment we have had to deal with and the utter crap we have had to read on these forums in recent times, admittedly from just a sanctimonious and bitter few, has been pretty hard to take.
I must say that the support and good wishes of the majority helped a great deal.
But I do not recall another occasion where a company has faced such a sustained vicious campaign by a newspaper (no need to name which one is there?) and such a sustained “bad mouthing” within our business, by two companies in particular. With regard to those two companies, my colleagues and I never doubted that they needed us out of the way to shore up their own struggling operations. It does appear that we were not wrong. However that gives me no warm feelings whatsoever. I feel nothing but contempt for those that contribute unfounded “facts” to the debate in an attempt to undermine any of our companies.
I do not condone the tone of NACUD’s initial posting but it is understandable in light of the above. However I do not believe it contained anything that was not verifiable, did it?
The further post by NACUD and those of kinsman, U/S Pres and P of D, eloquently covered the reasons for my disappointment with you Danny. I know you have good friends at MYT but if you think that you’re handling of this has done them and the rest of us anything less than a disservice then I am sorry but you are kidding yourself.
I read this thread just after 1230 and it took me a while to get around to writing my post. I had a quick look at the refreshed page and after reading your latest posting Danny, - I give up. You are not the guy I thought you were.
And you think it’s hilarious do you pinni?....................Jeeeeeeez!
The treatment we have had to deal with and the utter crap we have had to read on these forums in recent times, admittedly from just a sanctimonious and bitter few, has been pretty hard to take.
I must say that the support and good wishes of the majority helped a great deal.
But I do not recall another occasion where a company has faced such a sustained vicious campaign by a newspaper (no need to name which one is there?) and such a sustained “bad mouthing” within our business, by two companies in particular. With regard to those two companies, my colleagues and I never doubted that they needed us out of the way to shore up their own struggling operations. It does appear that we were not wrong. However that gives me no warm feelings whatsoever. I feel nothing but contempt for those that contribute unfounded “facts” to the debate in an attempt to undermine any of our companies.
I do not condone the tone of NACUD’s initial posting but it is understandable in light of the above. However I do not believe it contained anything that was not verifiable, did it?
The further post by NACUD and those of kinsman, U/S Pres and P of D, eloquently covered the reasons for my disappointment with you Danny. I know you have good friends at MYT but if you think that you’re handling of this has done them and the rest of us anything less than a disservice then I am sorry but you are kidding yourself.
I read this thread just after 1230 and it took me a while to get around to writing my post. I had a quick look at the refreshed page and after reading your latest posting Danny, - I give up. You are not the guy I thought you were.
And you think it’s hilarious do you pinni?....................Jeeeeeeez!
aka Capt PPRuNe
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The point I'm trying to make is that not everyone can have their favourite topic on the front page. At the end of the day editorial decisions are made based on many factors. I don't claim to get it right every time and it is becoming obvious that there is no convincing a few people that their accusations are misplaced and wrong.
This temporary forum was set up to prove a point. Yes, it is petty and after an hour or so I can step back and see that whilst it is amusing to some it doesn't do much else except to highlight the editorial issues and not the other more serious issues about MYT.
I will move these threads back to where I think they should be when I get a chance. Not everyone is going to be happy about my choice but you are going to have to live with it. Just don't accuse me of some hidden agenda to put pressure on MYT in order to expedite their possible demise.
Hopefully the latest news on the other thread will provide a morale boost to the crews. The discussion about how the banks operate and why they make the decisions they do is all valid although some of the speculation about why they are holding on will not be welcome by some it is only discussion.
Haven't got enough spare time to deal with all this at the moment so in light of the 'good news' thread that started today I'm going to close this one and the original MYT one that has upset some of you so much and see where it all leads.
Good luck for the future.
This temporary forum was set up to prove a point. Yes, it is petty and after an hour or so I can step back and see that whilst it is amusing to some it doesn't do much else except to highlight the editorial issues and not the other more serious issues about MYT.
I will move these threads back to where I think they should be when I get a chance. Not everyone is going to be happy about my choice but you are going to have to live with it. Just don't accuse me of some hidden agenda to put pressure on MYT in order to expedite their possible demise.
Hopefully the latest news on the other thread will provide a morale boost to the crews. The discussion about how the banks operate and why they make the decisions they do is all valid although some of the speculation about why they are holding on will not be welcome by some it is only discussion.
Haven't got enough spare time to deal with all this at the moment so in light of the 'good news' thread that started today I'm going to close this one and the original MYT one that has upset some of you so much and see where it all leads.
Good luck for the future.
